It's official newest Rugby Super 15 team will come from Melbourne !

[stuart27]

Just out of interest, did Melbourne & Moorabbin sign the letter?

Not sure, The Australian cited 20 different parties and the VRU have listed 7 of these on their website. As neither Melbourne or Moorabbin are listed my first instinct would be to say no, but I can't say with any certainty either way.

 

[meltiger]

Hmmm, My suspicion is no. I'm sure the VRU would have loved to have listed them had they signed given the events of the last 6 months.


If all this is true and VICSUPER15 is a no go, suffice to say I am very pleased. I'd rather no team, than what this team would have been.

 

[ERead]

The consortiums have merged. Hoorah: http://www.rugbyheaven.com.au/news/...evive-super-bid/2009/09/29/1253989912379.html

This should then hopefully be a strong, well-funded bid with the appropriate level of VRU involvement.

They are talking about being somehow linked with Melbourne Victory. That's probably ok, Victory know how to run an outfit.

They are hoping for crowds of 15,000. Hmmm, they might need to build up for that. I don't know how Victory crowds are, but Roar crowds are appalling.

 

[James Buchanan]

The consortiums have merged. Hoorah: http://www.rugbyheaven.com.au/news/...evive-super-bid/2009/09/29/1253989912379.html

This should then hopefully be a strong, well-funded bid with the appropriate level of VRU involvement.

They are talking about being somehow linked with Melbourne Victory. That's probably ok, Victory know how to run an outfit.

They are hoping for crowds of 15,000. Hmmm, they might need to build up for that. I don't know how Victory crowds are, but Roar crowds are appalling.

Victory crowds are very impressive. That being said, we're looking at a different demographic.

I think the Storm regularly gets around 10-15k a game, so its not an unreasonable estimate.

 

[ERead]

Victory crowds are very impressive. That being said, we're looking at a different demographic.

I think the Storm regularly gets around 10-15k a game, so its not an unreasonable estimate.

Yes, it was flawed to compare soccer and Rugby crowds (and soccer in Brisbane with soccer in Melbourne).

I guess my question is, how is Rugby doing in Victoria at the moment? The Wallabies have a following but that is occasional games from the international team (and I know people who go from Brisbane to Melbourne as an excuse to have a holiday while catching the game).

I guess it'd be easier to gauge if we'd kept on with the ARC and saw how that developed the game in Victoria.

I think the Super 15 conference system is exciting and really welcome the Victoria team in. Hell, I'll probably support them .

 

[ERead]

Some good analysis of the state of the Victorian bid: http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/melbourne-rebels-super-15-up-and-running/.

And more developments: http://www.rugbyheaven.com.au/news/news/more-confusion-over-super-bid/2009/10/01/1253989997223.html

 

[James Buchanan]

Yes, it was flawed to compare soccer and Rugby crowds (and soccer in Brisbane with soccer in Melbourne).

I guess my question is, how is Rugby doing in Victoria at the moment? The Wallabies have a following but that is occasional games from the international team (and I know people who go from Brisbane to Melbourne as an excuse to have a holiday while catching the game).

I guess it'd be easier to gauge if we'd kept on with the ARC and saw how that developed the game in Victoria.

I think the Super 15 conference system is exciting and really welcome the Victoria team in. Hell, I'll probably support them .

It's really hard to gauge. As a friend of mine said, when we were at the ARC games. People just weren't interested because they want to watch the top level games. I don't believe that myself, but that's the non dyed in the wool types out there.

And, you just want to support a team that isn't always losing

 

[ERead]

It's really hard to gauge. As a friend of mine said, when we were at the ARC games. People just weren't interested because they want to watch the top level games. I don't believe that myself, but that's the non dyed in the wool types out there.

And, you just want to support a team that isn't always losing

Heh, I am not a hard core Rugby man by any stretch of the imagination, starting to like it for some of it's similarities with American football, so not a Reds man. I also not a hard core Queensland man

 

[meltiger]

It's really hard to gauge. As a friend of mine said, when we were at the ARC games. People just weren't interested because they want to watch the top level games. I don't believe that myself, but that's the non dyed in the wool types out there.

And, you just want to support a team that isn't always losing

I actually do believe that is the case.

Melbourne Storm's State Cup outfit (Reserve Grade) won't attract crowds much higher than the ARC did.

 

[dr nick]

I dont think Melbourne supports rugby enough to see this outfit take off. It will probably attract similar crowds to what the storm did in it's infancy years, maybe a bit less. The number of juniors that play rugby is below that of Perth, so when you think the force has to raid other states, you can add Melbourne to the list too.

They will plod along for a few years, but unless they emulate something like the storm (with 5 grand finals in 11 years, and basically finals appearances every other), their crowds will just wither, they only turn up for winning teams in these non-traditional areas.. and unlike the NRL, i don't expect SANZAR will offer Melbourne any help whatsoever in terms of concessions and bailouts.

 

[meltiger]

I dont think Melbourne supports rugby enough to see this outfit take off.

You live in Sydney ............

 

[dr nick]

yes, but sometimes a knowledge of hard facts like junior participation numbers, number of leagues, survey results, ratings, expansion plans from the governing bodies and historical comparisons from other codes in similar situations counts for more than anecdotes

 

[meltiger]

& yet..... You live in Sydney

 

[stuart27]

& yet..... You live in Sydney

He's got you there

 

[EaglesFlyingHigh]

This is great news for ARU and Australian Rugby in general. I have doughts over how successful they will be in terms of support and quality players but still wish them the best of luck.
Another rival for the Force!!!

 

[NEMINI]

I'll definately consider becoming a member if this ends up happening. I find the Union game to be much better then NRL.

 

[Sunday Red]

Having a 2010 Bledisloe test in Melbourne can't hurt. I guess the ARU will now see what sort of crowd Melbourne can produce when they give us a REAL international match instead of the pissweak Wales or Italy games.

 

[camsmith]

Sunday Red, the last game we had in Melbourne was between the Wallabies and Italy. Even with all the hype and no AFL in the state on a Saturday night, it only managed 20,280.

I wish them well but I think they'll be struggling to consistently pull 10k, and that's at the nice new stadium which will make their numbers look good when compared to crowd figures for the Storm who have had to put up with the dump next door.

 

[dr nick]

20k for an international, not enough support for a sustained supported side playing the bulls, hurricanes etc. Theatregoers, mostly.

 

[stuart27]

Sunday Red, the last game we had in Melbourne was between the Wallabies and Italy. Even with all the hype and no AFL in the state on a Saturday night, it only managed 20,280.

I wish them well but I think they'll be struggling to consistently pull 10k, and that's at the nice new stadium which will make their numbers look good when compared to crowd figures for the Storm who have had to put up with the dump next door.

There was no hype for the Italy game down here. At all.

It was one of the most poorly advertised tests I can remember. I'm not surprised they only got 20k.

I reckon the Rebels have the potential to consistently pull good crowds, but they can't afford to be complacent. When they took part in the ARC, the VRU relied almost solely on advertising to the rugby community, which got them the 5k crowds that were, comparatively, very good in that competition, but it won't get them the 15-20k crowds the Super 15 tournament deserves.

Initially, they will need to push the S15 hard down here, which is why Melbourne Victory's help will be crucial. If there's one thing Lord and co. know how to do well, it's promotion.

The Rebels will get more than enough support, they just need to find it. And they will.

 

[Sunday Red]

Sunday Red, the last game we had in Melbourne was between the Wallabies and Italy. Even with all the hype and no AFL in the state on a Saturday night, it only managed 20,280.

I wish them well but I think they'll be struggling to consistently pull 10k, and that's at the nice new stadium which will make their numbers look good when compared to crowd figures for the Storm who have had to put up with the dump next door.

20k for an international, not enough support for a sustained supported side playing the bulls, hurricanes etc. Theatregoers, mostly.

Are you kidding? I wouldn't have known the game was on if not for a couple of print advertisements. It was woeful game promotion by the ARU and an insult to Melbourne fans to send Italy down here. As much as they want to trumpet the fact they are a European six nations side, they are not an England, Ireland or a New Zealand.

The ARU must be complete fools to send Italy down here with little promotion, scratch their heads at the 20,000 turn out and then listen as people debate whether we really love the game enough to have our own domestic franchise.

Don't insult the sports loving people of Melbourne by giving us the second tier internationals.

It was difficult to find historical rugby crowds in Melbourne, but I managed to compile a list:

34,042 (South Africa)
56,605 (British & Irish Lions)
37,482 (France)
54,868 (England)
54,206 (Ireland)
38,222 (Scotland)
26,520 (Italy)
65,000 (England)
75,127 (New Zealand)
90,119 (New Zealand)

Which goes to show when there is quality opposition in town, the fans will come. We almost cracked 40,000 against Scotland!! Melbourne loves rugby, but we won't bother paying the money to go and see a rubbish game that few people care about. Give us a Tri-Nations encounter, gives us the Bledisloe but stop giving us the second tier fixtures then assuming we don't care.

The 2010 Bledisloe match will sell out in days, if not hours. Then watch as everyone says how much we love our rugby and that a Super 15 franchise will work.

 

[Sunday Red]

Furthermore, the AVERAGE Super 14 crowd in Australia is 23,002.

If the sporting capital of the world can't average 20k with a brand new team in a brand new purpose built stadium, I'll go jump.

 

[camsmith]

Are you kidding? I wouldn't have known the game was on if not for a couple of print advertisements. It was woeful game promotion by the ARU and an insult to Melbourne fans to send Italy down here. As much as they want to trumpet the fact they are a European six nations side, they are not an England, Ireland or a New Zealand.

The ARU must be complete fools to send Italy down here with little promotion, scratch their heads at the 20,000 turn out and then listen as people debate whether we really love the game enough to have our own domestic franchise.

Don't insult the sports loving people of Melbourne by giving us the second tier internationals.

It was difficult to find historical rugby crowds in Melbourne, but I managed to compile a list:

34,042 (South Africa)
56,605 (British & Irish Lions)
37,482 (France)
54,868 (England)
54,206 (Ireland)
38,222 (Scotland)
26,520 (Italy)
65,000 (England)
75,127 (New Zealand)
90,119 (New Zealand)

Which goes to show when there is quality opposition in town, the fans will come. We almost cracked 40,000 against Scotland!! Melbourne loves rugby, but we won't bother paying the money to go and see a rubbish game that few people care about. Give us a Tri-Nations encounter, gives us the Bledisloe but stop giving us the second tier fixtures then assuming we don't care.

The 2010 Bledisloe match will sell out in days, if not hours. Then watch as everyone says how much we love our rugby and that a Super 15 franchise will work.

Hmm my memory is bad but im sure I remember hearing a fair bit about the Italy game in newspapers etc..?

Sunday Red your post is exactly why I think they'll get poor crowds. You are lamenting that they us giving us second tier internationals, well if internationals, no matter how substandard the opposition is, doesn't get great crowds.. how is a state team with even less quality players going attract anyone?

I just think those who do like Rugby are far more interested in the Wallabies than any state comp, similar to cricket.

Furthermore, the AVERAGE Super 14 crowd in Australia is 23,002.

If the sporting capital of the world can't average 20k with a brand new team in a brand new purpose built stadium, I'll go jump.

Yeah but it means little as they are far different markets to Melbourne. It's not about being the sporting capital of the world, its that people here are only interested in Rugby when it's at its highest level.

It's going to be very interesting to see what numbers they get.

 

[meltiger]

20k for an international, not enough support for a sustained supported side playing the bulls, hurricanes etc. Theatregoers, mostly.

http://wapedia.mobi/en/2009_Australian_football_code_crowds

Crowd Home team Score Away team Score Ground Match Type
80,467 New South Wales 14 Queensland 24 ANZ Stadium State of Origin
80,228 Australia 18 New Zealand 19 ANZ Stadium Tri Nations
69,238 Australia 2 Japan 1 MCG World Cup Qualifier
57,292 Australia 2 Uzbekistan 0 ANZ Stadium World Cup Qualifier
52,439 Queensland 16 New South Wales 28 Suncorp Stadium State of Origin
50,967 Queensland 28 New South Wales 18 Docklands Stadium State of Origin
43,588 Australia 22 France 6 ANZ Stadium Friendly
39,540 Australia 2 Bahrain 0 ANZ Stadium World Cup Qualifier
37,152 Australia 38 New Zealand 10 Suncorp Stadium ANZAC Test
36,148 Australia 25 South Africa 32 Subiaco Tri Nations
31,340 Brisbane Roar 0 Celtic 3 Suncorp Stadium Translink Cup
25,871 Rabbitohs 18 Dragons 6 ANZ Stadium Charity Shield
22,468 Australia 31 Italy 8 Canberra Stadium Friendly
20,280 Australia 34 Italy 12 Docklands Stadium Friendly
20,032 Australia 0 Kuwait 1 Canberra Stadium AFC Asian Cup qualification
9,419 Central Coast Mariners 0 Kawasaki Frontale 5 Bluetongue Stadium AFC Champions League
8,492 Newcastle Jets 0 Nagoya Grampus 1 EnergyAustralia Stadium AFC Champions League
8,266 Country 18 City 40 Wade Park City vs Country Origin
7,314 Newcastle Jets 2 Ulsan Hyundai Horang-i 0 EnergyAustralia Stadium AFC Champions League
6,870 Central Coast Mariners 0 Pohang Steelers 0 Bluetongue Stadium AFC Champions League
6,106 Newcastle Jets 2 Beijing Guoan 1 EnergyAustralia Stadium AFC Champions League
5,843 Central Coast Mariners 0 Tianjin Teda 1 Bluetongue Stadium AFC Champions League

22k against a numpty nation for a city that has a far more successful Super Rugby outfit than Sydney does ... Yet 2k less against the same 2nd rate opposition isn't good enough for a city to want a team ...

Seriously troll, **** off. The sporting world doesn't revolve around Sydney.

 

[dr nick]

lol that's at Bruce Stadium's capacity, and it was sold out