Senior Jack Billings - Player Advocate: Premium

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It's not over the top. I agree, Billings has had 4 or 5 good games in a row to start the year. But that is an exception for him, it doesn't yet change the pattern of his form over the previous 3 years. He is more consistent than Acres, so is Kim Jong-un, dosn't change the fact that he is not A-grade consistent a la Cripps, Kelly, Gaff, Zorko etc.

If the last 2 games turn out to be a blip - he plays consistently well for the rest of the year - then I'll applaud him. But right now, when I think of this group of players, all of whom are 1st round picks in their 4th and 5th/6th years, you can't help but be frustrated that they can be brilliant one game and very mediocre the next.
As soon as they get any attention from the opposition they curl up their toes. It was the same when he had a close checking HBF when playing forward he would go missing. Some players never learn to deal with being tagged but lets hope Billings can work thru it.
 

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BrutThough

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It's not over the top. I agree, Billings has had 4 or 5 good games in a row to start the year. But that is an exception for him, it doesn't yet change the pattern of his form over the previous 3 years. He is more consistent than Acres, so is Kim Jong-un, dosn't change the fact that he is not A-grade consistent a la Cripps, Kelly, Gaff, Zorko etc.

If the last 2 games turn out to be a blip - he plays consistently well for the rest of the year - then I'll applaud him. But right now, when I think of this group of players, all of whom are 1st round picks in their 4th and 5th/6th years, you can't help but be frustrated that they can be brilliant one game and very mediocre the next.
It's not like its the first time he has ever played good games in the row. He was great in 2017. His first half of 2018 went good but was consistently good and contributing in the second half of that season once he went to the wing.

Yes, he isn't as good or consistent as Cripps (who is arguably the best player in the competition) but if we are judging this season, he has been better over the 7 rounds than the others you mentioned.
 
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It's not over the top. I agree, Billings has had 4 or 5 good games in a row to start the year. But that is an exception for him, it doesn't yet change the pattern of his form over the previous 3 years. He is more consistent than Acres, so is Kim Jong-un, dosn't change the fact that he is not A-grade consistent a la Cripps, Kelly, Gaff, Zorko etc.

If the last 2 games turn out to be a blip - he plays consistently well for the rest of the year - then I'll applaud him. But right now, when I think of this group of players, all of whom are 1st round picks in their 4th and 5th/6th years, you can't help but be frustrated that they can be brilliant one game and very mediocre the next.

Good idea , lets judge all our players based on what they did three years ago, because they never develop.

Seb Ross has been going OK, but he's a spud , look at that first game he played.

FACTS:
Positive :
Billings has got his hands on the ball more than any other Saint in 2019. In his recent ( Bad ) game he got it more than twice as much as Acres or Clark.
Only 5 players have had more contested possessions than Billings in 2019.
Equal 2nd for Marks taken.
4th for contested marks.
5th for rebounds from the back 50.

Negative :
His disposal Efficiency is not good. 4th in the team for Clangers.
Behind Sinclair and Newnes for clearances.
Middle of the pack for Tackling.
 

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Who's done that? Why don't you take the time to read posts properly before responding to them. It's a waste of everyone's time and patience.
Billings has been our best performed player this year and at this moment would be leading our best and fairest - the guy has been a work in progress but that is what it takes - just him showing the leadership in the preseason is a big factor he has been slipped into the leadership group.

But what stands out to me is he added working out with Sam Soliman for extra work in the preseason just to improve himself.
Anyone who can go 12 rounds with Sam , is a tough unit and this was one area the guy has improved out of sight.

The poor kid has always copped a bagging from us.

But when was the last time we had a wing who got stats like this.

● 28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 7 marks and 2 goals in Rd 5 40-pt win over Melbourne at the MCG (20 Apr 2019)
● 34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 6 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 4 5-pt win over Hawthorn at Marvel Stadium (14 Apr 2019)
● 32 disps (15 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks and 2 goals in Rd 3 5-pt loss to Fremantle at Optus Stadium (7 Apr 2019)
● 28 disps (13 kicks 15 hballs) and 6 marks in Rd 2 11-pt win over Essendon at Marvel Stadium (30 Mar 2019)
● 28 disps (14 kicks 14 hballs) and 4 marks in Rd 1 1-pt win over Gold Coast at Marvel Stadium (24 Mar 2019)

This guy needs a bit more respect

We were asking to see if we could get a Gaff and on his current stats I would say Billings is most probably better than Gaff even though Gaff gets more disposals , but if you look at his effective disposals you will see Billings is just about the same.

20.1(Billings)------ Effective Disposals Per Game ------21.4 (Gaff)

2.0--------------- One Percenters Per Game ------------0.4

4.7 -----------------Turnovers Per Game----------------- 7.4

72.8%--------- Disposal Efficiency % Per Game --------64.5%


and about what the guy is worth , well if we were willing to pay 1.1 or more for Gaff , surely Billings is worth 900k being younger and maybe a lot more upside.

Remember Gaff collects a lot of uncontested possessions and playing in a team that usually wins more than it loses , he gets far more opportunities.

my view

leave my boy alone
 

joop

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Billings has been our best performed player this year and at this moment would be leading our best and fairest - the guy has been a work in progress but that is what it takes - just him showing the leadership in the preseason is a big factor he has been slipped into the leadership group.

But what stands out to me is he added working out with Sam Soliman for extra work in the preseason just to improve himself.
Anyone who can go 12 rounds with Sam , is a tough unit and this was one area the guy has improved out of sight.

The poor kid has always copped a bagging from us.

But when was the last time we had a wing who got stats like this.

● 28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 7 marks and 2 goals in Rd 5 40-pt win over Melbourne at the MCG (20 Apr 2019)
● 34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 6 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 4 5-pt win over Hawthorn at Marvel Stadium (14 Apr 2019)
● 32 disps (15 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks and 2 goals in Rd 3 5-pt loss to Fremantle at Optus Stadium (7 Apr 2019)
● 28 disps (13 kicks 15 hballs) and 6 marks in Rd 2 11-pt win over Essendon at Marvel Stadium (30 Mar 2019)
● 28 disps (14 kicks 14 hballs) and 4 marks in Rd 1 1-pt win over Gold Coast at Marvel Stadium (24 Mar 2019)

This guy needs a bit more respect

We were asking to see if we could get a Gaff and on his current stats I would say Billings is most probably better than Gaff even though Gaff gets more disposals , but if you look at his effective disposals you will see Billings is just about the same.

20.1(Billings)------ Effective Disposals Per Game ------21.4 (Gaff)

2.0--------------- One Percenters Per Game ------------0.4

4.7 -----------------Turnovers Per Game----------------- 7.4

72.8%--------- Disposal Efficiency % Per Game --------64.5%


and about what the guy is worth , well if we were willing to pay 1.1 or more for Gaff , surely Billings is worth 900k being younger and maybe a lot more upside.

Remember Gaff collects a lot of uncontested possessions and playing in a team that usually wins more than it loses , he gets far more opportunities.

my view

leave my boy alone
Haha love your optimism but come on mate, you’ve cherry picked 4 stats to back your argument. Also probably wouldn’t have a crack at Gaff getting uncontested possessions when he also gets more contested possessions than JB.
Would be stoked if Billings ended up the player Gaff is, definitely has time on his side.
 

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Haha love your optimism but come on mate, you’ve cherry picked 4 stats to back your argument. Also probably wouldn’t have a crack at Gaff getting uncontested possessions when he also gets more contested possessions than JB.
Would be stoked if Billings ended up the player Gaff is, definitely has time on his side.
Uncontested possessions Gaff got 2.8 more and the guy has spent more time in the middle this year where Billings has been playing all his time on a wing.
7.6 Contested Possessions Per Game 10.4
 

Ricmel

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B
But when was the last time we had a wing who got stats like this.

● 28 disps (12 kicks 16 hballs), 7 marks and 2 goals in Rd 5 40-pt win over Melbourne at the MCG (20 Apr 2019)
● 34 disps (17 kicks 17 hballs), 6 marks and 5 tackles in Rd 4 5-pt win over Hawthorn at Marvel Stadium (14 Apr 2019)
● 32 disps (15 kicks 17 hballs), 5 marks and 2 goals in Rd 3 5-pt loss to Fremantle at Optus Stadium (7 Apr 2019)
● 28 disps (13 kicks 15 hballs) and 6 marks in Rd 2 11-pt win over Essendon at Marvel Stadium (30 Mar 2019)
● 28 disps (14 kicks 14 hballs) and 4 marks in Rd 1 1-pt win over Gold Coast at Marvel Stadium (24 Mar 2019)
My post was nothing to do with knocking Billings form in first 5 games this year. It was all about the fact that in his career to date, the reason he is not widely regarded as A grade is he is inconsistent. His best is very good but there are too many average games scattered in there. The true A grade players in the AFL - even their bad days are a good day for most players.

Put a post up on the main board (not Saints board) - Poll - who would you take? Billings or Gaff?

95% will say Gaff, the other 5% will be Saints supporters flying the flag.

Watch the game Bulldogs vs Richmond. In just his first 4 touches Bont shows you why he is regarded as A grade. He has a composure and decision making that is far above where Jack is at.
 

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best players in first 8 games
BEST
Melbourne:
Brayshaw, Oliver, Gawn, Harmes, Salem
St Kilda: Billings, Kent, Membrey, Newnes, Acres, Steele, Geary

BEST
St Kilda:
Ross, Marshall, Billings, Lonie, Steele, Gresham, Acres
Hawthorn: Worpel, Scrimshaw, Scully, Sicily, Roughead, Henderson

BEST
Fremantle:
Walters, Ryan, Langdon, Hill, Cerra, Fyfe, Matera
St Kilda: Gresham, Billings, Geary, Marshall, Newnes, Steele

BEST
Essendon:
Stringer, McGrath, Hurley, Francis, Heppell
St Kilda: Gresham, Steele, Bruce, Ross, Sinclair, Newnes

BEST
St Kilda:
Ross, Billings, Steven, Newnes, Bruce, Steele, McKenzie
Gold Coast: Fiorini, Sexton, Witts, Ballard, Miller, Powell

BEST
St Kilda:
Steven, Parker, Ross, Savage, Steele, McKenzie
Adelaide: Keath, Walker, B Crouch, M Crouch, Laird, Greenwood, Atkins

BEST
Greater Western Sydney:
Cameron, Williams, Taranto, Haynes, Taylor, Reid
St Kilda: Steele, Ross, Marshall, Newnes, Kent

BEST
St Kilda:
Dunstan, Bruce, Ross, Battle, Billings, Gresham, Savage
West Coast:
Hurn, Cripps, Yeo, Sheed, Shuey, Gaff, Ryan
 
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