Player Watch Jack Ginnivan

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Mukesh

Premiership Player
Oct 23, 2014
3,773
3,366
Kalapathar, Havelock Island
AFL Club
Collingwood
Another topic that people on this board are FAR too obsessed with - turning forwards / backmen into mids.

Ginni represents something we have been screaming out for for years - a dangerous goalkicking small forward - yet still plenty here want to run him down because they don't think he can make a mid.

Newsflash!!!!!!!

He was recruited as a goal kicking small forward . . . rollseyes.gif
Hallelujah..... mid fielders are a dime a dozen... guys who can create and kick goals not so much...
 

Roverjg

Premiership Player
Sep 18, 2014
3,152
3,908
Surf Coast
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Collingwood
When McRae got the coaching gig he said he expected more tackles from our first year draftees. I imagine that will be an area of focus for Ginnivan this off season. It'll be a harder task to execute in the absence of leg speed and a mature body. He might need to apply some of that footy IQ to defensive positioning too. I'm also hoping Jarrod Wade can get the boys beefed up a bit. He started off as a weights trainer.
Lack of defensive pressure was one of the knocks on him in his draft year
 

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Roverjg

Premiership Player
Sep 18, 2014
3,152
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Surf Coast
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Richmond memorabilia in his gym shared on social media is grounds for dismissal right? Asking for a friend who’s settling into a new job.
I think that Jack following Richmond/Dusty and having Dusty on his wall may have more to do with both he and Dusty playing for the same junior team (Campbell's Creek). Dusty used to go back regularly to Campbell's Creek training on Pie Nights and junior presentations.
 

manicpie

Premiership Player
Suspended
Jul 19, 2019
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Lack of defensive pressure was one of the knocks on him in his draft year
Depends who is assessing him. According to power rankings in 2019, forward pressure was one of his strengths, Anyway, we have ourselves a genuine HFF goal kicker who is an under ager and the scope for improvemet is limitless. I don't want him to play midfield, I want him exactly where as he is
 

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
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I think that Jack following Richmond/Dusty and having Dusty on his wall may have more to do with both he and Dusty playing for the same junior team (Campbell's Creek). Dusty used to go back regularly to Campbell's Creek training on Pie Nights and junior presentations.
Yeah supporting Richmond is no go, but supporting Dusty is OK. He really should take out a marker and make those pictures black and white.
 

Mukesh

Premiership Player
Oct 23, 2014
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That's a myth. Most of the good ones went top 10 in their draft year. They don't come cheap. And you can't be a good team without good mids.
true, good mids are expensive to buy in (maybe not Jarryd Lyons)... but I reckon there are many people capable of playing in the midfield with success, but there are less people capable of successfully playing forward...where success is measured by goals..
 

sr36

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true, good mids are expensive to buy in (maybe not Jarryd Lyons)... but I reckon there are many people capable of playing in the midfield with success, but there are less people capable of successfully playing forward...where success is measured by goals..
Hard to really say. I'd suggest that many who would be very good small forwards play mid. If you've got a player who would be a good forward as well as being a good mid, you'd generally play them mid as it's a more crucial role. Although you get exceptions when a team has a really stacked midfield. And we are seeing a bit of a shift, with someone like Dusty playing mostly forward for the last few years and Danger spending a fair bit of time there too.
 

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jonbe54

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 18, 2009
16,800
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Obviously you can find crap players of every position really easily and cheaply - not sure why you'd want to though.
There are levels between star and crap sr but I get your point. But you said it yourself you won't find a midfield star outside the top 10 in any draft year - there are 18 teams in the competition and an average of 3 mid fielders needed for each club.

Not every mid field draftee is star quality because A They don't have to be and B there simply are not enough elite trait midfielder to fill 54 positions a year.

It's a simple matter of doing the maths.
 

manicpie

Premiership Player
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Jul 19, 2019
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That's a myth. Most of the good ones went top 10 in their draft year. They don't come cheap. And you can't be a good team without good mids.
Are you sure?, I can think of a heap of gun midfielders that didn't go top 10. Lyons, Zorko, Mundy, I can't be bothered naming them all but there are plenty
 

Pie eyed

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Jun 26, 2007
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I'm more of the opinion - imagine if Cox was ever coached to add playing from behind to his repertoire. He just went for front position every single time and wasn't strong enough to hold the position.
If we got Cox when he was 18 and we chucked him in the weight room for 4 years...
If I was as tall as Cox and could still run as hard and fast as I could when I was in my 20's I would be a Brownlow medalist.
If I was as big as Cloke there would be a slew of corpses about 40 meters from the point of the square.

What I am saying is if Cox actually had strength he would be a different player.
He's a bean pole.
His sole duty was to bring the ball to ground and mark it if he gets a run.
 

sr36

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If we got Cox when he was 18 and we chucked him in the weight room for 4 years...
If I was as tall as Cox and could still run as hard and fast as I could when I was in my 20's I would be a Brownlow medalist.
If I was as big as Cloke there would be a slew of corpses about 40 meters from the point of the square.

What I am saying is if Cox actually had strength he would be a different player.
He's a bean pole.
His sole duty was to bring the ball to ground and mark it if he gets a run.
Yes, but I'm suggesting that he would have done his job better from behind, as it takes less strength to hold your position from behind.
 

Mukesh

Premiership Player
Oct 23, 2014
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Kalapathar, Havelock Island
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Hard to really say. I'd suggest that many who would be very good small forwards play mid. If you've got a player who would be a good forward as well as being a good mid, you'd generally play them mid as it's a more crucial role. Although you get exceptions when a team has a really stacked midfield. And we are seeing a bit of a shift, with someone like Dusty playing mostly forward for the last few years and Danger spending a fair bit of time there too.
I guess we will have to differ on this...if I had a player who would be a good forward (kicks and creates goals) as well as being a good mid, I'd play him forward because I'd be more confident of finding another guy to play in the midfield...
 

Jen2310

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Aug 21, 2018
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Yeah not that it matters but the family are hawthorn supporters from memory. Loved Breust


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeah, I recall that from an interview, so didn't think it was because they were richmond supporters.
Think his dad said that he viewed Jack as a Bruest type of player.
 

Scodog10

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Jul 25, 2008
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Yes, but I'm suggesting that he would have done his job better from behind, as it takes less strength to hold your position from behind.
I think he just entered the system too late from a development perspective. My best guess is that the club thought he’d be even easier to hold out of contests if he gave up front position because of his lack of footy instincts and centre of gravity.

For instance against guy’s like Andrews or Pearce it’s unlikely he’ll be outreached from in front so in order to out mark him they at least have to manoeuvre him under the ball and potentially give up free kicks. Giving front position to them effectively means he can’t compete. I just think he was always a shitty forward and we just lumped him there because he was super tall and had mobility. I’m strong of the belief that as a football mind Buckley has forgotten more than we’ll ever know, but his mind set toward tall forwards seemed his biggest blind spot.
 

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