Oppo Camp James Aish, (Traded to Freo 2019)

[TradeDraft]

Will improve once he gets a real coach and a properly functioning environment around him...

100% agree and Lot of other Players well

 

[loki04]

We did not give up a High Pick for Him though

We gave up 2 picks in the low to mid 20s.

Usually you are a fair chance to land a player capable of 150 games in that bracket also every now and then a gun ala Beams and Hannebery. Conversly you may completely strike out but odds are you find at least 1 capable player from 2 shots.

I still think Aish will become a player and likely 200 gamer so I am not against the trade but I can also see the other side of the coin.

 

[NT.Thunder]

Terrible Form I hope he Can get Out of this Funk he has been for over a Season

I'm not sure we can label 1-3 year players has having poor form. I mean he has to show good form consistently doesn't he to then regress to poor form.
Aish, like DeGoey and Grundy who get far too much scrutiny from this board are all developing players with unfair expectations on all their heads. They are in a struggling team, that is disorganised on the field with at times poor leadership so let's cut them some slack. This isn't about unicorns and rainbows - this is about having realistic expectations of youth that all show promise.

 

[MagpieBat]

100% agree and Lot of other Players well

Yep.

 

[TradeDraft]

We gave up 2 picks in the low to mid 20s.

Usually you are a fair chance to land a player capable of 150 games in that bracket also every now and then a gun ala Beams and Hannebery. Conversly you may completely strike out but odds are you find at least 1 capable player from 2 shots.

I still think Aish will become a player and likely 200 gamer so I am not against the trade but I can also see the other side of the coin.

We Traded 2 2nd Rounders but Last Years one was a Downgrade to Pick 34 and then Pick 34 was in a Trade to GWS where we moved up to Pick 27

 

[loki04]

We Traded 2 2nd Rounders but Last Years one was a Downgrade to Pick 34 and then Pick 34 was in a Trade to GWS where we moved up to Pick 27

So we traded pick 27 ie mid round and this years 2nd round from Saints likely to be a pick around the same.

 

[TradeDraft]

So we traded pick 27 ie mid round and this years 2nd round from Saints likely to be a pick around the same.

Was Pick 28 We Traded but got Back Pick 27 from GWS

 

[Busse]

What I do not understand with Aish is how he is yet to play at VFL level this season. (yes he played practice matches but these don't count.)
How can someone who is so horribly out of form not have a chance to regain some form and confidence in the VFL. He has shown very little in his time at Collingwood, but enough in my view that he can still contribute to the future of the club. I think that is something people forget about, the fact he is 20 years old. We did not trade for him to come in, round 1 and be one of our best players. He is a player for the future and thats how he should be seen. I blame his poor form and obvious poor confidence on our coaching staff.
As for the article, it is a joke to compare the 2 players. for one they are totally different player types, then look at the team differences. Sydney are a team full of great players, they are a team that has lost only 1 match for the season, a team that beat us by 80 points! Then look at our team. Our whole game plan is totally flawed. Majority of our players seem to not know what is going on.

 

[TradeDraft]

What I do not understand with Aish is how he is yet to play at VFL level this season. (yes he played practice matches but these don't count.)
How can someone who is so horribly out of form not have a chance to regain some form and confidence in the VFL. He has shown very little in his time at Collingwood, but enough in my view that he can still contribute to the future of the club. I think that is something people forget about, the fact he is 20 years old. We did not trade for him to come in, round 1 and be one of our best players. He is a player for the future and thats how he should be seen. I blame his poor form and obvious poor confidence on our coaching staff.
As for the article, it is a joke to compare the 2 players. for one they are totally different player types, then look at the team differences. Sydney are a team full of great players, they are a team that has lost only 1 match for the season, a team that beat us by 80 points! Then look at our team. Our whole game plan is totally flawed. Majority of our players seem to not know what is going on.

Because we had so many Injuries

 

[Busse]

Because we had so many Injuries

You can say that , but players like Phillips, Wills, even Macaffer would have been a suffice replacement for him weeks ago.

 

[loki04]

He's had a limited pre-season.
He's still new to the club.
He's missed games through injury/form at VFL and AFL.
He's trying to settle into a team that is asking A LOT from its younger players meanwhile the senior players are out of form and struggling themselves.
He's still adapting to the pace of the game and the bigger bodies.


There's numerous factors in why he may not be playing well.

So we need to have patients write this year off to development let the kids find their way and reload next year with hopefully a fitter list and more idea of how we want to play our "brand" of footy!

 

[TradeDraft]

You can say that , but players like Phillips, Wills, even Macaffer would have been a suffice replacement for him weeks ago.

I agree with Phillips but Wills and Caff play Different Postions

 

[Axl the great]

I think once the team starts to find its rhythm and some kind of system then the improvement will come from all the players not just from Aish, look at the youth at StKilda Carlton and West Coast among others, when they were struggling there were questions asked about their youth not living up to the hype, especially the Saints.
Once it all clicks into gear most players generally come along, It is infinitely easier to get confidence and natural or elevated improvement when the team is playing well.

 

[Busse]

I agree with Phillips but Wills and Caff play Different Postions

100% true, but really isn't offering much of a position at the moment, I think replacing him with any sort of midfielder that you could put at half forward for majority of the game could do is role.

 

[bungalow_bill]

I Know how this sounds, but to me he almost seems to polite as a footballer. and what I mean by this is that there have been instances in games where he and another team mate are near ever a loose ball. and he almost goes out of his way to ensure that the other player get's it. it's almost like his lost all confidence and doesn't want the ball in hand. personally I don't believe the year can get worse and they should play him out of the centre square and try get him some early touches. even if it's a cheeky one two. and build up the confidence.

He definitely doesn't suffer from white line fever. His problem is no real weapons. Classy player though.

 

[CLUBMEDhurst]

I think once the team starts to find its rhythm and some kind of system then the improvement will come from all the players not just from Aish, look at the youth at StKilda Carlton and West Coast among others, when they were struggling there were questions asked about their youth not living up to the hype, especially the Saints.
Once it all clicks into gear most players generally come along, It is infinitely easier to get confidence and natural or elevated improvement when the team is playing well.

Man, I hope you're on the money, Axl

 

[rose jam]

I just don't understand what characteristic a recruiter would have seen in him, it's mega puzzling.

Sent from my GT-I9507 using Tapatalk

 

[Lefthanded]

Was Pick 28 We Traded but got Back Pick 27 from GWS

Collingwood received Aish and pick No.34 and 53, and gave up picks No.26, 28, 47 and a 2016 second-round pick http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-10-22/aish-a-pie-bastinac-a-lion-in-threeway-deal
Given picks 34 and 53 are weaker than 28 and 47 respectively we effectively paid approx pick 20 and Saints 2016 2nd round.
Pick 28 we got with Treloar, nothing to do with Aish
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_AFL_draft

 

[Axl the great]

Man, I hope you're on the money, Axl

Don't worry I have been in sparkling form lately, killing it to rave reviews with AC/DC, back with Slash and Duff and spot on about our future too I reckon .

 

[Mateyman]

I know. Just quoted the related bits of the article for those who couldn't access it.

Yeah fair, I was just pointing out that the article doesn't even make sense rating him as a midfielder when he hasn't played there

 

[robertg22]

Collingwood received Aish and pick No.34 and 53, and gave up picks No.26, 28, 47 and a 2016 second-round pick http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-10-22/aish-a-pie-bastinac-a-lion-in-threeway-deal
Given picks 34 and 53 are weaker than 28 and 47 respectively we effectively paid approx pick 20 and Saints 2016 2nd round.
Pick 28 we got with Treloar, nothing to do with Aish
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_AFL_draft

So the way I read it is we gave up 26, 28, 47 and (as it stands) pick 24 from this year also.

In return, we got 34, 53 and Aish.

Using the AFL's draft pick points rating system (http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/Father-son-bidding-system.pdf) that they now use for academy and F/S picks, we have shelled out 2507 worth of points in return for 775 points and Aish, so a net loss of 1650 draft 'points'.

1650 points on the scale is just a bit more than pick 7. Am I reading it right?

If so, Aish for pick 7 right now is horrendous.

 

[ottoman]

So the way I read it is we gave up 26, 28, 47 and (as it stands) pick 24 from this year also.

In return, we got 34, 53 and Aish.

Using the AFL's draft pick points rating system (http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/Father-son-bidding-system.pdf) that they now use for academy and F/S picks, we have shelled out 2507 worth of points in return for 775 points and Aish, so a net loss of 1650 draft 'points'.

1650 points on the scale is just a bit more than pick 7. Am I reading it right?

If so, Aish for pick 7 right now is horrendous.

I like your analysis, assuming the data is correct.

 

[robertg22]

I like your analysis, assuming the data is correct.

It assumes that St Kilda remain in 13th spot and there are no compensation picks in the first round (I am sure there will be) so that pick 24 from this year is likely to be a bit further down, but not by a significant amount..

 

[TradeDraft]

So the way I read it is we gave up 26, 28, 47 and (as it stands) pick 24 from this year also.

In return, we got 34, 53 and Aish.

Using the AFL's draft pick points rating system (http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/Father-son-bidding-system.pdf) that they now use for academy and F/S picks, we have shelled out 2507 worth of points in return for 775 points and Aish, so a net loss of 1650 draft 'points'.

1650 points on the scale is just a bit more than pick 7. Am I reading it right?

If so, Aish for pick 7 right now is horrendous.

We never gave a 1st Rounder for Aish.

 

[robertg22]

We never gave a 1st Rounder for Aish.

Congratulations for completely failing to comprehend everything I wrote in my post.