Jarryd Lyons

azza77

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#51
Ask Tex who he wants kicking the ball to him, M Crouch or Lyons? Lyons is a very good contested mark but is slow but if he can have a full pre season his endurance will be where it should be. As a centre clearance player and as a forward Lyons is better, around the field M Crouch is better.

With your draw it is a uphill battle to make finals but not impossible but imo by halfway through when Thompson makes the 300 he may be pushed out if finals are off the cards
Dont think Id be calling Lyons a great contested mark mate. He's never proven otherwise.

Lyons does have the ability to hit a few forwards lace out, when he's just outside the 50 and has 0 pressure on him. Put him in the midfield where the heat is on and he has little time, and you'll find he's often dropping his kicks short or they are wide of the mark. Would definitely not rate him an above average field kick.

Id also argue Matt Crouch's contested game is just as good as Lyons' at this stage. Lyons might be ahead, but only slightly.

In terms of the future of our club, I know who Id be giving games to, and its definitely Matt Crouch. Lyons is pretty much playing at his full potential right now. Matt Crouch is capable of so much more.

Hell if I was coach, id even be giving Gore a run over Lyons. Again, not that I have some deep hatred for Lyons or think that he is utter garbage, but I just think Gore has a lot more potential to be unlocked and has many more strings to his bow.
 

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#52
Id also argue Matt Crouch's contested game is just as good as Lyons' at this stage. Lyons might be ahead, but only slightly.

In terms of the future of our club, I know who Id be giving games to, and its definitely Matt Crouch. Lyons is pretty much playing at his full potential right now. Matt Crouch is capable of so much more.
Agree to disagree. I dont see much more improvment in M Crouch, I see him as a solid midfielder with no real stand out quality while Lyons while slow is a better kick and is a better forward.

I still maintain giving Thompson another year was a mistake, your better off giving CEY, M Crouch and Lyons real centre time this year
 

Mattrox

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#53
Agree to disagree. I dont see much more improvment in M Crouch, I see him as a solid midfielder with no real stand out quality while Lyons while slow is a better kick and is a better forward.

I still maintain giving Thompson another year was a mistake, your better off giving CEY, M Crouch and Lyons real centre time this year
A 3rd year player who is only completing his 1st full preseason has no improvement left in him. You are right, let's just resign ourselves to the fact that his career had plateaued.


o_O
 

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#54
Agree to disagree. I dont see much more improvment in M Crouch, I see him as a solid midfielder with no real stand out quality while Lyons while slow is a better kick and is a better forward.

I still maintain giving Thompson another year was a mistake, your better off giving CEY, M Crouch and Lyons real centre time this year

So you would have been happy to lose both our best two midfield from 2015.
Thommo was second to Danger in most fields Stats and considering he came from a restricted pre season, At this time he is the best Midfielder on the Crows list It up to the others to take that mantle of him. We can speculate and say who we think can but At this point in time He is the best Stats also support the argument. He stops playing when he drops down the pecking order not before.
 

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#55
If the choice was two of CEY, M Crouch, Lyons - surely Lyons misses out at this stage?

I reckon Lyons has a bit of the Sam Shaws about him - there is obviously potential there, but how long do you wait to see it bloom? M Crouch has shown he is up for the fight at AFL level, and seeing the brothers Crouch in the centre will be something. There has to be some advantage in playing with someone you have played alongside your ENTIRE life. There must be :)
 
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#56
I’m not sold on Lyons, but to be fair his opportunities with the sub have been limited. Because of this he hasn’t been given sufficient game time. This may change for him this year, depending on our form/injuries.


From what I’ve seen of him so far, there’s nothing remarkable about him. He doesn’t have an elite leg or explosive speed.


I would rather see the likes of Matt Crouch, Cam Ellis-Yolmen and our new recruits in the side ahead of him. He’s competing for that final spot in the side, and I don’t see him breaking through this year.


I would love to be proven wrong by the young fella, but my instincts tell me otherwise.
 

azza77

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#57
Agree to disagree. I dont see much more improvment in M Crouch, I see him as a solid midfielder with no real stand out quality while Lyons while slow is a better kick and is a better forward.

I still maintain giving Thompson another year was a mistake, your better off giving CEY, M Crouch and Lyons real centre time this year
Matt Crouch has the aggression and hunger that very few players have, we just haven't seen the extent of it yet as he hasn't had the fitness base to provide for his hunger. He also appears to read the game better than Lyons.

I have Thommo and BoB in the same side, but if one of them went down then no doubt CEY and Lyons would be next in line.

I just see Lyons as too similar to Thommo to be able to play in the same side, especially the way modern day football is played.

I do agree with you however with the Thommo dilemma, and have debated on here the idea of continuing to play Thommo consistently over this last year or so. We always want to see the new and next generation guys in the side and they are the future after all. Considering that this club has had many setbacks, there appears to be very little value for the club in playing him in 22 games. But, you still do need that senior head and experience somewhere in your side and that's what Thommo provides.
 

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#58
Grigg has to be ahead of Lyons. Has had just as much of a debacle with the vest as Lyons but was the best sub in the league. Was cementing his spot in Walsh's side until he let himself and the club down off field. He's paid his penance now. Elite disposal and very good defensive running capacity surely put him far ahead given a game plan that will no doubt try to focus on clean ball movement and team defense. Lyons strengths are his clearance work and goal sense. Unfortunately for him we have others who do these things and potentially with more upside. We need fit users of the footy. We've been smashing the clearances for years without much to show for it. It's more about uncontested ball movement hitting targets and running to provide targets and defend the entire ground these days
 

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#59
If the choice was two of CEY, M Crouch, Lyons - surely Lyons misses out at this stage?

I reckon Lyons has a bit of the Sam Shaws about him - there is obviously potential there, but how long do you wait to see it bloom? M Crouch has shown he is up for the fight at AFL level, and seeing the brothers Crouch in the centre will be something. There has to be some advantage in playing with someone you have played alongside your ENTIRE life. There must be :)
To be fair, we haven't really given him a real shot to bloom. He's been sub more often than not. Nobody is going to play consistently good football when they're sub for 3 weeks, go back to the SANFL, play an AFL game, sub for a fortnight then get dropped back to SANFL for a month and repeat it all again.
 

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#60
Grigg has to be ahead of Lyons. Has had just as much of a debacle with the vest as Lyons but was the best sub in the league. Was cementing his spot in Walsh's side until he let himself and the club down off field. He's paid his penance now. Elite disposal and very good defensive running capacity surely put him far ahead given a game plan that will no doubt try to focus on clean ball movement and team defense. Lyons strengths are his clearance work and goal sense. Unfortunately for him we have others who do these things and potentially with more upside. We need fit users of the footy. We've been smashing the clearances for years without much to show for it. It's more about uncontested ball movement hitting targets and running to provide targets and defend the entire ground these days
I think Thommo will struggle to fit into what you describe above. There either needs to be a seperate rule for his defensive role or he won't be playing much football in the 1's next year. Is going to be a very interesting first half dozen games.
 

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#61
I think Thommo will struggle to fit into what you describe above. There either needs to be a seperate rule for his defensive role or he won't be playing much football in the 1's next year. Is going to be a very interesting first half dozen games.
I get the feeling he'll get to 300 regardless of how he's travelling.
 

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#62
I get the feeling he'll get to 300 regardless of how he's travelling.
I can't think of any player who has been denied that honor having gotten this close and Thommo won't be the first and nor should he be. My gut feel is he'll be starting most games on the bench and will not be Sauce's main target at anywhere near the volume of stoppages he was at last year.
 

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#63
I think Thommo will struggle to fit into what you describe above. There either needs to be a seperate rule for his defensive role or he won't be playing much football in the 1's next year. Is going to be a very interesting first half dozen games.
Our press went to pot as soon as Thommo came back last year as well. A press is only as tight as it's weakest link and as soon as you've got an immobile player who can't peel off his man and pressure the ball carrier or effectively block space then there's a hole in the press and that's all you need at this level to waltz it out.

Thommo shouldn't really be playing at this stage imo. I guess it's a reaction to losing danger and being worried about a clearance/leadership void. But if CEY/Mrouch hit their straps in the clearances Thommo may be in trouble
 

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#64
I think Lyons is this year's Wright. Small, slow, can't kick very far but absolutely dominates in the SANFL. Unlike Wright though he does have a pretty good goal sense, but with Betts, Cameron, Menzel, Knight and Milera, I think we have the small forward spots covered.

I'd rather invest games into Gore/CEY but he will still get a number of opportunities when injuries arise. It's do or die for him when those opportunities arise.
 

1970crow

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#65
Our press went to pot as soon as Thommo came back last year as well. A press is only as tight as it's weakest link and as soon as you've got an immobile player who can't peel off his man and pressure the ball carrier or effectively block space then there's a hole in the press and that's all you need at this level to waltz it out.

Thommo shouldn't really be playing at this stage imo. I guess it's a reaction to losing danger and being worried about a clearance/leadership void. But if CEY/Mrouch hit their straps in the clearances Thommo may be in trouble
Tend to agree. Seeing games almost entirely on TV, you see how ineffective his stoppage disposals are. Compared to Lyons or CEY who are mobile and get the ball to a player outside, Thommo is stationary and dishes off to players still under pressure. He doesn't take opponents on, be it lack of leg power or confidence. Again my gut feel is that he'll be a bit player off the bench and struggle with the game plan. We've accepted it for years but every year offensive and defensive spread becomes more important. I don't think we can gave a seperate rule for Scott Thompson any longer. But as said above, he'll get to 300, but I doubt much further.
 

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#66
I think Lyons is this year's Wright. Small, slow, can't kick very far but absolutely dominates in the SANFL. Unlike Wright though he does have a pretty good goal sense, but with Betts, Cameron, Menzel, Knight and Milera, I think we have the small forward spots covered.

I'd rather invest games into Gore/CEY but he will still get a number of opportunities when injuries arise. It's do or die for him when those opportunities arise.
Except you won't see Lyons holding his spot for 2/3rds of the year playing shit each week.
 

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#67
Tend to agree. Seeing games almost entirely on TV, you see how ineffective his stoppage disposals are. Compared to Lyons or CEY who are mobile and get the ball to a player outside, Thommo is stationary and dishes off to players still under pressure. He doesn't take opponents on, be it lack of leg power or confidence. Again my gut feel is that he'll be a bit player off the bench and struggle with the game plan. We've accepted it for years but every year offensive and defensive spread becomes more important. I don't think we can gave a seperate rule for Scott Thompson any longer. But as said above, he'll get to 300, but I doubt much further.
Yep and when you see him off the tv you realise how much he labours behind the play and struggles to reach effective positions in open play. He's a clearance specialist. Not sure if the modern game allows you to carry one of these. Definitely thought our midfield looked most dynamic and balanced in the first couple of games against North and Collingwood
 
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#68
Agree to disagree. I dont see much more improvment in M Crouch, I see him as a solid midfielder with no real stand out quality while Lyons while slow is a better kick and is a better forward.

I still maintain giving Thompson another year was a mistake, your better off giving CEY, M Crouch and Lyons real centre time this year
Lol, you just need to see how m crouch is moving this pre-season v last year to see his fitness has gone to another level.

There is natural improvement just there with a more ready made body for Afl.
 

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#69
Some people are going to be surprised about Thommo, He is currently the Best Midfielder in the Crows side, For both effectiveness and disposals, and other players will need to lift to knock him off, By the end of the year he will still be in the top 4 of the Crows midfielders. And he has been playing in the modern game for a few years and still racking up the disposals, On a bad day he get 20 touches 12 effective. Let see 4-5 of these other player bettering his bad games before ruling him out. He can also kick a bag full of goals when resting in the forward line.
As for Lyons he needs a bigger tank, his ability to recover is slower than some. which affects his two way running late in the quarters.
 

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#71
I can't think of any player who has been denied that honor having gotten this close and Thommo won't be the first and nor should he be. My gut feel is he'll be starting most games on the bench and will not be Sauce's main target at anywhere near the volume of stoppages he was at last year.
Do we have the luxury to get Thomo to 300 games if he's not helping the team? Especially with less rotations. Or will the game slow down from this and we find Thomo goes even better.
 

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#72
Lyons always struck me as a player who would really benefit from playing whole games. I think that players who have natural footy skill, as opposed to natural athletic talent, take time to "warm into" a game. Lyons falls into the former category for me. He's not on an AFL list because he's an exceptional athlete, but because he's got good footy instincts.
 
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#73
Lyons always struck me as a player who would really benefit from playing whole games. I think that players who have natural footy skill, as opposed to natural athletic talent, take time to "warm into" a game. Lyons falls into the former category for me. He's not on an AFL list because he's an exceptional athlete, but because he's got good footy instincts.
Lyons doesn't appear to have issues running out sanfl games.

This year he is having an uninterrupted pre-season unlike last year which will improve his fitness base.

Imo Lyons should benefit from less rotations as hardly a burst player.

The issue is we probably can't play thommo, m crouch, cey & Lyons in the same side... But it's good we have competition for inside spots, even without Dangerfield. They all bring different attributes, so interesting to see who the match committee prefer when all fit.
 
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#74
Do we have the luxury to get Thomo to 300 games if he's not helping the team? Especially with less rotations. Or will the game slow down from this and we find Thomo goes even better.
Thommo's form didn't drop of in 2015 & until it does, thommo keeps getting a game as quality.

However, I believe he should be rested for a few games during the year to keep him fresh.
 

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#75
So you would have been happy to lose both our best two midfield from 2015.
Thommo was second to Danger in most fields Stats and considering he came from a restricted pre season, At this time he is the best Midfielder on the Crows list It up to the others to take that mantle of him. We can speculate and say who we think can but At this point in time He is the best Stats also support the argument. He stops playing when he drops down the pecking order not before.
Of course he'd be happy for us to lose 2 of our best mids, he's a port supporter.
 
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