Strategy Jason Horne-Francis in 2021 mega thread

Easy, it’s pronounced

  • Horn-ee, like he’s feeling amorous

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Bearded Clam

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Sounds legit...it was probably in the weekly internal staff newsletter.
Sounds a but far fetched doesnt it..

But then again.. we did offer North a kings ransom for pick 1 (and thus JHF) in the trade period last year.. which showed just how unbelieveably desperate the crows were to snag him…

so..

its nowhere near outside the realms of possibility that we’d offer something like the rumour is suggesting if we think he’s now gettable..

Edit: and its also probably worth mentioning we have a decent amount of coin in our salary cap we need to start throwing around..

We’ve lost some big names in the last 4 years (bcrouch, talia, lynch etc), who wouldve been on big coin, and have replaced them all with juniors that wouldnt be on much coin at all..
 
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Bearded Clam

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Freo fan. In the premiership window.
If he does end up telling north he wants out.. north will be praying he choses crows over port or freo..

We’ll have a top 4 pick.. freo and power should be finalists but not really sucessful one’s.. reacon both will just scrape in and get knocked out in the first week..
 

Carmo

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Ive said it before and I'll say it again, no chance he comes to the crows. Stop wasting your time.

I will say very good idea to make an offer like that though, serves several purposes.
 

texanmike

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That's what I like about it. I'm 99% he goes to Port, but if it helps drive the price up, I'm ok with that.
what I don’t get is why so many people feel he will go to port, just because his step dad played for them? Big deal, he’s his own man. He didn’t even support port power, throw the cheque book at him he’s gettable.
 

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ABAB

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My mate who works at the club said yesterday we’ve offered JHF six years at 800k.
Interesting.....don't we use the Geelong's salary scheme were players earns more than the captain at the club, Sloane is reportedly on $800K and we've freed up a lot of salary from Talia so we should up this to $1M.
 

Carmo

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what I don’t get is why so many people feel he will go to port, just because his step dad played for them? Big deal, he’s his own man. He didn’t even support port power, throw the cheque book at him he’s gettable.
My reasoning is nothing to do with his father, its based on other stuff. Although I will say adding his father's name to his surname just before the draft sends a signal dont you think? Anyway, time will tell.
 

texanmike

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My reasoning is nothing to do with his father, its based on other stuff. Although I will say adding his father's name to his surname just before the draft sends a signal dont you think? Anyway, time will tell.
yes it was pretty strange that he did that but he would of known he was always going to north after they knocked back our offer. I still think he will resign with north
 

Betts are off

Norm Smith Medallist
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As much as I think there is a >1% chance of this eventuating. Jason Horne-Francis is the perfect example of how the AFL is still in its infancy in terms of Free Agency, in particular how recruiters and fanbases overemphasize "fair deals" in trades of A++ players. When at the end of the day, its not suppose to be fair!

Right now we probably have 50% of the people in this thread terrified of throwing too much at JHF in terms of money and draft capital, just incase he doesn't continue to look like the player he's been his entire life (including this year at AFL level). Rather then taking an aggressive approach at a 19year old, pick#1, superstar who has multiple club champion/ brownlow medalist potential.

If you look at deals in the NFL, NBA, IPL, MLB and the EPL. If teams in those leagues have a shot at a 2nd contract player with that kind of ceiling, they don't hesitate in making them the highest paid player at their position. And for those type of players fanbases couldn't care less about the price. It may seem like a lot, but the proof is in the pudding, star players change teams, every single year!!

I feel like AFL transactions will get to this point eventually, but right now recruiters and fans are both so afraid of being seen as "paying overs" that the only way players move, is if they personally want to change teams. But make no mistake, if the Crows really wanted JHF, they could get him. But they would need have to be willing to put up a deal so unpassable that Jason would be stupid to do anything else. And TBH, I don't think 6 years at $800k is that deal, its a exceptionally good offer. But its certainly not a "can't say no" type deal.
 

Crow till I die

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As much as I think there is a >1% chance of this eventuating. Jason Horne-Francis is the perfect example of how the AFL is still in its infancy in terms of Free Agency, in particular how recruiters and fanbases overemphasize "fair deals" in trades of A++ players. When at the end of the day, its not suppose to be fair!

Right now we probably have 50% of the people in this thread terrified of throwing too much at JHF in terms of money and draft capital, just incase he doesn't continue to look like the player he's been his entire life (including this year at AFL level). Rather then taking an aggressive approach at a 19year old, pick#1, superstar who has multiple club champion/ brownlow medalist potential.

If you look at deals in the NFL, NBA, IPL, MLB and the EPL. If teams in those leagues have a shot at a 2nd contract player with that kind of ceiling, they don't hesitate in making them the highest paid player at their position. And for those type of players fanbases couldn't care less about the price. It may seem like a lot, but the proof is in the pudding, star players change teams, every single year!!

I feel like AFL transactions will get to this point eventually, but right now recruiters and fans are both so afraid of being seen as "paying overs" that the only way players move, is if they personally want to change teams. But make no mistake, if the Crows really wanted JHF, they could get him. But they would need have to be willing to put up a deal so unpassable that Jason would be stupid to do anything else. And TBH, I don't think 6 years at $800k is that deal, its a exceptionally good offer. But its certainly not a "can't say no" type deal.
just highlighting EPL - its a totally different animal as there is no salary cap. The only impediment is the FIFA financial fair play laws that can still be worked around ALA Man City with the owners brother who owns Etihad sponsoring the city of manchester stadium for something like half a billion dollars that counts towards club revenue.

We are on a salary cap system with finite resources to trade and spend
 

Betts are off

Norm Smith Medallist
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just highlighting EPL - its a totally different animal as there is no salary cap. The only impediment is the FIFA financial fair play laws that can still be worked around ALA Man City with the owners brother who owns Etihad sponsoring the city of manchester stadium for something like half a billion dollars that counts towards club revenue.

We are on a salary cap system with finite resources to trade and spend
Fair enough, and in that sense the NFL is probably the closest like for like league to what we are dealing with. But even they are much more mature in sense of player movement and what can be done if you're willing to pay the piper.

Put it this way. If you go on a NFL teams chatroom at the start of Free Agency, you wont find the term "Playstation Trade" anywhere. Every deal is a "playstation trade" in the NFL!
 

Crow till I die

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Fair enough, and in that sense the NFL is probably the closest like for like league to what we are dealing with. But even they are much more mature in sense of player movement and what can be done if you're willing to pay the piper.

Put it this way. If you go on a NFL teams chatroom at the start of Free Agency, you wont find the term "Playstation Trade" anywhere. Every deal is a "playstation trade" in the NFL!
Honestly these last couple of years have anesthetized me somewhat to losing players. I mean Rachele, Thilthorpe, Dawson and Butts are the only ones I just would not want to trade, but if the right type of deal presented for any other player, I'd be up for it as a supporter. The only thing I ask of my club is to be better than any other club and extract maximum value whilst giving up minimum value
 

Bearded Clam

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My reasoning is nothing to do with his father, its based on other stuff. Although I will say adding his father's name to his surname just before the draft sends a signal dont you think? Anyway, time will tell.
I agree it was strange timing when it came to that name change.. but did he actually maybe do that in the hope that it might keep him in Adelaide?..

Because he surely couldnt be dumb enough to think that wouldve got him all the way through to Ports 1st draft pick in the early teens… but ge may have been thinking it might get put enough Victorian teams to get him to pick 4 and Adelaide.. and thus not have to move interstate..

Lots of have, maybes and couldve’s!..

I dont know that the pull toward pprt would be that massive for him.. given he’s a freo supporter.. sure Fabian might try and get in his ear about going to port.. but he could just go to the club out of port and crows with the best deal on offer..

Then again.. he could ask to go to freo!
 

Betts are off

Norm Smith Medallist
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Honestly these last couple of years have anesthetized me somewhat to losing players. I mean Rachele, Thilthorpe, Dawson and Butts are the only ones I just would not want to trade, but if the right type of deal presented for any other player, I'd be up for it as a supporter. The only thing I ask of my club is to be better than any other club and extract maximum value whilst giving up minimum value
It should have. Thats the way Gil wants it to be. Player moving every offseason fast and often! Getting too invested in players is a recipe for a broken heart in terms of AFL fandom now-a-days.

However, to be honest, "winning trades" on AFL.com also no longer interests me that much. Getting top down type players is far more intriguing. Players that don't need to be justified as best 22, because they're clearly best 5. Players that opposition teams desperately don't want to lose!

For better or for worse, those are the deals that move the needle. And we a club that clearly needs a needle mover or 2!

P.s. Not saying JHF is that move, but its a great example of a needle moving scenario.
 

Bearded Clam

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Fair enough, and in that sense the NFL is probably the closest like for like league to what we are dealing with. But even they are much more mature in sense of player movement and what can be done if you're willing to pay the piper.

Put it this way. If you go on a NFL teams chatroom at the start of Free Agency, you wont find the term "Playstation Trade" anywhere. Every deal is a "playstation trade" in the NFL!
The Australian NRL doesnt have drafts.. players dont even care about contract status with numerous moves made every year regardless..

And there doesnt end up being dominant teams..

In fact.. if you look at the past 20 years of AFL and NRL there have been a heap more different flag winners in the NRL over the AFL..

Barely any triple premiership winners in a row too..

The NRL actually seems way more equalised.. No drafts, no trade costs - just an enforced salary cap.

Does result in a lot of players playing for numerous different clubs throuhhout their careers though.. but so what..
 

Thetrader15

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As much as I think there is a >1% chance of this eventuating. Jason Horne-Francis is the perfect example of how the AFL is still in its infancy in terms of Free Agency, in particular how recruiters and fanbases overemphasize "fair deals" in trades of A++ players. When at the end of the day, its not suppose to be fair!

Right now we probably have 50% of the people in this thread terrified of throwing too much at JHF in terms of money and draft capital, just incase he doesn't continue to look like the player he's been his entire life (including this year at AFL level). Rather then taking an aggressive approach at a 19year old, pick#1, superstar who has multiple club champion/ brownlow medalist potential.

If you look at deals in the NFL, NBA, IPL, MLB and the EPL. If teams in those leagues have a shot at a 2nd contract player with that kind of ceiling, they don't hesitate in making them the highest paid player at their position. And for those type of players fanbases couldn't care less about the price. It may seem like a lot, but the proof is in the pudding, star players change teams, every single year!!

I feel like AFL transactions will get to this point eventually, but right now recruiters and fans are both so afraid of being seen as "paying overs" that the only way players move, is if they personally want to change teams. But make no mistake, if the Crows really wanted JHF, they could get him. But they would need have to be willing to put up a deal so unpassable that Jason would be stupid to do anything else. And TBH, I don't think 6 years at $800k is that deal, its a exceptionally good offer. But its certainly not a "can't say no" type deal.
I agree, 6x800k is a good deal, but in 3 years time, he could be worth 1.3m if he's in the best few players in the league. Alternatively, he might not make it and it's a lot to spend, but I feel we are now in a place to overspend than underspend.

It's a lot to bet on a young kid, but the dogs did similar with Boyd, and it worked out / didn't work out for them.
 

Betts are off

Norm Smith Medallist
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The Australian NRL doesnt have drafts.. players dont even care about contract status with numerous moves made every year regardless..

And there doesnt end up being dominant teams..

In fact.. if you look at the past 20 years of AFL and NRL there have been a heap more different flag winners in the NRL over the AFL..

Barely any triple premiership winners in a row too..

The NRL actually seems way more equalised.. No drafts, no trade costs - just an enforced salary cap.

Does result in a lot of players playing for numerous different clubs throuhhout their careers though.. but so what..
Exactly, massive yoyo league. But the players get paid, their teams are never 20 years irrelevant, and they probably extend their players careers in the process.