Jeremy Cameron

[PhatBoy]

Does the NRL play their Grand Final at the same venue every year? Brisbane played Collingwood at their home ground twice despite being the higher ranked team.

Yes

 

[Mad_Hatter]

You have basically written a bunch of words which have no meaning whatsoever. How are GWS toxic? Do you have a shred of evidence about their culture? GWS enabled him to become the best forward of his era and until Saturday GWS were more successful than Geelong in the past 4 years. I stand by my previous comment. GWS had a stack of talent and should of won flags by now. The only reason they haven't is players like him have demanded to be overpaid or they will go home. So they finish outside of the 8 for the first time in 5 years, when they only dropped because they lost the last 3 games of the season, 2 of them close losses, when he has underperformed all year and himself kicked 2 goals in those last 3 games as a 1.4mil dollar man. And GWS is failing him?

Do you have any idea what you are on about?
You do realise this is the AFL board, right?
Open both eyes and grasp some reality bud.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Salt? Yeah, duh

the strong get stronger and the weak are left weaker. Free agency is a joke of a system.

Benefits two groups: strong clubs and players

But you were ok when you got Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Dixon? Fine with it then?

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

You could almost forgive Tom Lynch chasing some success but Cameron has been in Prelims and Granny’s for the last few years

Pretty soft to jump right in to another contending team

Arguably offset by Lynch leaving the club that he was captain of at the time (along with his co-captain).

I'd hate it if I were a neutral too. Good for Geelong, but not good for the game. Unless you're one of the SA/WA clubs (where you're one of only two options for a 'go home' player), at this point you may as well forget landing one of the really big fish in the free agent market if you missed the finals.

Perhaps limiting the heavy front/back loaded contracts is a way to even the playing field (i.e. the clubs with more cap space free immediately will have an advantage over the clubs that are already loaded).

 

[Duckenthusiast]

The AFL's job is not to subsidise clubs who are incompetent at managing their own affairs. Look at Richmond and the basket case they used to be to where they are now. It IS possible with the right leadership and coaches - the problem is clubs who refuse to look in the mirror and instead scream about how unfair everything is instead of just accepting the cards they are dealt and moving towards their goals. There are always going to be losers and winners - the AFL draft rewards the losers as well - we don't need anything else FFS.

That is a crock of s**t. Go and have a look at all of the big 4 Vic clubs. Collingwood was broke, Richmond was wobbly, Essendon was Heavily in Debt, Carlton couldn't produce books you could trust. Hawthorn have been bailed out by another state because the AFL would rather have Tasmania prop some Vic clubs up rather than have one of their own. The only way those clubs have had the free cash to make the investments they have is they a) don't have to travel and therefore don't incur the cost of doing so b) playing 15 million games in Victoria against other Victorian teams so even if you only get 30k supporters out to a game, you get 20-40k from the opposition and c) get prime time billing - much easier to get sponsorship when every game you play is Fri/ Sat night, like Collingwood. The one time the Collingwood/ Carlton game got scheduled on a Sunday, they got 40k to the game and Eddie went ******* spare.

So you take those undeniable benefits, give them some free cash, and then invest them into pokies - wow what geniuses those club administrators must be. What amazing business acumen and skill. On top of that the SA clubs get absolutely fisted in their Stadium deal so that the SANFL can fund junior development meanwhile the AFL funds the TAC cup.

Lots of these benefits spill over onto the attractiveness of the clubs for the players as well. Have more money, means better facilities. Less travel, means more time with the family. More time in primetime means bigger exposure and recognition and ability to attract personal sponsorship and media commitments. The players are also more likely to want to play in front of 60k every week instead of 30-40k, even though a lot of interstate clubs have similar numbers of fans that attend each week. So spare me the 'some clubs are run better' horseshit. Port is an amazingly run club with the hand it is dealt. The 2 WA clubs are among the richest and best run in the league. Adelaide has been very well administered and only went off the rails when its head coach was murdered. 2 of the other 4 clubs are all but run by the AFL and its facilities are whatever the AFL decided to give it.

 

[port_adelaide_1870]

But you were ok when you got Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Dixon? Fine with it then?

Dixon and Watts were not free agents. Motlop and Rockliff are hardly great players. Good at best definitely not in the same category of a Lynch or Cameron.

 

[PhatBoy]

That is a crock of sh*t. Go and have a look at all of the big 4 Vic clubs. Collingwood was broke, Richmond was wobbly, Essendon was Heavily in Debt, Carlton couldn't produce books you could trust. Hawthorn have been bailed out by another state because the AFL would rather have Tasmania prop some Vic clubs up rather than have one of their own. The only way those clubs have had the free cash to make the investments they have is they a) don't have to travel and therefore don't incur the cost of doing so b) playing 15 million games in Victoria against other Victorian teams so even if you only get 30k supporters out to a game, you get 20-40k from the opposition and c) get prime time billing - much easier to get sponsorship when every game you play is Fri/ Sat night, like Collingwood. The one time the Collingwood/ Carlton game got scheduled on a Sunday, they got 40k to the game and Eddie went ******* spare.

So you take those undeniable benefits, give them some free cash, and then invest them into pokies - wow what geniuses those club administrators must be. What amazing business acumen and skill. On top of that the SA clubs get absolutely fisted in their Stadium deal so that the SANFL can fund junior development meanwhile the AFL funds the TAC cup.

Lots of these benefits spill over onto the attractiveness of the clubs for the players as well. Have more money, means better facilities. Less travel, means more time with the family. More time in primetime means bigger exposure and recognition and ability to attract personal sponsorship and media commitments. The players are also more likely to want to play in front of 60k every week instead of 30-40k, even though a lot of interstate clubs have similar numbers of fans that attend each week. So spare me the 'some clubs are run better' horseshit. Port is an amazingly run club with the hand it is dealt. The 2 WA clubs are among the richest and best run in the league. Adelaide has been very well administered and only went off the rails when its head coach was murdered. 2 of the other 4 clubs are all but run by the AFL and its facilities are whatever the AFL decided to give it.

What do you propose happens mate.

The AFL calculates the circumference of australia, divides it by 18, and spaces the clubs out evenly along the coastline, gives them all the same facilities, identical grounds, chooses which players go where and everybody is happy?

 

[Luv_our_club]

Is it time Geelong fans stopped denying the huge advantage they have over most others clubs (if not all clubs):

1. They are the only team of 10 clubs in Vic who attract wantaway players that prefer not to live in the city/prefer rural life; any wantaway player who prefers the city of Melbourne have 9 clubs to chose from.

2. The only team of 10 clubs in Vic who have a suburban ground and home crowd and clear home advantage.

Both these advantages has served them extremely well over the last decade.

 

[Duckenthusiast]

But you were ok when you got Motlop, Rockliff, Watts and Dixon? Fine with it then?

We Traded for Watts and Dixon. That's the entire point, we've basically traded out of 2 drafts to get Dixon/ Ryder. That's why we have a gap in our 23-26 range. If we could have got Dixon/ Ryder and kept 1st x 2 and 2nd x 2 , we'd be a 2-3 good players better than we are right now. Richmond gets a better Forward for nothing. Hawthorn gets a AA KPD for nothing. You get a quality player in Dalhaus for nothing. And even though it looks like you are going to be forced to trade for Cameron it will be under a situation where GWS is under more pressure to get a deal done. You got one of the best players in the competition and pick 50 for pick 9, 28, and Dean ******* Gore.

I don't think you are complaining about Moltop. The AFL made sure to rig the compo so you got the pick you needed to trade for Ablett who you wanted 3x more than Motlop. Rockliff was good business albeit Brisbane didn't fight much for him as he had a stuffed shoulder and took 18 months to come good. More than happy to accept a situation where we have to trade for the next Motlop/ Rockliff to ensure an even comp.

 

[PhatBoy]

Is it time Geelong fans stopped denying the huge advantage they have over most others clubs (if not all clubs):

1. They are the only team of 10 clubs in Vic who attract wantaway players that prefer not to live in the city/prefer rural life; any wantaway player who prefers the city of Melbourne have 9 clubs to chose from.

2. The only team of 10 clubs in Vic who have a suburban ground and home crowd and clear home advantage.

Both these advantages has served them extremely well over the last decade.

Mate shut up.
The only team who play home games, away from home, against an away team, at their home.
And we still have a winning record on every ground bar Optus Stadium.
Statistically we could never return to Geelong and we’d keep making finals.

End argument, f*** it off and let it go.

 

[deanc]

Free agency has been a disaster for the AFL. All it’s done, is consistently make the top sides stronger...BUT those are the rules, so well done to both the Cats and Lions....

Cameron is a massive get for the Cats. He’s the best free agent in the market this season. Him and Hawkins will be unstoppable next season. Cameron will also be able to play more up the ground...with his endurance, he will be elite at the cats....good luck to every other side trying to match up on Hawkins, Cameron and Dangerfield

Looks like GWS will match, so the Cats will have to trade at least two of their first round picks...for a player in his prime like Jeremy Cameron

5

Jeremy Cameron

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

9.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.6

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.0

5star

, you do that deal in a heartbeat...he’s worth 10 x more than treloar and shiel who cost the same.

Not sure it's been a disaster in general terms, but in hindsight (in the spirit of equalization) Free Agency policy should of included a condition that a player can nominate any club, providing they have not finished top 4 in any of the past 3 seasons.
I'm also not sure the AFL (or anybody really) could of predicted how rare it has become for the FA players existing club to match offers to retain a player, unless it's a lifetime deal, i.e. Tigers with Martin or more recently GWS with Coniglio...

 

[Boxhead_31]

Holy moly this is a scathing review of the situation haha. I agree with it too.

Loyalty is all but gone in footy.

Not really, loyalty is why Geelong is able to make a FA offer to Cameron.
Clubs best players have agreed for the good of the club to take under the market value so the club can remain competitive

 

[Duckenthusiast]

What do you propose happens mate.

The AFL calculates the circumference of australia, divides it by 18, and spaces the clubs out evenly along the coastline, gives them all the same facilities, identical grounds, chooses which players go where and everybody is happy?

Not rigging the fixture worse than Russians rig elections for one. Ending FA. Top seed plays a home GF. Equivalent funding for feeder comps outside of Vic. Dislcosure of salaries and non football earnings so we can see exactly who is getting what.

 

[HairyO]

Frawley to Hawthorn was Big, but I assume he means Lynch to Richmond.

Frawley was mocked for pretty much his entire career.

A single AA in 8 years and Melbourne got Pick 3 compo.

Im pretty sure despite us getting our man the feeling was Melbourne were the big winners. Petracca and Brayshaw for picks 2 and 3.

 

[HairyO]

Is it time Geelong fans stopped denying the huge advantage they have over most others clubs (if not all clubs):

1. They are the only team of 10 clubs in Vic who attract wantaway players that prefer not to live in the city/prefer rural life; any wantaway player who prefers the city of Melbourne have 9 clubs to chose from.

2. The only team of 10 clubs in Vic who have a suburban ground and home crowd and clear home advantage.

Both these advantages has served them extremely well over the last decade.

And their players keep finding $1 waterfront pubs for sale. Its a magical place.

 

[Duckenthusiast]

Frawley was mocked for pretty much his entire career.

A single AA in 8 years and Melbourne got Pick 3 compo.

Im pretty sure despite us getting our man the feeling was Melbourne were the big winners. Petracca and Brayshaw for picks 2 and 3.

FA throws up dumb distortions like that compo. It doesn't help your nearest rivals that you have been made a better side at no direct cost though.

 

[Duckenthusiast]

It is, but the draft is set up so it was never really there anyway. What connection would a west Victorian kid like Cameron have with a club in outer Sydney that didn't even exist when he was a teenager?

He had a pretty good connection to it when he was pocketing 1mil a season there.

 

[JackFlash]

Is it time Geelong fans stopped denying the huge advantage they have over most others clubs (if not all clubs):

1. They are the only team of 10 clubs in Vic who attract wantaway players that prefer not to live in the city/prefer rural life; any wantaway player who prefers the city of Melbourne have 9 clubs to chose from.

2. The only team of 10 clubs in Vic who have a suburban ground and home crowd and clear home advantage.

Both these advantages has served them extremely well over the last decade.

There won't be 10 Victorian clubs by 2022 or 23, Geelong has it just as tough as any club..

 

[HairyO]

FA throws up dumb distortions like that compo. It doesn't help your nearest rivals that you have been made a better side at no direct cost though.

Sure. But I also dont think clubs should own players their entire life. So there has to be a mechanism for a player who has stayed for a length of time to be able to move.

 

[Duckenthusiast]

Sure. But I also dont think clubs should own players their entire life. So there has to be a mechanism for a player who has stayed for a length of time to be able to move.

Through trading. It is the way the league was set up. You only get so many points. The only way you get more points is to get worse and move up the draft order. Therefore the only way to win a flag is to turn what you have into something better (either finding a bargain in the draft or trading for someone and turning them around). In order to get Dixon/ Ryder into the club, we had to move pieces around, we didn't get something for nothing. When we traded for players like Pickett and Wakelin in the early 2000s to win a flag, we condemned ourselves 2008-12. That is how the comp should be. You don't get a free lunch.

 

[HairyO]

Through trading. It is the way the league was set up. You only get so many points. The only way you get more points is to get worse and move up the draft order. Therefore the only way to win a flag is to turn what you have into something better (either finding a bargain in the draft or trading for someone and turning them around). In order to get Dixon/ Ryder into the club, we had to move pieces around, we didn't get something for nothing. When we traded for players like Pickett and Wakelin in the early 2000s to win a flag, we condemned ourselves 2008-12. That is how the comp should be. You don't get a free lunch.

And when a club refuses to trade a player who wants out ?

 

[PIEWITHSAUCE]

The only team who play home games, away from home, against an away team, at their home.

I don't know how it plays out across all teams but you're actually not. Collingwood play North and/or St Kilda (depending on the year) at Marvel for our home game. Just sayin'

 

[Duckenthusiast]

And when a club refuses to trade a player who wants out ?

They always have the option of entering the draft (my view is it should be the main draft only). Just about the only time it ever happened was us with Nick Stevens

Multiple players found. Use birthday to differentiate. eg [PLAYERCARD="23/11/1962"]Joe Smith[/PLAYERCARD]

. He wanted to go to one of our nearest rivals in Collingwood and instead ended up at a bottom team. The view from us was we would rather get nothing and prop up a team that wasn't a thread than do a trade that made us a worse team and our rival a better one. Stevens still ends up back home. No one outside of Victoria were going to draft him.

On face value, the same option is possible now, but it places more pressure on the trading club. They have the FA comp pick and look 'petty' for allowing it to happen. Clubs don't ever get market value in this instance.

 

[Dr Awkward]

You would like to see a salary cap system where the clubs at the top of the ladder can't afford the best free agents (Lynch, Kelly, Cameron).

On another note, this is why I'm not sure that GWS is a sustainable club. They've done well so far, but in the long run who wants to play for a team with no fans. Players are going to keep leaving imo.

 

[Duckenthusiast]

You would like to see a salary cap system where the clubs at the top of the ladder can't afford the best free agents (Lynch, Kelly, Cameron).

On another note, this is why I'm not sure that GWS is a sustainable club. They've done well so far, but in the long run who wants to play for a team with no fans. Players are going to keep leaving imo.

To me their biggest problem is they are a s**t version of Melbourne. More expensive to live there. More traffic. Big town, but with no AFL presence, and no crowd. Qld teams at least have a point of difference. For all the arrogance of Victorians, Brisbane/ GC are amazing cities. Its a beautiful city, easier to drive around, the weather is amazing, cheaper COL. GC struggled to retain players early because they were operating out of a tin shed and they got belted by 15 goals every second week. Once they start making finals, I think they will hold their players.