Preview JLT 1: GWS v Collingwood

[Gone Critical]

I think it's an 8 player I/C for both JLT1&2

Thanks. I didnt know but just guessed it might go down as it has in other years. If it stays makes Shaz more of a chance for JLT2

 

[Gone Critical]

You might be right about the pecking order, and I don't mind that Scharenberg might have to show some VFL form.

I suppose I'm less surprised by Scharenberg than I am by Murray, who I think fills are more urgent need and who might have been given more chance to prove himself.

I also thought that Crocker might have been given a go before Mayne, but there you go.

I think Murrays stocks have been maybe artificially elevated by the price we paid. He was not near senior selection in 2017 so he needs a bit of time so wont be a surprise if he is mainly a VFL player this year.

 

[rand corp]

No need for histrionics here its a rotation; some guys will play the first game others the second, its who impresses when their turn comes that will have a say in selection when the real stuff starts.

 

[loki04]

Those numbers don't really have anything to do with the JLT series though. In those days (noticed you stopped after 2013) they were actually playing for silverware & it was a competition of sorts. Nowadays there is no competition finals, nor silverware & no winner. It's now just a trial match.
Can we have the stats since JLT series began instead of the ones that aren't relevant?

So it's okay for you guys to bring up Carlton winning in that competition as a reason but not me to retort with the same competition?

I even stated in it that it was in that format and that JLT was different. It's harder to gauge it and needs further context to said wins/loss', like teams fielded, how they played, who they played and where.

2014 NAB challenge (2 televised games and 1 regional game). Here was the eventual top 5 after finals.

Hawks 3/3 wins, Premier.
Sydney 2/3 wins (Loss vs Nth 4th), Runner up.
Port 2/3 wins (Loss Adel 10th), 3rd.
North 2/3 wins (Loss Car 13th), 4th.
Geel 2/3 wins (loss Nth 4th), 5th.

2015. 3 games.
Hawks 1/3 wins (Loss Pies 12th, Nth 4th) Premier
WC 1/3 (Loss Freo 3rd, Port 9th), Runner up
Freo 2/3 (loss Syd 5th) 3rd.
Nth 2/3 (Loss Adel 6th) 4th.
Syd 2/3 (Loss lions 17th) 5th (4th after HnA).

2016.
Dogs 1/3 (Loss Pies 12th, Mel 11th) Premier (7th after HnA with 15 win and 7 loss record)
Syd 2/3 wins (Loss GWS 3rd), runner up.
GWS 2/3 (loss Dogs premier) 3rd.
Geel 1/3 (Loss Freo 16th, Pies 12) 4th.
Crows 2/3 (Loss Freo 16th) 5th.

2017. JLT top 6.
Rich 2/3 (Loss Pies 13th 7 points) Premier.
Adel 2/3 (Loss Rich Premier) runner up.
Geel 1/3 ( Loss Hawks 12th 4 points, Adel 2nd 6 points) 3rd.
GWS 2/3 (Loss Syd 6th) 4th
WC 2/3 (Loss GWS 4th) 5th.
Syd 2/3 (Loss Nth 15th) 6th.


Barring the odd team here and there, it very much reads how the old format knockout comp reads and that is more often then not the good teams tend to win even in the preseason.

 

[jackcass]

I think Murrays stocks have been maybe artificially elevated by the price we paid. He was not near senior selection in 2017 so he needs a bit of time so wont be a surprise if he is mainly a VFL player this year.

What appears to have been an interrupted preseason wont help his cause.

 

[jackcass]

Players who don't play JLT will also have the following VFL practice games before R1 to show their wares. The 16/3 game between JLT2 and R1 might be critical for a few of the players returning from injury. Obviously DeGoey's performances will be watched with great interest.

Collingwood Intra-club Friday 02-Mar-18 6:00 PM Olympic Park Oval
Richmond v Collingwood Thursday 08-Mar-18 6:00 PM Swinburne Centre, Richmond
Collingwood v Coburg Friday 16-Mar-18 7:00 PM Olympic Park Oval

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Some of those names are in and out of the 22, some like deledio are quality players that have barely played for them, Williams and Setterfield are out for the season.

So of the available they are missing around 5 best 22 players. They also have a dearth of top line draft picks and talent that need to be played and situation completely different to ours even still they named a relatively strong 22.

Seven of them are best 22 as I said.

As for Setterfield, if we had a 20 year old top five pick out for the season there would be a riot.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Players who don't play JLT will also have the following VFL practice games before R1 to show their wares. The 16/3 game between JLT2 and R1 might be critical for a few of the players returning from injury. Obviously DeGoey's performances will be watched with great interest.

Collingwood Intra-club Friday 02-Mar-18 6:00 PM Olympic Park Oval
Richmond v Collingwood Thursday 08-Mar-18 6:00 PM Swinburne Centre, Richmond
Collingwood v Coburg Friday 16-Mar-18 7:00 PM Olympic Park Oval

Shame the last game will be against witches hats. Not sure theres any point playing the likes or Elliot Greenwood and Fasolo in that match

 

[frizzle]

So it's okay for you guys to bring up Carlton winning in that competition as a reason but not me to retort with the same competition?

I even stated in it that it was in that format and that JLT was different. It's harder to gauge it and needs further context to said wins/loss', like teams fielded, how they played, who they played and where.

2014 NAB challenge (2 televised games and 1 regional game). Here was the eventual top 5 after finals.

Hawks 3/3 wins, Premier.
Sydney 2/3 wins (Loss vs Nth 4th), Runner up.
Port 2/3 wins (Loss Adel 10th), 3rd.
North 2/3 wins (Loss Car 13th), 4th.
Geel 2/3 wins (loss Nth 4th), 5th.

2015. 3 games.
Hawks 1/3 wins (Loss Pies 12th, Nth 4th) Premier
WC 1/3 (Loss Freo 3rd, Port 9th), Runner up
Freo 2/3 (loss Syd 5th) 3rd.
Nth 2/3 (Loss Adel 6th) 4th.
Syd 2/3 (Loss lions 17th) 5th (4th after HnA).

2016.
Dogs 1/3 (Loss Pies 12th, Mel 11th) Premier (7th after HnA with 15 win and 7 loss record)
Syd 2/3 wins (Loss GWS 3rd), runner up.
GWS 2/3 (loss Dogs premier) 3rd.
Geel 1/3 (Loss Freo 16th, Pies 12) 4th.
Crows 2/3 (Loss Freo 16th) 5th.

2017. JLT top 6.
Rich 2/3 (Loss Pies 13th 7 points) Premier.
Adel 2/3 (Loss Rich Premier) runner up.
Geel 1/3 ( Loss Hawks 12th 4 points, Adel 2nd 6 points) 3rd.
GWS 2/3 (Loss Syd 6th) 4th
WC 2/3 (Loss GWS 4th) 5th.
Syd 2/3 (Loss Nth 15th) 6th.


Barring the odd team here and there, it very much reads how the old format knockout comp reads and that is more often then not the good teams tend to win even in the preseason.

Mate I never said anything about Carlton winning it. Others may have, but I prefer to pretend they don't exist.
Anyway we just disagree on this & both of us can put up data to prove our points.
But I still say we don't need to be concerned with the JLT1 result. Pretty much all our rookie listed players are getting their chance & rightly so.
I would think they would have known from a while ago that this will be their chance to impress & have prepared accordingly.
I don't care about the result. I'm just looking forward to watching some footy after the AFLX junk.

 

[frizzle]

Seven of them are best 22 as I said.

As for Setterfield, if we had a 20 year old top five pick out for the season there would be a riot.

Top 6 player out for 2 seasons doesn't count?

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Top 6 player out for 2 seasons doesn't count?

Thats why there would be a riot given it wouldnt be the first time

 

[jackcass]

Shame the last game will be against witches hats. Not sure theres any point playing the likes or Elliot Greenwood and Fasolo in that match

More point than them not getting any competitive game time at all before R1.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

More point than them not getting any competitive game time at all before R1.

Coburg are pretty s**t. Its arguable.

 

[jackcass]

Coburg are pretty s**t. Its arguable.

Yeah...... nah!

As we see every year, most clubs will be applying to the AFL for players to play that weekend in a bid to get them ready for R1. Coincidence? Me thinks not. The opposition is irrelevant.

 

[loki04]

Mate I never said anything about Carlton winning it. Others may have, but I prefer to pretend they don't exist.
Anyway we just disagree on this & both of us can put up data to prove our points.
But I still say we don't need to be concerned with the JLT1 result. Pretty much all our rookie listed players are getting their chance & rightly so.
I would think they would have known from a while ago that this will be their chance to impress & have prepared accordingly.
I don't care about the result. I'm just looking forward to watching some footy after the AFLX junk.

Not to be an ass but...I'm yet to see you put up any data, only unfounded opinions in the face of actual results shown across 2 preseason formats.

As I said it isn't season destroying but it clearly isn't putting you on the front foot to have a poor preseason or "tank" it, especially for a club that is down the arse end of the ladder needing confidence and belief.
If we were a top 4 team then my stance would change and blooding youth and depth mixed may be the best tact, but not for a bot 6 team imo.

If we lose but show improvement in skills and game play elements I'll be happy but winning would increase the teams belief and confidence heading into rnd 1.

It also appears there are a lot of key players injured so clubs hand is tied a bit which i was not aware of full extent before today, still prefer to blood youth over the terrible trio.

 

[CFC2010]

Not to be an ass but...I'm yet to see you put up any data, only unfounded opinions in the face of actual results shown across 2 preseason formats.

If we lose but show improvement in skills and game play elements I'll be happy but winning would increase the teams belief and confidence heading into rnd 1.

It also appears there are a lot of key players injured so clubs hand is tied a bit which i was not aware of full extent before today, still prefer to blood youth over the terrible trio.

 

[loki04]

Seven of them are best 22 as I said.

As for Setterfield, if we had a 20 year old top five pick out for the season there would be a riot.

If they are unavailable for an entire year that is no longer a best 22 for 2018.

Of the available players they picked all bar 5 of their likely round 1 team.

 

[frizzle]

Not to be an ass but...I'm yet to see you put up any data, only unfounded opinions in the face of actual results shown across 2 preseason formats.

As I said it isn't season destroying but it clearly isn't putting you on the front foot to have a poor preseason or "tank" it, especially for a club that is down the arse end of the ladder needing confidence and belief.
If we were a top 4 team then my stance would change and blooding youth and depth mixed may be the best tact, but not for a bot 6 team imo.

If we lose but show improvement in skills and game play elements I'll be happy but winning would increase the teams belief and confidence heading into rnd 1.

It also appears there are a lot of key players injured so clubs hand is tied a bit which i was not aware of full extent before today, still prefer to blood youth over the terrible trio.

Then just don't be one

I did put up data earlier in the piece only for you to use unfounded opinions to counter my argument. See what I did there?
Essendon up by 27 points etc. But hey they still lost the game didn't they? It's a win or a loss & not who was in front at any particular time.

You are also putting up data that takes in the whole of the pre season competitions not just JLT1, which is the whole argument here. Just wait to see what team is named for JLT2. You wont have to wait long. We are giving all the rookies a run because they wont probably get another crack at it this season.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Keen to see Stephenson in the flesh. He's lightning quick. Anyone else heading up? It's been nearly 20 years since we've played in Canberra.

I live there. Will be standing on the hill having a couple of beers. Can't believe Pies are playing here!

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

If they are unavailable for an entire year that is no longer a best 22 for 2018.

Of the available players they picked all bar 5 of their likely round 1 team.

I wasnt actually counting Setterfield amongst the seven best 22 players the are missing, as hes young and still developing

Notable absentees: Toby Greene, Rory Lobb, Brett Deledio, Tom Scully, Jacob Hopper, Zac Williams, Nick Haynes , Will Setterfield, Aidan Corr , Matt Buntine , Adam Kennedy

Greene Lobb Deledio and Scully are absolute top liners.
Williams played 23 games last year, Haynes 19, Corr 23.

Theres your seven. Throw in Hopper (13 games) if you want to make it eight.

Just because it doesnt suit your agenda to admit GSW is managing its list in the preseason in a similar fashion to Collingwood....doesnt make your theories correct.

Both teams are approaching this game in similar fashion.

 

[Carringbush2010]

J Albert

You can actually get a free week through the AFL app (even as a non-Telstra customer) if you subscribe for 1 week, then cancel your subscription, you're given a 7 day free trial. Have to watch it on your phone/tablet though or stream it to a larger screen.

Hey Bard, bit of advice for me please? How do I stream from my phone to the TV?

 

[jackcass]

Hey Bard, bit of advice for me please? How do I stream from my phone to the TV?

I bought a phone to HDMI lead and used to just plug the phone into the TV but they changed the video format so that it doesn't expand to full screen any more. Not sure anymore.

 

[swoop42]

Is the JLT series free on AFL live or does one have to pay for a 7 day pass? (I'm not a Telstra customer)

 

[Carringbush2010]

I bought a phone to HDMI lead and used to just plug the phone into the TV but they changed the video format so that it doesn't expand to full screen any more. Not sure anymore.

Thanks Jack, might just have to watch it on the phone

 

[loki04]

I wasnt actually counting Setterfield amongst the seven best 22 players the are missing, as hes young and still developing

Notable absentees: Toby Greene, Rory Lobb, Brett Deledio, Tom Scully, Jacob Hopper, Zac Williams, Nick Haynes , Will Setterfield, Aidan Corr , Matt Buntine , Adam Kennedy

Greene Lobb Deledio and Scully are absolute top liners.
Williams played 23 games last year, Haynes 19, Corr 23.

Theres your seven. Throw in Hopper (13 games) if you want to make it eight.

Just because it doesnt suit your agenda to admit GSW is managing its list in the preseason in a similar fashion to Collingwood....doesnt make it so.

Again Williams out for 2018 season so "6" as long as GWS don't look to make a few changes with players coming in or out of the team, you know the million first rounders playing NEAFL... GWS have an abundance of talent that would play in most other teams it is not the same situation as us.

You are talking about a team that has close to round 1 midfield Forwards ad key defenders in it...

Even they are saying it is a "strong line up"

GIANTS Name Strong Line-Up for Collingwood Clash
Alison Zell February 27, 2018 3:30 PM
Co-captain Phil Davis is ready for his first match of the pre-season.

He’s been impressive all pre-season so he gets the opportunity to show us what he can do against an opposition.
GIANTS assistant coach Mark McVeigh on Zac Langdon
The GIANTS have named a strong line-up as they get set to take on Collingwood in their first JLT Community Series clash at UNSW Canberra Oval on Thursday night.

Co-captain Phil Davis will play his first match of the season when he takes to the field against the Magpies alongside the usual midfield brigade of Callan Ward, Dylan Shiel, Stephen Coniglio, Josh Kelly and Lachie Whitfield.

Jeremy Cameron and Jonny Patton will join forces up forward while Davis will lead a defence that includes Heath Shaw, Ryan Griffen, Adam Tomlinson and former Magpie Lachlan Keeffe.

West Australian draftee Zac Langdon will get his first chance in the orange and charcoal, playing as a small forward, with this week’s stand-in coach Mark McVeigh impressed with the mature-age recruit’s first pre-season.

“We think Zac Langdon is a really good talent and he gets his opportunity to impress,” he said.

“He’s been impressive all pre-season so he gets the opportunity to show us what he can do against an opposition.

“He and Daniel Lloyd have trained really well so we’re hoping their pre-season training form transfers over to opposition and we think it will.

“Those two guys have been really impressive, probably in our top five most impressive players over the pre-season.”

McVeigh was excited to have a strong line-up at his disposal as he takes the reins of the senior side.

“Our midfield looks really strong, arguably it’s our starting midfield for round one, and our forward line is starting to take shape,” he said.

“We’re excited because we feel like we’re starting to build closer to our main team with players in the wings that are training really hard at the moment and we’ll see another influx of senior players for our next JLT match too.”



Also 5 or 6 players missing with the bulk of their "best" players in the team pretty much is close to their best 22. You are in denial if you think that the named GWS team is not a strong team with mainly best 22 types.