Autopsy JLT 4 v West Coast

[Russian Demon]

I just watched the highlights.... some awful umpiring there in those pieces alone. Looks like we got slaughtered on the rebound. Garland isn't up to it.

I really liked Hunt's defensive pressure. So many times there he would have affected a turnover in defensive 50 on a worse side. I know Spencer looks like he had a blinder, but can we not lose sight of the fact the muzz can't play football? He kicks it worse than Karmichael or Issy!

And Gus.... i loved his work. Every possession was silk.

 

[Islanda22]

OMac plays. The reason he was towelled was because he was on JJK. A twig on the reigning Coleman medalist. If it's the real deal TMac goes to Kennedy and OMac to Darling.

Pretty sure he started on LeCres who pretty much was by himself the 1st half

Then onto Kennedy late

 

[blitznu]

Weideman needs to be used far more than what he is atm

Too many times he was free and they kick it over his head or turn the ball over

I think it's out of him and Watts for that 2nd tall option up forward

Spencer is pretty much guaranteed a spot in Round 1

My Round 1 team:

B- Jetta

Happened to both of them all ******* game they were running free 30-40m away yet for some reason the bloke with the ball refused to use em only had to kick it over the top. Id still be going with Watts

 

[Sprout]

What was our defence like? Were we opened up easily?

They broke through the zone far too easily, exacerbated by the size of the ground. It's frustrating to see and a concern for Round 1 given the Saints have arguably taken advantage of it more than any other side.

There was a class gap in skill level but they were obviously more accustomed to the conditions which weren't helping either side. Some of our better mids were well down, namely Tyson and Viney. Some of Tyson's errors you couldn't make up.

A quality small forward or two was sorely missed. Forward line felt far too tall with Spencer lumbering around and Weideman doing, well, not much. We go in with the same forward line and we lose the match.

I'd prefer Jetta over Melksham and would feel better with Frost in the backline. I'm not confident of seeing either of them in Round 1.

Main positive was the midfield looked good when clicking into gear. Lewis will be a great asset this year, and Oliver is definitely one out of the box. His improved ability to run out the game was the most exciting aspect. Once he starts doing that, he could be anything.

 

[Sprout]

Highlight of the game... Buggy running over to give it to the bloke sat behind me who was getting stuck into Hoges after he kicked that first one. He made a beeline to the boundary, gave him the old shut up d@ckhead and raised the finger to his lips. i didn't think I could love the man more, but picking a fight with the crowd in a JLT match. I can't even deal. Was beautiful.

Spencer was great tonight. Oliver is a jet and Gawny couldn't buy a free kick. Umpiring was dreadful.

Wind was a joke, picked up in the third straight to the eagles end and then did a complete 180 and blew their way in the final as well.

I legit love Buggy

Played alright too.

 

[PerfectFooty]

I'd have to say Nib would have to have been our worst last night, really wasn't thinking

 

[Demons Advocate]

Haven't watched the game yet but purely off reports I have a few thoughts/questions:

- How did Watts go?

- The Muss seems to have played a good game and I've seen a few saying he gets a gig round 1. How good a practice game did he play? Because he was a liability in the first 2 JLT's and has had a very unremarkable career. (I really want him to be good because it makes Gawn a much deadlier weapon but Spencer has historically had 1 good senior game where he chases/tackles takes marks etc. followed by 10-12 bad games).

- Trenners was listed, did he play? Is it the end of him?

- I would really like to see Milkshake and Hibberd force their way into the team via the 2's. I know that's not going to happen (and may be an unpopular opinion in Hibberd's case) but to have a whole year away from the game and be a walk up start doesn't sit right with me. Injuries may factor into this too but if we have Vince, Jetta, Frost, 2macs, Hunt and now Jones potentially rotating through half back I think that we are in a reasonable position to introduce Milk/Hibberd through a few JLT's, a few 2's games and then into seniors.

- Agree with the Saints poster regarding a few things here but I'm not going to right off Goodwin as a bad coach after 3 Praccy's haha. There are some concerns I have but the outcomes of his actions are yet to be know. I will say though that Vince should be taken out of the backline. Once Hibberd gets in I would like him to take Vince's current role and see Vince playing half forward/mid. He is good overhead, decent in the contest and can roost a goal.

 

[Simon_Says]

[QUOTE="Mijhaa, post: 49060658, member: 49165"

Garland made whoever he was meant to be playing on (eg Lecras) look like a superstar.

Oliver is an absolute gun and Salem and Brayshaw are primed for big years![/QUOTE]
Now I didn't see the game, but I did watch the highlights off my phone later on.
Yeah I think Garlands time is up, everytime i saw the ball go into there 50 he was playing from behind.

Hes not in my 22.

 

[CTHORANGE]

This was a pretty frustrating game with all the mistakes and general rusty look.

It was a very good sign that we fought back and stayed in the game after that bad 10 minutes in the 3rd quarter when the eagles got a run on though.

Concerning how open Le Cras and Kennedy were all night, not even sure who their opponents were...

OMac must do a lot of things off the ball I don't see, and if so then that's great. But from I can see, he is slow to get going, slow once he is going, and generally poor skills with ball in hand, but he does put in his best efforts in every time he competes. A long term project that we don't have the luxury of building up at Casey.

I would much rather see Lewis getting back and sharing the role Vince is in right now. Lewis is a good user in close and I'd trust him more than Vince making decisions back there. Get Vince back up the ground, he is far too good an offensive weapon to have in the back pocket.

 

[Demons Advocate]

This was a pretty frustrating game with all the mistakes and general rusty look.

It was a very good sign that we fought back and stayed in the game after that bad 10 minutes in the 3rd quarter when the eagles got a run on though.

Concerning how open Le Cras and Kennedy were all night, not even sure who their opponents were...

OMac must do a lot of things off the ball I don't see, and if so then that's great. But from I can see, he is slow to get going, slow once he is going, and generally poor skills with ball in hand, but he does put in his best efforts in every time he competes. A long term project that we don't have the luxury of building up at Casey.

I would much rather see Lewis getting back and sharing the role Vince is in right now. Lewis is a good user in close and I'd trust him more than Vince making decisions back there. Get Vince back up the ground, he is far too good an offensive weapon to have in the back pocket.

I've whipped Omac quite a bit last year in particular. I think his defensive work is pretty good generally but sometimes gets pushed off the ball too easily, still young so understandable. Would be nice to develop him at Casey with Frost taking his role but arguably like you said we don't have the luxury. The problem is his offense is crap. Is getting better though so credit where it is due. Haven't seen last nights game but if he was playing on Kennedy then you can see why he got towelled up.

The loose opposition players in OUR defensive 50 is concerning and a real downside to our style. If our skills aren't up to it we can get seriously damaged on the turnover. As we play Saints in Rd1 who usually score heavily against us when this happens I am a bit worried that this will happen. Just have to trust that as the team is maturing the decision making/skills have improved to a standard where we can execute.

 

[Tulip]

1. Wasteful mids. I just think Bernie Vince is being played out of position down back - it grates on me. He is a better mid than Viney, Jones or Lewis. Bernie Vince was still improving as a mid, and he actually hits targets. Many of your mids last night didn't. 2. Outside of being Goodwin's mate - Melksham would struggle to be Casey level. He is just a bog ordinary football player. The guy cannot hit a target. Makes bad decisions, I just cannot see why or how the Dees targeted him. 3. Petracca should start in the midfield and not move from there. The only thing more obvious than that is that Oliver is something special. 4. Jack Watts get hung out to dry. He was a good track worker and Goodwin showed Neeld like judgement to go hard on him - and for no reason. Then he tries to play it off like Watts was just behind a few. Gimme a break.

Goody needs plenty more time but I agree with your individual points


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[Djcjdees]

Agree with everyone's concerns about the game style and coming up against st kilda, who relish playing against us because of this.

The thing is, it is all predicated upon the delivery inside 50. If we mark it, crumb it and get a shot, or cause a stoppage inside 50 it is a success. Even if we cause a 'slow' turnover it is ok, but as soon as we shank it inside while runnin and gunnin, we are gonna get blown apart by sides who can use it and have pace (like the Eagles and Saints).

When our defence us time to set up, like when we have had the ball down in the forward half for a while, we looked really difficult to score against. Hell, Eagles didnt score until 7 minutes into the game. That is an excellent effort on that ground. Problem is, the delivery inside 50 was so bad and the forward line so dysfunctional and easy to defend, that we only had a goal ourselves.

We need a bit more composure and a better set up, in that we need to make sure we somehow have our best users delivering the ball in there more often than not. If there isn't a clear option, share it around. Don't bomb it unless we have pretty much a guaranteed stoppage to gain out of it. Because you know as soon as we do this, and the side we are playing against are pacy, we will get done.

Also, on umpiring. If the moron didnt pay the stupid deliberate in the 1st qtr, he wouldnt have had to pay all the other stupid deliberates for the rest of the game. Just. Umpire. Properly. None of them were. The game is not better umpiring this way. Just umpire the rules properly.

 

[lose]

Pretty surprised that everyone thinks Spencil is a lock for round 1.. having listened to Goodys press conference I actually would be very surprised if he plays, yeh he kicked 3 goals but he was bloody useless for the rest of the time.. we are way to big and slow down there with him & weid, and I rekon I counted at least 5 times where he got into the space of the leading forwards..

I actually wouldn't play either round 1 to be honest, much rather go with watts, hoges and even an underdone pedo if we have to.. think we will get destroyed on the quick deck with those 2 playing

 

[CWaffles]

Melksham:
Against Eagles - 22 disposals at 81.8% DE
Against Carlton - 23 disposals at 82.6% DE
Bulldogs - 16 Disposals at 69.2% DE

While his game against the Dogs was ordinary I think his last 2 weeks have been pretty good. Not sure why everyone is saying that his disposal is that bad, seems to be getting better as he gets comfortable in our team.

Lets just remember only a few years ago we had blokes like Matt Jones, James Magner and Jordie McKenzie running around.

 

[CWaffles]

Pretty surprised that everyone thinks Spencil is a lock for round 1.. having listened to Goodys press conference I actually would be very surprised if he plays, yeh he kicked 3 goals but he was bloody useless for the rest of the time.. we are way to big and slow down there with him & weid, and I rekon I counted at least 5 times where he got into the space of the leading forwards..

I actually wouldn't play either round 1 to be honest, much rather go with watts, hoges and even an underdone pedo if we have to.. think we will get destroyed on the quick deck with those 2 playing

I don't think Spencer will play round 1, he doesn't get enough of the football to justify it.

He needs to get around the ground more and be used as a marking option as well as getting forward to kick a few goals, otherwise we are better off having another runner in the squad.

 

[CWaffles]

He's ******* immense. Honestly, I'm tempted to ring Sportsbet and get a request on most Brownlow votes for the team for him.

Jump on the Sportsbet website, $21 for Clarry to get the most votes is actually a very good bet.

 

[LeverPuller]

Jump on the Sportsbet website, $21 for Clarry to get the most votes is actually a very good bet.

Wasn't there last night!

 

[Crusty Demon]

No way Spencer plays round 1. Not too sure why he played in this game tbh. 3 goals was a great effort from him though, but we are far too big down forward with him and Gawn in the team. Where is Pederson at? I feel we miss his ability to take a clunker down forward and give a chop out in the ruck. He's much better than Spencer.

Weid is a liability too while he develops IMO. He looks like he'll be a player, he goes when it's his turn, but he's just not ready. He needs games though, so we must be patient.

OMAC similar. Still young and raw. I don't feel totally comfortable with him in our best 22. I'd prefer Frost, but I believe he won't be available Round 1. I can really see the Saints expose us in the back half just like every other time they have played us. We have to literally smash them in the middle to win. Which we are an outside chance to do, but I find it hard to believe we will keep their F50 at Etihad under a score we will manage to kick.

RIP Garland. Simply not up to this level. Depth only please. Once Hibberd and Frost are fit then he wont get a game.

Tyson will be better for the run. Sprayed a few, but he usually does that anyway. Needed a game under his belt, and he got one. Still best 22 and will play round 1 if fit. Same with Watts. Needed a run. Bit concerned he still looked the same lethargic player at times, but needs to show he's seriously putting in Round 1 or faces being dropped.

I'm concerned with Jetta tbh. We need him. He's our best small backman and the Saints have plenty of running small forwards. What the hell is wrong with him? Granted I haven't paid much attention to this pre season, but is he likely for Round 1 or not?

I like others just don't see Melksham in our best 22. He's a decent VFL player, but I don't have any idea why Goodwin chased him so hard. Makes no sense and nothing I've seen of him this pre season changes my mind. Depth player only please.

Hunt, Salem and Brayshaw have certainly showed they will take another step up this season. Petracca as well, but he came crashing down to earth this week after being hailed the next big thing a fortnight ago. I'd like to see him played in the midfield more often and get more of the ball. We get the ball in his hands more often, then good things will happen.

Lewis I still can't believe Hawthorn let a player of his ability go so easily. Regardless if they were past 30 or not, Mitchell and Lewis are still showing how much class they have and Lewis will be a huge asset to us the next couple of seasons.

I feel we miss Kent and Garlett a lot. There presence around the F50 and the flanks are huge for us. Without one we look a bit slow and one dimensional going forward, but without both our F50 entries are very predictable. We need speed moving into the forward half and these guys are sorely missed tbh. Any idea if both or either will be available round 1, because like Frost and Jetta, they are badly needed IMO for us to have a good chance at beating St.Kilda.

Oliver! I think like most people were a little unsure of him being taken so high in the draft, but he has the potential to be a superstar. Someone like a Simon Black who accumulated so many possessions without you realising, and using the handball in such a damaging way. Kid is a gun and IMO flown past Tyson and a couple of others who play a similar role.

 

[The Dr]

No way Spencer plays round 1. Not too sure why he played in this game tbh. 3 goals was a great effort from him though, but we are far too big down forward with him and Gawn in the team. Where is Pederson at? I feel we miss his ability to take a clunker down forward and give a chop out in the ruck. He's much better than Spencer.

Weid is a liability too while he develops IMO. He looks like he'll be a player, he goes when it's his turn, but he's just not ready. He needs games though, so we must be patient.

OMAC similar. Still young and raw. I don't feel totally comfortable with him in our best 22. I'd prefer Frost, but I believe he won't be available Round 1. I can really see the Saints expose us in the back half just like every other time they have played us. We have to literally smash them in the middle to win. Which we are an outside chance to do, but I find it hard to believe we will keep their F50 at Etihad under a score we will manage to kick.

RIP Garland. Simply not up to this level. Depth only please. Once Hibberd and Frost are fit then he wont get a game.

Tyson will be better for the run. Sprayed a few, but he usually does that anyway. Needed a game under his belt, and he got one. Still best 22 and will play round 1 if fit. Same with Watts. Needed a run. Bit concerned he still looked the same lethargic player at times, but needs to show he's seriously putting in Round 1 or faces being dropped.

I'm concerned with Jetta tbh. We need him. He's our best small backman and the Saints have plenty of running small forwards. What the hell is wrong with him? Granted I haven't paid much attention to this pre season, but is he likely for Round 1 or not?

I like others just don't see Melksham in our best 22. He's a decent VFL player, but I don't have any idea why Goodwin chased him so hard. Makes no sense and nothing I've seen of him this pre season changes my mind. Depth player only please.

Hunt, Salem and Brayshaw have certainly showed they will take another step up this season. Petracca as well, but he came crashing down to earth this week after being hailed the next big thing a fortnight ago. I'd like to see him played in the midfield more often and get more of the ball. We get the ball in his hands more often, then good things will happen.

Lewis I still can't believe Hawthorn let a player of his ability go so easily. Regardless if they were past 30 or not, Mitchell and Lewis are still showing how much class they have and Lewis will be a huge asset to us the next couple of seasons.

I feel we miss Kent and Garlett a lot. There presence around the F50 and the flanks are huge for us. Without one we look a bit slow and one dimensional going forward, but without both our F50 entries are very predictable. We need speed moving into the forward half and these guys are sorely missed tbh. Any idea if both or either will be available round 1, because like Frost and Jetta, they are badly needed IMO for us to have a good chance at beating St.Kilda.

Oliver! I think like most people were a little unsure of him being taken so high in the draft, but he has the potential to be a superstar. Someone like a Simon Black who accumulated so many possessions without you realising, and using the handball in such a damaging way. Kid is a gun and IMO flown past Tyson and a couple of others who play a similar role.

I was thinking the same thing about Pedo ... where is he and will he be half a chance for R1? Weid still looks way off it.

 

[dees arent rabble]

Just watching the post game. I really think goodwin is the man to take us to the promise land

 

[stretcharmstrong]

Off topic, but got Max to sign my #11 jumper last week, and I said "you can probably guess who my favourite player is."
Without missing a beat Maxy replies "Paul Johnson?"

Lengendary

 

[astrodee]

We don't know what roles Goody wanted them to play. I suspect Trac had a very different role to last game.
I thought milkshake did everything required of him.
I loved the way the weid kept presenting and knocking the ball to the ground where there were no small forwards to take advantage of it.
The turnovers were reminiscent of their worst efforts from the last few years.
They kept much of their powder dry particularly in all over defence.
All in all I was quite happy with their display

 

[Tulip]

Melksham:
Against Eagles - 22 disposals at 81.8% DE
Against Carlton - 23 disposals at 82.6% DE
Bulldogs - 16 Disposals at 69.2% DE

While his game against the Dogs was ordinary I think his last 2 weeks have been pretty good. Not sure why everyone is saying that his disposal is that bad, seems to be getting better as he gets comfortable in our team.

Lets just remember only a few years ago we had blokes like Matt Jones, James Magner and Jordie McKenzie running around.

You could probably pull out similar stats from Matt Jones in real-season matches. Magner in 2012 would have almost certainly been better, before Crazy Neeldy decided one of our only two functioning midfielders was better off as a pressure forward.

 

[Xhoquelin]

You could probably pull out similar stats from Matt Jones in real-season matches. Magner in 2012 would have almost certainly been better, before Crazy Neeldy decided one of our only two functioning midfielders was better off as a pressure forward.

Yeah Grimes and Matt Jones had very good stats last year but they were safer, conservative kicks, and Jones' lack of composure when it matters went against him.
Melksham seems to have the ability to kick beautifully sporadically, too many mistakes though

 

[Omar Little]

I'd have to say Nib would have to have been our worst last night, really wasn't thinking

To be fair, viney laid him out pretty hard in the 2nd. Most blokes would never have got back up.