JLT Round 2 - v Swans - Sunday March 10. Lismore

gosuns!

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Touk gives everything and performs his role well
But A graders get tagged, they don't tag
Would love to see him step up but he's a fair way from it still IMO
And btw, the bottom 16 players in ANY team are B graders or worse so there's no shame in that
If Touk is bottom 16 in the next year or 2 our midfield is in a much better place.
There's always a spot for a bloke that busts his gut and plays team first footy the way Touk does.

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gcsunsfc

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Heat has wrecked them by this point. Lots of dropped marks and missed kicks. Another terrible game RE: injury. Been a bad pre-season for us.
Was there an injury?
I saw Aaron young - was there someone else?


My thoughts - watched bits and pieces.

Witts is too left hand dominant in the ruck - hits it to the same spot 80% of the time it seems. Not really to our players advantage. I’ve posted this in previous years - it is not just based on today’s game.

Ballard looked great with his intercept marking playing on a 3rd tall.

Weller is a lovely long kick and looks great on the wing.

Miles is not our best inside kid like every Victorian based afl observer was suggesting.

Wil Powell always composed

Collins ok

Hombsch smaller the


We were thoroughly outplayed - but had we taken some opportunities the score would have been closer.
 

TheSunGod

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I reckon it's got a lot to do with our game plan and team structure.
Players are being ask to do way to much and a lot of unnecessary running
Our structures also fall apart very easily due to our midfield regularly getting bashed in the middle. Puts immediate pressure on our immature defence, then our forwards slip out of position moving in to help out the defence and mids.
 

TheSunGod

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Was there an injury?
I saw Aaron young - was there someone else?


My thoughts - watched bits and pieces.

Witts is too left hand dominant in the ruck - hits it to the same spot 80% of the time it seems. Not really to our players advantage. I’ve posted this in previous years - it is not just based on today’s game.

Ballard looked great with his intercept marking playing on a 3rd tall.

Weller is a lovely long kick and looks great on the wing.

Miles is not our best inside kid like every Victorian based afl observer was suggesting.

Wil Powell always composed

Collins ok

Hombsch smaller the


We were thoroughly outplayed - but had we taken some opportunities the score would have been closer.
Rankine hammy.
 

Tex Danger

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Hey guys, question on Hanley (full disclosure! - AF, RDT purposes)

I didnt see any of the game but what I herd on radio sounded like there was a lot of positives from him.

He scored heavily in quarters 1 and 3 but negative 2 in the 2nd.
Did he play a different role in the 2nd or have more TOG in 1st and 3rd and managed more in the 2nd?
 

Suns of Anarchy

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Hey guys, question on Hanley (full disclosure! - AF, RDT purposes)

I didnt see any of the game but what I herd on radio sounded like there was a lot of positives from him.

He scored heavily in quarters 1 and 3 but negative 2 in the 2nd.
Did he play a different role in the 2nd or have more TOG in 1st and 3rd and managed more in the 2nd?
I heard he only played about 50-55% game time.
 

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My thoughts from the game -

- Ballard, Powell and Macpherson should have confirmed their spots in our round 1 team.
>The forward pressure Macpherson offers we don't have in anyone else besides possibly Lemmens, except he does the basics significantly better. With Lemmens out and probably Rankine too Macpherson is a definite starter for me.
>Loving the development of Powell. Give him 2 more pre-seasons worth of muscle and he's going to be genuinely hard to stop. Unbelievably sticky hands, finds separation from his defender really easily and his skills are silky. Picks the right option 9/10 times.
>Ballards reading of the ball from an intercept perspective is exceptional. He was a bit hit and miss last year - talented and showed glimpses but was not confirmed best 22 with a healthy list - but he looks to have put on a lot of size and besides his two horrible kicks, everything he showed in both JLT's suggests he'll play a lot this year.

- I'm concerned with our lack of consistently accumulating midfielders
> Fiorini has the most potential of the group currently to be consistent 25+ average possession mid that we desperately need but I'm concerned that too often we lose the possession count by 50+ touches (83 vs the swans and 60 vs WB). Our midfield is young, sure, but we need to start having games where we have 3, 4 or 5 players at least hitting 25+ touches. you can be the silkiest team in the league (which we 100% are not) and lose on the pure weight of possession numbers we have against us at the moment. in the 2 JLT games we had 2 players go over 25 touches (Miller - 31 vs Sydney and Fiorini 26 both games) whereas WB had 5 (Macrae 40, Hunter 32, Daniel 32, Bontempelli 30 and Liberatore 27) and the Swans had 4 (Kennedy 30, Clarke 29, Papley 27, and Parker 25). It's a big concern imo.
EDIT: This is actually part of why I'm disappointed that Horlin-Smith has pretty much been guaranteed a spot in the starting 22. We don't have the luxury a team like Geelong has with guys like Dangerfield, Selwood, Duncan and Ablett to do the bulk of the accumulation and GHS, as much as he's a quality guy, doesn't provide enough offensively or defensively to justify his selection considering his lack of pure numbers with the ball at AFL level.

- Our forward line at full strength is going to be hard to stop
> Ainsworth, Wright, Burgess, Lukosius, Rankine, Macpherson, Sexton, Ah Chee are all capable of kicking bags given proper supply. At times this year I expect us to catch a few teams out and I expect these guys to really pile on some goals. Lot of talent there. Speaking of Ah Chee - Stop playing him in defence. Looks 1000% times better at half forward or on the wing.

- Development year for King
> Looked lost on the field both games a little and was outmuscled in most contests. Wouldn't mind trialling him forward given our tall forward stocks right now but expect he'll spend a lot of time in the NEAFL. His pace is good though, he's got a great reach and his agility for a big bloke was solid. Lots to work with but will take time.


- We've missed a fit Hanley on the field.
> Underrated how important he will be to the team. Class disposal from defence is hard to come by.

- Rucking situation
> I'm not sure about Witts' effectiveness. Aliir Aliir and Wright had the same amount of hit outs to advantage as what Witts did despite both having 1/3 of the total hitouts Witts had. We were getting smashed in Centre clearances but managed to even the stat sheet by dominance around stoppage clearances (again, pretty crazy that Brodie was ranked 7th in the afl for average centre clearances last year and we're not playing him). There needs to be either more cohesion with Witts and the midfielders or he needs to really work on looking for a player rather than just 'beating' his opponent and hitting the ball nowhere because it isn't working for us and in actuality it was hurting us because he had more sharked hitouts than hitouts to advantage.

- Disposal efficiency needs improving
>Wright 47%DE, 33% Goal percentage
>Fiorini 42%DE, 33% Goal percentage
>Miller 61%DE
>Witts 68%DE
>Ballard 50%DE
>Martin 55%DE
>Bowes 47%DE
>Lukosius 53%DE, 100% Goal percentage
>Ainsworth 54%DE, 50% Goal percentage
>Powell 69%DE
>Miles 42%DE
>Sexton 57%DE, 50% Goal Percentage
>Burgess 33%DE, 20% Goal Percentage
>Hombsch 66%DE
>Ah Chee 66%DE
>Anything less than 70% is shit and unfortunately that was almost everyone in our team. Just from the players above we missed 57 points from missed goal opportunities. The scoreline realistically flattered Sydney because had we been kicking or disposing at even a semi-decent percentage, it would have been only a goal or two in it. Need to work on skills otherwise it's going to be a long season.
 
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SandyToes

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- Rucking situation
> I'm not sure about Witts' effectiveness. Aliir Aliir and Wright had the same amount of hit outs to advantage as what Witts did despite both having 1/3 of the total hitouts Witts had. We were getting smashed in Centre clearances but managed to even the stat sheet by dominance around stoppage clearances (again, pretty crazy that Brodie was ranked 7th in the afl for average centre clearances last year and we're not playing him). There needs to be either more cohesion with Witts and the midfielders or he needs to really work on looking for a player rather than just 'beating' his opponent and hitting the ball nowhere because it isn't working for us and in actuality it was hurting us because he had more sharked hitouts than hitouts to advantage.
Ask yourself as an opposition mid where you're moving to if Witts is rucking against your second stringer
This isn't about Witts- it's about our mids finding a way to beat their mids to the ball and use the Witts advantage
Not good enough or smart enough at the moment unfortunately
What's the record number of possessions in a game for a Suns player excluding Ablett?
 
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Ask yourself as an opposition mid where you're moving to if Witts is rucking against your second stringer
This isn't about Witts- it's about our mids finding a way to beat their mids to the ball and use the Witts advantage
Not good enough or smart enough at the moment unfortunately
What's the record number of possessions in a game for a Suns player excluding Ablett?
Evidently it is against Witts though, at least to some extent, if Wright can get 1/3 the total hitouts but provide the same amount of hitouts to advantage.
42 - Prestia, 2013
40 - Hall, 2016
40 - Hall, 2017
39 - Miller 2016
39 - Lyons 2017
 

SandyToes

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Evidently it is against Witts though, at least to some extent, if Wright can get 1/3 the total hitouts but provide the same amount of hitouts to advantage.
Probably because opposition mids are less likely to setup to rove to 2MP's ruckwork
They be feasting on Witts
I'm not sure what else he can do other than ,as someone has mentioned, bash it forward
It's not a bad thought have someone standing 10 m forward of the ruck contest in theory
But the opposition mids would figure that out within 2 bounces and cover it
 

Old Sol

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My thoughts from the game -

- Ballard, Powell and Macpherson should have confirmed their spots in our round 1 team.
>The forward pressure Macpherson offers we don't have in anyone else besides possibly Lemmens, except he does the basics significantly better. With Lemmens out and probably Rankine too Macpherson is a definite starter for me.
>Loving the development of Powell. Give him 2 more pre-seasons worth of muscle and he's going to be genuinely hard to stop. Unbelievably sticky hands, finds separation from his defender really easily and his skills are silky. Picks the right option 9/10 times.
>Ballards reading of the ball from an intercept perspective is exceptional. He was a bit hit and miss last year - talented and showed glimpses but was not confirmed best 22 with a healthy list - but he looks to have put on a lot of size and besides his two horrible kicks, everything he showed in both JLT's suggests he'll play a lot this year.

- I'm concerned with our lack of consistently accumulating midfielders
> Fiorini has the most potential of the group currently to be consistent 25+ average possession mid that we desperately need but I'm concerned that too often we lose the possession count by 50+ touches (83 vs the swans and 60 vs WB). Our midfield is young, sure, but we need to start having games where we have 3, 4 or 5 players at least hitting 25+ touches. you can be the silkiest team in the league (which we 100% are not) and lose on the pure weight of possession numbers we have against us at the moment. in the 2 JLT games we had 2 players go over 25 touches (Miller - 31 vs Sydney and Fiorini 26 both games) whereas WB had 5 (Macrae 40, Hunter 32, Daniel 32, Bontempelli 30 and Liberatore 27) and the Swans had 4 (Kennedy 30, Clarke 29, Papley 27, and Parker 25). It's a big concern imo.
EDIT: This is actually part of why I'm disappointed that Horlin-Smith has pretty much been guaranteed a spot in the starting 22. We don't have the luxury a team like Geelong has with guys like Dangerfield, Selwood, Duncan and Ablett to do the bulk of the accumulation and GHS, as much as he's a quality guy, doesn't provide enough offensively or defensively to justify his selection considering his lack of pure numbers with the ball at AFL level.

- Our forward line at full strength is going to be hard to stop
> Ainsworth, Wright, Burgess, Lukosius, Rankine, Macpherson, Sexton, Ah Chee are all capable of kicking bags given proper supply. At times this year I expect us to catch a few teams out and I expect these guys to really pile on some goals. Lot of talent there. Speaking of Ah Chee - Stop playing him in defence. Looks 1000% times better at half forward or on the wing.

- Development year for King
> Looked lost on the field both games a little and was outmuscled in most contests. Wouldn't mind trialling him forward given our tall forward stocks right now but expect he'll spend a lot of time in the NEAFL. His pace is good though, he's got a great reach and his agility for a big bloke was solid. Lots to work with but will take time.


- We've missed a fit Hanley on the field.
> Underrated how important he will be to the team. Class disposal from defence is hard to come by.

- Rucking situation
> I'm not sure about Witts' effectiveness. Aliir Aliir and Wright had the same amount of hit outs to advantage as what Witts did despite both having 1/3 of the total hitouts Witts had. We were getting smashed in Centre clearances but managed to even the stat sheet by dominance around stoppage clearances (again, pretty crazy that Brodie was ranked 7th in the afl for average centre clearances last year and we're not playing him). There needs to be either more cohesion with Witts and the midfielders or he needs to really work on looking for a player rather than just 'beating' his opponent and hitting the ball nowhere because it isn't working for us and in actuality it was hurting us because he had more sharked hitouts than hitouts to advantage.

- Disposal efficiency needs improving
>Wright 47%DE, 33% Goal percentage
>Fiorini 42%DE, 33% Goal percentage
>Miller 61%DE
>Witts 68%DE
>Ballard 50%DE
>Martin 55%DE
>Bowes 47%DE
>Lukosius 53%DE, 100% Goal percentage
>Ainsworth 54%DE, 50% Goal percentage
>Powell 69%DE
>Miles 42%DE
>Sexton 57%DE, 50% Goal Percentage
>Burgess 33%DE, 20% Goal Percentage
>Hombsch 66%DE
>Ah Chee 66%DE
>Anything less than 70% is shit and unfortunately that was almost everyone in our team. Just from the players above we missed 57 points from missed goal opportunities. The scoreline realistically flattered Sydney because had we been kicking or disposing at even a semi-decent percentage, it would have been only a goal or two in it. Need to work on skills otherwise it's going to be a long season.
Love the work you have put into this post and your optimism is really refreshing. The only thing I don't agree with is your view that possession numbers win games of football. I would actually argue the opposite - the silkiest teams in the competition actually can win despite weight of possession numbers against them. This is of course just my opinion =)
 
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Love the work you have put into this post and your optimism is really refreshing. The only thing I don't agree with is your view that possession numbers win games of football. I would actually argue the opposite - the silkiest teams in the competition actually can win despite weight of possession numbers against them. This is of course just my opinion =)
I agree that teams with better skills win games - hence my last point about our terrible DE but 83 possession differential is basically the equivalent of having another 5 players out there on the field by the end of the game for Sydney. by sheer weight of disposals, Sydney was going to run over the top of us and will continue to unless we can start matching teams as far as ball winning is concerned
 
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Probably because opposition mids are less likely to setup to rove to 2MP's ruckwork
They be feasting on Witts
I'm not sure what else he can do other than ,as someone has mentioned, bash it forward
It's not a bad thought have someone standing 10 m forward of the ruck contest in theory
But the opposition mids would figure that out within 2 bounces and cover it
That still then tells me that Witts as a ruck isnt going to be effective. If opposition teams are just going to setup to shark his hitouts and do it effectively and we can't beat the other midfields then we're just losing vital clearances by playing him there
 

SandyToes

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That still then tells me that Witts as a ruck isnt going to be effective. If opposition teams are just going to setup to shark his hitouts and do it effectively and we can't beat the other midfields then we're just losing vital clearances by playing him there
Well that's Leigh Matthews theory
I reckon the best idea for him would be just drop it at his feet and let our guys scrounge around for the contested ball
 
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