Game Day JLT2 - Carlton vs Collingwood - Monday 11th March 2.10PM @ Morwell - Final Team Post #777

skadoosh

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JLT and practice games are an opportunity to give young kids a taste of on field action. Teams like Richmond, Sydney and Hawks played their full compliment of 26 players last weekend, while other teams played 25 and 24 players. We only played 22.

Club erred imo. Could have easily played another 2 guys and given them a better experience.
Fitness and being able to run out a full game is a big issue for us given how many younger players we have. Club did the right thing by using players as if a real game.

Albeit being a JLT game, you know the boys put in and grinded out the game. Imagine how the team felt knowing they nearly beat the 2nd placed team from last year. Massive confidence booster and nothing to laugh at.

Confidence and knowing how to win are some big development milestones everyone in our team needs to learn together.
 

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pinot

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phillips is a back up ruckman that went up against the competitions best ruckman some perspective on phillips output - did he compete? yes - did he dominate? no....did grundy dominate? not really.

performance against nankervis will be different again... will likely dominate the hit outs and be competitive around the ground.
 

Bluey24

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Two JLT game sample:

Best 22 and improved: SPS, Weitering, McKay
Moved into best 22: Cuningham, Garlett
Recruited and best 22: Setterfield, Newman, McGovern
Drafted and best 22: Walsh

Best 22 and tracking well after injury in 2018: Murphy, Fisher, Jones, Plowman

Handy depth: Phillips, Polson, JSOS, LO’b, Kennedy
I'd add Dow to first line
 
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Anyone: What was the point of leaving Stocker on the bench for the entire game?
We just don't know the full story, and it is fraught with danger to second guess match committee/ performance management.

It could be that Kerr/Stocker were to 2 chosen to be there as "break only in an emergency" substitutes for an in game injury.

They may have had a different training lead in to those that played VFL because they were only going to play if needed.

It is always a good idea to get fringe players to go through match day prep. and routine to grow and learn.

They would have felt included and very much in the know about the plans on the day, so I don't get why people (not specifically you AD)
complain about the stuff we as observers from afar know nothing about.
 

GoBlues!

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as opposed to preparing for Rd One?
Soap, I still think we could’ve given Stocker or Kerr some game time in the last quarter without any major impact on our Round 1 game preparation. Experienced guys like Simpson, Murph, Ed and Thomas could have had 5-10 mins less game time without it compromising their prep.

Just my opinion though.
 

Soapy V

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Soap, I still think we could’ve given Stocker or Kerr some game time in the last quarter without any major impact on our Round 1 game preparation. Experienced guys like Simpson, Murph, Ed and Thomas could have had 5-10 mins less game time without it compromising their prep.

Just my opinion though.
Maybe but it was about time on ground for the 22. Russell has run the bench over the JLT. I understand the reasoning
 

Opine

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...

You've completely misread what was written, but I suppose that's you living up to your moniker...
Regardless of whether one's feelings about others makes him a misanthrope or an information philanthropist, human companionship is important; I need you Jimmae.

I'm glad you decided to un-ignore me, even if only temporarily. :)
 

Macca43

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Two JLT game sample:

Best 22 and improved: SPS, Weitering, McKay
Moved into best 22: Cuningham, Garlett
Recruited and best 22: Setterfield, Newman, McGovern
Drafted and best 22: Walsh

Best 22 and tracking well after injury in 2018: Murphy, Fisher, Jones, Plowman

Handy depth: Phillips, Polson, JSOS, LO’b, Kennedy
Those first 9 players will go a long way to determining our season.
 

cfc05

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Not sure if true. Liam was wearing the t shirt training top at 3/4 time. Was fairly obvious that he was not playing at all. Unless it changed during the game.
I asked a coach about Stocker on Sunday and I then passed it on in matchday thread. Knew all along he was an "emergency" in case of injury.
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2019-03-11/final-team-v-collingwood-jlt-2

"Fans will get their first look at Liam Stocker" in case you can't be bothered opening the link from the Carlton Media Department. So at a minimum the fans were lied too. If you support the narrative it was known all along, and communicated on Sunday. Average of the club to print an article Monday saying the club will get their first look at Liam.

This is a highly professional sport, and it is filled with individual disappointments every single day. .........
Is making Liam Stocker's mummy happy more important than the effort the team put in?
100% agree on the point it is a highly professional sport filled often filled with disappointments. You would just hope these disappointments are not created by the coaches of our club for no reason, these disappointments are not unnecessarily caused by the Carlton Football Club.

I 100% expect the coaches and selection committee to disappoint players throughout the season, provide constructive criticism and make tough selection decision. I also expect (now only hope), they communicate effectively, openly and can be trusted at their word.

If you can't communicate something so simple- this is JLT!!! If the players lose trust in your message and words, how on earth can you convey your thoughts and plans effectively?

If you don't have sound communication skills and the trust of the group, you simply can not educate or teach them, as Brendan regularly proclaims is important.

Moving on: Anyone know when our next practice game is at VFL level. Looking forward to seeing Liam and the next level pushing for spots again. Exciting fortnight ahead
 

Soapy V

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https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/2019-03-11/final-team-v-collingwood-jlt-2

"Fans will get their first look at Liam Stocker" in case you can't be bothered opening the link from the Carlton Media Department. So at a minimum the fans were lied too. If you support the narrative it was known all along, and communicated on Sunday. Average of the club to print an article Monday saying the club will get their first look at Liam.



100% agree on the point it is a highly professional sport filled often filled with disappointments. You would just hope these disappointments are not created by the coaches of our club for no reason, these disappointments are not unnecessarily caused by the Carlton Football Club.

I 100% expect the coaches and selection committee to disappoint players throughout the season, provide constructive criticism and make tough selection decision. I also expect (now only hope), they communicate effectively, openly and can be trusted at their word.

If you can't communicate something so simple- this is JLT!!! If the players lose trust in your message and words, how on earth can you convey your thoughts and plans effectively?

If you don't have sound communication skills and the trust of the group, you simply can not educate or teach them, as Brendan regularly proclaims is important.
Massive overreaction and importantly just wrong

I can assure you that one thing I do know, there is very good communication between coaches, fitness staff and the players. It’s excellent.

This type of muckraking is BS
 
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cfc05

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Massive overreaction and importantly just wrong
Soapy V - this is very easy, which part is just wrong?

I had three facts listed - so presume you mean one of the following three points is "just wrong".

I presume you agree the club printed the article Monday?
I presume you agree with your previous statement coaches and player knew Sunday Liam wasn't playing? Which it is therefore odd for the club to print an article the next day telling fans they would see him for the first time?

The only other "fact" i stated was "If you don't have sound communication skills and the trust of the group, you simply can not educate or teach them "

I guess that is an opinion you could disagree with, however most management literature will support my theory.
 

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Laphroaig

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Soapy V - this is very easy, which part is just wrong?

I had three facts listed - so presume you mean one of the following three points is "just wrong".

I presume you agree the club printed the article Monday?
I presume you agree with your previous statement coaches and player knew Sunday Liam wasn't playing? Which it is therefore odd for the club to print an article the next day telling fans they would see him for the first time?

The only other "fact" i stated was "If you don't have sound communication skills and the trust of the group, you simply can not educate or teach them "

I guess that is an opinion you could disagree with, however most management literature will support my theory.
The article was correct.

I was at the ground. I saw Liam Stocker for the first time. He sat on the bench, where he was named.

It doesn't matter whether or not the match staff intended to give Stocker minutes or not. When the time (if there actually was a time) came, they opted for not.

You know what would have been genuinely bad management?

The team didn't just go through the motions as they might have been tempted to in the 4th, they dug deep and showed fight.

For the coaching staff to then rack the cue by sending out a kid for a fun run instead of letting them finish what they started sends a horrendously negative message to the team. It says we place no value on the fight and determination you are showing.

You are creating a tempest in a teacup, obviously emotionally driven. Perhaps you need to consider that the team is more important than the individual, no matter how much you personally favor him.
 

cfc05

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The article was correct.

I was at the ground. I saw Liam Stocker for the first time. He sat on the bench, where he was named.

It doesn't matter whether or not the match staff intended to give Stocker minutes or not. When the time (if there actually was a time) came, they opted for not.

You know what would have been genuinely bad management?

The team didn't just go through the motions as they might have been tempted to in the 4th, they dug deep and showed fight.

For the coaching staff to then rack the cue by sending out a kid for a fun run instead of letting them finish what they started sends a horrendously negative message to the team. It says we place no value on the fight and determination you are showing.

You are creating a tempest in a teacup, obviously emotionally driven. Perhaps you need to consider that the team is more important than the individual, no matter how much you personally favor him.
Point one: I personally believe the club article hinted at seeing him play football, if you believe it meant seeing him sit on a bench - we will agree to disagree on that one.

Point two: I personally don't think it was bad management for the majority of teams in the JLT to play 24 players, don't think it was bad management for many coaches to play a 23rd and 24th in second half/final quarters throughout the past 2 weeks. I also don't believe the fact we did it in JLT1 and most coaches did it throughout JLT1 or 2 was them putting the cue in the rack, believe it was managing players minutes and giving exposure to some more inexperienced players depending on their program. So again, personal opinion, but I like many other coaches in the game don't believe sending a kid out in the last quarter of a JLT sends a "horrendously negative message to the team".

Last point: I AGREE! Team is far more important than an individual.

So two opinions we disagree on and one we agree on.

Now we can move on!
 
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Soapy V - this is very easy, which part is just wrong?

I had three facts listed - so presume you mean one of the following three points is "just wrong".

I presume you agree the club printed the article Monday?
I presume you agree with your previous statement coaches and player knew Sunday Liam wasn't playing? Which it is therefore odd for the club to print an article the next day telling fans they would see him for the first time?

The only other "fact" i stated was "If you don't have sound communication skills and the trust of the group, you simply can not educate or teach them "

I guess that is an opinion you could disagree with, however most management literature will support my theory.


Best to let it go & move on.
 

jezza25

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This game didn't have my full attention as it was the day after my wedding but this is what I took from it.

Walsh is gonna be one of those guys who just gives you an excellent output every week.

Cunners will be our biggest improver this year.

Daisy, SPS, Murph all great.

Phillips worries me as the number one ruck. Doesn't offer anything around the ground.

All in all, a great hitout by the boys. Bring on Round 1!
You sick of being happy ?
 

katmanblue

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Yeah Charlie gathers 14 possessions, 7 marks (2 contested) and 1 goal 2 in a shortened match and everyone thinks it is a disaster, Harry takes 4 contested marks and we have to wait for him to start clunking them.

These two are going to have good years but let's not expect them to dominate every game like Carey.
Exactly.

They may dominate patches in games and kick a few goals quickly or have a quarter or two where they clunk everything is sight, but they won't be doing it regularly for another couple of years.

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katmanblue

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This game didn't have my full attention as it was the day after my wedding but this is what I took from it.

Walsh is gonna be one of those guys who just gives you an excellent output every week.

Cunners will be our biggest improver this year.

Daisy, SPS, Murph all great.

Phillips worries me as the number one ruck. Doesn't offer anything around the ground.

All in all, a great hitout by the boys. Bring on Round 1!
Congratulations.


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katmanblue

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JLT and practice games are an opportunity to give young kids a taste of on field action. Teams like Richmond, Sydney and Hawks played their full compliment of 26 players last weekend, while other teams played 25 and 24 players. We only played 22.

Club erred imo. Could have easily played another 2 guys and given them a better experience.
We are trying to get our best 22 to gel. We have so many new faces.

The clubs you mentioned have a much more settled line up. Where the majority of their players know the system. Playing a few extra kids to try them out is easier, given they wouldn't expect most of them to play much during the year.

We did it a couple of years ago too. Hell, even LeBois got some game time.

At the moment we are trying to settle and get the repetitions in with as stable a line up as possible.

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