FriendlyJordies- and friends

[nut]

FFS i love gen y...

Im gen Y??? Na. But carry on.

16 Years Later, How the Press That Sold the Iraq War Got Away With It

In an excerpt from his new book 'Hate Inc.,' Matt Taibbi looks back at how the media built new lies to cover their early ones

www.rollingstone.com

I guess you’ll come out with something like “Rolling stone magazine should stick to music” ....

 

[NSWCROW]

nut

On the thread title, can you please nuke that " e " in friendly ?


Doin' my head in

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Im gen Y??? Na. But carry on.

16 Years Later, How the Press That Sold the Iraq War Got Away With It

In an excerpt from his new book 'Hate Inc.,' Matt Taibbi looks back at how the media built new lies to cover their early ones

www.rollingstone.com

I guess you’ll come out with something like “Rolling stone magazine should stick to music” ....

my point is learn about something that happened before 2000, its sad someone as old as you think journalism started at gulf war 2

 

[lloydbraun]

So if you're so fatalistic and passive about it all why have you spend the majority of your life over the past year fighting for team Trump?
There are hundreds and hundreds of pages on the politics boards where every second post is you and a fair percentage of them would have something to say about cancel culture, electoral fraud, Gov corruption etc.

Yet a genuine example comes up, in Australia, of a guy who is fighting against Gov corruption, gets branded a terrorist and dragged off to jail and all you can say is like yeah whatever dude?

Yeah but some obscure Dr Suess books no one reads anymore are no longer being published. Where was the MSM outrage over that? (Besides everywhere)

 

[squashface]

nut

On the thread title, can you please nuke that " e " in friendly ?


Doin' my head in

Knew something was bugging me about the title haha

 

[Gethelred]

how many exposes has he done on NSW Labor?

how often does he give a right of reply?

how often does he not report something when he only has one source?

how often does he not report something when he has no evidence and just conjecture?

how often has a third party editor reviewed his story for content, legality, and balance before reporting?

being a journo isnt about being a member of MEAA, or having a Martin Place press pass, but it is about at least having an attempt to report all stories no matter who they impact upon

again, I wouldnt call Andrew Bolt a journo, so how on earth can i call him one?

I think this is a bit of an unfair aspersion to cast at him, given the grassroots nature of his enterprise (in short, largely unfunded until recently) and while I agree ostensibly with the statement that he's not a journalist, it does not mean that he does not do journalism when he exposes things that the sitting governments of NSW and the Fed are doing.

It is not ad hominem to expose misbehaviour with facts, then to ridicule that behaviour. Caricature has long been a part of news and political reporting. Why is this not a new media manifestation of the long trend?

I'm extremely curious why people are gatekeeping for the media of Australia who are - frankly - weak as piss in this country.

Some of y'all sound like conservatives.

 

[Gethelred]

and BTW nut Im saying this as perhaps the only card carrying fee paying member of the ALP on this site. His work is great for the party, and I like it. But its not journalism

One thinks you are holding journalism to a standard that precious few journalists are meeting at the moment.

 

[FireKrakouer]

So if you're so fatalistic and passive about it all why have you spend the majority of your life over the past year fighting for team Trump?
There are hundreds and hundreds of pages on the politics boards where every second post is you and a fair percentage of them would have something to say about cancel culture, electoral fraud, Gov corruption etc.

Yet a genuine example comes up, in Australia, of a guy who is fighting against Gov corruption, gets branded a terrorist and dragged off to jail and all you can say is like yeah whatever dude?

I said I didn't know anything about the situation. If it occurred as you state, that someone was arrested for revealing corruption, then I am 100% against that. Just as I am 100% against the despicable treatment of Assange.

I am more interested in US politics because it is more important on a global scale, and a f*ckton more entertaining. I like Trump because he rattled the cage and pissed off all the right people (the Clintons, the Bushs, the CIA and FBI establishment). Just as I have a soft spot for AOC, even if I think she's got some batshit crazy ideas. She's standing by her principles and pissing off the right people too.

I'm sorry if you've been indoctrinated by relentless "orange man bad" messages from the establishment, and write off the opinions of anyone who supported him. See the recent Kamala speech directed at illegal immigrants? How's the border situation going? How about issues like fracking, and easing sanctions on Russia? These guys are the same as Trump, just without the mean tweets.

 

[nut]

nut

On the thread title, can you please nuke that " e " in friendly ?


Doin' my head in

it was just a stunt

 

[NSWCROW]

Right on cue c7 had a story about the Camelia debacle

State govt paid 3 ( THREE ) times the price for a parcel of contaminated land.

Enquiry today seems to have found a 10m hole......

 

[nut]

my point is learn about something that happened before 2000, its sad someone as old as you think journalism started at gulf war 2

???? I’ve got no idea what you are implying ... what would you like me to learn about??? The creation of the Middle East?

 

[Doss]

So if you're so fatalistic and passive about it all why have you spend the majority of your life over the past year fighting for team Trump?
There are hundreds and hundreds of pages on the politics boards where every second post is you and a fair percentage of them would have something to say about cancel culture, electoral fraud, Gov corruption etc.

Yet a genuine example comes up, in Australia, of a guy who is fighting against Gov corruption, gets branded a terrorist and dragged off to jail and all you can say is like yeah whatever dude?

It's almost like they pick and choose when to go.

 

[E Shed]

I said I didn't know anything about the situation. If it occurred as you state, that someone was arrested for revealing corruption, then I am 100% against that. Just as I am 100% against the despicable treatment of Assange.

I am more interested in US politics because it is more important on a global scale, and a f*ckton more entertaining. I like Trump because he rattled the cage and pissed off all the right people (the Clintons, the Bushs, the CIA and FBI establishment). Just as I have a soft spot for AOC, even if I think she's got some batshit crazy ideas. She's standing by her principles and pissing off the right people too.

I'm sorry if you've been indoctrinated by relentless "orange man bad" messages from the establishment, and write off the opinions of anyone who supported him. See the recent Kamala speech directed at illegal immigrants? How's the border situation going? How about issues like fracking, and easing sanctions on Russia? These guys are the same as Trump, just without the mean tweets.

That's the spirit! Maybe you can channel some of your passion into exposing the corruption nearer to home.
Here's a good place to start if you want to know something about the subject of this thread. Michael West does serious journalism.

Tamed Estate: arrest of FriendlyJordies producer attests to dangerous state of democracy - Michael West

The arrest of a producer for YouTube comedian and journalist FriendlyJordies has eerie parallels to repressive regimes around the world.

www.michaelwest.com.au

 

[nut]

I think this is a bit of an unfair aspersion to cast at him, given the grassroots nature of his enterprise (in short, largely unfunded until recently) and while I agree ostensibly with the statement that he's not a journalist, it does not mean that he does not do journalism when he exposes things that the sitting governments of NSW and the Fed are doing.

It is not ad hominem to expose misbehaviour with facts, then to ridicule that behaviour. Caricature has long been a part of news and political reporting. Why is this not a new media manifestation of the long trend?

I'm extremely curious why people are gatekeeping for the media of Australia who are - frankly - weak as piss in this country.

Some of y'all sound like conservatives.

hallelujah

We have s**t politicians because we have s**t media

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I think this is a bit of an unfair aspersion to cast at him, given the grassroots nature of his enterprise (in short, largely unfunded until recently) and while I agree ostensibly with the statement that he's not a journalist, it does not mean that he does not do journalism when he exposes things that the sitting governments of NSW and the Fed are doing.

It is not ad hominem to expose misbehaviour with facts, then to ridicule that behaviour. Caricature has long been a part of news and political reporting. Why is this not a new media manifestation of the long trend?

I'm extremely curious why people are gatekeeping for the media of Australia who are - frankly - weak as piss in this country.

Some of y'all sound like conservatives.

when i call him an advocate it doesnt mean what he does isnt of value and doesnt reveal truth. it isnt however impartial reporting - he does have a clear agenda (which i support remember)

 

[Gethelred]

when i call him an advocate it doesnt mean what he does isnt of value and doesnt reveal truth. it isnt however impartial reporting - he does have a clear agenda (which i support remember)

Sounds like 'they go low, we go high' to me. Ideal world stuff.

This ties in with my other quote to you; that you're holding FJ to journalistic standards that the majority of the industry are failing to meet. I personally think that people should view tax avoidance as unpatriotic and that our parliamentarians should be the most moral of us, but I do not expect reality to match my own moral standards.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

One thinks you are holding journalism to a standard that precious few journalists are meeting at the moment.

100% dont disagree with this at all

its actually a subject Hutchy and Barrett have discussed in depth on their podcast

in years gone by, barrett would need two (possibly three) sources to get his editor to agree to a story, and if there were concerns they would hold

now some of our "journos" have burner twitter accounts which they plant rumours out there, and then write an article reporting on the discussion raised by the "anon" twitter account.

a key to this seems to be the move to online, and editors focus now on "being first" rather than "being right"

then you have the move from reporting news to editorials on news (remember when the editorials used to be just 1-2 pages!!)

its sad when you try to think of elite journos we have other than Baker and Mackenzie, and you come up with pretty much meh

this is where i think some online publications are trying to fill the void, but its a tough ask

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Sounds like 'they go low, we go high' to me. Ideal world stuff.

This ties in with my other quote to you; that you're holding FJ to journalistic standards that the majority of the industry are failing to meet. I personally think that people should view tax avoidance as unpatriotic and that our parliamentarians should be the most moral of us, but I do not expect reality to match my own moral standards.

ffs, let me spell this out

I am an alp member. I love the notion of alp supporters getting out there and doing the work that conservative think tanks have been doing for years (highlighting the weaknesses and failures in the other mob)

its like saying a ute isnt tractor. it doesnt mean its bad, it just does a different job

 

[Gethelred]

ffs, let me spell this out

I am an alp member. I love the notion of alp supporters getting out there and doing the work that conservative think tanks have been doing for years (highlighting the weaknesses and failures in the other mob)

its like saying a ute isnt tractor. it doesnt mean its bad, it just does a different job

I suppose I should've put more into my original post: I do not think, given the lack of resources his group has, that an inability to report on things that aren't part of their investigative wheelhouse should be held against them. I think that is grotesquely unfair, because it places a financial barrier over whoever can be regarded as a journalist.

I have a question. FJ has people as part of his group whose sole role is to investigate and verify the information he puts into those videos; these people have (to my knowledge) not really been wrong yet. Are they journalists?

Is there a difference between the anchor of a broadcast and a journalist?

How many barriers are you going to put between the act of doing journalism before it's not a reasonable expectation to overcome them?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I suppose I should've put more into my original post: I do not think, given the lack of resources his group has, that an inability to report on things that aren't part of their investigative wheelhouse should be held against them. I think that is grotesquely unfair, because it places a financial barrier over whoever can be regarded as a journalist.

I have a question. FJ has people as part of his group whose sole role is to investigate and verify the information he puts into those videos; these people have (to my knowledge) not really been wrong yet. Are they journalists?

Is there a difference between the anchor of a broadcast and a journalist?

How many barriers are you going to put between the act of doing journalism before it's not a reasonable expectation to overcome them?

having multiple sources isnt a barrier based upon cost or resources - just effort and verification

editorial is a tough one, but it can be managed (the old Crikey used to do it reasonably well).

there is one fundamental issue however as to why FJ isnt a journo. He doesnt report NSW political news. He ONLY reports negative LNP NSW political news. If he wants to be a journo, he needs to tackle the ALP just as he does the libs. and lets be blunt, the NSW ALP is far from pristine on corruption, so its not like there isnt material.

our standard for modern journalism shouldnt be Sky After Dark

 

[Gethelred]

having multiple sources isnt a barrier based upon cost or resources - just effort and verification

Not sure what you mean here. 'Multiple sources' isn't what I meant by anything I said, merely that when they report they don't go off half cocked.

editorial is a tough one, but it can be managed (the old Crikey used to do it reasonably well).

Too young to remember.

there is one fundamental issue however as to why FJ isnt a journo. He doesnt report NSW political news. He ONLY reports negative LNP NSW political news. If he wants to be a journo, he needs to tackle the ALP just as he does the libs. and lets be blunt, the NSW ALP is far from pristine on corruption, so its not like there isnt material.

our standard for modern journalism shouldnt be Sky After Dark

I'd argue that, while you are certainly correct that he doesn't go after Labor, Labor are not and have not been in power in NSW for the majority of the time he's been doing politics. Before Gladys, his focus was on the federal government, and again, while he's not been as critical of Labor as he could be he's still been critical of them before. Check out some of his earlier political content for examples if you're interested.

His real focus - what he's almost always been pointing towards - is exposing the media's complicity in politics here. He ridicules the Libs, but he holds his real scorn for other journalists who he feels (and demonstrates) are complicit in the narrative production by either sitting federal or state NSW government.

Now, I could be going out on a limb here, but I do not think he needs to go after the NSW Labor party when they are virtually non-existent.

I maintain: I do not think he's a journalist, but some of the work he does is journalism. There's a distinction there, and it's important to acknowledge that the work that is on the table is what matters, not who or where it's from.

 

[Gethelred]

I don't condone that really (if he truly didn't do something terrible that wasn't shown in the video) - was just making a broad point.

You've edited your post - conservatives haven't won any major battles in the culture wars in this country for about 50 years.

If I think of something else I could've said in a post, I'll try to go back and edit it quickly. Alas, you were too quick on the gun!

I'm not talking about the big picture 'culture wars', I'm talking about 'pwning the liberals' online; 'winning' the small interaction ahead of actually standing for something you say believe in.

Just to be clear here, Andy, I'm not actually having a crack at you here; despite your dubiousness and dislike of FJ, you've at least acknowledged that the arrest of his producer isn't acceptable. You've the sack to actually have a fixable position, something that you're willing to value ahead of simply 'winning'.

That's more than some can say.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Not sure what you mean here. 'Multiple sources' isn't what I meant by anything I said, merely that when they report they don't go off half cocked.

Too young to remember.


I'd argue that, while you are certainly correct that he doesn't go after Labor, Labor are not and have not been in power in NSW for the majority of the time he's been doing politics. Before Gladis, his focus was on the federal government, and again, while he's not been as critical of Labor as he could be he's still been critical of them before. Check out some of his earlier political content for examples if you're interested.

His real focus - what he's almost always been pointing towards - is exposing the media's complicity in politics here. He ridicules the Libs, but he holds his real scorn for other journalists who he feels (and demonstrates) are complicit in the narrative production by either sitting federal or state NSW government.

Now, I could be going out on a limb here, but I do not think he needs to go after the NSW Labor party when they are virtually non-existent.

I maintain: I do not think he's a journalist, but some of the work he does is journalism. There's a distinction there, and it's important to acknowledge that the work that is on the table is what matters, not who or where it's from.

labor dont have any control over NSW councils? he choses not to go after the alp because he isnt reporting NSW political corruption, but NSW LNP political corruption

again, good for me so yay team, but it doesnt make him a journalist just because i agree with it

 

[Gethelred]

labor dont have any control over NSW councils? he choses not to go after the alp because he isnt reporting NSW political corruption, but NSW LNP political corruption

again, good for me so yay team, but it doesnt make him a journalist just because i agree with it

... and this is why I said you're starting to sound like a conservative. You are looking at a small producer who lacks the resources to be able to research, fact check, properly investigate 'all sides' and declaring that they don't meet your standards for journalism.

I'm out, I think. You've your own opinion, but I don't want you to fully flex out into Kwality.

 

[FireKrakouer]

That's the spirit! Maybe you can channel some of your passion into exposing the corruption nearer to home.
Here's a good place to start if you want to know something about the subject of this thread. Michael West does serious journalism.

Tamed Estate: arrest of FriendlyJordies producer attests to dangerous state of democracy - Michael West

The arrest of a producer for YouTube comedian and journalist FriendlyJordies has eerie parallels to repressive regimes around the world.

www.michaelwest.com.au

Yup, at worst I'd say that this producer fella should've been visited by local police and questioned about potential harassment. Sending the unit they did and locking him up is grossly excessive.

However, to call out the potential dishonesty of FJ: the footage of when the producers mum was allegedly knocked over goes black for a few seconds during the incident itself, then seems to skip forward a few seconds. If you have the unedited footage, I'd love to see it.

Nextly, FJ claims that the producer stumbled upon Bruz by mere coincidence while walking home from uni. That is very hard to believe, particularly when he happened to be equipped with the document in his hand he wanted to serve Bruz. Then FJ claims that the video evidence proves that the producer did not walk 200m to approach Bruz, when it shows no such thing. It's about 5 seconds long.

Don't get me wrong, there was nothing in the incident. It didn't warrant an arrest. But FJ needs to be honest about the facts as well.