Recommitted Josh Dunkley [contracted and staying at the Western Bulldogs]

[Lore]

2020 discussion here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-requested-a-trade-to-essendon.1250264/unread

*2021 discussion here*

 

[Morro]

I don't know about best, Merrett is having just as good a season. Kind of a moot point though, he would be AT WORST our 2nd best player.

Essendon are likely finishing bottom six - with or without Dunkley - and there's no way they were giving up their 2021 first.

No one is particularly disappointed we didn't land Dunkley. And that's not to say I wouldn't like Dunkley, I'd love him, but our need to hit the draft hard is greater than our need for Dunkley - that's just the way it is, which is why no one is bleeding over it.

Given how the season appears to be heading for you guys, you absolutely made the right call. Similar to us missing out on Treloar. Instead of losing 2 x first rounders, we got Rioli and Meatball which was a far better result in hindsight.

 

[Jade]

Given how the season appears to be heading for you guys, you absolutely made the right call. Similar to us missing out on Treloar. Instead of losing 2 x first rounders, we got Rioli and Meatball which was a far better result in hindsight.

I think the asking price for Dunkley was absolutely absurd.

Having said that, the Dogs had every right to do it.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

This guy is a dead set star the bombers and dodo really f’ed this up and for what a future 3rd from port lol.
Maybe if he got the Fantasia and Caldwell deals done quicker he would of got his man?

The Fantasia/Caldwell deals had nothing to do with the Dunkley trade not getting done. We had the currency to get the deal done. We just didn't do it due to the price.

The Dogs wanted Pick 8 + Pick our 2021 First. - that's 2 x TOP 10 Picks. An absolute Absurd price for a re building team. No player in HISTORY has gone for 2 x top 10 Picks that hasn't been an AA. Dunkley is a great player who is also playing in an amazing team with an absolutely stacked midfield - he's was always going to shine.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Tippa has career high limited impact. Stats ain’t saving him. 5 games - named in your best once. He has been closer to wog than bog in the other 4.

They didn’t want or need 2020 1st rounders. Dunkley would be in the AA team if named now and essendon best player. But you got dodoed - again.

You can take Wild Bill out of the North but you can take the North out of Wild Bill.

Maybe you need to check the actual statistics instead of always trying to take a pot shot at Essendon at every opportunity. We get it. You don't like Essendon.

Dunkley would absolutely not be our best player and Merrett would also be in the AA team if it was chosen right now.

Merrett is statistically better Career wise and they are generally on Par in 2021 in terms of Key Stats, Dunkley is a better inside mid where Merrett is a better user of the ball and averages almost DOUBLE the meters gained.- shock horror you know, because that's the position they play.

No ones debating Dunkley isn't a great player. But 2 x top 10 picks for a re building team? lol. No.

 

[Morro]

You can take Wild Bill out of the Norf but you can take the Norf out of Wild Bill.

Maybe you need to check the actual statistics instead of always trying to take a pot shot at Essendon at every opportunity. We get it. You don't like Essendon.

Dunkley would absolutely not be our best player and Merrett would also be in the AA team if it was chosen right now.

Merrett is statistically better Career wise and they are generally on Par in 2021 in terms of Key Stats, Dunkley is a better inside mid where Merrett is a better user of the ball and averages almost DOUBLE the meters gained.- shock horror you know, because that's the position they play.

No ones debating Dunkley isn't a great player. But 2 x top 10 picks for a re building team? lol. No.

This!

The only time a team should pay 2 x 1st rounders is for a final piece of a Premiership puzzle IMO

 

[HirdsTheWord]

This!

The only time a team should pay 2 x 1st rounders is for a final piece of a Premiership puzzle IMO

we are 4-5 years off being back in the mix for finals and a GF.

By that time Dunkley will be 30..........does nothing for us investing that hard when has not going to stop us finishing bottom 6 for the next few years.

Only [redacted] think with should have paid that currency for Dunkley, [redacted] and [redacted] who have little understanding of trading/drafting and are just using this thread to bag us. hence the *in influx of North supporters.

 

[Mofra]

It will be interesting to see if any player from the same stable (Pickering) is targeted by Essendon again.
Player managers tend to have long memories and in such a supposed professional industry, they can be a little petty.

 

[Jesse Custer]

It will be interesting to see if any player from the same stable (Pickering) is targeted by Essendon again.
Player managers tend to have long memories and in such a supposed professional industry, they can be a little petty.

I could be wrong but i don't remember Pickers being angry or upset with the Bombers or the Dogs on this one. A little flat for his client but he was understanding of both parties.

 

[Virgin Dog]

we are 4-5 years off being back in the mix for finals and a GF.

By that time Dunkley will be 30..........does nothing for us investing that hard when has not going to stop us finishing bottom 6 for the next few years.

Only [redacted] think with should have paid that currency for Dunkley, [redacted] and [redacted] who have little understanding of trading/drafting and are just using this thread to bag us. hence the fu**in influx of North supporters.

I think Essendon had two paths they could go down last offseason - try improve their list to be competitive for a finals tilt by trading for Dunkley
OR
Rebuild.

If they chose the latter, it would make no sense to pursue Dunkley for the reasons you gave. He'd be late 20s by the time you were on the rise, and it would have meant two less first rounders to kick-start your rebuild with. It's the main part that confuses me about this whole thing - surely Essendon were aware that a rebuild needed to happen, so why pursue Dunkley knowing the trade price would be astronomical? I'd have thought either going for him a year earlier when he made the AA squad, or waiting a couple years for the rebuild to get a start, would have made far more sense than 2020 specifically. Seemed like the absolute worst timing, especially given his contract situation

 

[HirdsTheWord]

It will be interesting to see if any player from the same stable (Pickering) is targeted by Essendon again.
Player managers tend to have long memories and in such a supposed professional industry, they can be a little petty.

you think Pickering has some type of resentment? Why would he?

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I think Essendon had two paths they could go down last offseason - try improve their list to be competitive for a finals tilt by trading for Dunkley
OR
Rebuild.

If they chose the latter, it would make no sense to pursue Dunkley for the reasons you gave. He'd be late 20s by the time you were on the rise, and it would have meant two less first rounders to kick-start your rebuild with. It's the main part that confuses me about this whole thing - surely Essendon were aware that a rebuild needed to happen, so why pursue Dunkley knowing the trade price would be astronomical? I'd have thought either going for him a year earlier when he made the AA squad, or waiting a couple years for the rebuild to get a start, would have made far more sense than 2020 specifically. Seemed like the absolute worst timing, especially given his contract situation

Essendon were always going to re build. Our Core are grandfathers. Heppell, Hooker, Hurley are all in the last couple of years of their careers. We also lost Joe Daniher so our spine is well and truly gonskies. We currently have the youngest team in the AFL by way of games played.

Pursuing good players is always a good idea regardless of your position on the ladder. If you get them at the right price. Paying 2 top 10 picks was WELL beyond that right price. Essendon probably thought they would have had to pay overs and of course they would have, he's a gun contracted player. But 2 x Top 10 picks? That is beyond astronomical. That is a trade that has NEVER been done in the history of the game - people seemingly don't understand this.

They just see a Club not land a player and just say "oh rofl what a fail"

 

[Mofra]

you think Pickering has some type of resentment? Why would he?

Not resentment, but if they have a player that is looking to move clubs than managers would be more inclined to recommend a club that can accommodate the request ($$, contract length and trade assets).

 

[Mofra]

I think Essendon had two paths they could go down last offseason - try improve their list to be competitive for a finals tilt by trading for Dunkley
OR
Rebuild.

If they chose the latter, it would make no sense to pursue Dunkley for the reasons you gave. He'd be late 20s by the time you were on the rise, and it would have meant two less first rounders to kick-start your rebuild with. It's the main part that confuses me about this whole thing - surely Essendon were aware that a rebuild needed to happen, so why pursue Dunkley knowing the trade price would be astronomical? I'd have thought either going for him a year earlier when he made the AA squad, or waiting a couple years for the rebuild to get a start, would have made far more sense than 2020 specifically. Seemed like the absolute worst timing, especially given his contract situation

Dunkley's off-field traits (leadership, training etc) were reported as part of the reason he was targeted. It was as much about finding a good person to help their kids develop as just the style of player.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Not resentment, but if they have a player that is looking to move clubs than managers would be more inclined to recommend a club that can accommodate the request ($$, contract length and trade assets).

I very much doubt Pickering has any issues with Essendon not landing Dunkley. He and Essendon would have spoken about what Essendon's trade limit was, well before Dunkley nominated us. They are not idiots.

The trade required to land Dunkley would have been the first time in history that type of trade was done, when you look at that player involved along with the asking price. I very much doubt there's any sourness from anyone involved over it not getting done. It was a monumental asking price.

 

[Virgin Dog]

Essendon were always going to re build. Our Core are grandfathers. Heppell, Hooker, Hurly are all in the last couple of years of their careers. We also lost Joe Daniher so our spine is well and truly gonskies.

Pursuing good players is always a good idea regardless of your position on the ladder. If you get them at the right price. Paying 2 top 10 picks was WELL beyond that right price.

What would have been the "right price" though, given the circumstances? Dogs were never going to let him go easily, and we were never in a position to accept 2020 first rounders which every club would have known. The whole scenario was just baffling honestly

 

[Mofra]

What would have been the "right price" though, given the circumstances? Dogs were never going to let him go easily, and we were never in a position to accept 2020 first rounders which every club would have known. The whole scenario was just baffling honestly

We may have been able to if it was at the start of trade week and had time to turn those picks into players or 2021 picks. Essendon low-balled with a first offer as would be the norm for a player who was uncontracted and from a club that could take those picks to draft. We made a high counter offer, and I understand Essendon then went silent until late in the trade period.

There was no way a three-way trade with Collingwood was going to work as we had Ned Guy over a barrel at that stage anyway.

 

[Virgin Dog]

We may have been able to if it was at the start of trade week and had time to turn those picks into players or 2021 picks. Essendon low-balled with a first offer as would be the norm for a player who was uncontracted and from a club that could take those picks to draft. We made a high counter offer, and I understand Essendon then went silent until late in the trade period.

There was no way a three-way trade with Collingwood was going to work as we had Ned Guy over a barrel at that stage anyway.

Just adds to the confusion though - Why leave it so late when you don't hold the cards? Why surprise with a trade offer in a year where the other club NEEDS ample time to make it work? In any year we'd have been hesitant to trade him, but in 2020 I can fully understand why we went down the "give us everything you have and more" path considering the circumstances. And anyone could have seen that coming, especially Dodoro

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Just adds to the confusion though - Why leave it so late when you don't hold the cards? Why surprise with a trade offer in a year where the other club NEEDS ample time to make it work? In any year we'd have been hesitant to trade him, but in 2020 I can fully understand why we went down the "give us everything you have and more" path considering the circumstances. And anyone could have seen that coming, especially Dodoro

No one on this forum knows how the trade went down, nor the conversations that were held between the parties RE offers. So I wouldn't pay much attention to people who think they know how it played out, cause even your own list manager didn't comment on it and neither did Dodoro, apart from simply saying what the dogs asked for.

What would have been the "right price" though, given the circumstances? Dogs were never going to let him go easily, and we were never in a position to accept 2020 first rounders which every club would have known. The whole scenario was just baffling honestly

IMO a fair "overs" trade for Dunkley would have been the 2 x Top 10 firsts requested with a 2nd rounder coming back to us. That is a comparable trade to other similar gun players. I think that deal would have been accepted.

 

[The 747]

This guy is a dead set star the bombers and dodo really f’ed this up and for what a future 3rd from port lol.
Maybe if he got the Fantasia and Caldwell deals done quicker he would of got his man?

Nope, never had any intention of paying what the Bulldogs wanted. If I had to guess I don't think they even thought about it because if they did and went ahead with tapping Dunkley the EFC recruitment are exceptionally dumb.

 

[Virgin Dog]

No one on this forum knows how the trade went down, nor the conversations that were held between the parties RE offers. So I wouldn't pay much attention to people who think they know how it played out, cause even your own list manager didn't comment on it and neither did Dodoro, apart from simply saying what the dogs asked for.



IMO a fair "overs" trade for Dunkley would have been the 2 x Top 10 firsts requested with a 2nd rounder coming back to us. That is a comparable trade to other similar gun players. I think that deal would have been accepted.

It's why I was so surprised by the pursuit happening in 2020 in particular. Just such poor timing with us having JUH. I'd have thought a top 10 pick plus a teens pick for Dunkley + 2nd would've been reasonable (essentially the Neale deal) but it just wasn't possible given that 1st rounders were useless to us in 2020. You're right in saying none of us truly know what went on behind closed doors, but you'd think this whole thing would've had a far better chance of happening if we were given even an extra month to prepare (from what we've heard, it was genuinely news to us in the days leading up to the trade request).

 

[Mofra]

IMO a fair "overs" trade for Dunkley would have been the 2 x Top 10 firsts requested with a 2nd rounder coming back to us. That is a comparable trade to other similar gun players. I think that deal would have been accepted.

If that was on the table from Essendon at the start of trade week I'd say a trade gets done.

Interesting to see if similar players are targeting this year. I was surprised the Bombers didn't chase a Ben Keays or Jarrod Lyons type, would be much cheaper but would allow for a mature body in the centre to protect the kids.

 

[Virgin Dog]

If that was on the table from Essendon at the start of trade week I'd say a trade gets done.

Interesting to see if similar players are targeting this year. I was surprised the Bombers didn't chase a Ben Keays or Jarrod Lyons type, would be much cheaper but would allow for a mature body in the centre to protect the kids.

In hindsight, Hugh Greenwood would have been absolutely ideal if they went for him in 2019. Went for an absolute bargain (future 3rd + future 4th)

 

[HirdsTheWord]

If that was on the table from Essendon at the start of trade week I'd say a trade gets done.

Interesting to see if similar players are targeting this year. I was surprised the Bombers didn't chase a Ben Keays or Jarrod Lyons type, would be much cheaper but would allow for a mature body in the centre to protect the kids.

Who knows. I'd be disappointed if it wasn't offered but all Dodo said was that Dogs wanted pick 8 + 2021 1st. So I take it as though the dogs wanted 2 x top 10 picks straight up in which putting tribalism aside is a ridiculous price.

2021 is a stacked inside midfield draft so hopefully we use the pick well.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

In hindsight, Hugh Greenwood would have been absolutely ideal if they went for him in 2019. Went for an absolute bargain (future 3rd + future 4th)

no one was paying Hugh Greenwood as much as the suns were. That's why he went there.

hes 29 years old and needs to take the highest $$ offer he can before he's out of the game.

 

[Substance]

Can't be overstated how much it's worth having an 800k player on your books for half that for the next 2 years, whilst you're having a tilt at a flag. That would have made the trade nearly impossible, and I would not have traded a player like Dunkley for even pick 1 in hindsight, given it could be the difference between a premiership in 2021 or 2022, or nothing. To replace him with someone that would impact us just as much, would cost at least an extra 500k of cap space over 2 years, plus whatever picks we aquired.