Plus the $2 million fine. Plus the legal fees for the players and the abandoned court writs.
Mega Thread JUDGMENT -Essendon/Hird v ASADA Trial: Investigation legal (club/ASADA/AFL/AFLPA/WADA statements)
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Plus the $2 million fine. Plus the legal fees for the players and the abandoned court writs.
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias · 1h
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias
- Much smaller courtroom today, filling up already
- The Ess contingent have arrived in court
- Standing room only now
- Court officer confirms that judgment will be available online soon after
- Nervous silence now. Expected in 2 mins
- Dank just walked in the courtroom
- Middleton has arrived. Here we go
- Middleton will publish his written reasons and read an extract
- Middleton: investigation may be referred to as a joint investigation but the label is of little relevance
- Middleton: must consider nature purpose and conduct of proceedings themselves
- Middleton: ASADA has important national and international functions to perform
- Middleton: ASADA and AFL may need to act jointly, however statutory authorities must act within law
- Middleton: no relief is sought against the AFL
- Middleton: no contention that the AFL's powers were illegal or unenforceable or unconscionable
- Middleton: the 34 players are not parties, they have a significant interest
- Middleton: the only witness who was impugned was Andruska
- Middleton: does not consider Essendons criticisms of Andruska can be sustained. Ms Andruska was a credible witness.
- Middleton: Ms Andruska thought carefully about her answers. I would have expected her to be careful about this
- Middleton: it was apparent she relied on her staff. As CEO she was entitled to delegate to her staff
- Middleton: these proceedings do not involve a broad and general inquiry as to the general conduct of the investigation
- Middleton: Andruska was under pressure from AFL and government. However no dereliction of her responsibilities
- Middleton: ministerial direction outside the Act would normally be seen as forbidden
- Middleton: I conclude that by 1 Feb ASADA and AFL to investigate Ess and use AFLs powers
- Middleton: ASADA would have investigated even without invitation by the club
- Middleton: ASADA would have investigated Ess even without the AFLs compulsory powers
- Middleton: Ess and Hird and players cooperated because of contractual obligations to do so
- Middleton: Hird and players were represented at all times and did not claim right against self incrimination
- Middleton: information provided in interviews was simultaneously disclosed to both ASADA and the AFL
- Middleton: the investigation required coordination between ASADA and the AFL on matters of procedure and machinery
- Middleton: ASADA benefitted from cooperation of AFL with use of formal powers to acquire evidence and arrange interviews
- Middleton: ASADA and the AFL had different but related purposes
- Middleton: the investigation undertaken by ASADA resulted in both ASADA and AFL making separate decisions within their own area of resp
- Middleton: report provided with the knowledge it would be provided to AFL knowing they would use for disciplinary proceedings
- Middleton now generally describing judicial review. Purpose is to ensure the legality of government action rather than its correctness
- Middleton: ASADA had power to request information however direct or implied power required to force someone to provide information
- Middleton: the nature and conduct of the investigation was lawful
- Middleton: once appreciated that AFL received information directly and not from ASADA then the protections did not apply
- Middleton: there was no disclosure of information from ASADA to the AFL in the interviews
- Middleton: the desire to use or harness AFLs powers can immediately be accepted as a consideration for using AFLs powers
- Middleton:hird and players could have refused to answer and breached their contractual obligations. Whether they felt forced is not to point
- Middleton: signing up to the AFLs agreement is subject to giving up certain rights
- Middleton: no suggestion that Hird and players did not understand the rights they were giving up to play or coach AFL
- Middleton: no power of the state has been utilised by ASADA to compel
- Middleton: report was provided to the AFL for the purposes of the investigation and connected to the investigation
- Middleton: the Investigation disclosed strong link between governance practices and anti doping issues at Essendon
- Middleton: the poor governance was related to possible anti doping violations to the extent violations may have been systemic.
- Middleton: I dismiss the applications
- Middleton: if I had found otherwise, issues would have arose around discretion of relief
- Middleton: in these proceedings I would not have declined to set aside the show cause notice. But futility may have denied relief
- Middleton:the court would not have framed an order preventing investigation,even if it involved using derivatives of illegally obtained info
- Middleton: final observation about interim report, interim report was provided in August and no proceedings were brought at that point
- Middleton: ASADA complied with the rule of law. ASADA lawfully provided the interim report to the AFL. Applications dismissed.
- Middleton: Essendon and Hird to pay costs
Confused by the whole Essendon/ASADA process? I've written a guide to what might come next on the Social Litigator - http://t.co/cwPwM5oifr
@ChrisKaias
Here is the full judgment - http://t.co/wakcCcKAVR
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias now
It is an enormous 500-paragraph judgment. Incredible considering the short turnaround.
SuperFooty (AFL) @superfooty now
Federal Court disaster for Hird, Bombers. Justice Middleton slams case. All the latest http://tinyurl.com/n4qfe7y pic.twitter.com/lKvdSpCr9H
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I think you blokes are harsh. I really feel for Essendon. Poor bastards actually have to try and defend their actions now as opposed to trying to get out via a loophole.
Hope James is ok, Hope Tanya is ok, I hope Litte is ok, and I really hope Robbo is ok. He'll take this just as hard as anyone.
Actually, he would have been drunk by the time the decision came down and probably thinks they'll still win the case
Hope James is ok, Hope Tanya is ok, I hope Litte is ok, and I really hope Robbo is ok. He'll take this just as hard as anyone.
Actually, he would have been drunk by the time the decision came down and probably thinks they'll still win the case
Well I got so excited I had an extra dump after lunch
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias · 1h
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias
- Much smaller courtroom today, filling up already
- The Ess contingent have arrived in court
- Standing room only now
- Court officer confirms that judgment will be available online soon after
- Nervous silence now. Expected in 2 mins
- Dank just walked in the courtroom
- Middleton has arrived. Here we go
- Middleton will publish his written reasons and read an extract
- Middleton: investigation may be referred to as a joint investigation but the label is of little relevance
- Middleton: must consider nature purpose and conduct of proceedings themselves
- Middleton: ASADA has important national and international functions to perform
- Middleton: ASADA and AFL may need to act jointly, however statutory authorities must act within law
- Middleton: no relief is sought against the AFL
- Middleton: no contention that the AFL's powers were illegal or unenforceable or unconscionable
- Middleton: the 34 players are not parties, they have a significant interest
- Middleton: the only witness who was impugned was Andruska
- Middleton: does not consider Essendons criticisms of Andruska can be sustained. Ms Andruska was a credible witness.
- Middleton: Ms Andruska thought carefully about her answers. I would have expected her to be careful about this
- Middleton: it was apparent she relied on her staff. As CEO she was entitled to delegate to her staff
- Middleton: these proceedings do not involve a broad and general inquiry as to the general conduct of the investigation
- Middleton: Andruska was under pressure from AFL and government. However no dereliction of her responsibilities
- Middleton: ministerial direction outside the Act would normally be seen as forbidden
- Middleton: I conclude that by 1 Feb ASADA and AFL to investigate Ess and use AFLs powers
- Middleton: ASADA would have investigated even without invitation by the club
- Middleton: ASADA would have investigated Ess even without the AFLs compulsory powers
- Middleton: Ess and Hird and players cooperated because of contractual obligations to do so
- Middleton: Hird and players were represented at all times and did not claim right against self incrimination
- Middleton: information provided in interviews was simultaneously disclosed to both ASADA and the AFL
- Middleton: the investigation required coordination between ASADA and the AFL on matters of procedure and machinery
- Middleton: ASADA benefitted from cooperation of AFL with use of formal powers to acquire evidence and arrange interviews
- Middleton: ASADA and the AFL had different but related purposes
- Middleton: the investigation undertaken by ASADA resulted in both ASADA and AFL making separate decisions within their own area of resp
- Middleton: report provided with the knowledge it would be provided to AFL knowing they would use for disciplinary proceedings
- Middleton now generally describing judicial review. Purpose is to ensure the legality of government action rather than its correctness
- Middleton: ASADA had power to request information however direct or implied power required to force someone to provide information
- Middleton: the nature and conduct of the investigation was lawful
- Middleton: once appreciated that AFL received information directly and not from ASADA then the protections did not apply
- Middleton: there was no disclosure of information from ASADA to the AFL in the interviews
- Middleton: the desire to use or harness AFLs powers can immediately be accepted as a consideration for using AFLs powers
- Middleton:hird and players could have refused to answer and breached their contractual obligations. Whether they felt forced is not to point
- Middleton: signing up to the AFLs agreement is subject to giving up certain rights
- Middleton: no suggestion that Hird and players did not understand the rights they were giving up to play or coach AFL
- Middleton: no power of the state has been utilised by ASADA to compel
- Middleton: report was provided to the AFL for the purposes of the investigation and connected to the investigation
- Middleton: the Investigation disclosed strong link between governance practices and anti doping issues at Essendon
- Middleton: the poor governance was related to possible anti doping violations to the extent violations may have been systemic.
- Middleton: I dismiss the applications
- Middleton: if I had found otherwise, issues would have arose around discretion of relief
- Middleton: in these proceedings I would not have declined to set aside the show cause notice. But futility may have denied relief
- Middleton:the court would not have framed an order preventing investigation,even if it involved using derivatives of illegally obtained info
- Middleton: final observation about interim report, interim report was provided in August and no proceedings were brought at that point
- Middleton: ASADA complied with the rule of law. ASADA lawfully provided the interim report to the AFL. Applications dismissed.
- Middleton: Essendon and Hird to pay costs
Confused by the whole Essendon/ASADA process? I've written a guide to what might come next on the Social Litigator - http://t.co/cwPwM5oifr
@ChrisKaias
Here is the full judgment - http://t.co/wakcCcKAVR
Chris Kaias @ChrisKaias now
It is an enormous 500-paragraph judgment. Incredible considering the short turnaround.
SuperFooty (AFL) @superfooty now
Federal Court disaster for Hird, Bombers. Justice Middleton slams case. All the latest http://tinyurl.com/n4qfe7y pic.twitter.com/lKvdSpCr9H
Time to resign hirdie and take it on the chin bombers if I was playing for ÿa id be leaving if hirdie is there not fair on players but guess they cheated due to hirds negligence
telsor
Hall of Famer
Exactly.
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It would be reasonable for the AFL to negotiate assistance IF the intransigent idiots at EFC agreed to drop further denialist/delaying actions and take the full dose of bloody medicine owing to them from ASADA. Little, having had the chutzpah to ask the Federal government to intervene "if the case drags on" while in the middle of a bloody appeal (!) surely must stand down, likewise I can't see how Hird is anything other than permanently damaged goods in the eyes of sponsors. Actions by players and major sponsors - any hint of an exodus - will speak volumes from now on.
TedDougChris
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angrylion1
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Come on resident Hirdashians
You can still Deflect and Spin.
please....
fun got to continue lol
You can still Deflect and Spin.
please....
fun got to continue lol
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They're all here, we just didn't take records.
telsor
Hall of Famer
I really hope they don't.
Not saying they shouldn't assist is Essendon gets into trouble, I just don't want the two related and muddying the waters with 'we only accepted this because the AFL paid us to/gave us an easy way of ending it'.
Would be much cleaner and simpler to all if it's.
Findings.
Punishment.
Case closed.
<seperation>
Assistance as required.
- Feb 12, 2010
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Always thought 10 teams was too many for Victoria.
Bit early to dance on essendons grave?
Nah
Nah
They're pretty vocal on the Essendon facebook page.
There aren't many fans of Albert at the moment.
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Only if there has been an absolute clearout of everyone involved in this mess and its aftermath. I don't want to see Essendon die, but I don't want to see people like Hird or Little get anything but their full whack.
Another coaching vacancy coming?
After ASADA is finished, the Bombers will be back in the stoneage.
Nate_MX
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- Sep 19, 2014
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James "Jim" Hird or James "Jim" Jones?
It staggers me how far the EFC have taken this all to protect the reputation of their golden boy. If I were a Bomber fan or member, god forbid, I would be demanding that he is shown the door immediately and given a life ban. The man who vowed to take full responsibility for this has done nothing more then shake his head, and doubtfully will contribute a single cent to the legal fees. Thus the members will again be invited to "tick the box" next season to make another contribution to another "flight plan".
I feel almost sorry for the members and fans of this once great football club, you have all been dudded either by admiration of your idol or the fair belief that the truth would come out, in your favour. Will you now continue down the same path and proclaim Saint James to still be untouchable? Or have you finally come to the realisation that the only path he is taking you down is an expensive stressful one?
It staggers me how far the EFC have taken this all to protect the reputation of their golden boy. If I were a Bomber fan or member, god forbid, I would be demanding that he is shown the door immediately and given a life ban. The man who vowed to take full responsibility for this has done nothing more then shake his head, and doubtfully will contribute a single cent to the legal fees. Thus the members will again be invited to "tick the box" next season to make another contribution to another "flight plan".
I feel almost sorry for the members and fans of this once great football club, you have all been dudded either by admiration of your idol or the fair belief that the truth would come out, in your favour. Will you now continue down the same path and proclaim Saint James to still be untouchable? Or have you finally come to the realisation that the only path he is taking you down is an expensive stressful one?
