Current Julian Assange arrested. Twice.

shellyg

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petedavo

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I will fight for this thread ;) .... it might be politically loaded but he's been charged, has priors for hacking and Sweden may pursue him for rape/molestation. It's outside the general mayhem and serial killer murder themes of this board but I think that makes it very interesting. And it's important.
You might find this twitter thread interesting. Kevin is up-to #40 as of 10 minutes ago. That's 30 days worth of threaded tweets, and he's not stopping.

Start from this tweet»

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Sausages

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Here's a piece from this guy - Alan M. Dershowitz is the Felix Frankfurter Professor of Law, Emeritus, at Harvard Law School.

Report here - a good read from a legal historical perspective, citing the NY Times 1971 case.
 
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Here's a piece from this guy - Alan M. Dershowitz is the Felix Frankfurter Professor of Law, Emeritus, at Harvard Law School.

Report here - a good read from a legal historical perspective, citing the NY Times 1971 case.

That would be the same Dershowitz affiliated with & implicated in the Epstein Island Under age girl sex-scandal.

You'll forgive me for ignoring anything such a scum-bag has to say.....Not to mention an insider tool of the 1% establishment.
 

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That would be the same Dershowitz affiliated with & implicated in the Epstein Island Under age girl sex-scandal.

You'll forgive me for ignoring anything such a scum-bag has to say.....Not to mention an insider tool of the 1% establishment.
That's fine - I don't care who he is, the facts he presents are a matter of judicial record, which is the important bit.
 

shellyg

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You'll forgive me for ignoring anything such a scum-bag has to say.....Not to mention an insider tool of the 1% establishment.[/QUOTE]

Did you read it? He raises a couple of good points, that the case against Assange is factually weak, that as it stands is a 'political' crime and the UK would be unlikely to approve extradition.
 
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You'll forgive me for ignoring anything such a scum-bag has to say.....Not to mention an insider tool of the 1% establishment.
Did you read it? He raises a couple of good points, that the case against Assange is factually weak, that as it stands is a 'political' crime and the UK would be unlikely to approve extradition.[/QUOTE]


Any lawyer worth their salt knows full well that Assange has no case to answer.

Citing Dershowitz as an authority on anything only serves to turn my stomach.
 

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Did you read it? He raises a couple of good points, that the case against Assange is factually weak, that as it stands is a 'political' crime and the UK would be unlikely to approve extradition.


Any lawyer worth their salt knows full well that Assange has no case to answer.

Citing Dershowitz as an authority on anything only serves to turn my stomach.

With all due respect, you can't convict in the court of public opinion one party, but then refuse to do so in another as it suits your conscience. You either accept or deny the Rule of Law for all, or for none - you cannot selectively apply as fits your conscience.

As I say, I have no personal concern over Dershowitz's bona fides as of now, since he is yet to be convicted of any crime. It's unreasonable to extend to Assange the same innocent until proven guilty defence and then retract that for another party - that tends to weaken the overall impact that the argument has.

Whether you believe, or anyone believes, Assange is innocent is irrelevant. He has been indicted and the Rule of Law must now be followed. Accordingly, the gathering up of facts and precedents is important. Dershowitz isn't the relevant party in that article - the judicial ruling IS.

As an aside, Assange is also charged with sex offences which were the original reason he fled Sweden, as I'm sure you're aware - charges that have yet to be heard in a court of law.
 
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With all due respect, you can't convict in the court of public opinion one party, but then refuse to do so in another as it suits your conscience. You either accept or deny the Rule of Law for all, or for none - you cannot selectively apply as fits your conscience.

As I say, I have no personal concern over Dershowitz's bona fides as of now, since he is yet to be convicted of any crime. It's unreasonable to extend to Assange the same innocent until proven guilty defence and then retract that for another party - that tends to weaken the overall impact that the argument has.

Whether you believe, or anyone believes, Assange is innocent is irrelevant. He has been indicted and the Rule of Law must now be followed. Accordingly, the gathering up of facts and precedents is important. Dershowitz isn't the relevant party in that article - the judicial ruling IS.

As an aside, Assange is also charged with sex offences which were the original reason he fled Sweden, as I'm sure you're aware - charges that have yet to be heard in a court of law.

Sorry....But one of those people is the victim of corrupted Western governments, while the other is the beneficiary of that self-same corruption.

The 2 are in no way similar nor compatible......And shame on you for trying to make that comparison.
 

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Sorry....But one of those people is the victim of corrupted Western governments, while the other is the beneficiary of that self-same corruption.

The 2 are in no way similar nor compatible......And shame on you for trying to make that comparison.
You strike me as deliberately obfuscating the issues - unless it matches your specific moral compass, it's of no relevance or worse.

That's a dangerous way to live your life my friend - one doesn't eschew standards for some yet hold others to higher and expect a just, well-ordered and transparent society.
 

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With all due respect, you can't convict in the court of public opinion one party, but then refuse to do so in another as it suits your conscience. You either accept or deny the Rule of Law for all, or for none - you cannot selectively apply as fits your conscience.

As I say, I have no personal concern over Dershowitz's bona fides as of now, since he is yet to be convicted of any crime. It's unreasonable to extend to Assange the same innocent until proven guilty defence and then retract that for another party - that tends to weaken the overall impact that the argument has.

Whether you believe, or anyone believes, Assange is innocent is irrelevant. He has been indicted and the Rule of Law must now be followed. Accordingly, the gathering up of facts and precedents is important. Dershowitz isn't the relevant party in that article - the judicial ruling IS.

As an aside, Assange is also charged with sex offences which were the original reason he fled Sweden, as I'm sure you're aware - charges that have yet to be heard in a court of law.
This!
 
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You strike me as deliberately obfuscating the issues - unless it matches your specific moral compass, it's of no relevance or worse.
Hide behind due process all you like amigo....But when that due process is impeded & infringed upon by corrupt governments, then that particular Democratic check & balance isn't worth the paper it's written on.

You can choose to close your eyes to the fact of government corruption all you like....But don't expect me or others to follow suite.
 

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That would be the same Dershowitz affiliated with & implicated in the Epstein Island Under age girl sex-scandal.

You'll forgive me for ignoring anything such a scum-bag has to say.....Not to mention an insider tool of the 1% establishment.
Don't be so quick to judge P35. Dershowitz was JE's lawyer when he received an extremely light sentence for underage sexual assault charges. But that was his job.

For himself, from the flight logs of "Lolota Express" Dersh flew return by himself from Bedford (Bed) Mass to Qubec (CYUL) Canada in 2005 and one way from Bed to Tetotoro NJ in 1998. Lawyer business probably and no flights to JE's Little St James Island.

Dershowitz wasn’t named as a defendant, but a motion in the suit said a girl described as Jane Doe No. 3 had been forced to have sex with “powerful people,” including Dershowitz. Dershowitz shouldn’t have been implicated in the Epstein case in the first place. “Edwards and Cassell acknowledge that it was a mistake to have filed sexual misconduct accusations against Dershowitz,” the lawyers said in a joint statement.
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/alan-dershowitz-jeffrey-epstein-settlement-2016-4?r=US&IR=T

I'm keeping an open mind as besides initially defending JE against his charges, I don't think he's compromised and he's written a good piece comparing what JA has done publishing the leaks with the publication of the Pentagon Papers in 1971.

Also who paid for Assange's companion visitor and gf? Starts with Sore and ends with us. I'm curious to see how this plays out a bit more.
 

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What if Pakistan wanted him extradited to face charges of blasphemy? Would that be okay?
If he broke that law in Pakistan? Blasphemy is a belief, not State secrets, so it's debatable anyway. What if he was from Pakistan and hacked into US computers and then published everything he found (or perhaps just the bits he wanted you to see*)?

*Do we know for a fact that Wikileaks publishes everything they 'come across' or is that just what they tell us?
 

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If he broke that law in Pakistan? Blasphemy is a belief, not State secrets, so it's debatable anyway. What if he was from Pakistan and hacked into US computers and then published everything he found (or perhaps just the bits he wanted you to see*)?

*Do we know for a fact that Wikileaks publishes everything they 'come across' or is that just what they tell us?
Blasphemy is a crime in Pakistan, punishable by death. They take it just as seriously as sharing state secrets.

*We should go on the facts that we have. Almost nothing. What journalist or publisher publishes everything they 'come across' anyway even though Wikileaks reputation as a trusted source is pristine. They haven't made any mistakes.
 

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If he broke that law in Pakistan? Blasphemy is a belief, not State secrets, so it's debatable anyway. What if he was from Pakistan and hacked into US computers and then published everything he found (or perhaps just the bits he wanted you to see*)?

*Do we know for a fact that Wikileaks publishes everything they 'come across' or is that just what they tell us?


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shellyg

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I had a look at that guys tweets earlier PD, he is disingenuous in his postings and not telling the whole story. Not looking at them all because for every one I saw could have destroyed his argument.

What I did see also had no relevance whatsoever to the current charge.
 

petedavo

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Hide behind due process all you like amigo....But when that due process is impeded & infringed upon by corrupt governments, then that particular Democratic check & balance isn't worth the paper it's written on.

You can choose to close your eyes to the fact of government corruption all you like....But don't expect me or others to follow suite.
Democratic? Why does wikileaks employ antisemitic fascists, white supremacists, who actively support the suppression of democratic activities in dictatorships, by deliberately delivering names and personal details of activists to their secret police?

https://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/79749/wikitargeted
Extract»
In December 2010, Israel Shamir, a WikiLeaks content aggregator in Russia, traveled to Belarus with a cache of unredacted American diplomatic cables concerning Belarus. (At the time, these unredacted cables were not available online.) He met Lukashenko’s chief of staff, Vladimir Makei, handed over the documents to the government, and stayed in the country to observe the presidential elections. Lukashenko pronounced himself the winner on Dec. 19, 2010, with nearly 80 percent of the vote. His nearest opponent, the leading dissident Andrei Sannikov, is now serving out a five-year prison sentence and is reportedly being tortured.

The same month that Shamir was in Minsk on behalf of WikiLeaks, the American left-wing journal Counterpunch published an article by Shamir in which he extolled Lukashenko (“The president of Belarus … walks freely among his people”), derided the dictator’s opponents (“The pro-Western ‘Gucci’ crowd,” Shamir called them), and credited WikiLeaks with exposing America’s “agents” in Belarus (“WikiLeaks has now revealed how … undeclared cash flows from the U.S. coffers to the Belarus ‘opposition’ ”).

He has a Jewish-sounding name, but Shamir is a dangerous anti-Semite. Will Yakowicz, who interviewed Shamir in Moscow for a Tablet Magazine profile, concluded that he is an anti-Semitic Holocaust-doubter. An exhaustive investigation carried out by the Norwegian anti-racist magazine Monitor found that Shamir has a long history of association with European fascist parties. He has changed his name several times, published anti-Semitic articles, and falsely claimed to be a correspondent for the Israeli newspaper Haaretz. Shamir was also in the habit of offering himself as a speaker at white-supremacist conventions in return for a small fee, daily expenses, flight tickets, and hotel accommodations for him and his wife. (WikiLeaks has since tried to distance itself from Shamir, but recent revelations by a former WikiLeaks staffer suggest that he was an influential part of the organization.)

In January 2011, Soviet Belarus, a state-run newspaper, began serializing what it claimed to be extracts from the cables gifted to Lukashenko by Shamir. Among the figures “exposed” as recipients of foreign cash were Sannikov, the defeated opposition presidential candidate; Oleg Bebenin, Sannikov’s press secretary, who was found dead in suspicious circumstances months before the elections; and Vladimir Neklyayev, the writer and former president of Belarus PEN, who also ran against Lukashenko and is now under house arrest. Because virtually every opposition leader was already under arrest at the time Shamir leaked the cables, the publication of these documents served to bolster, rather than prompt, the regime’s crackdown in the immediate aftermath of the presidential elections.

But the damage inflicted by Shamir’s WikiLeaks cache didn’t end last year. As I learned from Sergey and other opposition figures, the leaked cables have harmed the lower rungs of the opposition movement. Having targeted the leadership of the opposition, Lukashenko is now going after dissident intellectuals. The hope? By the time Sannikov and his colleagues serve out their sentences, their base will have been decimated.

Other than what the regime printed in its newspapers, it isn’t clear what the cables contain. But the fear that Lukashenko may know something about the opposition figures that they do not know about themselves has bred paranoia among the opposition. That fear yields submission—which is happy news for Lukashenko.

As I was paying the lunch bill, one of Sergey’s professors joined us. Sergey had messaged him earlier. The professor told me that he was teaching as many as 12 students privately in order to survive. “Tell WikiLeaks I am not an American agent,” he said. “I am a Belarusian democrat.”

This professor said he worked briefly with the International Exchanges and Research Board, an educational initiative funded by the United States that operates in more than 50 countries, including India, Israel, Brazil, and Turkey. The “undeclared cash” that Shamir claimed the United States was pouring into the coffers of the Belarusian opposition was a deliberate mischaracterization of this legitimate educational funding. The professor told me the board played absolutely no role in subverting the regime—as if he had something to prove. Unlike Sergey, the professor spoke very little English, and his dress and demeanor could not have been further from the Gucci-clad caricature invented by Shamir for Counterpunch.



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Did US AG Barr just clear Assange in his presser on Muller report?

No publisher has committed any crime.

When talking about Russia leaking information to sources.
 

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Blasphemy is a crime in Pakistan, punishable by death. They take it just as seriously as sharing state secrets.

*We should go on the facts that we have. Almost nothing. What journalist or publisher publishes everything they 'come across' anyway even though Wikileaks reputation as a trusted source is pristine. They haven't made any mistakes.
Ok well if he broke that law while in their country? Sure. We expect people to respect our own laws so I'd expect other countries to do the same. Remember Barlow and Chambers and the other more recent ones? If another country is far more lenient on, say, wife abuse, do we expect that country to judge 'one of ours' in the same way we do? If we think their applied conviction/sentence is inadequate do we 're-charge' the person when he or she comes back here?

As for us having "almost nothing" of the facts, that's what I've been saying all along.
 
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