Koby Stevens.

[Eastern Rangers]

9 disposals a game from 33% game time... Sub roles skew stats.

So he collects touches faster than Sharrod Wellingham.

 

[Goldfish]

So he collects touches faster than Sharrod Wellingham.

We'll never know, he was never given a full game

 

[THE_GUN]

What i know after watching 47 years of AFL/VFL Football is this - If a player is good enough to play AFl nobody will keep you out of the team, the stuff about Kerr,Pridis,selwood keeping him out of the team is all rubbish

Stevens problems are Disposal,Injuries & decision making - He gets it but cant use it, ordinary player very very similar to a player we have getting alot of games at richmond that should be replaced in 1-2 years in Daniel Jackson

 

[TigerBlood87]

What i know after watching 47 years of AFL/VFL Football is this - If a player is good enough to play AFl nobody will keep you out of the team, the stuff about Kerr,Pridis,selwood keeping him out of the team is all rubbish

Stevens problems are Disposal,Injuries & decision making - He gets it but cant use it, ordinary player very very similar to a player we have getting alot of games at richmond that should be replaced in 1-2 years in Daniel Jackson

Rubbish. Sometimes a player is good enough but just hasn't been given the opportunity, does the name Josh Kennedy ring any bells?

Also, different positions on the ground require different traits to be exploited effectively. It's not simply a case of listing your best 22 players in order from best to worst and mashing them into a team sheet, some players are better than others when played in different roles/positions.

If there are 5 inside mids that are better than you on your list they aren't just going to throw you into the ruck because you are a better all-round player than the ruckman, unless your coach is Robert Walls. Chances are the ruckman does a better job at rucking than the inside mid which is why he will get the nod over him.

 

[THE_GUN]

Rubbish. Sometimes a player is good enough but just hasn't been given the opportunity, does the name Josh Kennedy ring any bells?

Also, different positions on the ground require different traits to be exploited effectively. It's not simply a case of listing your best 22 players in order from best to worst and mashing them into a team sheet, some players are better than others when played in different roles/positions.

If there are 5 inside mids that are better than you on your list they aren't just going to throw you into the ruck because you are a better all-round player than the ruckman, unless your coach is Robert Walls. Chances are the ruckman does a better job at rucking than the inside mid which is why he will get the nod over him.

Gee what would people have to hang their hats on if it wasnt for josh kennedy !!

You see if you read your post correctly - you have actually answered your own qustion but i will still give you a hint

1 Dimensional,Cant play any other position,But not good enough to make the A squad = B grader

 

[dajesmac]

What i know after watching 47 years of AFL/VFL Football is this - If a player is good enough to play AFl nobody will keep you out of the team, the stuff about Kerr,Pridis,selwood keeping him out of the team is all rubbish

Stevens problems are Disposal,Injuries & decision making - He gets it but cant use it, ordinary player very very similar to a player we have getting alot of games at richmond that should be replaced in 1-2 years in Daniel Jackson

Jesus, he's 21.

 

[TigerBlood87]

Gee what would people have to hang their hats on if it wasnt for josh kennedy !!

You see if you read your post correctly - you have actually answered your own qustion but i will still give you a hint

1 Dimensional,Cant play any other position,But not good enough to make the A squad = B grader

I never said Koby Stevens was one dimensional, whether he is or not is another argument for another thread.

What I did say was that some players are not given opportunities in sides whether they are actually considered "better" than guys who are getting games over them or not. Ok Josh Kennedy is a worn out example, but we only have to look at our own team for players that haven't been given a go at other clubs yet have excelled at Richmond when given the opportunity. Shaun Grigg and Ivan Maric come to mind. If you lined up both Carlton's and Adelaide's list from best player to worst player then I think (my opinion only) both would fit somewhere in the initial 22, but wouldn't get a game because certain players in their role/position are considered better at it than they are. Get it?

 

[THE_GUN]

I never said Koby Stevens was one dimensional, whether he is or not is another argument for another thread.

What I did say was that some players are not given opportunities in sides whether they are actually considered "better" than guys who are getting games over them or not. Ok Josh Kennedy is a worn out example, but we only have to look at our own team for players that haven't been given a go at other clubs yet have excelled at Richmond when given the opportunity. Shaun Grigg and Ivan Maric come to mind. If you lined up both Carlton's and Adelaide's list from best player to worst player then I think (my opinion only) both would fit somewhere in the initial 22, but wouldn't get a game because certain players in their role/position are considered better at it than they are. Get it?

I get what your saying , but unfortunately you are posting without reading !!

You mentioned our team, As i mentioned in another post - He is WC version of Daniel Jackson
What would you give up for another Daniel Jackson

 

[TigerBlood87]

I get what your saying , but unfortunately you are posting without reading !!

You mentioned our team, As i mentioned in another post - He is WC version of Daniel Jackson
What would you give up for another Daniel Jackson

I wouldn't trade anything for Daniel Jackson as I don't want him on Richmonds' list. Jackson is lucky he has played in one of Richmond's weakest eras or he wouldn't have played for the length of time he has. I would however trade a high second round pick for Stevens. Anything above pick 35 sounds alright to me.

 

[dajesmac]

LOL @ the Daniel Jackson = Koby Stevens comparisons.

 

[THE_GUN]

LOL @ the Daniel Jackson = Koby Stevens comparisons.

Please explain !! LOL is easy without an explanation its like laughing at your own jokes

 

[dajesmac]

Please explain !! LOL is easy without an explanation its like laughing at your own jokes

Stevens is born in 1991, he is a third year player. He came to the club with osteitis pubis, and was also hampered by an ankle injury for a lot of 2011(?). For 2/3 of his years at West Coast he has been competing for a spot in a top 4/5 midfield. He was #23 selection in his draft year, was in the TAC cup team of the year and was part of the AIS/AFL academy, so was obviously a highly rated junior.

Daniel Jackson is 26 years old, was a late speculative selection in his own draft and played a ton of games in one of the weakest sides of the last 20 years. He is now already on the outer of a bottom eight club.

No comparison from where I'm sitting on their trade value. Stevens was time and time again selected in West Coast's 25 over the last season or two, it's hardly as though no one rates him. Also put up a very respectable showing in the Sandover Medal count. What people seem to fail to (or more likely refuse to) comprehend is that Stevens is an inside clearance bull, a very comparable playing style to the likes of Watson and Kennedy. These types always blossom late, as they need to develop a body advantage at AFL level that they had in juniors. Off the top of my head I can't think of any tall, bulky clearance mids who were able to impact at AFL level in their first three seasons.

I'm not unrealistic in my hopes for compensation re: Stevens, a pick in the early/mid 30's is realistic. But trying to make him out as some sort of list-clogger and calling him the WC version of Daniel Jackson just displays ignorance.

 

[heypenny]

I think some of the Eagles fans are being a little too optimistic on his future.

He would have to improve a lot to tally a AFL career of 123+ games like Jackson has.

For someone in his 3rd year who is averaging 21 possessions in the WAFL with iffy disposal, he has a way to go.

He would provide good depth at clubs like Melbourne, Bulldogs and the Bombers. Probably worth a pick around 35-50.

 

[THE_GUN]

Stevens is born in 1991, he is a third year player. He came to the club with osteitis pubis, and was also hampered by an ankle injury for a lot of 2011(?). For 2/3 of his years at West Coast he has been competing for a spot in a top 4/5 midfield. He was #23 selection in his draft year, was in the TAC cup team of the year and was part of the AIS/AFL academy, so was obviously a highly rated junior.

Daniel Jackson is 26 years old, was a late speculative selection in his own draft and played a ton of games in one of the weakest sides of the last 20 years. He is now already on the outer of a bottom eight club.

No comparison from where I'm sitting on their trade value. Stevens was time and time again selected in West Coast's 25 over the last season or two, it's hardly as though no one rates him. Also put up a very respectable showing in the Sandover Medal count. What people seem to fail to (or more likely refuse to) comprehend is that Stevens is an inside clearance bull, a very comparable playing style to the likes of Watson and Kennedy. These types always blossom late, as they need to develop a body advantage at AFL level that they had in juniors. Off the top of my head I can't think of any tall, bulky clearance mids who were able to impact at AFL level in their first three seasons.

I'm not unrealistic in my hopes for compensation re: Stevens, a pick in the early/mid 30's is realistic. But trying to make him out as some sort of list-clogger and calling him the WC version of Daniel Jackson just displays ignorance.

What he has done as a junior has absolutely nothing to do with the player we are talking about today ! junior football is very very different to senior afl football.Ever heard of Anthony Banik ? No - ok lets talk about
Richard Tambling then - all these things you mentioned about Stevens as a junior - Times 10 and what happened

As i mentioned before and will mention again- Kennedy,Watson you say !
There are 100 Hislops,Prismalls,Thompsons, and your comparison to kennedy or watson is completely unjustified and i cant see any resemblence what so ever

Everything i have mentioned is backed up by the fact that your own club isnt really trying to keep him at the club apart from a token comment saying that he is required but they can understand his situation and will try to find him a new home (probably to get some value) Also there are 10 clubs in melbourne and there is only 2 clubs even considering him and only at a token pick 40+ (which backs up my opinion)

Your last comment about not knowing any Tall,Baulky,Clearance mids impacting afl level in 3 years,Whats being tall and baulky have to do with being an inside mid and impacting games, Just of the top of my head Bell from carlton as a rookie has shown more in 1 game than stevens has shown in 10

Wafl form is a much lower level and you are getting that to cloud your judgement on stevens, if players like Jackson were to play that level they would dominate every game. We had a players called Hyde,Tivendale,Pettifer,Howat that used to get 40 possesions a game at VFL level but never got there in the end.

1 thing i will agree with you on is this- Stevens will get a pick 35-45 but only because of essendon & Bulldogs shallow mids that are ready to go. But i very very much doubt that he will play 100 games

 

[dajesmac]

What he has done as a junior has absolutely nothing to do with the player we are talking about today ! junior football is very very different to senior afl football.Ever heard of Anthony Banik ? No - ok lets talk about
Richard Tambling then - all these things you mentioned about Stevens as a junior - Times 10 and what happened

Given Stevens was only drafted 3 years ago it is somewhat relevant how highly he was rated as a junior. It's the same deal with Caddy, do you think if Caddy was a pick #40+, do you think he'd still be worth a first rounder based on his exposed AFL form? Absolutely not. Caddy, for the most part, is valued because of his strong junior career and draft position.

As i mentioned before and will mention again- Kennedy,Watson you say !
There are 100 Hislops,Prismalls,Thompsons, and your comparison to kennedy or watson is completely unjustified and i cant see any resemblence what so ever

My comparison was purely due to similarities in playing style. Are you trying to make it seem as though I was suggesting he'll be as good as Watson and Kennedy? Not sure who you're trying to fool with that one.

Everything i have mentioned is backed up by the fact that your own club isnt really trying to keep him at the club apart from a token comment saying that he is required but they can understand his situation and will try to find him a new home (probably to get some value) Also there are 10 clubs in melbourne and there is only 2 clubs even considering him and only at a token pick 40+ (which backs up my opinion)

Making a bit of an assumption there aren't you? Actually, for the record, the clubs currently interested in him are the Dogs, St Kilda and Essendon, with Geelong and North Melbourne previously being keen. The latter two most likely cooled to focus on the Caddy deal (as they should). Hmm, given Stevens' rough market value would probably be ~30-35 anyway, I would fully expect those clubs to be trying to bring it down to 40+. That's what the recruiters are paid for.

Your last comment about not knowing any Tall,Baulky,Clearance mids impacting afl level in 3 years,Whats being tall and baulky have to do with being an inside mid and impacting games, Just of the top of my head Bell from carlton as a rookie has shown more in 1 game than stevens has shown in 10

When you're a clearance specialist-type inside mid, having a developed body is paramount. Stevens was always an overdeveloped junior but was never going to be able to convert that advantage to AFL level until he'd gotten a few preseasons under his belt. Okay so Bell? That's your best example?

Wafl form is a much lower level and you are getting that to cloud your judgement on stevens, if players like Jackson were to play that level they would dominate every game. We had a players called Hyde,Tivendale,Pettifer,Howat that used to get 40 possesions a game at VFL level but never got there in the end.

Stevens was always going to have to develop his game through the WAFL between ages 18-21. He did that, and did it quite well for East Fremantle. That's all I'm saying. But it's alarming when so many posters try and make out as though he was a hack who was no where near selection.

1 thing i will agree with you on is this- Stevens will get a pick 35-45 but only because of essendon & Bulldogs shallow mids that are ready to go. But i very very much doubt that he will play 100 games

Fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion. The Daniel Jackson comparison was wide of the mark though.

 

[juddy_Like]

What i know after watching 47 years of AFL/VFL Football is this - If a player is good enough to play AFl nobody will keep you out of the team, the stuff about Kerr,Pridis,selwood keeping him out of the team is all rubbish

Stevens problems are Disposal,Injuries & decision making - He gets it but cant use it, ordinary player very very similar to a player we have getting alot of games at richmond that should be replaced in 1-2 years in Daniel Jackson

So you are old.

Carry on.

 

[THE_GUN]

I really cant be bothered going on anymore about a player that has nothing to do with my team,its fairly clear that you rate stevens highly - I dont, He could be a good player but will never ever become anything better than a work horse(just doent have the skill set) The comparison to Jackson and even Tuck to a certain degree is VALID and they are all JUST work horses.

Anything more than a average player would get you a higher return & Clearly the recruiters of the clubs also think along the same line as me ............... Other wise market would demand he goes higher, You mention Caddy LOL
Chalk & Cheese - Silk & Polyester - Kia & Bmw take you pick

Your comparisons to Watson (brownlow medalist) Kennedy (2012 BF winner of a premiership side) to a player with very average disposal thats injury prone and cant get a game, who's club is very eager to let go !

Brown is in a similar position to Stevens at WC yet i dont see WC coming out and letting him go, actually the opposite they are pretty much insisting that he is a required player and not available for trade.

SORRY -- Stevens is not the player your trying to make out

 

[THE_GUN]

So you are old.

Carry on.

Im sure thats the best contribution you have made in your 4700 odd posts - carry on

 

[Zach Package]

I think some of the Eagles fans are being a little too optimistic on his future.

He would have to improve a lot to tally a AFL career of 123+ games like Jackson has.

For someone in his 3rd year who is averaging 21 possessions in the WAFL with iffy disposal, he has a way to go.

He would provide good depth at clubs like Melbourne, Bulldogs and the Bombers. Probably worth a pick around 35-50.

make no mistake about it, daniel jackson is an awful footballer, Slattery has almost amassed 100 games playing in a woeful side. doesn't mean squat.

IMO there is enough there to work with, just finds the pill, guys like that are always handy. would love to have him on board if the price is right

 

[dajesmac]

Anything more than a average player would get you a higher return & Clearly the recruiters of the clubs also think along the same line as me ............... Other wise market would demand he goes higher, You mention Caddy LOL
Chalk & Cheese - Silk & Polyester - Kia & Bmw take you pick

I used the Caddy example to illustrate a point. Jesus.

Your comparisons to Watson (brownlow medalist) Kennedy (2012 BF winner of a premiership side) to a player with very average disposal thats injury prone and cant get a game, who's club is very eager to let go !

Okay first of all, you are blatantly making stuff up. C'mon.

Secondly, again with that? Do you disagree that Stevens and those two players play similar roles? Don't forget too that both of those two players were considered pretty average early in their careers. I think you do understand that I'm not suggesting he's as good as them, but you're either just trying to shit me or can't think of something to reply with?

Brown is in a similar position to Stevens at WC yet i dont see WC coming out and letting him go, actually the opposite they are pretty much insisting that he is a required player and not available for trade.

Brown has a legal obligation to play for us in 2013, we have every right not to trade him. Stevens is uncontracted, the best we could do is have a whinge about it. Who's to say West Coast didn't try and convince him to stay? In all honesty most could see the Stevens-exit coming a long way off. Just wasn't rewarded for good WAFL form.

SORRY -- Stevens is not the player your trying to make out

Hmm, pretty half-assed statement. What sort of player am I trying to make Stevens out to be? No doubt a clone of Watson/Kennedy/Caddy.

 

[THE_GUN]

make no mistake about it, daniel jackson is an awful footballer, Slattery has almost amassed 100 games playing in a woeful side. doesn't mean squat.

IMO there is enough there to work with, just finds the pill, guys like that are always handy. would love to have him on board if the price is right

You see this is the point im trying to make, Daniel Jackson would be probably in the top 5 most intellegent players playing football atm (I.Q wise) Playing inside midfield he just racks up possesions at will and regurlarly gets over 25 a game, BUT

Disposal kills him & Cant take the next step - Stevens has the same issues but to make it worse he is injury prone

 

[juddy_Like]

Im sure thats the best contribution you have made in your 4700 odd posts - carry on

The fact you have 47 years experience makes Koby Stevens rubbish.

Carry on.

 

[THE_GUN]

The fact you have 47 years experience makes Koby Stevens rubbish.

Carry on.

No the fact that im even responding to your childish comments has just decreased my life expectancy by 2 minutes dissapoints me - I will never get that back and feel or be any wiser for it.

Another 3 brain cells has just died trying to enlighten the lost

 

[juddy_Like]

No the fact that im even responding to your childish comments has just decreased my life expectancy by 2 minutes dissapoints me - I will never get that back and feel or be any wiser for it.

Another 3 brain cells has just died trying to enlighten the lost

No the fact that you are the be-all and end-all expect on Koby Stevens is whats disapointing. You either must be him, his dad or his coach to make such firm assertions.

You claim he is injured all the time, yet he has played 50 games in 3 odd years in WA. Injury-riddled you say?? What he has missed/ suffered from is a full pre-season which 'might' have an impact on his development.

As to why he can't get a game, ask Mumford at Geelong, Kennedy at Hawthorn, Bolton at Brisbane, etc. Good players do not play because of depth. Doesn't mean they are shit, just need a chance.

The fact you have written off a kid who was drafted bottom-aged, with 3 years in the system with no pre-season base, playing in a premiership-contending team playing in the position with the most depth is ridiculous. Teams are enquiring about him, more than what you are reading in the paper.

Carry on

 

[Patron]

Gotta say im slightly frustrated with the constant digs at his disposal as being appalling when it aint that bad at all.