Lack of Respect for the History of our Great Game by Interstate Clubs

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Foucault1989

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Oct 16, 2016
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Well you should as North Melbourne would have gone belly up years ago without them.
Let's be honest. North Melbourne should be an interstate club. The sooner they are shipped to tassie the better. They are the ugly cousin of the Victorian clubs who we a pity.
 

pablo668

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Why? That's the job of the various non-Vic footy codes
That is true to an extent. As to the why though, we outside of Victoria who don't necessarily only follow the AFL and have strong ties to the previous leagues have had the AFL foisted on to us as the top league and also as the custodian of the game as such, as well as the main governing body. Both things I could do without to be honest.
Therefore it would be nice if the AFL was a bit less Victoria centric in its view of the history of the game nation wide.
 

Marc_Remillard

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Jan 4, 2015
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That is true to an extent. As to the why though, we outside of Victoria who don't necessarily only follow the AFL and have strong ties to the previous leagues have had the AFL foisted on to us as the top league and also as the custodian of the game as such, as well as the main governing body. Both things I could do without to be honest.
Therefore it would be nice if the AFL was a bit less Victoria centric in its view of the history of the game nation wide.
What exactly do you want them to do?
 

Duskfire

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Jun 30, 2007
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Out of curiosity, why doesn’t other leagues such as the WAFL and the SANFL also get recognised? Port Adelaide is basically a direct team from there to AFL aren’t they?
 

PAFC_1870

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Out of curiosity, why doesn’t other leagues such as the WAFL and the SANFL also get recognised? Port Adelaide is basically a direct team from there to AFL aren’t they?
Yep. As mentioned earlier, we are the only one who existed before though.

So we obviously complicate the whole matter more than anyone.
 

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pablo668

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What exactly do you want them to do?
Ok, good question, complaining and criticising is easy, coming up with solutions quite a bit harder.
Like I said, in the historical presentation of the game, stop only citing what happened in Victoria and rendering WA and SA as an afterthought. To be fair, of recent times I think they have improved on this a tad.
If I were god for a day I'd remove any custodian or governing status from the AFL. Make it the responsibility of an Australia wide body instead. Leave the AFL to manage what is increasingly becoming an entertainment business rather than a sports league.
 

Laphroaig

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Jul 22, 2013
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Some valid points, but then this drivel about SA...you seriously understate the financial health and strength in a strict football sense of the SANFL back then.
What part is drivel?

The SA was healthy, I thought I said that. It was a well run bush league.

It was also a second tier competition with no prospect of ever achieving the top level or becoming a genuine professional sport. Unless it found a way into the VFL.

This inconvenient truth tramples on the other myth, the one about SA and WA football being of equal standard to the VFL. They simply were not.
 

Marc_Remillard

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If I were god for a day I'd remove any custodian or governing status from the AFL. Make it the responsibility of an Australia wide body instead. Leave the AFL to manage what is increasingly becoming an entertainment business rather than a sports league.
Ahem to that brother

fwiw i think that when the AFL was originally formed they should have instead created a brand new league with 'super' teams formed from Vic, SA and WA and use the State leagues all around the country as feeder competitions. I remember looking back and seeing clubs merging from other states as a direct result of the VFL growing and thinking that it was pretty shit those clubs losing their history. But sadly history shows that those license fees paid by the Eagles etc kept the Vic clubs afloat, mine included.
 

Laphroaig

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Jul 22, 2013
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That is true to an extent. As to the why though, we outside of Victoria who don't necessarily only follow the AFL and have strong ties to the previous leagues have had the AFL foisted on to us as the top league and also as the custodian of the game as such, as well as the main governing body. Both things I could do without to be honest.
Therefore it would be nice if the AFL was a bit less Victoria centric in its view of the history of the game nation wide.
While there may be alternatives, it is doubtful that they would represent a better outcome.

The AFL came into existence as an expansion of the VFL. It might have been achieved in other ways, but that was how it happened.

Let us also not forget the attitude of the "previous leagues". The WAFL was awarded the first licence in WA. And immediately put it up for sale to the highest bidder. Hardly a glowing reason for the AFL to be more inclusive of WAFL sensibilities.
 

pablo668

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What part is drivel?

The SA was healthy, I thought I said that. It was a well run bush league.

It was also a second tier competition with no prospect of ever achieving the top level or becoming a genuine professional sport. Unless it found a way into the VFL.

This inconvenient truth tramples on the other myth, the one about SA and WA football being of equal standard to the VFL. They simply were not.
Your contempt for the WAFL and SANFL is somewhat misguided.
Sure the VFL was the top league in it's day, bigger population will do that for you, but not by as much as most VFL aficionados like to make out though.
Most of the time VFL club sides won the games they played against WAFL and SANFL sides, at least two thirds, but what is forgotten is that the scorelines were what you would see in any game between two top league sides.
Keep in mind also I'm talking of an era when sides weren't used to travelling and really didn't know each others footy that well.
Further to that remember that in the case of history, what is now is not always what has been. During the gold rush in WA arguably the best football in the land was played in the goldfields, because that's where a lot of the best players went.
During the 50's, South Fremantle was arguably the strongest club side in the country.

And if you want to get really particular, all of the leagues were essentially bush leagues to one extent or another back then, even the VFL.
 

Laphroaig

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Jul 22, 2013
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Most of the time VFL club sides won the games they played against WAFL and SANFL sides, at least two thirds, but what is forgotten is that the scorelines were what you would see in any game between two top league sides.
I assume you're talking about the Premiers' challenge matches. You're missing the part where the Vic Clubs got on the piss on Grand Final night and stopped drinking, briefly, on the morning of the exhibition games. While their WA and SA counterparts trained through "to show the Vics".
 

pablo668

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While there may be alternatives, it is doubtful that they would represent a better outcome.

The AFL came into existence as an expansion of the VFL. It might have been achieved in other ways, but that was how it happened.

Let us also not forget the attitude of the "previous leagues". The WAFL was awarded the first licence in WA. And immediately put it up for sale to the highest bidder. Hardly a glowing reason for the AFL to be more inclusive of WAFL sensibilities.
I don't think there really was any way to form a national/professional league without Victorian footy on board. Like I've said before, that amount of population and market share can't be ignored or done without.
You also won't find me arguing that the WAFL/WA footy in general didn't screw the pooch in that time period. Possibly the result of a real lack of appreciation in our state of exactly how strong our league was and what we really had. Far to many here were all to willing to be subservient to whatever was happening in Victoria or came out of there at that time.
I think it also would have been far too complicated for the WAFL, it's clubs and all their differing interests to come together and actually agree on anything really, hence the licence being sold on.
I say this remembering that at least both East Perth and Claremont had had dalliances with the idea of joining the VFL in one form or another. Part of the machinations of the wrangling going on at the time of forming a national comp was the VFL itself unable to decide whether they wanted Traditional Clubs or new entities to join.
 

Marc_Remillard

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I assume you're talking about the Premiers' challenge matches. You're missing the part where the Vic Clubs got on the piss on Grand Final night and stopped drinking, briefly, on the morning of the exhibition games. While their WA and SA counterparts trained through "to show the Vics".
I really want to argue with you but I just love Laphroaig too damn much
 

pablo668

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I assume you're talking about the Premiers' challenge matches. You're missing the part where the Vic Clubs got on the piss on Grand Final night and stopped drinking, briefly, on the morning of the exhibition games. While their WA and SA counterparts trained through "to show the Vics".
That may or may not have happened, but then that would be their own fault for not taking things seriously.
There were a few different comps going on for that kind of thing, as well as a slew of pre-season scratchies and what seem to be just one-offs for no particular reason. I've heard the 'Vics have nothing to prove and they played above themselves to beat us arguments too, many times. I don't find them that convincing.
 

greatwhiteshark

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Oct 3, 2007
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There seems to be an absolute lack of respect for the history of our great game by some Interstate clubs supporters simply because their clubs were not present.

Should Carlton forget about champions such as Nicholls and Jesaulenko because they only played in 12 team competitions?

Should the legends of the Colliers and Coventry’s be wiped from the record books because they played iagaindt ‘suburban’ teams’ ?

Should the Coleman medal be renamed the ‘Kennedy Medal’ because the great man played in a time of ‘amateur’ footballers and should Reynolds exploits be ignored?

Perhaps Bunton and Murray should be thrown on the scrap heap.

Maybe the immortal that is EJ Whitten should be relegated to suburban footballer and forget about Charlie Sutton.

Farmer and Goggin should be removed because they were not part of the AFL. Even Ablett’s 9 goal GF heroics would be wiped.

Matthews the greatest of them all would not be considered with the modern greats because he played in pre AFL

Barrassi and the immortal Demons teams of the 50s and 60s should not be celebrated due to the the fact they didn’t play in the expansion. The Norm Smith medal should be renamed

Grieg and Dempsey only played part time and could not possibly rank with the greats of today

Forget the Jack Dyer medal, Tigers fans should ignore his legend and rename it the Dusty medal. As for Hart and Bartlett they would not rate.

Pratt’s 150 and Nash’s heroics do not count

Baldock and Stewart ??? Who ???

And well we are at let’s rename ‘Up there Cazaly’ - Up there Modra
and the Jock McHale medal the ‘Simpson Medal’. No matter what era, no matter how long ago, a champion of the game is a champion of the game. They were the best on a level playing field against their peers. A Premiership whether Essendon in 1897 or West Coasts in 2018 was just as important. The history of our great game has been carved and written and for those who don’t like it the answer is simple. Stop whinging about our past and go and make your own history.
Probably the funniest post ever seen on BF. Pot calling the kettle black.
If any state is guilty of not respecting, acknowledging and admiring the history of Australian Rules it’s Victoria. They are the kings of not being able to see outside their backyard.
We have had your history and tradition rammed down our throat for 30 years and I don’t see anyone asking for it to be wiped.
Yet I don’t see Victorians acknowledging Port Adelaides achievements, East Fremantles 30 flags, Craig Bradleys 473 games of league football etc etc.
We accept the VFL grew into the national comp, over the journey we have been shafted from pillow to post with finals scheduling to suit Victorians, tv scheduling to suit Victorians, decisions on the future of the game to suit Victorians.
How dare we question such a bias and pathetically run comp.
If anyone needs to go and do some research about the true history of the game at the top level it is Victorians, unfortunately it does not always paint a pretty picture for your clubs as they are not as great as you thought they were.
Spare me your sooking, we have accepted it as it is, we acknowledge the total football history at the top level not just the VFL.
Absolutely pathetic thread and one which clearly shows how insecure Victorian footy supporters are.
 

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