Least Amount Of games Played In Grand Final

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HumanMeatball said:
Going by that graham will be the youngest in current competition
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Having a closer look at it, they are lists that show the Least (total career) Games to include a Grand Final, not necessarily how many games it took before a player played in the GF e.g. Les Smith and Sam Jamison played 5 career games but their GF appearance came in game number 3.

So perhaps there could be a better/different answer than the one I have provided!
 
HumanMeatball said:
Does anyone know the least amount of career games a player has played before playing in a grand final?

E.g. Jack graham 4 career games and likely to play in a grand final.
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From AFL Record Season (Guide) 2017:-
Playing Debut In Grand Final:
Harry Prout Essendon 1908 Loss
Bill James Richmond 1920 Win
George Rawle Essendon 1923 Win
Fred Vine Melbourne 1926 Win
Keith Batchelor Collingwood 1952 Loss

^ That would be the answer!!
 
There's a good story in the 2015 Grand Final Record about Bill James. It includes the same list of 5 players who made their debut in a Grand Final that the AFL "year book" has.

However, any other sources (apart from the AFL's own) I've looked at call the Melbourne player "Francis" instead of "Fred" Vine, as do the newspaper articles (from his playing days) I've seen on Trove. e.g.:- http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/183739492

The article also has Keith Batchelor as having 21 career games (the book has the same figure), but he played 21 for both Collingwood and North Melbourne, so I'd say they need to correct that.
 

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Hawthorn had a bloke named Michael Cooke, who only ever played 2 games for us in his entire career, during the 1975 finals series.

He made his debut in the Second Semi Final, which we won, kicking 4 goals from full forward.....He then played his last game in the Grand Final, where we got rolled by North, and in which he never registered a single stat or disposal.

He even got himself a gig on the footy cards the following year in 1976.

s-l225.jpg
 
35Daicos said:
There's a good story in the 2015 Grand Final Record about Bill James.
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Aaaah - the legend of Billy James.

Made his debut in the Grand Final. Had one kick - the winning goal*. (*Note - story may get slightly embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days).

Goes out hunting with mates in the off-season - gets accidentally shot in the leg. Never plays again.* (*Note - story definitely gets embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days, but he did play for Kyabram in later years - so - shot in leg? Probably not).

Career - I game, 1 kick, 1 goal, 1 premiership. ****
 

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Wallaby said:
Aaaah - the legend of Billy James.

Made his debut in the Grand Final. Had one kick - the winning goal*. (*Note - story may get slightly embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days).

Goes out hunting with mates in the off-season - gets accidentally shot in the leg. Never plays again.* (*Note - story definitely gets embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days, but he did play for Kyabram in later years - so - shot in leg? Probably not).

Career - I game, 1 kick, 1 goal, 1 premiership. ****
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Either way it's always been a great story, but the old version (which said he never played football again) is the most "enjoyable"! Just not quite true!!
 
It will be interesting to see how Jack Graham adapts after last season.

In the AFL he has only played 5 games, all of them ending in pretty comfortable wins. Yes, that includes a qualifying final, preliminary final, and a grand final. In which every game he showed his worth. Including kicking 3 goals in the grand final and carrying the cup into the change rooms.

This is not a post about how wonderful a player is or pumping up a team, I think it will be genuinely worth taking note about how his career unfolds after having the ultimate prize after 5 games at 19 years of age.
 
Damon_3388 said:
Aaron Keating (brother of Clark Keating) played in the 1997 GF for Adelaide in his 3rd AFL match. Played in a SANFL Premiership for Norwood the week after too (along with fellow Crows premiership player Brett James). Only played in three more AFL games in 1998.
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Another Crow supporting mate and I love AK's efficiency. 16.7% of all AFL games he played resulted in a premiership.
 
Wallaby said:
Aaaah - the legend of Billy James.

Made his debut in the Grand Final. Had one kick - the winning goal*. (*Note - story may get slightly embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days).

Goes out hunting with mates in the off-season - gets accidentally shot in the leg. Never plays again.* (*Note - story definitely gets embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days, but he did play for Kyabram in later years - so - shot in leg? Probably not).

Career - I game, 1 kick, 1 goal, 1 premiership. ****
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Have found that he had another kick earlier in the match ! From The Herald report of second quarter https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/242244717
"...and W James, with a clever snap, tried for goal, but hit the post..."
 
Wallaby said:
Aaaah - the legend of Billy James.

Made his debut in the Grand Final. Had one kick - the winning goal*. (*Note - story may get slightly embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days).

Goes out hunting with mates in the off-season - gets accidentally shot in the leg. Never plays again.* (*Note - story definitely gets embellished every time it is retold. No one knows for sure these days, but he did play for Kyabram in later years - so - shot in leg? Probably not).

Career - I game, 1 kick, 1 goal, 1 premiership. ****
Click to expand...

Have had a check around various papers on Trove dated October 1920 to March 1921. Cannot find ANY reference to Bill/Billy James being involved in a shooting accident, so at the moment I don't believe that story. Naturally will accept it as genuine if anyone comes up with actual evidence proving it really happened.
 
the croucher said:
Have had a check around various papers on Trove dated October 1920 to March 1921. Cannot find ANY reference to Bill/Billy James being involved in a shooting accident, so at the moment I don't believe that story. Naturally will accept it as genuine if anyone comes up with actual evidence proving it really happened.
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There's an article in The Herald, Friday 22 April 1921 [coming soon] that should be worth checking on:- the team. Billy James, the little rover, has gone back to Kyabram. There had been expectations that ...

He did play in the first game of the 1921 season for Kyabram, and made the best players, so if he had picked up some sort of an injury, it clearly didn't hamper him for long:- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/174156653

Interesting to read this quite recent article from a Kyabram newspaper. It does contain some inaccuracies, so it's no wonder the legend lives on!!
http://sport.kyfreepress.com.au/2017/10/13/5035/billy-made-a-grand-debut

THE late Billy James, a former Kyabram footballer, still holds the record for the least number of games played before appearing in an AFL/VFL grand final.

The question had been raised after Richmond’s Jack Graham — there’s another famous footballing Kyabram name but no relation — played in the Tigers’ recent grand final win after only five senior games.

Sunday Herald Sun columnist Jon Anderson had an item on the query last Sunday and James is the only player whose first game at the elite level was in a grand final.

That was in the 1920 grand final when Richmond beat Collingwood.

His only goal, late in the last quarter, sealed the victory as Richmond won its first AFL/VFL flag.

James had played in Kyabram’s premiership side in the GVL Wednesday competition the same week so it was two flags in four days for the 20-year-old.

But the Richmond triumph was the last game James ever played.

While out hunting prior to the commencement of the 1921 season, James was accidentally shot in the foot, ending his football career.

This is interesting reading as well:- http://www.ozsportshistory.com/melbournerules/justonegame.html

There have been a couple of brief accounts of James' unusual career, including one in “The Encyclopedia of V.F.L. Footballers”, but some inaccuracies need to be corrected, including one report that puts forward the theory that James played in a premiership with Kyabram in the week before he played with Richmond.

Nope! The Goulburn Valley Football League at the time played their games on the Wednesday half-holiday (in return for most men working Saturday mornings), but in 1920, Kyabram were defeated by the ultimate premiers, Shepparton in the first semi-final three weeks before Billy made his one and only appearance with Richmond. He had, however, starred in Kyabram's 1919 premiership victory over Tatura, 5.11.41 to 5.5.35 (the initial season of the G.V.F.L).

The Encyclopedia (and other publications from the same author) suggest that James did not play again after he was wounded in the foot after a shooting accident when out hunting rabbits with friends "the following summer".

Again, this is open to interpretation and perhaps debate - perhaps at a later stage James may have been incapacitated in some way to the point were his career was terminated, but certainly not in the summer following Richmond's win.

Just where and when the story of the supposed "shooting accident" arose remains a mystery - a comprehensive search of Goulburn Valley and Melbourne newspapers from the day of the final through to the end of January of the following year reveals not a trace of James' unfortunate accident.

Billy James in fact returned to Kyabram and was regularly in their leading players in 1921, being named as the team's best on the win in their premiership when they defeated Tatura, 7.9.51 to 5.13.43.

This 1937 article says he was one of seven brothers who played for Kyabram after the war:- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/224412442

Edit: W. R. James was the Kyabram club secretary in 1928 (The Encyclopedia calls the Richmond player William R. James so should be him):- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/179175163

This has W. James playing for Kyabram in 1932 (not sure if it's "our chap" or another W. James):- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/168640640
 
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Found it!! It happened in 1925:- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/2026477 (16 Jan 1925)

GUN AND FENCE.
Friend Wounded in Foot.
KYABRAM, Thursday. -- Mr. W. James, a leading Kyabram athlete, while returning with Mr. D. L. Nuttall, the secretary of the Kyabram Coursing Club from a shooting expedition to-day, was shot in the right foot. Mr. Nuttall placed a gun on the other side of a fence and climbed through it. He stepped on the hammer of the trigger as he was getting through, and Mr. James, who was about 6ft. distant, received practically the full discharge in his foot. Mr. Nuttall, who is a chemist, rendered first aid, and carried Mr. James on his back for half a mile to the house of Mr. R. Breen, on the Cooma-Kyabram road.

To-day Mr. James was admitted to the Mooroopna Hospital.
 
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35Daicos said:
Found it!! It happened in 1925:- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/2026477 (16 Jan 1925)

GUN AND FENCE.
Friend Wounded in Foot.
KYABRAM, Thursday. -- Mr. W. James, a leading Kyabram athlete, while returning with Mr. D. L. Nuttall, the secretary of the Kyabram Coursing Club from a shooting expedition to-day, was shot in the right foot. Mr. Nuttall placed a gun on the other side of a fence and climbed through it. He stepped on the hammer of the trigger as he was getting through, and Mr. James, who was about 6ft. distant, received practically the full discharge in his foot. Mr. Nuttall, who is a chemist, rendered first aid, and carried Mr. James on his back for half a mile to the house of Mr. R. Breen, on the Cooma-Kyabram road.

To-day Mr. James was admitted to the Mooroopna Hospital.
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So no real factor then given it occurred a full 4 seasons later.....Other than to curtail any possible come-back 5 years after the fact.
 
Procrastinator35 said:
So no real factor then given it occurred a full 4 seasons later.....Other than to curtail any possible come-back 5 years after the fact.
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Yes, it clears that part of the story up for sure. He wasn't prevented from returning to Richmond in 1921 due to having been shot, most likely he just preferred to keep playing with Kyabram and did that for the next four seasons, until fate (finally) intervened.
 
35Daicos said:
Found it!! It happened in 1925:- https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/2026477 (16 Jan 1925)

GUN AND FENCE.
Friend Wounded in Foot.
KYABRAM, Thursday. -- Mr. W. James, a leading Kyabram athlete, while returning with Mr. D. L. Nuttall, the secretary of the Kyabram Coursing Club from a shooting expedition to-day, was shot in the right foot. Mr. Nuttall placed a gun on the other side of a fence and climbed through it. He stepped on the hammer of the trigger as he was getting through, and Mr. James, who was about 6ft. distant, received practically the full discharge in his foot. Mr. Nuttall, who is a chemist, rendered first aid, and carried Mr. James on his back for half a mile to the house of Mr. R. Breen, on the Cooma-Kyabram road.

To-day Mr. James was admitted to the Mooroopna Hospital.
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Mmm..serious enough all right. He didn't get home for three months !!
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/173260958
 
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