Review Lets talk about Walker...

[Malifice]

OK. I know you have seen and heard it all before.

"Loads of Potential". "Remember his 1st game against the Eagles". "Injury interrupted career". "Pick 2 after Cooney". "Get a full preseason into him and he'll be right". "Great Athlete, lacks quality disposal". "Fittest at the club". Etc etc etc.

There is one camp that reckon he should be traded, and there is another that reckon he should stay. There are some (like me) that has a foot in both camps.

The facts are, he's 25 next year and already a 100+ game player. Yes he's been cruelled with injury, but is he playing at his best? Does he have room for improvement? Is he in our best 22? What are thoughts on his value to the team, and his ability to be a player and contributor in a Premiership side going forward?

Also - where is his best position in the side? I struggle with this one. He isn't any good overhead since the multiple operations on his shoulder, and has stopped going the aerial route since also largely due to his operations. He hasn't flourished in the Midfield, and I'm not sold on his value as an attacking defender. His tackles don't stick and he cant tag all that well. He is fast and has top endurance.

I was once an advocate of a HFF to hide his disposal deficiencies, but struggle a bit due to his poor marking. Perhaps he is best suited to a wing?

Personally, I'm in favor of retaining him on the list for next year, getting a full pre season into him and seeing what happens. If there is no improvement then perhaps seek a trade at the end of next year (with WSYD? - reckon Sheeds would be all over him being a fast outside player with an Indigenous heritage... ticks all the Sheedy boxes).

What are others thoughts?

 

[CrippsonBlue]

No offense, but it's been covered to death, and there's only one obvious option.

We won't get anywhere near decent value for him - he has barely any trade currency.

We are not struggling to find players to delist this year.

Put simply - we would be stupid to trade him. Even if he sits in the reserves all next year, we would still probably get similar trade value as to what we would get now.

You retain him not because you think he will be a star, but because you have no other options. He is slowly moving his way closer to the 'delist' group, but it'll be a couple more years yet.

If he continues down that path, it's unfortunate, but we've lost nothing in terms of not trading him.

 

[Kaladin Stormblessed]

I have been a massive advocate of Walker but unfortunately time to stick a fork in him, absolutely done.

Getting out-marked in the goal square by a second gamer, not being able to stick a tackle, getting beaten to the ball by Joel Selwood in a sprint.

Don't know what it is but is offering nothing at the moment.

 

[Malifice]

We won't get anywhere near decent value for him - he has barely any trade currency.

He is slowly moving his way closer to the 'delist' group, but it'll be a couple more years yet.

In relation to a trade, I'm not sold on the fact we would not get anything of value. To the right side (a team looking for pace) he would be worth a bit. An second - third rounder(ish).

Thats gotta be better than simply playing him in the 2's and then delisting him?

Injury concerns are the main thing that would stop a side from picking him up IMO.

 

[blues4flag]

Always been a huge fan of Walker but a bloke of his physical prowess, he appears to be too weak. Also, seems restricted overhead, probably due to the last shoulder operation. He must improve his tackling over the preseason.

Needs to gain weight and get stronger through the core.

 

[CrippsonBlue]

In relation to a trade, I'm not sold on the fact we would not get anything of value. To the right side (a team looking for pace) he would be worth a bit. An second - third rounder(ish).

Thats gotta be better than simply playing him in the 2's and then delisting him?

A second or third rounder is going to be a very late pick in this draft - basically a normal 3rd or 4th round pick in what is already a semi-depleted draft.

If it was guaranteed that he was going to only play in the 2's and then be delisted, obviously do the trade.

However it is not guaranteed - what is likely however is that we will be getting a player with just as many deficiencies as Walker, but not as great an upside.

Walker is becoming very speculative, but not more so than any player we will get for him. The upside is still there, we saw it at the beginning of the year.

 

[Malifice]

A second or third rounder is going to be a very late pick in this draft - basically a normal 3rd or 4th round pick in what is already a semi-depleted draft.

What if Sheeds was prepared to offer... say WSYD 2nd rounder next year for him in a trade?

If it was guaranteed that he was going to only play in the 2's and then be delisted, obviously do the trade.

Thats what Im getting at I guess. Do we want to retain him, take the risk, and potentially miss the boat on a trade like we did with Thornton?

 

[No1Suspect]

Goes missing in the hardstuff... Will always have his injuries int he back of his mind.. Gets found out more time than not with his disposal.

Looks good when he is 50m in the clear.

 

[CrippsonBlue]

What if Sheeds was prepared to offer... say WSYD 2nd rounder next year for him in a trade

I'm assuming WSYD will get the same concessions as GC, so if they target Walker, and Walker is happy to go there, we will lose him for nothing.

Just because they have a bunch of picks, it doesn't mean they are stupid enough to spend over the odds on speculative players.

They won't offer us a second rounder for Walker if his output remains the same, so why waste time talking about it?

and potentially miss the boat on a trade like we did with Thornton?

Not having Thornton for the past years would have been awful to an already terrible backline, and he had a great year last year.

We hardly missed the boat - we are close to pushing for a top 4 spot, and that requires depth. Some players will be pushed out of the side, but having experienced players like Thornton in the reserves is exactly what will help us with our top 4 aspirations.

 

[Malifice]

I'm assuming WSYD will get the same concessions as GC, so if they target Walker, and Walker is happy to go there, we will lose him for nothing.

Unsure as to 1AW's contract status, but if he's contracted they would have to trade for him.

If he wasn't contracted and simply walked out to go to WSYD we would receive a compensation pick (one of the criteria is former draft position - as a PP with over 100 games, this might not be a bad thing!)

Just because they have a bunch of picks, it doesn't mean they are stupid enough to spend over the odds on speculative players.

But is it an option that we should be pursuing?

They won't offer us a second rounder for Walker if his output remains the same, so why waste time talking about it?

Because there are still some around these parts that feel he has value to the side, and can improve given a break from his injury problems.

There are others that think he is a limited player that isnt going to improve but that we should trade him now while he is young.

There are those that think he isnt going to improve, but should be retained anyway.

There are those that think he is a dud, and should be delisted.

Its worth discussing.

Not having Thornton for the past years would have been awful to an already terrible backline, and he had a great year last year.

Perhaps. But its hard to do an accurate comparison seeing as we dont know who we would have drafted with the picks he would have obtained.

The Hawthorn Football Club has been particularly keen to acquire Thonton's services. They expressed interest in trading for the out-of-contract Thornton for the 2007 season, and Thornton similarly named Hawthorn as his preferred destination for 2007.

Hawthorns pick 33 that year was Jarrod Morton. Kurt Tippett went at 32, and Alwyn Davey at 36.

Worth thinking about.

We hardly missed the boat - we are close to pushing for a top 4 spot, and that requires depth. Some players will be pushed out of the side, but having experienced players like Thornton in the reserves is exactly what will help us with our top 4 aspirations.

Arguable.

OT, I'm actually surprised by Thorntons fall from grace. He was in great nick last year.

 

[juddsentant517]

For the first time, i'm in the trade camp.
He still has that potential, but lets be honest, doesn't really look like filling out to what he could have been.
Probably the weakest tackler on our list, which just kills a team, and yes, no good overhead. As the years go by, the trade value will probably decrease, and now would probably be a good time to go for the trade. It is a shame, because injuries really did kill him, but he is probably worth a late 2nd rounder/early 3rd. I reckon that's our best option. What does he really offer us? Disposal is average, not particually accountable, below avg tackler, bad overhead. Only way he could turn it all around is by being an accumulator, as his speed is good. But that position is already taken

 

[CrippsonBlue]

Unsure as to 1AW's contract status, but if he's contracted they would have to trade for him.

If he wasn't contracted and simply walked out to go to WSYD we would receive a compensation pick (one of the criteria is former draft position - as a PP with over 100 games, this might not be a bad thing!

Don't think we signed him this year, so I'd assume he's only contracted until next year. Regardless, the pick offered in either of these 2 cases wouldn't be great, and brings me back to my original post.

Its worth discussing

When I said why waste time talking about it, I was referring you holding onto hope that we could get a second round from WSYD if his form remains the same - that isn't worth discussing, as it won't happen.

Hawthorns pick 33 that year was Jarrod Morton. Kurt Tippett went at 32, and Alwyn Davey at 36.

Worth thinking about

Why is it worth thinking about?

How it Tippett at all relevant to pick 33, if he was taken before this pick? He isn't, but you need someone to strengthen a weak argument...

If we had pick 33, we would have picked Austin at 33, and then had pick 35. We would have then used pick 35 on either Benjamin, or a player picked between 35 & 51 (Benjamin's pick).

Apart from Davey (which we passed on 4 times), who would we prefer from that draft over Thornton between picks 35 & 51?

 

[1981]

He has had potential for 7 yrs. How long is long enough??

nd now he has wrecked shoulders and the collar bone, meaning he can't tackle, and tackling is more important now than ever

He is 25 next year, and with his frankenstein body might only have 4 yrs left

If he was a stock you would trade now before the value becomes almost negligible

Trade him and Thornton and get as many picks as we can

 

[CrippsonBlue]

I really don't see the point in this thread, not being harsh, but I don't.

Your post belongs in the 'who is trade bait thread' - simple.

Even if we do trade him, it's not going to be for anything that exciting, that we need to devote a thread to it at this stage of the year.

All you've done is create an avenue for people to throw shit on Walker, when there is already a dedicated thread for potential trade options...

 

[mac25]

l do not see Walker being traded for a trade pick e.g 2nd or 3rd rounder as some have discussed but l do think there is a reasonable chance he may be part of trade for players that can potentially improve our team for next year.

He is clearly at the crossroads career-wise and it is highly unlikely he is going to fufill the promise 4 to 5 years ago, he has some real weaknesses in his game that are not going to get better, very clear he is tradeable for the right deal.

 

[rampar]

walker is played out of position, he is best forward of centre.

cheers

 

[Madblue]

Poor kick, poor tackler, injury prone and soft therefore he isn't worth anything on the trade table,

 

[Sin City]

walker is played out of position, he is best forward of centre.

cheers

Yes but so are a number of our players. Is he good enough there to command a spot in front of them? I'm a fan of him when he's in form, but we are pretty well set for quality front running mids and flankers.

 

[zeeCFC]

Let's talk about TEX, ba-by
Let's talk about you-and-me

Let's talk about all the good things
and the bad things, that may be

LET'S TALK ABOUT TEX!

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

Def worth a thread on its own.

With GC and WS about to enter the comp, there just may be some weak trade value...better than nothing if he isn't in Ratten's plans.

If he pus in 100%, he makes the grade...he just doesnt put in anywhere close to this effort often enough. Take into account his average personality/drive around the club....i'm for trading!

 

[scomac]

The Op sates that he still believes in Walker and just wants an assessment about him.For me its simple is the side better with him in, or with him out at the moment its obvious.

 

[Malifice]

walker is played out of position, he is best forward of centre.

cheers

I used to think the same (playing up the ground from a HFF, or deep inside F50) but his overhead marking (and aerial ability) have taken a massive hit with the Shoulder reco.

This leaves us in a conundrum of where to play him.

 

[Malifice]

With GC and WS about to enter the comp, there just may be some weak trade value...better than nothing if he isn't in Ratten's plans.

Mirror my thoughts mate. He's got value. He fast, athletic and has top line endurance, and has shown he can do the Job at the highest level.

On the downside, his decision making and vision isn't all that flash (certainly not where it should be at his level of development), his disposal still needs work, and there are question marks over his shoulders - both the impact the operation has had on his ability overhead, and the fact that he is one shoulder injury away from ending his career.

Many of those things above can be fixed by stringing together an uninterrupted couple of games, something he has yet to be able to do due to being cruelled by injury.

He has value for a trade, make no mistake about it. Id have him worth a second - third rounder.

The question is, is it worth trading him for a second -third rounder, or instead hoping that he finally 'comes good' after a preseason or doesn't injure his shoulders again (fingers crossed)?

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Probably stating the bleeding obvious but are we sure that we are going to get more out of a 3rd rounder than we would out of a fit Andrew Walker.

I'm inclined to at least give him another season unless we are offered at least a high second rounder.


The grass isn't always greener .....

 

[Malifice]

The Op sates that he still believes in Walker and just wants an assessment about him.

I'm happy to give him one more year unless a ripper of a deal came along at the end of the year (early second rounder or lower) which it wont.

With the club to actively seek a trade at the end of next year if he hasn't come along.