Draft Profile Liam Stocker

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The reaction of SOS when the deal was done for Stocker was priceless (almost comical)

SOS and the Blues seriously have NFI what they gave just done

Talk about clueless, this man has set them back 10 years!

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It is amazing there are actually people out there who think the trade was done without an understanding of what may be given up.

Of course Silvagni and Carlton know the risks involved.

It’d be naive to suggest otherwise. Or dare i suggest it...trolling.
 

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THE_GUN

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It is amazing there are actually people out there who think the trade was done without an understanding of what may be given up.

Of course Silvagni and Carlton know the risks involved.

It’d be naive to suggest otherwise. Or dare i suggest it...trolling.
People in the know (Carlton recruiters ) Would have a very good idea of the players available in next years draft and where their 2019 pick would most likely fall 2-4 imo or maybe they may think its 3-7

Whilst i dont agree with Stocker being rated at #6 all clubs have different players ranked at different places and he may have been the 6th best player that suited what Carlton need rather than 6th best talent.

If Carlton thinks that in next years draft stocker would be the 10th best player in 2019 then they may just think we are getting a player in 1 year early as well as having a 1st round pick to trade out for a player they may already be into as a trade next year.

I personally think we will never know who will be the winner from this trade and may actually be both clubs that end up winners, But i think it will all depend on the player Liam Stocker becomes in 4-5 years time
 

pinot

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The reaction of SOS when the deal was done for Stocker was priceless (almost comical)

SOS and the Blues seriously have NFI what they gave just done

Talk about clueless, this man has set them back 10 years!


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What do you mean or are you trolling? Have you seen Stocker play football or train in a senior team environment before for validation or do you go on the ignore list?
 
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The reaction of SOS when the deal was done for Stocker was priceless (almost comical)

SOS and the Blues seriously have NFI what they gave just done

Talk about clueless, this man has set them back 10 years!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
Did bucks and hine fist pump when they wasted top ten picks on scharenberg and freeman leaving Cripps on the board? Maybe the pies would have won the flag if they had drafted Cripps or if they hadn’t given the eagles the picks to acquire yeo and sheed. Or maybe they were excited when they traded 2 second round picks for aish?

All teams make mistakes and Carlton’s decisions have not even been tested yet so maybe wait a few years before you declare it a massive failure. Must be hard for you blokes stuck on 15 flags... better luck next year
 

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I really feel for this kid, who thanks to Carlton's deal is now under more pressure than the #1 pick. There will be no shortage of people hoping he fails purely to put the heat on Silvagni for selling the farm to acquire him.

Adjusting to the big league is tough enough for first year players and the last thing any of them needs is to be forced to carry around all this extra baggage.
 
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I really feel for this kid, who thanks to Carlton's deal is now under more pressure than the #1 pick. There will be no shortage of people hoping he fails purely to put the heat on Silvagni for selling the farm to acquire him.

Adjusting to the big league is tough enough for first year players and the last thing any of them needs is to be forced to carry around all this extra baggage.
Walsh was always going to have the magnifying glass over him going before some pretty handy players in the top 5

however is it unusual for a guy pick20 odd to have so much focus. It will be fascinating to watch how Stocker develops under Bolton - Adelaide fans will be double interested in his early career
 

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Walsh was always going to have the magnifying glass over him going before some pretty handy players in the top 5

however is it unusual for a guy pick20 odd to have so much focus. It will be fascinating to watch how Stocker develops under Bolton - Adelaide fans will be double interested in his early career
To be honest, most Crows don't really care about Stocker apart from Supercoach and Fantasy Football, and mainly because if Carlton are Right he good value. And Yes that is my main interest in him, as Carlton always play the kids making them good buys and money earners.
End of this year Stocker just another player at Carlton because we will be looking at 2020,

From this trade, we are happy to be in a position where we could end up using our highest draft pick in the Clubs history, the first time we have a chance a possible top 5 pick. that for us is exciting, and hence the reason that in 2019 we want Carlton to finish as low as possible.
I don't believe a lot of opposition supporter understand how big a deal it is to get a potential top 5 pick for the Crows.
 

Gethelred

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I personally think we will never know who will be the winner from this trade and may actually be both clubs that end up winners, But i think it will all depend on the player Liam Stocker becomes in 4-5 years time
Unfortunately, on this website there is no such thing as a win/win scenario.
 

Monkey King

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I don't believe a lot of opposition supporter understand how big a deal it is to get a potential top 5 pick for the Crows.
Reading this i can’t help but wonder what Crows supporters would do if the impossible happened and the Crows finished lower than Carlton and had to hand over their first ever top 5 pick for say pick 8.

Note the word impossible. All supporters can dream.
 

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Reading this i can’t help but wonder what Crows supporters would do if the impossible happened and the Crows finished lower than Carlton and had to hand over their first ever top 5 pick for say pick 8.

Note the word impossible. All supporters can dream.
I think you could just about get 100-1 for that to happen

I see the crows finishing 6/8 and the blues 16/18
 

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My take on it is that after all is said and done carlton will have drafted walsh and stocker last year and will likely have a mid to late teens pick to draft trade in 2019. I will be looking to see how walsh tracks against caldwell over the coming seasons as if caldwell exceeds walsh as a player then carlton made a mistake not trading down from pick 1 to get 2 mid 1sts (ie adelaide's picks 8 & 13 which would have got them caldwell and stocker) and left them with a top 2-3 2019 pick which is more valuable to trade for someone like kelly for example. There were draft scribes that rated caldwell very highly and i was somewhat surprised the crows didn't jump for him at pick 8. Just a different slant on things
 

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Reading this i can’t help but wonder what Crows supporters would do if the impossible happened and the Crows finished lower than Carlton and had to hand over their first ever top 5 pick for say pick 8.

Note the word impossible. All supporters can dream.
Pitch Fork and burning materials,
Seriously we would be contacting the club demanding explanations and demand heads to roll if the Crows failed to make the 8.
Read the discussion on our BF page for 2018 we don't like losing seasons.

However, if we made the top 6 and Carlton finished higher by playing the better football all season then, I don't know how we would react.
Maybe in awe of SOS.
 

dlb99

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My take on it is that after all is said and done carlton will have drafted walsh and stocker last year and will likely have a mid to late teens pick to draft trade in 2019. I will be looking to see how walsh tracks against caldwell over the coming seasons as if caldwell exceeds walsh as a player then carlton made a mistake not trading down from pick 1 to get 2 mid 1sts (ie adelaide's picks 8 & 13 which would have got them caldwell and stocker) and left them with a top 2-3 2019 pick which is more valuable to trade for someone like kelly for example. There were draft scribes that rated caldwell very highly and i was somewhat surprised the crows didn't jump for him at pick 8. Just a different slant on things
Caldwell has already had quite a few soft tissue injuries.

Carlton does not need Sam Walsh to be the absolute best player from this draft. We need him to be an A-grade midfielder in a Carlton premiership team.
 

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Caldwell has already had quite a few soft tissue injuries.

Carlton does not need Sam Walsh to be the absolute best player from this draft. We need him to be an A-grade midfielder in a Carlton premiership team.
Sure but if caldwell ends up just as good and he looks a good prospect, then with a 2019 pick 1 or 2 you may have been able to trade for josh kelly at the end of this year and then been closer to finals than what you may very well end up being. SOS could have traded down this year and it quite possibly would have offered a better overall result for your club in my opinion
 

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Carlton does not need Sam Walsh to be the absolute best player from this draft. We need him to be an A-grade midfielder in a Carlton premiership team.
Walsh needs to be the best from this draft. Accepting otherwise means they should have downgraded to obtain better talents at 2, 3 or 4.

SOS backed himself just like he did in 2015 with Weitering over Oliver. Hopefully he gets it right this time.
 

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Reading this i can’t help but wonder what Crows supporters would do if the impossible happened and the Crows finished lower than Carlton and had to hand over their first ever top 5 pick for say pick 8.

Note the word impossible. All supporters can dream.
It’s not impossible. I’m fact SOS raised this as a possiblilty when justifying the trade. The pressure is now on Bolton to deliver. Poor bloke, reckon SOS has significantly more leverage with the powerbrokers than he does.
 

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Walsh needs to be the best from this draft. Accepting otherwise means they should have downgraded to obtain better talents at 2, 3 or 4.
Don’t agree. Carlton anticipates this as their last swing at the top end of the draft for this list. They needed an A grade mid and they needed it to be as close to a sure thing as you can get. The only 2 other realistic options for recruiters here were Rankine and Lukosius, neither of whom are mids, both having a go-home risk and both probably having higher ceilings than Walsh but less of a sure thing. So long as Walsh becomes an A grade mid, Carlton have made the right decision. The obsession of getting the best at every pick is unrealistic.

Oliver rocketed into the top 5 and was never a chance of going at pick 1. SOS’ choice was Weitering vs Schache.
 
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Sure but if caldwell ends up just as good and he looks a good prospect, then with a 2019 pick 1 or 2 you may have been able to trade for josh kelly at the end of this year and then been closer to finals than what you may very well end up being. SOS could have traded down this year and it quite possibly would have offered a better overall result for your club in my opinion
If we convince Josh Kelly to leave this year and come to us, it would cost us our 1st rounder plus heavy change (a future 1st) in any event.

That's kind of the plan as far as I see it. We'll be throwing what we can to shake loose a player or two via free agency and trades, with this years picks (and next years picks) on the table.

We got to load up with an extra gun kid during our three year list reset period (adding Stocker to the likes of Dow, LOB, SPS, Curnow, Weitering, Walsh, Marchbank, Plowman, McKay, Kennedy, Setterfield, Fisher, Mclovin and so forth to build around Cripps and Docherty). From our position we're now stocked up with enough kids to form the core of the list for the next 10 years.

From here on in, over the next few years, its all about development and supplementing that list with established talent from elsewhere.
 

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If we convince Josh Kelly to leave this year and come to us, it would cost us our 1st rounder plus heavy change (a future 1st) in any event.

That's kind of the plan as far as I see it. We'll be throwing what we can to shake loose a player or two via free agency and trades, with this years picks (and next years picks) on the table.

We got to load up with an extra gun kid during our three year list reset period (adding Stocker to the likes of Dow, LOB, SPS, Curnow, Weitering, Walsh, Marchbank, Plowman, McKay, Kennedy, Setterfield, Fisher, Mclovin and so forth to build around Cripps and Docherty). From our position we're now stocked up with enough kids to form the core of the list for the next 10 years.

From here on in, over the next few years, its all about development and supplementing that list with established talent from elsewhere.
I understand that, but the crows 2019 1st might be a very late teens pick if they do well and accounting for NGA / father son picks etc. You may not have the currency to snare a josh kelly without having to trade your 2020 1st as well whereas if you had kept the 2019 1st that in itself may have been enough to get the job done. I just think in the end there was another pathway that carlton could have taken if josh kelly is a main target that still would have seen them get the midfielders they needed last year as well...noting that there were 3/4 mids in 2018 that all projected very high
 

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Sure but if caldwell ends up just as good and he looks a good prospect, then with a 2019 pick 1 or 2 you may have been able to trade for josh kelly at the end of this year and then been closer to finals than what you may very well end up being. SOS could have traded down this year and it quite possibly would have offered a better overall result for your club in my opinion
A better overall result, why trade down and pick an inferior player in Caldwell? Most scribes had Walsh as the best midfielder in the draft.
 

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Funny thing is if the blues had pick 5 in last years draft they probably would of picked liam anyway with no need for the king twins.


Plus we saw last draft. if carlton's pick from the crows is say pick 12 other clubs will be more then happy to trade for it to land talent they rate.
 

Will.B.Worth.Da.Waite

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Sure but if caldwell ends up just as good and he looks a good prospect, then with a 2019 pick 1 or 2 you may have been able to trade for josh kelly at the end of this year and then been closer to finals than what you may very well end up being. SOS could have traded down this year and it quite possibly would have offered a better overall result for your club in my opinion
Pretty silly 'logic' - the order of the draft never ends up being the correct order of talent so you could apply that 'logic' to any player taken at any draft pick.

E.g. Based on this 'logic' in 2010 West Coast could/should have downgraded Pick 4 (Gaff) for 2 later picks and gotten a combination of Dyson Heppell, Tom Lynch, Luke Parker plus others. Essentially rather than having one gun they could have had 2.

This doesn't mean they stuffed up by taking Gaff and I doubt they would do things differently even if they could, it just demonstrates that there's nearly always more value to be had when you have the benefit of hindsight.
 
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Walsh needs to be the best from this draft. Accepting otherwise means they should have downgraded to obtain better talents at 2, 3 or 4.

SOS backed himself just like he did in 2015 with Weitering over Oliver. Hopefully he gets it right this time.
Lol. Good to see you’re still running with this absurd statement.

Walsh doesn’t “need” to be the best from this draft & odds are that he probably won’t be.

That in no way means we made a mistake taking him or not trading down. And repeating it over and over again doesn’t change that.

You’ve been told this previously and acknowledged it too. Maybe head to Bay 13 if you want to continue with that crap.
 

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Lol. Good to see you’re still running with this absurd statement.

Walsh doesn’t “need” to be the best from this draft & odds are that he probably won’t be.

That in no way means we made a mistake taking him or not trading down. And repeating it over and over again doesn’t change that.

You’ve been told this previously and acknowledged it too. Maybe head to Bay 13 if you want to continue with that crap.
Clubs have ratings for all the top picks (the later ones have some variability as need is taken into account).
But at that top end, it’s a ranking. Carlton did well this year. The players they had ranked 1 and 6 they picked up.

But to not look back in a few years time and evaluate these guys in their draft class is absurd. It’s how clubs can evaluate recruiting departments.

But at pick 1, when you are looking at the entire draft pool, you need to be looking at the player that’s going to be the best from that class for a long time.

Not just a starting mid. Or an inconsistent tall forward, that’s capable of turning a match sometimes.

It’s the Fyfe, Martin, Riewoldt, Franklin types pick one is reserved for.

History shows it’s hard to get right.

Evaluation of what could have been done with the benefit of hindsight helps the recruiters and industry learn from the past. Although some will still ignore it with pig headed stubbornness and back their recruiters in no matter what.
 
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