Recruiting List Development 2017 - How do we develop our list?

[eDPS]

Billings, Daniel, Cripps and Kelly are the most notable absentees.

B: Kade Kolodjashnij (Gold Coast), Jake Lever (Adelaide), Ryan Burton (Hawthorn)

HB: Jayden Hunt (Melbourne), Harris Andrews (Brisbane), Callum Mills (Sydney)

C: Matt Crouch (Adelaide), Marcus Bontempelli (c) (Western Bulldogs), Josh Kelly (GWS Giants)

HF: Christian Petracca (Melbourne), Peter Wright (Gold Coast), Isaac Heeney (Sydney)

F: Jack Billings (St Kilda) Eric Hipwood (Brisbane), Orazio Fantasia (Essendon)

Foll: Tom Boyd (Western Bulldogs), Zach Merrett (vc) (Essendon), Clayton Oliver (Melbourne)

Int: Darcy Parish (Essendon), Caleb Daniel (Western Bulldogs) Patrick Cripps (Carlton) Andrew McGrath (Essendon)
Better ?

 

[BrunoV]

Caleb Daniel is a notable player?

 

[eth-dog]

Cripps and Kelly don't match the criteria.

They have to have been 21 at some stage of this season.

Kelly turned 22 in Feb and Cripps March.

The u/22 rules are that they're 21 as of Jan 1

B: Kade Kolodjashnij (Gold Coast), Jake Lever (Adelaide), Ryan Burton (Hawthorn)

HB: Jayden Hunt (Melbourne), Harris Andrews (Brisbane), Callum Mills (Sydney)

C: Matt Crouch (Adelaide), Marcus Bontempelli (c) (Western Bulldogs), Josh Kelly (GWS Giants)

HF: Christian Petracca (Melbourne), Peter Wright (Gold Coast), Isaac Heeney (Sydney)

F: Jack Billings (St Kilda) Eric Hipwood (Brisbane), Orazio Fantasia (Essendon)

Foll: Tom Boyd (Western Bulldogs), Zach Merrett (vc) (Essendon), Clayton Oliver (Melbourne)

Int: Darcy Parish (Essendon), Caleb Daniel (Western Bulldogs) Patrick Cripps (Carlton) Andrew McGrath (Essendon)
Better ?

If we're being serious, McGrath would make way first.

 

[Killer_Mike]

The u/22 rules are that they're 21 as of Jan 1

If we're being serious, McGrath would make way first.

Not according to the criteria set by Zerohanger.

https://www.zerohanger.com/zero-hangers-best-22-22-14428/


"To be eligible for our team, a player must have been 21 years of age at some stage during the 2017 season.

For example, Carlton superstar Patrick Cripps misses out by just five days, after turning 22 less than a week before the Blues’ season opener against Richmond in March."

 

[eth-dog]

Not according to the criteria set by Zerohanger.

https://www.zerohanger.com/zero-hangers-best-22-22-14428/


"To be eligible for our team, a player must have been 21 years of age at some stage during the 2017 season.

For example, Carlton superstar Patrick Cripps misses out by just five days, after turning 22 less than a week before the Blues’ season opener against Richmond in March."

That's not the rules from the AFL

 

[Killer_Mike]

That's not the rules from the AFL

Yeah, it's a strange way of doing it.

 

[Yoda_]

That's not the rules from the AFL

Lucky they have stated there own criteria then.

 

[Sockeye]

I'd be happy if Watson, Goddard and Kelly all retired (along with Stanton and Hocking who I would keep on as VFL players) if it freed up salary space so we could recruit Devon Smith or whatisname Kelly from GWS. I would prefer Smith.

It is hard to gauge the impact these older fellas have around the club. In some ways they are invaluable, but they need to be performing at an elite level, not just playing OK. Kelly was brilliant last year, and been very solid this year, but would surprise me if he can continue this form deep in to next year. If Watson and Kelly both retire then it would be worth considering BJ for another year as he is probably the most consistently good of the older generation. Is he contracted for next year anyway?

Are these blokes on the veterans list where some of their salary is not counted in the cap? Do they still have that?

How many are we expected to turn over? 5, 8, 10?
Name and age at start of 2018.

J Merrett 25
Hocking 30
Stanton 31
McKernan 28
Morgan 22

Baguley? 30
Kelly? 34
Watson? 33
Howlett? 29
Goddard? 32

Brown? 27
Dea? 26

 

[Vindicater]

Would like to see six gone from the main list.

Watson, Stanton, Hocking, Merrett, Morgan and Howlett. (Retired, delisted or traded no real problem for mine.)

If Kelly decides to hang up the boots then keep Howlett.

Rookie list we have a spot freed up by Eades and would like to promote Long for a season to see if he can continue to improve.

That would then give us five spots on the main list to fill via draft/trade/free agency along with Long being upgraded.

Rookie list we take two more guys.

 

[mayhem20202]

Would like to see six gone from the main list.

Watson, Stanton, Hocking, Merrett, Morgan and Howlett. (Retired, delisted or traded no real problem for mine.)

If Kelly decides to hang up the boots then keep Howlett.

Rookie list we have a spot freed up by Eades and would like to promote Long for a season to see if he can continue to improve.

That would then give us five spots on the main list to fill via draft/trade/free agency along with Long being upgraded.

Rookie list we take two more guys.

Upgrade Long? Surely not


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[Capt Hindsight]

I'd be happy if Watson, Goddard and Kelly all retired (along with Stanton and Hocking who I would keep on as VFL players) if it freed up salary space so we could recruit Devon Smith or whatisname Kelly from GWS. I would prefer Smith.

It is hard to gauge the impact these older fellas have around the club. In some ways they are invaluable, but they need to be performing at an elite level, not just playing OK. Kelly was brilliant last year, and been very solid this year, but would surprise me if he can continue this form deep in to next year. If Watson and Kelly both retire then it would be worth considering BJ for another year as he is probably the most consistently good of the older generation. Is he contracted for next year anyway?

Are these blokes on the veterans list where some of their salary is not counted in the cap? Do they still have that?

How many are we expected to turn over? 5, 8, 10?
Name and age at start of 2018.

J Merrett 25
Hocking 30
Stanton 31
McKernan 28
Morgan 22

Baguley? 30
Kelly? 34
Watson? 33
Howlett? 29
Goddard? 32

Brown? 27
Dea? 26

Goddard is contracted for next year after meeting a games trigger in his contract.
Brown and Dea are contracted for next year.
Baguley considering the amount of games he has played and standing within the club is a certainty to get a 1 year deal.
The veterans list allowance has been removed so every players salary counts within the cap regardless of age.
Bird is in the same position as Howlett being 29 at the start of next season.
Jake Long like Morgan is 22 at the start of next year and will be in discussions about being delisted.
It all depends on how many players are traded in/acquired by free agency. Also how deep into the draft Essendon want to go.

 

[Vindicater]

Upgrade Long? Surely not


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All depends on what we do with free agency/trading.

Draft looks weak at the back end. Would rather Long than alot of these guys. If we hit the draft with 5 or 6 live selections i would spend one on Long

 

[mayhem20202]

All depends on what we do with free agency/trading.

Draft looks weak at the back end. Would rather Long than alot of these guys. If we hit the draft with 5 or 6 live selections i would spend one on Long

After 3 years, we know he's not good enough. Why keep him? Strong or weak draft, there will be someone in the 50s, 60s or 70s who makes it as a player, by keeping Long we just give ourselves one less chance to find him.


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[Ambrosia]

Hard not to be disappointed with our list development this season and by extension our season as a whole.

 

[Vindicater]

Hard not to be disappointed with our list development this season and by extension our season as a whole.

I am far from disapointed.

Having our young guys earn spots through the VFL is not a bad thing.

As long as we are in the finals hunt you play the ready bodies.

If we drop out of the hunt we can start blooding youth

 

[BrunoV]

Hard not to be disappointed with our list development this season and by extension our season as a whole.

It depends on what you classify as list development. I think of it in terms of what we now know about our list which is good that we didn't know at the start of the year.

Tippa proving himself forward though he was very clearly AFL standard. Stewart as a genuinely good AFL player has been a massive win. McKenna is now best 22. McGrath though he's made it seem like it was a foregone conclusion is someone that we've 'found'.

Parish, Gleeson and Daniher are what I would say are examples of natural development expected of players we already knew about. There are no surprises there.

Hartley and Ambrose are essentially the players we had last year though I'm unconvinced by Hartley's year.

I think that more than anything this year we have reaped the reward of the work put into the list last year.

Other than getting a year into first to third year players it's still a bit hard to say that we have learned a lot about the list as a whole.

Midfield loomed as a problem which based on performances is certainly no closer to being solved.

If we were to win a VFL premiership or at least play off (and we should) we should be able to say with confidence that the there has been a genuine list wide improvement.

If we don't make the finals and we're bundled out of VFL finals I'd be pretty critical of the year. Too much has been made of difficulties created by returning players. Our football improved after two months and nothing has really changed since then with the same players producing the same inconsistent results.

 

[Capt Hindsight]

Hard not to be disappointed with our list development this season and by extension our season as a whole.

Depends on what you originally expected prior to the season.
An 11th to 8th placed finishing range is where alot of people had Essendon.
With all the experienced players returning and low injuries the club went with experienced players in an attempt to play finals of which the outcome is still pending.
Francis (2 games), Langford (6 games) and Laverde (2 games) all played AFL footy and due to the current side structure or fitness issues (Francis) couldn't cement a spot. This is also a by-product of the forward line being relatively set this year. Francis is having to play back and Langford in the mid at VFL level as they can't be placed at half forward to adjust to AFL level as Stewart has taken the third tall position. With retirements/delistings they are well positioned to cement senior spots provided they have good preseasons and stay fit throughout 2018.
Begley, Ridley, Mutch and Clarke (if improves kicking) all get another preseason in and will step up and take opportunities next year when given them.

 

[ghostdog]

Not to put the kibosh on Lever, but the AFL webpage says the coaches survey reports this; When it came to the type of player needed for team success, nine of the coaches identified inside midfielders, with four pointing to key forwards. None rated key defenders in the 'most vital' category.

 

[Teflon Dons]

You're arguing with the results of a survey now?

Well, can't remember the last inside mid with a norm smith and we've just witnessed a dynasty without a notable inside midfielder. And Collingwood. So yeah I don't agree

 

[Teflon Dons]

It doesn't mean that most didn't tick the 'reasonably vital' category. We'll get an inside mid. It won't be Dusty. It's amusing that so many are pinning their hopes on him.

Was this a survey for our team or the league? If so I'll retract my answer

 

[ghostdog]

Was this a survey for our team or the league? If so I'll retract my answer

League coaches.

 

[Teflon Dons]

League coaches.

Like do you reckon Clarko or Damien Hardwick don't think their key backs in Hodge and Rance are the most vital part of them seeing success? Hence spin. I reckon clarko loves horse Longmire stocking up on slow blokes. Gave them josh Kennedy for free. Coaches loves games

 

[ghostdog]

Like do you reckon Clarko or Damien Hardwick don't think their key backs in Hodge and Rance are the most vital part of them seeing success? Hence spin. I reckon clarko loves horse Longmire stocking up on slow blokes. Gave them josh Kennedy for free. Coaches loves games

Hodge isn't a key back, he rotates through HB and midfield. And didn't Hardwick pretty much gave up a rebounding HB/mid for two mids, Caddy and Prestia. In any case, I don't give a toss what they do tbh. None of them said it was the most vital need they had. Doesn't mean it's not on their list and causes me to think Woosh prefers an inside mid as priority.

 

[Heppellfreak]

People are either just way too emotional about everything, done a hell of a lot of kool aid drinking or are just flat out misreading the situation if they think that Worsfold is anything resembling a problem.

The harsh reality of the situation is that he's essentially coaching an expansion team, and I think he's made a fine fist of getting them to gel and play together despite the list's obvious deficiencies and problems. In fact I'd argue that the fact that he's managed to make 'plan A' work so well (when it was such a departure from what many of them were so used to) is a bigger success than our inability to implement 'plan B' is a failure.

Now Watson is finished and I think we all unfortunately know that, but Worsfold would be the bravest coach in the league to go 'ok, we're getting absolutely smashed in the contested stuff, let's drop our best clearance player'. He's also flirted with decent form at times too, so he's probably built up a few credits. That and the lack of a clear replacement has saved him in my eyes and I'm guessing Worsfold's too.

Now if he continues to not address it and attempt to fix the broken parts of our game by this time next year I'll begin to get a little suss but I consider this year an overwhelming success, we're 7th FFS.

Ffs bird looks like Dangerfield compared to Jobe atm.

 

[Killer_Mike]

People are either just way too emotional about everything, done a hell of a lot of kool aid drinking or are just flat out misreading the situation if they think that Worsfold is anything resembling a problem.

The harsh reality of the situation is that he's essentially coaching an expansion team, and I think he's made a fine fist of getting them to gel and play together despite the list's obvious deficiencies and problems. In fact I'd argue that the fact that he's managed to make 'plan A' work so well (when it was such a departure from what many of them were so used to) is a bigger success than our inability to implement 'plan B' is a failure.

Now Watson is finished and I think we all unfortunately know that, but Worsfold would be the bravest coach in the league to go 'ok, we're getting absolutely smashed in the contested stuff, let's drop our best clearance player'. He's also flirted with decent form at times too, so he's probably built up a few credits. That and the lack of a clear replacement has saved him in my eyes and I'm guessing Worsfold's too.

Now if he continues to not address it and attempt to fix the broken parts of our game by this time next year I'll begin to get a little suss but I consider this year an overwhelming success, we're 7th FFS.

Spot on!

Our pedestrian midfield has held us back all year and Woosha has still made team that can beat anybody on its day! People need to remember that this is a midfielders game and we are still beating good teams.