List Mgmt. List Management Discussion for 2021

Remove this Banner Ad

Walshawk

Club Legend
Mar 24, 2017
2,174
2,324
Blackburn
AFL Club
Hawthorn
To be fair just using our first pick 2 years in a row probably doesn’t count as rebuilding. Plenty of teams who are better than us already, had stronger draft hands than us. If we’d moved gunston on for a decent haul last year I would be happier with our position. But we really are starting from absolute scratch
Correct. So we have two potential A Graders. Maybe four if zWorps and CJ come good. Problems is we need a dozen potentials as less than half actually make it. Rebuilding is not just taking all of your allocated draft picks. It is taking extra draft picks - at the top end. Rebuilding is literally removing the old and replacing with new. We are n T really doing that if we just bring in two first round picks in the next two years.
 

Hawks2011

Team Captain
Feb 2, 2011
311
125
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Chicago Bulls, Chelsea
After a few days of reflection I’ve come to the conclusion that it is imperative that we trade out a Mitchell or Jaeger type at the end of this year to net another first round pick.

We need to fast track our rebuild and this is the best way to do it - Mitchell would be the ideal option as it is very unlikely that he’ll be going around again once we are beginning to push for finals again in 2024-2025. My only concern is that he might not command a first round pick anymore due to his injuries and loss of penetration in his kick.

As a result of this and as much as I love the bloke, I believe Jaeger would definitely command a first round pick (10-15) which would be good value - he has only recently turned 27 but in all likelihood he will be coming to an end by the time we fully rebuild and his talents will be wasted in a developing team.

Trading out either of these players will obviously lead to some short term pain but I believe it is in the best interests of the club to bite the bullet and net four picks in the top 20 of the draft this year!
 

BurnaHawks

Debutant
Sep 15, 2020
74
191
AFL Club
Hawthorn
After a few days of reflection I’ve come to the conclusion that it is imperative that we trade out a Mitchell or Jaeger type at the end of this year to net another first round pick.

We need to fast track our rebuild and this is the best way to do it - Mitchell would be the ideal option as it is very unlikely that he’ll be going around again once we are beginning to push for finals again in 2024-2025. My only concern is that he might not command a first round pick anymore due to his injuries and loss of penetration in his kick.

As a result of this and as much as I love the bloke, I believe Jaeger would definitely command a first round pick (10-15) which would be good value - he has only recently turned 27 but in all likelihood he will be coming to an end by the time we fully rebuild and his talents will be wasted in a developing team.

Trading out either of these players will obviously lead to some short term pain but I believe it is in the best interests of the club to bite the bullet and net four picks in the top 20 of the draft this year!
My position has not changed. Personally we need to trade a few out.

Mitchell and Wingard are the two that could potentially attract a first round pick and the two I would trade. I would be keeping O’Meara for his leadership qualities.

We should have never got Wingard, he doesn’t strike me as a bloke you want leading young kids in a struggling team.

Gunston & Breust would also be on the table for me. Both could potentially net us a solid second round pick. Or a pick swap Gunston and Pick 21 for a first round pick? Maybe? Or even strengthen our 2022 draft hand.

I can hear the bedwetters, no look at Carlton or Melbourne. No experience Bla Bla. Unfortunately it needs to be done, and yes we will struggle for a few years regardless if Gunston & Breust are in the side or not. Time to face the facts. Extra picks is what we need.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Hawks91b

Draftee
Oct 12, 2018
9
14
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I think we need to be careful and not end up like Melbourne i.e. totally void of leadership when we try to rebuild and end up in the wilderness for a long time. However, right now we have a surplus of half back flankers (Hardwick, Jiath, Frost, Day, Sicily, Impey, Scrimshaw, Pepper, Greaves, Hartley,), slow mostly inside mid's (Mitchell, Worpel, Howe, Phillips, O'Meara, Maguiness, Morrison), average half forward flankers, forward pockets (Moore, Nash, Hanrahan, Morris), and older and average ruckman (McEvoy, Ceglar, Brooksby) and of course Timmy. We could easily jettison a third to a half of this group and not suffer too much. Not many have currency for higher picks so may need to package some of them up with a Breust or a Gunston to get a higher pick. On Ruckman, there are a heap out there so no need to pay up just jettison the ones that wont make it eg Brooksby and take a punt.
 

Strapping Young Lad

previously grumbleguts
Apr 19, 2006
69,992
136,182
Your local Satanist Cabal
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Spurs, Socceroos
My position has not changed. Personally we need to trade a few out.

Mitchell and Wingard are the two that could potentially attract a first round pick and the two I would trade. I would be keeping O’Meara for his leadership qualities.

We should have never got Wingard, he doesn’t strike me as a bloke you want leading young kids in a struggling team.

Gunston & Breust would also be on the table for me. Both could potentially net us a solid second round pick. Or a pick swap Gunston and Pick 21 for a first round pick? Maybe? Or even strengthen our 2022 draft hand.

I can hear the bedwetters, no look at Carlton or Melbourne. No experience Bla Bla. Unfortunately it needs to be done, and yes we will struggle for a few years regardless if Gunston & Breust are in the side or not. Time to face the facts. Extra picks is what we need.
Wingard is the class we need to add to, not cut away from the list.

Mitchell being traded makes more sense because inside mids, albeit probably not as prolific as him, can be sought much easier and Worpel has seemingly prospered when Tom is not in the side.
 

MrPremiership

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 18, 2013
12,868
27,844
AFL Club
Hawthorn
We've got plenty of leaders, so I'm happy to trade out talent to get into the draft.

But it wouldn't be a midfielder, that's where we are most bare. But I wouldn't be totally against moving on one.

Wouldn't be a forward, as we're a bit young there, so keep Breust and Gunners

Controversial maybe, but we're most stacked in defence. So i'd look at trading our Sicily for a top pick.
 

local hack

Team Captain
Mar 26, 2017
479
845
AFL Club
Hawthorn
The media narrative has finally caught up and lots of media talk such as Hawks have the worst and most unappealing list in the comp etc.
Hard to argue based on recent form and recruiting/trading of late, and Jeff coming out and saying we are now in a full rebuild.
I have had a look at our under 22's and put hem in some form of grouping. Hope the majority of column 2 and 3 really develop quickly, as if not this is going to be one hell of a long road back. Even if we do hit the draft hard the next two years, unfortunately looks at least 5 years till we are competitive again.
Easy to say in hindsight and fully support the position to have a crack whilst we thought we had a few more rolls left, but really should have started the rebuild, including trading out players, two years ago.

Looks the goodsUnknown but look like can make itUntried (low'ish pick)Untried (high'ish pick)Need to improve / unlikely
CJ (21)Kossie (20)Finn McGuiness (20)Josh Morris (19)Greaves (21)
Day (19)Lewis (22)DGB (19)Harry Pepper (19)Hanrahan (22)
Worpel (22)Jeka (19)Seamus Mitchell (18)Josh Saunders (19)Nash (22)
Scrimshaw (22)Dylan More (21)
Reeves (22)
Harry Morrison (22)
Brockman (18)
Downie (18)
 

derp de derp

Senior List
Feb 25, 2015
283
380
AFL Club
Hawthorn
After a few days of reflection I’ve come to the conclusion that it is imperative that we trade out a Mitchell or Jaeger type at the end of this year to net another first round pick.

We need to fast track our rebuild and this is the best way to do it - Mitchell would be the ideal option as it is very unlikely that he’ll be going around again once we are beginning to push for finals again in 2024-2025. My only concern is that he might not command a first round pick anymore due to his injuries and loss of penetration in his kick.

As a result of this and as much as I love the bloke, I believe Jaeger would definitely command a first round pick (10-15) which would be good value - he has only recently turned 27 but in all likelihood he will be coming to an end by the time we fully rebuild and his talents will be wasted in a developing team.

Trading out either of these players will obviously lead to some short term pain but I believe it is in the best interests of the club to bite the bullet and net four picks in the top 20 of the draft this year!
Tom has me worried with the number of qtrs he goes without a clearance. Jaeger seems more consistent in this area, him being missing over the last 2 weeks highlights this. That said our comebacks and better performances are built on both dominating. We need more mids not less. We are leaving too much to too few.

For example Freo round 4 we kicked 5 goals in the 2nd qtr. Toms best qtr for the year 20 possessions, 12 hand balls 1 clearance at 70% 1 goal.

Jaeger had 12 possessions, 6 contested, 3 clearances at 83%


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Blackhawk42

Norm Smith Medallist
Feb 5, 2018
6,131
11,912
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Chicago Blackhawks Melb Renegades
Initially I thought Sicily would be the one we could A. Get the most for in return and B. Could cover the loss of the easiest.

However I've come around to thinking that perhaps our best course of action is moving him forward as the third tall behind Kosi and Lewis, with Gunston rotating through a wing with patches up forward.
DGB, Scrimshaw and CJ are potentially our intercepting and rebounding leaders for the next decade. Sicily isn't NEEDED there. Up forward he could be a seriously dangerous third target, like he has proven to be in the past.

That's only if the big name or name we are happy to move on in aid of a rebuild is Tom Mitchell.

If (hypothetically) we decide to shop around Worpel before Titch I'd legitimately believe the club has lost its mind.
 

derp de derp

Senior List
Feb 25, 2015
283
380
AFL Club
Hawthorn
The media narrative has finally caught up and lots of media talk such as Hawks have the worst and most unappealing list in the comp etc.
Hard to argue based on recent form and recruiting/trading of late, and Jeff coming out and saying we are now in a full rebuild.
I have had a look at our under 22's and put hem in some form of grouping. Hope the majority of column 2 and 3 really develop quickly, as if not this is going to be one hell of a long road back. Even if we do hit the draft hard the next two years, unfortunately looks at least 5 years till we are competitive again.
Easy to say in hindsight and fully support the position to have a crack whilst we thought we had a few more rolls left, but really should have started the rebuild, including trading out players, two years ago.

Looks the goodsUnknown but look like can make itUntried (low'ish pick)Untried (high'ish pick)Need to improve / unlikely
CJ (21)Kossie (20)Finn McGuiness (20)Josh Morris (19)Greaves (21)
Day (19)Lewis (22)DGB (19)Harry Pepper (19)Hanrahan (22)
Worpel (22)Jeka (19)Seamus Mitchell (18)Josh Saunders (19)Nash (22)
Scrimshaw (22)Dylan More (21)
Reeves (22)
Harry Morrison (22)
Brockman (18)
Downie (18)


Not going to argue, but the backline rebuild has been in affect a while. If you include the drafting of Kosi and DGB as defenders it’s hard to argue this phase of the build isn’t complete


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

H00t

All Australian
Sep 28, 2019
757
1,250
AFL Club
Hawthorn


Not going to argue, but the backline rebuild has been in affect a while. If you include the drafting of Kosi and DGB as defenders it’s hard to argue this phase of the build isn’t complete


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Looking at that we are stocked for flankers and ok for the back pocket but nothing in terms of long term key defender. It’s DGB then nothing. Frost plays more small. Hartley can’t defend. And Hartigan will be gone by the time we want to compete.

Still a lot of work to do
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Lickmesocks

Club Legend
Oct 2, 2019
1,373
4,837
AFL Club
Hawthorn
After a few days of reflection I’ve come to the conclusion that it is imperative that we trade out a Mitchell or Jaeger type at the end of this year to net another first round pick.

We need to fast track our rebuild and this is the best way to do it - Mitchell would be the ideal option as it is very unlikely that he’ll be going around again once we are beginning to push for finals again in 2024-2025. My only concern is that he might not command a first round pick anymore due to his injuries and loss of penetration in his kick.

As a result of this and as much as I love the bloke, I believe Jaeger would definitely command a first round pick (10-15) which would be good value - he has only recently turned 27 but in all likelihood he will be coming to an end by the time we fully rebuild and his talents will be wasted in a developing team.

Trading out either of these players will obviously lead to some short term pain but I believe it is in the best interests of the club to bite the bullet and net four picks in the top 20 of the draft this year!
If Mitchell keeps racking up 40 a week there will be a club that will pay a first rounder.
 

Bardo State

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 21, 2010
11,979
13,056
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Chelsea, Detroit Pistons
His missus obviously moved to Sydney , and he is struggling being away from her (the relationship ended due to the move), and he is desperate to get to Sydney and GWS are keen because they can effectively get Mitchell in and let Kelly walk


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
What makes you say all this with confidence?
 

WWSD

Premium Platinum
Sep 7, 2009
22,123
46,191
Mill Park
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Sacramento Kings
Mitchell and Sicily are the only players who have high market value. But they’re worth more to us, so trading them would be a bad list management decision. We would have a list filled with mostly 19 and 20 year old players with nothing at the top.

Gunston and Breust are still quality. It’s not like we’ve got talented small/medium forwards in the reserves pushing for selection.
 

theiaofseed

Club Legend
Jun 17, 2019
1,619
3,208
AFL Club
Hawthorn
His missus obviously moved to Sydney , and he is struggling being away from her (the relationship ended due to the move), and he is desperate to get to Sydney and GWS are keen because they can effectively get Mitchell in and let Kelly walk


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Pick 10 please and thank you.
 

Nastyfish

Pirate
Sep 14, 2018
470
881
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Mitchell to gws for a first rounder and Merrett to hawks as a free agent would be a very very good result for us
They might as well let him go as a free agent and get the compo pick, unless you think it’s us giving pick 2 to dodo and then taking gws pick ? To the draft. Would we do that?!
 

burner1

Club Legend
Nov 3, 2005
2,076
1,534
victoria
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
hawks
No one is giving up a first for our players. Look how crows got done over a while ago and north last year (eg a 2nd for Ben brown) when looking to rebuild. JOM, Mitchell, worpel and chad are all contracted to 2023 as well on probably bigger contracts than someone willing to pay (esp JOM and Mitchell).
 

Remove this Banner Ad