Current - Lloyd Rayney Trial / Appeal | BigFooty

Current Lloyd Rayney Trial / Appeal

Discussion in 'Crime' started by QS, Dec 7, 2012.

  1. QS

    QS Brownlow Medallist

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    What does everyone think of this case? For those not in the know, a prominent perth Barrister Lloyd Rayney was charged with the murder of his wife Corryn Rayney which occurred in 2007.

    The prosecution relied upon circumstantial evidence which ultimately did not satisfy the standard of proof, in the eyes of Justice Brian Martin (judge alone trial due to media exposure potentially skewing a jury verdict), and he was subsequently acquitted of the charge. Evidence was quite shaky when put to the court in order to substantiate a finding of guilt.

    Prosecution, at the eleventh hour, lodged an application to appeal the decision.


    The application cites the following grounds of appeal:
    "The trial judge erred in law in failing to apply the principles enunciated in R v Hillier (2007) 228 CLR 618 in relation to the assessment of circumstantial evidence in that his Honour assessed the circumstances in a piecemeal and sequential manner and failed to consider the circumstances as a whole.
    "The trial judge erred in law in finding that the fact that the deceased was attacked at, or in the near vicinity of her house, did not alone establish guilt, for the nature of the circumstantial case was that no fact alone established guilt.


    "The trial judge erred in law in concluding that the finding of the respondent’s dinner place card near the burial site did not prove guilt for the significance of that fact was not assessed together
    with the other circumstances, in particular, it was not assessed together with the accepted fact that
    the deceased had been attacked at or near her home."

    Question is, is this a face save exercise by the prosecution, or based on the facts presented and the above grounds of appeal do they stand nil chance of having the original decision set aside by a higher court? What do you think?

    Personally I think the former, after reading the case in full it would be hard to reason, based on the facts, that they could satisfy the standard of proof.
     

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  2. Kram

    Kram I'll brik u

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  3. Kram

    Kram I'll brik u

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    My brother works in an office near him and reckons the guy not actually that small in person, apparently it's a bit of a running joke that someone should just go up to him and ask if he done it :p
     
  4. Luigi742

    Luigi742 Team Captain

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    I've served him at the place where I work (I work at a supermarket)

    Man's a creep
     
  5. Clown Prince

    Clown Prince All Australian

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    My mother in law used to go to the boot-scooting class that Mrs Rayney went to. The Mum in law reckons from talking to Mrs Rayney that he was an extreme control freak.
    My personal opinion, and it is just that, my opinion is that he may not have done it himself, but he very well knows who did.
     
  6. QS

    QS Brownlow Medallist

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    For sure, I read the whole case rather than summary as prep for one of my law units and they try and sell a weak set of facts like the shamwow guy sells.. Well the shamwow.
     
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  7. Kram

    Kram I'll brik u

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    It's a funny situation because the guy obviously has motive and it happened right on his front doorstep so naturally it's the most likely option that he did it. Yet it's hard to think of a sequence of how he did it that fits in at least by himself. As much as nobody likes to think about it and as incredibly rare as they are random attacks and abductions have happened before, with nothing really undoubtedly linking him he deserves the benefit of the doubt.
     
  8. QS

    QS Brownlow Medallist

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    Yep I can see how Martin reached the conclusion he did, strictly legally speaking. I think they relied too heavily on motive to support the circumstantial facts.
    I have strong doubts that leave to appeal will be given..it's a very public case and I feel this is very much a facesaving gesture
     
  9. Oneiros

    Oneiros Norm Smith Medallist

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    Heard on the radio this morning that the acquittal is being appealed now.
     
  10. Miguel Sanchez

    Miguel Sanchez Arrogant and insolent

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    Yep: http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/breaking/18377296/sides-set-for-rayney-appeal/

    Two retired NSW judges and a current Vic judge have been especially sworn in to hear the appeal, which is listed for three days (remarkably long for an appeal, which generally is wholly a legal argument with no evidence given).
     
  11. Oneiros

    Oneiros Norm Smith Medallist

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    At the risk of sounding like I am posting from under the comforting confines of a tin-foil hat, would the appeal against the acquittal have anything to do with the pending defamation case against the Police?
     

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  12. Miguel Sanchez

    Miguel Sanchez Arrogant and insolent

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    Not beyond the realms of possibility, but I wouldn't think so. The prosecution and appeal is being run by the NSW DPP, who wouldn't have any vested interest in the defo case against the WA police.
     
  13. Total_Juddshanks

    Total_Juddshanks Premiership Player

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    I also have had a bit to do with him, and agree he comes across as a bit of an odd fellow.

    Based on the evidence at trial, there is no doubt the relationship between he and his wife had gotten very acrimonious and he was doing some frankly nutso things like tapping her phone. So you have a situation where you have a serious family dispute, willingness to engage in illegal conduct, motive and opportunity, and then suddenly a dead Mrs Rayney.

    If you were offering odds on what occurred based on the last century or so of cases where a woman shows up dead during or after a marriage breakdown, you'd say it was pretty obvious who the most likely suspect is, but at the end of the day, there is nothing which conclusively establishes guilt in this case and it would be very wrong to send someone to jail just because history says the hubby usually did it. Will be very interesting to see what happens with the appeal, but I think it will be over quickly and in the absence of any fresh evidence, its hard to see how he could be convicted.

    Some of the rumours and counter rumours swirling around about him, police, omcgs and the legal profession are wacky in the extreme. Perth's a small place.
     
  14. patsmith

    patsmith Premiership Player

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    Can't believe they appealed. He may have done it (or got someone else to), but he certainly didn't do it in the way the prosecution surmised. They can't bring up new evidence in the appeal, so it will essentially be a retread of the old arguments which the trial judge quite rightly poked holes in.

    Really, they shouldn't have even brought it to trial with the evidence they had. They were just hoping that the judge would agree with their nod-and-wink "SURELY the husband did it" story. Might have worked with a jury, but a judge could never convict someone based on that.
     
  15. CAS79

    CAS79 Brownlow Medallist

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    Looks like the prosecution is trying to show Martins summation the place card could have found another way there is wrong.

    http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/s...el-findings-rayney-lawyer-20130806-2rdg2.html

    Telling the court there is no reasonable alternative to it's presence and therefore Justice Martin incorrectly assesedthis piece of evidence. Their trying to use NSW precedent in the wallet in the Chang case.

    Does anyone following the case think Martin was wrong when he surmised their were other possible explanations as to how the place card had turned up near the burial site?
     
  16. patsmith

    patsmith Premiership Player

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    Well, if I wanted to frame Lloyd Rainey that's exactly how I'd do it. Is there any suggestion that he took his place card with him from the event where they played celebrity heads? I thought at trial it was said that all the place cards were just tossed in the table after the game and were accessible to anyone. Far from the 'smoking gun' the prosecutors are trying to make it out to be.
     
  17. Total_Juddshanks

    Total_Juddshanks Premiership Player

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    The place card is such a bizarre piece of evidence. You can imagine the police pinching themselves in excitement when the crime scene helpfully has a good sized piece of paper with the name of their suspect written in 20 pt cursive typescript- can't get much easier than that. But really its only relevant as an object the suspect had access to and may have carried around with him.

    Ruling out astronomically unlikely coincidences, there are three possibilities with it
    - Lloyd had it on his person, and dropped it at the crime scene -Lloyd is guilty-
    - For whatever reason it was in Ms Rayney's car, and was dislodged when the killer took things out of the car to dig the grave, or moved her body. - doesn't make lloyd more or less likely to be the killer-
    - Someone was using it to frame Lloyd Rayney. -Lloyd is innocent-

    I don't buy the framing thing as it suggests the whole car hitting the bollard/trail of oil thing was also part of a cunning plan to draw attention to her body, which just seems ridiculous- how many bollards did the killer drive over before he managed to find one which made the car leak oil?

    I do think for the place card to have any real significance, the state would need to show there's no way it couldn't just have gotten into Ms Rayney's car in the preceding days. If I found a piece of paper I own in someone who I live with's car, it wouldn't strike me as completely shocking- she might have picked it up for any old reason herself, or just got it mixed in with some of her papers by mistake, or taken it from his suit whilst doing dry cleaning, or any number of things.
     
  18. Farmer2Goggin

    Farmer2Goggin Norm Smith Medallist

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    Interesting article in the weekend paper over here.
    Revealed some aspects that weren't reported or were only briefly mentioned :
    > Suggestions of a sexual assault as saliva was found on her neck and vagina
    > Cigarette butt found close to Rayney house belonged to a guy living with a serious sex offender , who moved to Victoria soon after the event
    > Seed pods in her hair and soil in her boots suggest she was attacked at the house after the class
    > Signs of a struggle in the back seat of her car including part of her shirt , assorted unidentified fingerprints and footprints
    > Claims that an RAC technician saw two cars close together on a main road between Rayney home and Kings Park - rear car had a struggle going on in the backseat
    > Mrs Rayney died at the scene where she was buried.
    Certainly introduces other angles that the judge was critical weren't explored. Also explains why the verdict was reached a little clearer than when it was initially reported as these points weren't fully revealed.
     
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  19. Silent Alarm

    Silent Alarm (sandy)

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    I've heard one or two but they weren't too exciting. Mostly 'my dad's friend knows a guy who's...' type anecdotes. What are the prominent murmurs and whispers? I miss Perth.
     
  20. billywhizz

    billywhizz Cancelled

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    Farmer2Goggin mentioned this above but here is the article..



    http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...leared-of-murder/story-fnhocxo3-1226768049622
    "Her shirt had been torn and pushed up beyond the level of her bra and saliva had been found on her neck and..."
    After being attacked outside her home Corryn Rayney was driven to Kings Park and buried.

    A post-mortem examination revealed she took her last breaths near the gravesite quashing the state's contention that Mrs Rayney was killed in Como.

    Besides unidentified fibres being found near the gravesite, DNA was also found on a branch on top of the grave.

    Testing confirmed it did not come from Mr or Mrs Rayney and appeared to be a mixture of at least two people.

    A blonde hair was also found in leaf litter within the gravesite but no DNA testing was carried out.

    DNA that didn't belong to Mrs Rayney was found on her credit cards in car as well as the CD button.

    A mixed DNA profile was also found on her wallet and the street directory.

    A cigarette butt found on the verge outside the Rayneys' Como home contained DNA from a man who had been pulled over by police in the vicinity of the Rayney home on the night Mrs Rayney disappeared.

    During the trial it also emerged this man had lived in the area with one of WA's worst sex offenders who now lives in Victoria.

    A forensic scientist told the trial a full DNA profile was found on the butt which he said also had not been on the verge "for a great deal of time".

    But no specific time frame was given and Justice Martin made no mention of it in his judgment





    Um, WTF???? Article is crazy. It's insane they haven't been able to get this person. Is it true Corryn was involved in a corruption case against former Macro Task force officers at the time?
     
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  21. Oneiros

    Oneiros Norm Smith Medallist

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    Sounds to me like a classic case of WA Police tunnel vision leading to another innocent man tormented and unknown guilty parties remaining unknown. Massively incompetent organisation.
     
  22. billywhizz

    billywhizz Cancelled

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    Yeah. Sounds to me like they are designed to be incompetent. Tunnel vision really only seems to occur with people involved with the Macro Task Force. I wonder why?.. It seems like the only cop who had any idea was Paul Ferguson.
     
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  23. Hillsguy

    Hillsguy Rookie

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    LR did it but may have had some help. Prob some crim he defended & didn`t charge him majorly in case he ever needed him..
     
  24. Oneiros

    Oneiros Norm Smith Medallist

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    Oh rubbish, there's nothing to even begin to point to that possibly being a worthwhile or valid theory whatsoever.
     
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  25. Oneiros

    Oneiros Norm Smith Medallist

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    The most straight-forward explanation is that the cops and prosecutors got another case of tunnel vision and have ****** up the case. Again.

    At least this time they didn't actual put their target in jail (cf: Mallard).
     
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