List Mgmt. Lyon and the Cubs

theGav56

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We are coming up to the bye and sit a couple of years into a full scale list overhaul with a massive emphasis on youth, supported by the recruitment of early-mid career ex-WA players. One of the big question marks hanging over all of that has been the coach and his record with developing and playing the youth. His resume has revealed a coach who performs well with established, mature players who he grinds wins out of with an effort based game plan. His accusers have described him as not having the skill-set to develop a list, is not attacking enough, and who does not give enough freedom to players to use what elite skills they may have at their disposal.

I look at the reality of how the young players and how they have been developing and must say i am pretty happy with how they are trending. It is not difficult to put up examples, and Cerra currently sits in that spotlight. But there is a raft of other examples;

  • A Pearce and Ryan look like locks in what is looking like the most exciting defence that the club has ever put together.
  • Cerra and Brayshaw have the capacity to underpin some already well developed midfield options including Neale, Langdon and Blakely. Plus there are some babes in the woods in terms of youth who are also being given opportunities with an exciting debut from Giro to add to Banfield and Crowden's debuts.
  • In the much criticised forward line we have just witnessed a magnificent break-out game by a young Cox, a player who has been maligned on here despite being still wet behind the ears. The club has been regularly sledged on here about skills development, yet Cox has taken his kicking issues and transformed himself into a dangerous forward. We have also seen the evolution of Taberner from rookie list into an established best 22 player with a second string to his bow, and I credit Lyon's persistence in large part for that.
  • In the ruck we have rarely been as excited about a debutante's early contributions as Darcy. The excitement at the draft event when we selected him was palpable, but his development has also been excellent.
  • The wafl is a legitimate development tool and the alliance has been fruitful for the club. Taberner is the poster boy for this, but there is a clear opportunity being given to players to drop back there and develop some areas of their game.
The critical issue facing our rebuild is not about "can Lyon develop the youth". That question is answered. The question is now about where will he take his game plan?

He is an easy target, and I think the coach deserves scrutiny. They are such a pivotal part of a team that I believe that if a clearly better option is ever available to a club, then they should take it. But if you haven't been able to pick it up already with all the smoke that accompanies a rebuild, then the make up of our squad informs us all that there is change happening. It is towards a game plan full of speed, skill and footballing nous. It is aggressive and attacking. We saw some of the characteristic pressure that is Lyon's signature on the weekend mixed in as well. It is a potent brew.
 

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ydraw

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Pretty triumphant post after narrowly we beat a team with 7 of their best 22 out, at home, when they kicked 9.14.

Don't get carried away. Eddie Betts had a field day but kicked 2.6, it could easily have gone the other way.
 

salim malik

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Pretty triumphant post after narrowly we beat a team with 7 of their best 22 out, at home, when they kicked 9.14.

Don't get carried away. Eddie Betts had a field day but kicked 2.6, it could easily have gone the other way.
You forgot to mention one of the least experienced and youngest Freo teams to ever step out onto the park but you never let the facts get in the way of a good put down. Eddie missed a few but so did Balla's and Langdon. Maybe Eddie was pushed outside his goal kicking comfort zone.
 

Demons09

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Pretty triumphant post after narrowly we beat a team with 7 of their best 22 out, at home, when they kicked 9.14.

Don't get carried away. Eddie Betts had a field day but kicked 2.6, it could easily have gone the other way.
And yet we had arguably the best player in the comp, one of the top 5 ruckman, the Hill brothers, Cam and your boy out imo that makes it a great win we were more disadvantaged than the Crows.
 

theGav56

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Pretty triumphant post after narrowly we beat a team with 7 of their best 22 out, at home, when they kicked 9.14.

Don't get carried away. Eddie Betts had a field day but kicked 2.6, it could easily have gone the other way.
There other threads to discuss last weekends game. This one is about Lyon and his achievements in developing young players.
 

ydraw

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You forgot to mention one of the least experienced and youngest Freo teams to ever step out onto the park but you never let the facts get in the way of a good put down. Eddie missed a few but so did Balla's and Langdon. Maybe Eddie was pushed outside his goal kicking comfort zone.
Just saying, the crows had more scoring shots than we did. They kicked themselves out of it. It's great to get a win, but please remember it was against a massively depleted team and we were still lucky to sneak in, before you go crowing from the rooftops about how well the rebuild is going.
 

salim malik

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Just saying, the crows had more scoring shots than we did. They kicked themselves out of it. It's great to get a win, but please remember it was against a massively depleted team and we were still lucky to sneak in, before you go crowing from the rooftops about how well the rebuild is going.
But surely you recognise our own important outs plus the inexperience and youth of the Freo team. Personally I enjoyed every minute of watching the youngsters ply their trade and I'm still buzzing over the win.
 

Nodgey

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In fairness to Lyon he hasn't really needed to develop youngsters until now. So it probably is premature to say with certainty that he can't develop youth. I accept the parlous state of the Saints list when he left, and that we fell of a cliff, but one can't argue with his winning % when his team is thereabouts.

Another thing. I vehemently disagree with the notion that you only replace a coach if there's a better one available. IMHO if you decide your current coach isn't working out, then they simply have to go. Regardless of who's available.
 

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Crippa

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He is an easy target, and I think the coach deserves scrutiny. They are such a pivotal part of a team that I believe that if a clearly better option is ever available to a club, then they should take it.
Exactly what the Carlton board said when a clearly better option in Malthouse became available to the club. I mean look at all those premierships. No brainer.
 

ydraw

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But surely you recognise our own important outs plus the inexperience and youth of the Freo team. Personally I enjoyed every minute of watching the youngsters ply their trade and I'm still buzzing over the win.
Yeah, we can tell.
 

One_Wing

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Just saying, the crows had more scoring shots than we did. They kicked themselves out of it. It's great to get a win, but please remember it was against a massively depleted team and we were still lucky to sneak in, before you go crowing from the rooftops about how well the rebuild is going.
If you look at some of those shots in cotext they were kinda spray and prays.
 

Square Peg

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You can see the future yesterday for sure. It was fantastic.

The immediate interest is Carlton and how we play this Saturday. It can be argued we were so unlikely to win any away game so far this year that a mainly defensive approach has been justified. That doesn't apply this week. I'll wait to see how we structure up and play vs the Blues before talking much about us having a potency brewmeister in charge.

When it's all said and done, the general trend is upward for sure but I'm still not sure it's in his make-up. He has brought D Pearce into the side three times already this year. He only "doubled down" on the rebuild when we lost to North and so all realistic chance of finals went out the window. It's early days.
 

_007_

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Faaaaaar too generous imo so here are some quick thoughts.

A Pearce: Didn't get a game until necessity dictated through injury. Who knows what might have happened if that wasn't the case.

Ryan: Mature ager playing the same game he did at VFL, doing well and improving though.

Cerra: Way too early to claim Lyon developed him. What he has achieved so far is on him.

Brayshaw: See Cerra.

Cox: Had a number of above average games and now one good game. He is still visibly not confident in his own goal kicking.

Taberner: I would love hear what Tabs has to say about Lyon personally ;).

Darcy: See Cerra and Brayshaw.

Neale, Blakely and Langdon: Big tick of approval, especially with Langdon who is exceeding all expectations except for perhaps Allikat's. Well done.

Giro, Banfield and Crowden: May not even make it but like you said at least they're getting a go. Certainly doesn't go any way toward proving (or disproving) Lyon's ability to develop players.

Long story short: let's see if the rebuild actually succeeds before lauding the coaches ability to perform one. Heaps of water to go under the bridge yet.
 

Superkoops

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In fairness to Lyon he hasn't really needed to develop youngsters until now. So it probably is premature to say with certainty that he can't develop youth. I accept the parlous state of the Saints list when he left, and that we fell of a cliff, but one can't argue with his winning % when his team is thereabouts.

Another thing. I vehemently disagree with the notion that you only replace a coach if there's a better one available. IMHO if you decide your current coach isn't working out, then they simply have to go. Regardless of who's available.
It is a bit complicated though, with Lyon having over 2-years to run on very good coin.
 

theGav56

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In fairness to Lyon he hasn't really needed to develop youngsters until now. So it probably is premature to say with certainty that he can't develop youth. I accept the parlous state of the Saints list when he left, and that we fell of a cliff, but one can't argue with his winning % when his team is thereabouts.
He clearly can develop youth and we are seeing the evidence of that. I fully accept that he may not be a clu's first choice if it is entering a rebuild mind you, but so far he is doing ok.
Another thing. I vehemently disagree with the notion that you only replace a coach if there's a better one available. IMHO if you decide your current coach isn't working out, then they simply have to go. Regardless of who's available.
Happy for you to vehemently disagree with anything you like, but that's not what I am suggesting. There are several scenarios where you may want to change the coach. One of them is if there is a clearly better coach available. Your current coach not working out is another. Losing the players quite legit as well. Sometimes you just need a change.
 
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