Covid-19 Welcome to Freedom

[Osho]

IN australia vitamin D deficiency issues are fighting uphill against sunsmart messaging. Its an ongoing issue.

That's interesting. Immune system versus skin health. Is an hour of sunlight a day, at say 10am, a serious skin cancer risk, and do sun creams block the necessay spectrum? I suppose that is where Vit D supplements would become essential.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

of the examples you cite
- heart attack - there is myocarditis from covid 19, as well as septic shock can also lead to insufficient coronary blood flow which can cause "heart attack"; now if you are meaning that this person had covid 19 +ve, but was still well, then had sudden onset chest pain then died - yeah I'd agree that should not be classed as covid 19. It takes a lot of effort/ data collection to work this out though, unless the GP doing the death certificate had known the patient well (then they would accurately document cause of death as AMI and COVID 19 as only an associated condition)
- cancer - very hard to exclude the additive effect of COVID 19 infection (same was other cancer patients die of pneumonia etc)
- death from Parkinsons would be a fall (so trauma) or aspiration pneumonia (which would like a bit like chest infection, so distinguishing from COVID 19 hard)
- death from Alzheimers - similar to cancer, how do you exclude the additive effect

Better data costs more money and time. Is that where you see best use of health care resources?

There is also a fair bit of statistical data regarding death "after" Covid.
It seems like blood clotting can occur even in asymptomatic cases , and that in the months after recovery they stroke or ischaemic heart attack.
When these result in death, i doubt they are recorded as "Covid" deaths. For sure there will be grey areas and errors both ways.
We don't need better data, we know its killing a "lot" of people. The exact number is not important.

 

[owen87]

Is an hour of sunlight a day, at say 10am, a serious skin cancer risk

It's above the recommended amount of sun exposure, from memory the recommended amount for Vitamin D is basically walking to and from the car during daylight hours so an hour isn't really necessary anyway.

In summer it's not such a problem, in winter for office-workers it's quite easy not to actually get enough sun exposure.

 

[Crankyhawk]

It's above the recommended amount of sun exposure, from memory the recommended amount for Vitamin D is basically walking to and from the car during daylight hours so an hour isn't really necessary anyway.

In summer it's not such a problem, in winter for office-workers it's quite easy not to actually get enough sun exposure.

This is current (and joint position from skin protection vs osteoporosis)

National Cancer Prevention Policy

Find recommendations for governments and non-government organisations to reduce the incidence of specific preventable cancer types

wiki.cancer.org.au

They only say “few minutes on bare arms” should be sufficient (I had heard size of palms for 15 minutes) but is also dependent on skin pigmentation

 

[Crankyhawk]

I agree that it can be hard to assess the main cause of death. But where an elderly person is already sick with multiple ailments then dies within 28 days of a positive test should it automatically be assigned as a Covid death? What value does it add? From an Italian study, the average age of death among the unvaccinated was 78, with those people having four pre-existing conditions on average. The average age of death in the vaccinated was 85, and that on average each person had five underlying illnesses when they caught Covid.

Where someone has died but shows no current Covid-19 symptoms it often gets referred to the coroner. It is not a waste of health resources. It is vital for our understanding of this virus, its impact, and best treatment. Like the German pathologist, Peter Schirmacher, who has carried out hundreds of autopsies that have led, among other things, to better treatment and ventilation of Covid sufferers. "The knowledge gained here helps to be able to treat sick people better and more successfully and to save lives"

The issue has also become politicised. Daniel Andrews cited the death of a 27-year-old Sydney man as an example that the Delta strain is super dangerous for young people. The cause of death was not known and had been referred to the coroner. Another time last year a guy in his 20s died. It was pretty obvious it was a drug overdose but it did not stop Andrews stating "We are talking about the youngest person that has died of this virus, or at least with this virus".

Anecdotal evidence

But more serious it takes serious funding and time to determine cause. And while perhaps measuring it against total life expectancy would be a better way there would be immediate cries of devaluation of the lives of the elderly

 

[Marcel Proust]

This being the key point, they're not experts. Those who are experts, almost universally agree with getting it, and from what I've seen, those opposed to it often have extremely dubious credentials or a conflict of interest.

100% of nurses and doctors I know have all gotten it, so I'm guessing the overriding sentiment in the medical industry is pro-vaccine.

Was having a feed with a doctor got chatting.

Did not know / believe that az is made from chimp virus.

Bit of a worry these experts don't know the basics?

 

[Crankyhawk]

We've had almost two years now and funding seems to be the least of our worries when it suits.



I go back to what I said. It is vital for our understanding of this virus that the data is collected and analysed so as to assess its impact and best treatment is devised. As the German pathologist said, Peter Schirmacher, who has carried out hundreds of autopsies that have led, among other things, to better treatment and ventilation of Covid sufferers. "The knowledge gained here helps to be able to treat sick people better and more successfully and to save lives"

So in Victoria there appears to be fork all capacity to do autopsy, and it’s not just funding but having clinicians/ researchers interested in doing a pretty dry audit.

 

[owen87]

Was having a feed with a doctor got chatting.

Did not know / believe that az is made from chimp virus.

Bit of a worry these experts don't know the basics?

Not every doctor is an 'expert' in vaccine creation and manufacture, you do get that right?

The health advice remains the same. You don't go to a mechanic to ask how the electronics in your car are developed after all.

 

[Chief]

Was having a feed with a doctor got chatting.

Did not know / believe that az is made from chimp virus.

Bit of a worry these experts don't know the basics?

As a doctor friend of mine once said: "A doctor is just another bozo with a university degree."

Your local GP is not a virologist.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Of course there is capacity to do the small number of autopsies. The funding is political.

There has been unlimited funding to provide millions of PCR tests at the taxpayer expense. There has been unlimited funding to provide million of vaccines. But virtually nothing on what might lead to better treatment and ventilation of Covid sufferers.

There are bugger all anatomical pathologists.

 

[Crankyhawk]

There's sufficient for the small number of deaths we are seeing. But you would only need one or two who took that interest to make significant findings as German pathologist, Peter Schirmacher, did.
[/QUOTE]
You have no idea as usual.
Black Saturday for example caused a backlog that lasted for years.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

There's sufficient for the small number of deaths we are seeing. But you would only need one or two who took that interest to make significant findings as German pathologist, Peter Schirmacher, did.
[/QUOTE]

Peter Schirmacher did it for research right?
Not for making sure the statistics are up to your standard.

I'm sure Peter has shared his findings.

Why repeat the same research?

 

[Pessimistic]

As soon as it became clear the pandemic would not be a disaster for australia it was politics as usual. Perhaps even more so with the raised profile nationally of some pollies

 

[Crankyhawk]

Weren't you the one recently warning us about the toxicity of Vitamin D supplements? That was a bit clueless.



An event that caused 170 deaths in one day is not relevant to current events where a small number of people are dying each day. It would be well within the capacity of a small team of pathologists to verify or rebut Peter Schirmacher's findings - that 30 to 40 percent of those who died within two weeks of being vaccinated died from the vaccination.

THe vitamin D was pointing out that it is possible to have toxicity. Yes one needs to consume a really stupidly high level of supplement, but it was a response to soemone else positing the claim that there is NO (ie an absolute) issue with excessive vitamin D

Some people may read that, believe it and the do something dumb.

Vitamin D toxicity: What if you get too much? - Mayo Clinic

And Schirmacher has not published in peer reviewed journals as yet, so I am not going give that view any oxygen. It seems only available on websites which I would call freedumb echochambers.

also I find it odd that his CV seems to be publicly available to locate (although perhaps out of date as no publications since 2007)

Neoptolemos JP, Dunn JA, Stocken DD, Almond J, Link K, Beger H, Bassi C, (uni-heidelberg.de) (no I don't know why it looks like a set of author citations, the link is afile ending in.pdf).

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

There’s dumb and dumber and then there’s this… and a health worker to boot..

Italian tries to dodge Covid jab using fake arm - BBC News

The man is so keen to get a vaccine pass he turns up with a plastic arm, but doctors aren't fooled.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[SaintsSeptember]

THe vitamin D was pointing out that it is possible to have toxicity. Yes one needs to consume a really stupidly high level of supplement, but it was a response to soemone else positing the claim that there is NO (ie an absolute) issue with excessive vitamin D

Some people may read that, believe it and the do something dumb.

Vitamin D toxicity: What if you get too much? - Mayo Clinic

And Schirmacher has not published in peer reviewed journals as yet, so I am not going give that view any oxygen. It seems only available on websites which I would call freedumb echochambers.

also I find it odd that his CV seems to be publicly available to locate (although perhaps out of date as no publications since 2007)

Neoptolemos JP, Dunn JA, Stocken DD, Almond J, Link K, Beger H, Bassi C, (uni-heidelberg.de) (no I don't know why it looks like a set of author citations, the link is afile ending in.pdf).

I also claim there is no issue with excessive water.
Key word being "issue"

 

[Crankyhawk]

I also claim there is no issue with excessive water.
Key word being "issue"

Any thoughts about this schirmer stuff (claims found metal in autopsy of dead people post covid vaccination)

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The Age is calling on Daniel Andrews to scrap the mandate as soon as possible.

Yep they should scrap it because anti -vaxxers are upset.
And they should scrap underage drinking laws, because underage drinkers are upset.
and they should scrap public indecency laws because perverts are upset.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Any thoughts about this schirmer stuff (claims found metal in autopsy of dead people post covid vaccination)

Don't know the topic at all to be honest.

 

[Crankyhawk]

The Age is calling on Daniel Andrews to scrap the mandate as soon as possible.

just another clickbait organisation.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

As we scrap, Germany introduces…UK thinking about compulsory vax.

 

[Marcel Proust]

As a doctor friend of mine once said: "A doctor is just another bozo with a university degree."

Your local GP is not a virologist.

Blood doctor fwiw

 

[CM86]

History does not look kindly on following Germany into authoritarian regimens.

Don't be ridiculous!!!

I bet you can't give me just one single example where that's true!!!!



I don't know if I can trust you. You like Oldham and West Ham. That's just too much ham.

 

[owen87]

History does not look kindly on following Germany into authoritarian regimens.

bruh.

 

[CM86]

I'll take post 969 for misleading information please, Trebek.