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- #126
You're probably right. I'm too far gone.You too …. it might be a bit of a reach though.
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You're probably right. I'm too far gone.You too …. it might be a bit of a reach though.
Exactly. What I have been saying for 18months.If anyones job is under scrutiny its Judd. He's the director of footy, and thats the one area we currently suck in.
Say what you want about the rest of the directors, but off field (members, sponsorships, corporate engagement, money) we're actually doing well.
That said, I dont think Judds the problem. He's a good operator despite the ongoing issues with the Footy department. I think the problem is our list is at present way to young, and blame for that ultimately has to fall on SOS. I know we've tried to get in mature players in recent years (Rocky, Shiel) but we really needed to be more aggressive with doing so, without sacrificing our draft hand during the rebuild (get in some Free Agents, including some Hodge types at the end of their careers).
Say what you want, but we have been fielding some insanely young sides this year. At around the same age as GWS/ GCS teams in year 1 of their existence (and have been getting similar results).
We really need to be agressive this year with picking up some established senior players. They dont have to be absolute A graders either. Just solid best 22 types to enable us to leave some kids in the 2's to develop and to have hard bodies in the side.
We went full Melbourne. You never go full Melbourne.
As someone with a back bone willing to say the hard things and ask tough questions. I've never been hiding mate.
Polec, pittard, miles, lloyd, Rohan, tyson, preuss, hallYou mean like Lang, Kennedy, Garlett, Newman, McGovern, Fas, Shiel?
What B grade seniors are you thinking of mal that we could’ve chased.
Wingardium Leviosa. You asked for a spell right?“backbone willing to say the saying the hard things” - give me a spell.
Reactionary garbage.
I'd say there is more to that Trigg departure.Caro is leading the charge.
I’d love to know the truth re her relationship with Trigg.
Since Trigg was moved on she has viciously attached Carlton/MLJ, SOS, Bolton, Judd any chance she has.
Very, very bitter.
There is much more to this than we currently know.
Exactly. What I have been saying for 18months.
The disappointing thing is we didn't learn the lessons of Melbourne.
Would you take a Nathan Jones type as an example if he is retired off? Or Isaac Smith?
If say Jarred Roughead is perfect for us but unfortunately there's not a spot for him
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I know for a fact Saad came down to $$, SOS wouldn't budge. * Didn't offer much more, SOS said take it or leave it.Polec, pittard, miles, lloyd, Rohan, tyson, preuss, hall
Did we try talking to dalhaus types
We spoke to Goddard in January as part of the rookie replacement, should have been September as a playing coach like Hodge for example
Did we offer up enough cash or terms for Saad, Smith, stringer, rockliff by reports we missed due to contract length
Should we gave kept known knowns? - wright (who left because we couldn't guarantee a spot, surely better than fasolo) lamb, kerridge
Don't have to be world beaters but they were senior bodies who could transmit the gameplan to the kids, protect the kids and contribute
Point is SOS focus on A grade or ex GWS bargain buy ex high picks is what should be reviewed.
Roos when and got guys like Cross and Vince to help stabilise the list for example.
Plenty of options if the list management was in the headspace for it, would have rather seen the Lobbe money spent overpaying rockliff or chasing Saad than on a washed up VFL player
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Thats a valid point: but think its something that could be overcome by having clear distinction and delineation of responsibilities.Understand the sentiment, but not sure any new coach would want the old coach hanging around the sidelines. You’d also think the assistant coaches would need to be looked at.
Polec, pittard, miles, lloyd, Rohan, tyson, preuss, hall
Did we try talking to dalhaus types
We spoke to Goddard in January as part of the rookie replacement, should have been September as a playing coach like Hodge for example
Did we offer up enough cash or terms for Saad, Smith, stringer, rockliff by reports we missed due to contract length
Should we gave kept known knowns? - wright (who left because we couldn't guarantee a spot, surely better than fasolo) lamb, kerridge
Don't have to be world beaters but they were senior bodies who could transmit the gameplan to the kids, protect the kids and contribute
Point is SOS focus on A grade or ex GWS bargain buy ex high picks is what should be reviewed.
Roos when and got guys like Cross and Vince to help stabilise the list for example.
Plenty of options if the list management was in the headspace for it, would have rather seen the Lobbe money spent overpaying rockliff or chasing Saad than on a washed up VFL player
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If anyones job is under scrutiny its Judd. He's the director of footy, and thats the one area we currently suck in.
Say what you want about the rest of the directors, but off field (members, sponsorships, corporate engagement, money) we're actually doing well.
That said, I dont think Judds the problem. He's a good operator despite the ongoing issues with the Footy department. I think the problem is our list is at present way to young, and blame for that ultimately has to fall on SOS. I know we've tried to get in mature players in recent years (Rocky, Shiel) but we really needed to be more aggressive with doing so, without sacrificing our draft hand during the rebuild (get in some Free Agents, including some Hodge types at the end of their careers).
Say what you want, but we have been fielding some insanely young sides this year. At around the same age as GWS/ GCS teams in year 1 of their existence (and have been getting similar results).
We really need to be agressive this year with picking up some established senior players. They dont have to be absolute A graders either. Just solid best 22 types to enable us to leave some kids in the 2's to develop and to have hard bodies in the side.
We went full Melbourne. You never go full Melbourne.
Then why say Judd is the problem, like its a Bug company to fix?
I'm not saying Judd is the problem. I think he's a good operator.
I'm saying that our off field (corporate, members, sponsorship etc) is all in order. We've been doing well in those areas for the past few years.
The only area we suck in is the footy department (which is under Judds purview, as the Director of Football operations). The Coach (partly appointed by Judd, and on his recommendation) has just been sacked, we're a shambles on the field, and there are some issues around recruiting and list management (all of which come under his discretion). Coaching, list management, and gameday performances have all been questioned.
Judd is aware of this; he said as much on FC a few weeks ago. Its going to raise questions about his performance. The areas we are weakest in at the moment, are his areas of responsibility (list management, football, and coaching). The question needs to be asked about his performance in his role, and he would be more than aware of this himself.
Here is the responsibilities of each director:
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/club/board
Scully, hannebury would have cost nothing but cash which we have in spades, once you find out these types can be moved on they should be out bidding the opposition.
Even Rohan, Ellis would have been handy enough additions, they don't need to be superstars just solid contributors that will allow the kids to play more fringe roles until they force these types out of the side.
To me it seems like we put all our cash on Shiel and had no back up plan, we could have used that cash to get 2/3 of those types and we would be better off.
Scully did not want to come to us ... you cant FORCE them.
agreed. always knew Robert Walls was no good.Should of spent money on quality senior help and looked after Bolts.
Carlton board amd the powerbrokers in the background is the last part of our club that hasn't modernized.Malthouse has come out potting the rear vision mirror thinking and powerbrokers around the club having too big a say.
Problem is he hasn't been there for 4 years and a lot has changed. Also, he only got the gig because of those powerbrokers.
Roughy is cooked. Plus we dont need another tall. Jones was a gun player, but there are signs he's about to drop off sooner rather than later also, he's having a pretty down year by his standards, and it looks like age might be catching up with him.
A few (gettable) Free agents i'd look at:
All of those blokes we could get for free (other than Cap space).
- Ellis-Yeoman from the Crows is a RFA this year. No star, but worth it. 26 years old and averaging 24 disposals a game with a few 30+ games.
- Jamie Elliot (also a RFA) from the Pies is in the same boat. Definite upgrade on Gibbons, Polson and Fasolo as a small forward (if his hammies hold up).
- Bachar Houli might be another we could squeeze out from the Tigers. He's a F/A and a very underrated player (basically the Tiges version of Kade Simpson). The Salary cap is tight at Richmond, and he's got a premiership medal already. He might be persuaded to come to us on a 2 year swansong to feather his nest before his impending retirement.
- Harry Cunningham from the Swans. Recent adductor injury, but he's quick and gets enough of it.
- Liberatore from the Dogs. Great clearance game; and hard body. Bit of a tool by all reports (like his old man) but he also tackles like his old man, and wins the footy like him too.
We also need to throw down this years 1st (Adelaides) and next years 1st in a trade. As for next years 1st, there night be some value in Sydney; they're looking like they really need some young talent coming in the door over the next few years. I'd throw next years 1st rounder on the table, and see what they offer in return. They have senior bodies up there.
Jack Martin from the Suns is another I'd be looking at, using Adelaides 1st rounder this year as a starting point.
We're getting into list management here, so I'll copy/ paste the above into the List management thread, and we can continue the chat there.
I know for a fact Saad came down to $$, SOS wouldn't budge. * Didn't offer much more, SOS said take it or leave it.
You do understand that players actually have a say in where they go?
And not many want to play for a young team on the bottom of the ladder.
There are so many holes in your assumptions.
Scully, hannebury would have cost nothing but cash which we have in spades, once you find out these types can be moved on they should be out bidding the opposition.
Even Rohan, Ellis would have been handy enough additions, they don't need to be superstars just solid contributors that will allow the kids to play more fringe roles until they force these types out of the side.
To me it seems like we put all our cash on Shiel and had no back up plan, we could have used that cash to get 2/3 of those types and we would be better off.
Scully did not want to come to us ... you cant FORCE them.
Exactly. Players weren’t willing and we won’t get many guns this year either. Unfortunately, you need to do better then 2 wins a year. Hopefully we can show something in the second half of the year.
The Godfather and his Capos
https://m.carltonfc.com.au/club/about-us/board
I implore one of our many powerbrokers to clean the rot that has festered in our boardroom for far too long and force a board spill.
Members such as Fat Tony himself, Luke Sayers, Jeannie Pratt (her money will be missed), Craig Mathieson and co have presided over what can only be described as poor decisions one after another.
The sacking of Ratten.
The hiring of Malthouse.
The appointment of Bolton (without the nesescary support, where was Neal Craig's replacement?).
If Mike Fitzpatrick is reading this, I beg you to act. The general positive member sentiment towards the current board is at an all time low and the chances of someone being able to dislodge the current heirachy would be high.
Apologies for possibly causing more negative discourse but it has to be said. After today's performance from Mark, it should be the last nail in his boards coffin.
Also just let the record show. I agree with today's decision. It had to be done.
My biggest gripe with the current board is that we are letting the AFL control us.
I’d like to see us stand for what is best for our club and things such as home ground and away jumper aren’t being addressed. For instance our supporters, members and even players despise Marvel.