Matthew Guy. Can a mediocre leader with a 3rd rate team win government?

Remove this Banner Ad

Not Important

never test the depth of water with both feet.
Oct 4, 2016
4,132
5,759
AFL Club
Richmond
Yeah but I'm not wrong you're just unwilling to look at the distillery of what happened critically

now grales! u were the 1 who claimed labor was anti union.

who was it that ensured the ambos got their pay rise? which state is near top of the pops 4 teacher pay? which gov’t as 1 of the 1st acts defunded that union bashing outfit led by that union basher mcburney?

labor is for unionised labor, neoliberals are not.

labor is opposed to power and wealth being concentrated within transnational corporations and elite groups and is doing something about it, neoliberals are not.

labor does not believe in unfettered individual entrepreneurial freedom and an unfettered free market, neoliberals do.

labor does not believe in the role of the state being eliminated, neoliberals do.

labor does not believe in there being no necessity for intervention in markets. for neoliberals, intervention is a word not in their lexicon.

labor does not believe in laissez-faire economics, and the ultimate abolishment of all government, neoliberals do.

labor does not believe in trickle-down economics or radical deregulation, privatisation, and radical tax cuts, neoliberals do.

labor does not believe in a form of economic natural selection whereby the strong survive and the others can please themselves, neoliberals do.


i do get u r a 'green' and only 2 ready 2 swallow the brandt hardline shoutyness designed 2 get column inches. and i say that as someone who supports much of what they r about just not holus-bolus.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
now grales! u were the 1 who claimed labor was anti union.
i said they broke union power, which they did, with the help of the people running the unions
i also said they were anti worker, which they are
union membership has never recovered from what Hawke and Keating did
The union power within the ALP are unions like the Shoppies who most certainly aren't there for the benefit of their members

who was it that ensured the ambos got their pay rise? which state is near top of the pops 4 teacher pay? which gov’t as 1 of the 1st acts defunded that union bashing outfit led by that union basher mcburney?
you get that all ALP branches are part of the system yeah? They're all capitalists and we're in late stage capitalism where neoliberalism is the name of the game

our health systems are seriously underfunded including pay for staff, same with our education sector, in Vic Labor has been in power for 19 out of the past 23 years

labor is for unionised labor, neoliberals are not.
haha no
haven't seen any Labor solidarity with striking workers this year, have you?

no?

In fact Albo said they shouldn't be striking in NSW

Just because the ALP get funding from Unions doesn't mean they aren't neoliberals, you think most of the Unions in Australia haven't been compromised?

labor is opposed to power and wealth being concentrated within transnational corporations and elite groups and is doing something about it, neoliberals are not.
the main difference between the ALP and the Coalition is who gets to accumulate the wealth, there is a lot of overlap but some differences, but that doesn't mean Labor aren't neoliberals, again a nothing argument

labor does not believe in unfettered individual entrepreneurial freedom and an unfettered free market, neoliberals do.
funny how they consistently vote with the coalition on these sorts of things then isn't it

labor does not believe in the role of the state being eliminated, neoliberals do.
no neoliberals believe the state is a great tool for furthering their agenda which is why so many of them end up in government or donate to all major parties

labor does not believe in there being no necessity for intervention in markets. for neoliberals, intervention is a word not in their lexicon.
again, neoliberals intervene all the time, they lobby government to intervene all the time, what we have seen over the last few decades is how well they lobby governments

labor does not believe in laissez-faire economics, and the ultimate abolishment of all government, neoliberals do.
haha again no

labor does not believe in trickle-down economics or radical deregulation, privatisation, and radical tax cuts, neoliberals do.
really, because Keating started privatization nationally, Andrews loves it in Vic, ALP voted for and are continuing with the stage 3 tax cuts

labor does not believe in a form of economic natural selection whereby the strong survive and the others can please themselves, neoliberals do.
again no they don't neoliberals say let the market regulate, let the market decide, but only after they've fixed the game, and if the game turns they get Governments to change the rules

i do get u r a 'green' and only 2 ready 2 swallow the brandt hardline shoutyness designed 2 get column inches. and i say that as someone who supports much of what they r about just not holus-bolus.
Brandt can get *ed, he's a capitalist sell out as well, he's just more interested in rolling back to a more sustainable version of capitalism than what we have now, he doesn't want to break the cycle
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
I'd rather live off what my super will provide than the aged pension.
yes its a fairly easy sell to most people, but all the increases in compulsory contributions since super came in have also helped slow wage growth, and what the super cost will is calculated with wages, so really its a % of income you could be accessing now that is kept from you.

plus they can change when you can access it and how anytime they want, and others profit of that forced separation of wages, for profit super is *ed
 

Evolved1

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 14, 2013
12,443
14,934
The lockdown state
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Phil Ivey
compulsory super is *ed and impacts actual wages, the whole purpose of it was to force wages to be kept from people to fund their retirement so the Government didn't have to

Super sucks and is neoliberal policy

NDIS I will give you, Gillard did that before Rudd got back in, just a shame we then had 9 years of the Libs to gut it.

Not confident Labor will fix those issues given they'd rather have Hollie Hughes as Deputy chair of the committee rather than Jordan Steele-John
Would you rather people be financially self-sufficient or dependent on the government in retirement? Many people are financially illiterate and poor with their own money so forced saving/investment is good policy.

Either way the public pays, yet you act like the government operates independent of public money.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
Would you rather people be financially self-sufficient or dependent on the government in retirement? Many people are financially illiterate and poor with their own money so forced saving/investment is good policy.

Either way the public pays, yet you act like the government operates independent of public money.
they take a % of your income and other people profit off it for years and you get taxed on what is left at the end

it impacts wages, it impacts what you can afford now

its s**t neoliberal policy that helps siphon millions every year into the pockets of companies and people that leech from that system

it impacts our housing affordability and so many other things

the whole well if people were allowed to control their own money they'd just spend it argument ignores the fact that its their right to spend their own money
 

Evolved1

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 14, 2013
12,443
14,934
The lockdown state
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Phil Ivey
they take a % of your income and other people profit off it for years and you get taxed on what is left at the end

it impacts wages, it impacts what you can afford now

its s**t neoliberal policy that helps siphon millions every year into the pockets of companies and people that leech from that system

it impacts our housing affordability and so many other things

the whole well if people were allowed to control their own money they'd just spend it argument ignores the fact that its their right to spend their own money
The alternative is they have nothing at retirement age and leech off others, which takes away funds that could be put to better use in education, healthcare, and building the nation.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Crankyhawk

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 21, 2007
23,794
18,952
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
compulsory super is *ed and impacts actual wages, the whole purpose of it was to force wages to be kept from people to fund their retirement so the Government didn't have to

Super sucks and is neoliberal policy

NDIS I will give you, Gillard did that before Rudd got back in, just a shame we then had 9 years of the Libs to gut it.

Not confident Labor will fix those issues given they'd rather have Hollie Hughes as Deputy chair of the committee rather than Jordan Steele-John
Super does not suck the idea us to reduce the pension expense due to increasing numbers of boomers living longer with a smaller tax base.
Reducing total pension expenses is a good thing.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
The alternative is they have nothing at retirement age and leech off others, which takes away funds that could be put to better use in education, healthcare, and building the nation.
Ah yes pensioner are leeches.
Also lol at nation building or actually properly funding healthcare and education

Super does not suck the idea us to reduce the pension expense due to increasing numbers of boomers living longer with a smaller tax base.
Reducing total pension expenses is a good thing.
It's forced quarantine of your wages that the government decides when you have access to it, and their mates like the banks and retail superfunds are getting fat off having that money
 

winty

Moderator
Jun 8, 2006
42,921
69,368
Geelong
AFL Club
Geelong
Just gave Matthew Guy a smackdown on FB over his BS about Labor cutting $2 billion from the health budget, when Labor's own budget papers show all the cuts to funding are from Covid-related expenditure, and that Labor are actually increasing funding for everything else in the 2022/23 Financial year....

1660207187931.png
 

Dave

Premium Platinum
Feb 8, 2000
20,229
15,870
Windy Hill
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Essendon
yes its a fairly easy sell to most people, but all the increases in compulsory contributions since super came in have also helped slow wage growth, and what the super cost will is calculated with wages, so really its a % of income you could be accessing now that is kept from you.

plus they can change when you can access it and how anytime they want, and others profit of that forced separation of wages, for profit super is *ed

Yeah, I'm not blind to the issues with it. I didn't agree with the increase, especially as for me it comes out of my wage as a contractor. The bastards have already changed when I can access it once, I was planning to retire at 55. I'm also not relying solely on super to fund me once I stop working, but then I'm lucky enough to be able to do that. I'd wager most cannot.

I also think they should all be not for profit, but where's the fun in that for an industry drooling to get it's hands on trillions.

All that said, it still beats having to rely on a aged pension that governments have shown they wont increase (barely) much beyond the poverty line, especially if you don't, as will become more and more the case, own your own home.
 

Dave

Premium Platinum
Feb 8, 2000
20,229
15,870
Windy Hill
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Essendon
Won't someone think of all the landlords in the city who are going to lose out on rent as businesses move to the suburbs?

Pretty much this. We don't exist to serve as revenue for CBD landlords.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
Yeah, I'm not blind to the issues with it. I didn't agree with the increase, especially as for me it comes out of my wage as a contractor. The bastards have already changed when I can access it once, I was planning to retire at 55. I'm also not relying solely on super to fund me once I stop working, but then I'm lucky enough to be able to do that. I'd wager most cannot.

I also think they should all be not for profit, but where's the fun in that for an industry drooling to get it's hands on trillions.

All that said, it still beats having to rely on a aged pension that governments have shown they wont increase (barely) much beyond the poverty line, especially if you don't, as will become more and more the case, own your own home.
Super and people's attitudes towards those who don't have it give them the excuse
 

Dave

Premium Platinum
Feb 8, 2000
20,229
15,870
Windy Hill
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Essendon
Super and people's attitudes towards those who don't have it give them the excuse

As in people who have it don't care about those who don't? I've long been an advocate for an increase in both "jobseeker" or whatever the most recent iteration of it's called, as well as the aged pension. As one who will benefit from the stage 3 tax cuts I'd be more than happy for them to be scrapped in order to fund this.
 

Dave

Premium Platinum
Feb 8, 2000
20,229
15,870
Windy Hill
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Essendon
You mean those super funds which look after the part of our wages we can't be trusted with?

Touche. I hope they've invested in more than CDB property. Mind you that's why I've tried to put measures in place so I don't have to solely rely on it. As I said, I've been lucky.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
51,604
73,385
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
As in people who have it don't care about those who don't? I've long been an advocate for an increase in both "jobseeker" or whatever the most recent iteration of it's called, as well as the aged pension. As one who will benefit from the stage 3 tax cuts I'd be more than happy for them to be scrapped in order to fund this.
I'm saying super makes people less worried about what is happening to
Pensioners, because they either think it won't happen to them or that people on a pension deserve it like people on the dole.

Lot of demonizing of welfare for the past 40 years
 

Remove this Banner Ad