Opinion Matthew Nicks: Adelaide's Coach

[Mr_Moogle]

Wow a lot of hot takes on this thread, and from our 'astute' moderators, no less!

Moderator does not mean club arse licker.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

If you pick the wrong players you just endlessly rebuild

Eg games spent on Frampton instead of Worrell means that Worrell isn't as far down the path as he should be

If after this season we finally decide Murphy doesn't cut it as an AFL small forward? Start over in that position with a newbie

"Look how inexperienced we are. What do you expect?"

You can only start building when you have the right pieces to build something. We're still in the wait and see how they develop stage. I'm not sure we're clear on who to go forward with.

Gollant was preferred ahead of Fogarty for part of this season for instance, as was Himmelberg.

Plan? We don't need one.

Who played well last week? Who trained well this week? Select accordingly. That's the plan

TBF ...as part of any rebuild, you are trying players in different roles .....some may flop, some flourish

This year was still an assessment year .....Nicks has said that ....he has also said there was experimentation going on, and giving players time to show something .....that'll continue next year, but I'd suggest, not to the same degree

Nicks experimented with Frampton as a DEF ....what's wrong with that ?

Worrell himself said he wasn't ready in 2021 .....so yes, the timing of selection does vary from supporters to that of selectors .......it's not as simplistic as "when picked, he played well" .....which by suggestion implies the selectors didn't see the players potential

I've just watched the first 3-4 games again of the year .....Gollant absolutely warranted selection .....you can't, but you will, compare back end season form of Fogarty, and say he should have been played over Gollant

 

[Thetrader15]

Unfortunately I think that's very much the case.

Last year I can remember Nicks being on 5AA and Bickley asked him about constantly chopping and changing the team and wanted to know going forward who Nicks sees as being in the best 22. Nicks said something along the lines that he didn't know and they're still trying to work that out which suggests that there's no long term plan at all and all their selections are just week to week decisions based on who's training well etc

This concept of a best 22, and only playing them...what about rewarding players going well, those that aren't.

We play Gollant for 5 weeks because we think he's part of our best 22 moving forward. He doesn't get a kick for 4 weeks, do we just keep playing him because he's in our best 22, or do we reward McAdam who's been kicking goals each week in the SANFL?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Rowe getting 36 games over two years and then being delisted isn't a "take." It's what occurred. So we start over. Until we find enough keepers we'll spin our wheels. We've got some but enough?

It's how rebuilds occur .....you spin some wheels as draftees don't develop .....others, like Fogarty & Worrell, start very slow

Was there that much outrage at Rowe getting games this year ......not really

 

[relapse]

Wow a lot of hot takes on this thread, and from our 'astute' moderators, no less!

Bigfooty is an independent platform that's not affiliated with the AFL nor any of the clubs.

We're all free to express our opinions on here.

 

[George Kramer]

TBF ...as part of any rebuild, you are trying players in different roles .....some may flop, some flourish

This year was still an assessment year .....Nicks has said that ....he has also said there was experimentation going on, and giving players time to show something .....that'll continue next year, but I'd suggest, not to the same degree

Nicks experimented with Frampton as a DEF ....what's wrong with that ?

Worrell himself said he wasn't ready in 2021 .....so yes, the timing of selection does vary from supporters to that of selectors .......it's not as simplistic as "when picked, he played well" .....which by suggestion implies the selectors didn't see the players potential

I've just watched the first 3-4 games again of the year .....Gollant absolutely warranted selection .....you can't, but you will, compare back end season form of Fogarty, and say he should have been played over Gollant

Worrell may not have been ready in 2021 but he was ready in 2022 a lot earlier than when we played him. Instead we chose to play an injured Doedee and the clubs opinion was they both couldn’t play in the same team, except they did in the end

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

It's how rebuilds occur .....you spin some wheels as draftees don't develop .....others, like Fogarty & Worrell, start very slow

Was there that much outrage at Rowe getting games this year ......not really

In the early stages of a rebuild yes you're trying things out, seeing who's worth investing in. Some success, some failure, moving forward.

However in Year 3 to be operating in the Year 1 way?

This is what a perpetual Carlton/Melbourne rebuild looks like. Building on sand

 

[WeedsMullet84]

Rowe getting 36 games over two years and then being delisted isn't a "take." It's what occurred. So we start over. Until we find enough keepers we'll spin our wheels. We've got some but enough?

Frampton has been traded in by Collingwood who saw enough of him earlier on during the season to want to select him. You could argue that by having not put a few games into him we may have gotten nothing for him at the end of the year. There is also a theory, and this may come as a dramatic shock to you, that our coaches saw something in Frampton that Collingwood did, you know the team that were within a whisker of a GF??

Gollant 100% deserved games over Fogarty earlier in the year. Basically anyone worth their salt in the game could see he wasn't putting the effort in. Fogarty said so much himself.

We ARE in a phase where there is major competition for spots, and we're building a culture that indicates games aren't going to be gifted to you because you're a fan favourite and remind supporters of a FF from the 70's. You have to earn it.

The majority of Crows fans are fickle in their support of the club, lacking the patience required for something like a rebuild, and that frustration is mirrored heavily on these threads.

I just wish we had a few more moderators (that have a bit more of a footy brain/are analytically minded) that would bring a better balance to these boards, which is HEAVILY geared towards glass-half-empty and the 'end is nigh' desperate types (aside from WaynesWorld19 )

I think we have a fair few moderators that like to frequently project an emotional frustration with not winning and pass it off as 'opinion'

Just my opinion.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Nicks experimented with Frampton as a DEF ....what's wrong with that ?

Moving Billy to defense was okay. Nicks tried something out of left field to salvage a player and it failed. He didn't persist with it that long though. Where he face-planted was in the media. All that back patting about his work ethic and turn around in form, then he drops him a few weeks later and never picks him again. You'd think a coach would want to know it's more than just a purple patch before they write their redemption arc.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

In the early stages of a rebuild yes you're trying things out, seeing who's worth investing in. Some success, some failure, moving forward.

However in Year 3 to be operating in the Year 1 way?

This is what a perpetual Carlton/Melbourne rebuild looks like. Building on sand

Looks to me, like the spine is pretty set .....understand what you're saying about year 3, but we've never done a FULL rebuild B4

I'd be asking questions though if what we did in year 3, we were doing next year ......it's time to settle the side down, certainly in the 2nd half of 2023

BIG difference to MELB / CARL ......who always took the quick fix, had a lousy Club Culture .....and poor player development .....they had so many good draftee's that simply got burn't

I'd throw RICH in that group as well .....they were terrible with recruits pre-Hardwick

 

[Thetrader15]

In the early stages of a rebuild yes you're trying things out, seeing who's worth investing in. Some success, some failure, moving forward.

However in Year 3 to be operating in the Year 1 way?

This is what a perpetual Carlton/Melbourne rebuild looks like. Building on sand

We've learnt a lot from year 1, where we just played all kids and they got smashed, so we have evolved. That's why we play a balance between kids and experience, to let them actually get the ball rather than just chasing jumpers all day and losing by 100 points. That was the Melbourne model until they brough more experience in with Cross, Vince etc.

So we aren't operating the way we were in year 1, quite the opposite, we've learnt and evolved, trying to get a balance of playing for the future, and also being competitive.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Moving Billy to defense was okay. Nicks tried something out of left field to salvage a player and it failed. He didn't persist with it that long though. Where he face-planted was in the media. All that back patting about his work ethic and turn around in form, then he drops him a few weeks later and never picks him again. You'd think a coach would want to know it's more than just a purple patch before they write their redemption arc.

Billy lacked the competitive spirit to play in Finals ! .....as part of re-watching those early games, not once did he use his body to hit players ....a 200cm + body playing mostly outside ......and I did see him pull out of a few contests

Lets not confuse SANFL form .....with developing players, not for minor round games, but are Finals type players

IMO we're doing a good job of that

 

[MRB37]

In different ways I think it's a bit simple to look at it as total failure or success, especially in terms of W/L.

Like look at what Paul Roos did at Melbourne after taking over an absolute rabble of a club. 4 wins, 7 wins, 10 wins, almost on par with what Nicks has managed to achieve in his 3 years. I don't think Nicks will be the guy who takes us deep into finals or be a Premiership winning coach, but that doesn't mean what he's doing now is a total failure because the raw W column hasn't filled up. He's taking a young group and drilling into them the fundamentals of football, about contested work, about competing and playing as a team. He may not be here to see the end result of what we become, but those fundamentals will be massive for whoever may takeover next, much the same way what Roos did helped Goodwin, who jumped into that 10 win team and went to 12 and then 16 wins the next two years.

Nicks is far from perfect, the middle portion of the year was gross for me and we swung the pendulum far too hard towards being a contest only side, and we put in some putrid performances because of it, but I can't see him as a total failure either.

 

[George Kramer]

Frampton has been traded in by Collingwood who saw enough of him earlier on during the season to want to select him. You could argue that by having not put a few games into him we may have gotten nothing for him at the end of the year. There is also a theory, and this may come as a dramatic shock to you, that our coaches saw something in Frampton that Collingwood did, you know the team that were within a whisker of a GF??

Gollant 100% deserved games over Fogarty earlier in the year. Basically anyone worth their salt in the game could see he wasn't putting the effort in. Fogarty said so much himself.

We ARE in a phase where there is major competition for spots, and we're building a culture that indicates games aren't going to be gifted to you because you're a fan favourite and remind supporters of a FF from the 70's. You have to earn it.

The majority of Crows fans are fickle in their support of the club, lacking the patience required for something like a rebuild, and that frustration is mirrored heavily on these threads.

I just wish we had a few more moderators (that have a bit more of a footy brain/are analytically minded) that would bring a better balance to these boards, which is HEAVILY geared towards glass-half-empty and the 'end is nigh' desperate types (aside from WaynesWorld19 )

I think we have a fair few moderators that like to frequently project an emotional frustration with not winning and pass it off as 'opinion'

Just my opinion.

You know moderators are just posters that just make sure we abide by board rules?

Do you want mods to censor the boards to suit your opinions?

Another weird mullet take.

 

[George Kramer]

In different ways I think it's a bit simple to look at it as total failure or success, especially in terms of W/L.

Like look at what Paul Roos did at Melbourne after taking over an absolute rabble of a club. 4 wins, 7 wins, 10 wins, almost on par with what Nicks has managed to achieve in his 3 years. I don't think Nicks will be the guy who takes us deep into finals or be a Premiership winning coach, but that doesn't mean what he's doing now is a total failure because the raw W column hasn't filled up. He's taking a young group and drilling into them the fundamentals of football, about contested work, about competing and playing as a team. He may not be here to see the end result of what we become, but those fundamentals will be massive for whoever may takeover next, much the same way what Roos did helped Goodwin, who jumped into that 10 win team and went to 12 and then 16 wins the next two years.

Nicks is far from perfect, the middle portion of the year was gross for me and we swung the pendulum far too hard towards being a contest only side, and we put in some putrid performances because of it, but I can't see him as a total failure either.

Is anyone labelling him a total failure though because of our win loss record?

Actually is anyone labelling him a total failure at all?

 

[MRB37]

Is anyone labelling him a total failure though because of our win loss record?

Actually is anyone labelling him a total failure at all?

You're questioning if he can even coach. Would that not make him a total failure if he can't do the thing he's employed to do?

 

[skam85]

I think we have a fair few moderators that like to frequently project an emotional frustration with not winning and pass it off as 'opinion'

Here's a hot "take" that I'll break down nice and simple for you

Mods are just fans of the football club that also happen to have to read and moderate internet drivel

 

[George Kramer]

You're questioning if he can even coach. Would that not make him a total failure if he can't do the thing he's employed to do?

Seriously? Yes I’ve been critical of some of his coaching and yes I am questioning his coaching ability, but that’s not the same as calling him a total failure. That’s ridiculous.

Oh and notice one of my criticisms wasn’t win loss record?

 

[MRB37]

Seriously? Yes I’ve been critical of some of his coaching and yes I am questioning his coaching ability, but that’s not the same as calling him a total failure. That’s ridiculous.

Oh and notice one of my criticisms wasn’t win loss record?

What makes you think my entire initial post was directed at you specifically?

 

[George Kramer]

What makes you think my entire initial post was directed at you specifically?

I didn’t at all. I asked you is anyone calling him a total failure for his win loss record or calling him a total failure at all.

Your response was to suggest I did, hence why I explained my previous comments.

But my original question still remains, has anyone? Wayne implied the same thing, Nicks is being criticised because of our win loss record.

 

[Jetafl]

My view on Nicks and I don't think he is hopeless or anything. However, if I'm being totally honest, he hasn't won me over as, yet I'm happy to give him next season to show he really is an A grade AFL coach. At this moment of time, I see him as quality Senior Assistant. He needs to step it up a level for me.

 

[MRB37]

I didn’t at all. I asked you is anyone calling him a total failure for his win loss record or calling him a total failure at all.

Your response was to suggest I did, hence why I explained my previous comments.

But my original question still remains, has anyone? Wayne implied the same thing, Nicks is being criticised because of our win loss record.

You said or suggested he can't coach. That to me says you're calling him a failure.

 

[George Kramer]

You said or suggested he can't coach. That to me says you're calling him a failure.

And around we go. I’ve criticised some elements of his coaching and questioned him. If you take that as calling him a failure that’s on you.

Curious, have you been critical of elements of his coaching?

 

[Thetrader15]

Is anyone labelling him a total failure though because of our win loss record?

Actually is anyone labelling him a total failure at all?

I assume those who are wanting him to be sacked are!

 

[MRB37]

And around we go. I’ve criticised some elements of his coaching and questioned him. If you take that as calling him a failure that’s on you.

Curious, have you been critical of elements of his coaching?

Yes I have, but I have not said he can't coach and is hiding behind a rebuild like you did.