Mitch Duncan on Aaron Hall

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Spearman

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Duncan has form. A late spoil on Hodge broke his arm a few years ago.

For that to not even be a downfield free is atrocious umpiring.
Poor example, MRP cleared him, and without replaying the thread on it, looked like late intercept try. Still, that's all you could find? That was 5 years ago. How many fines, suspensions, even citations has he racked up over 10 years?
 

Ricky Vaughn

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I want consistency.

Cunnington gets a week for a bump where he didn't leave the ground, there was no obvious hit to the head and the player got up almost immediately. We took it to the tribunal and got it reduced.

Duncan jumped, turned his back, struck the head of the player who will miss a week through concussion. From every angle it looks worse than the Cunnington bump, the effect on the victim is greater, so the MRO should at least be looking at it. If he is given one or two weeks, then it should be up to Geelong whether they except the verdict or go to the tribunal.
You're going to get consistency.

Cunnington bumped and got penalised.
Dangerfield bumped and got penalised.
Mitch Duncan didn't bump and won't get penalised.
 

UnitedWarrior93

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So what. He “accidentally” hit an opponent in the head who will now miss a game due to concussion. In this day and age there needs to be some kind of penalty, irrespective of intent.
So rubbing out players purely for ‘accidents’ now, geez. It’s a contact sport mate, unfortunately sometimes players will get hurt, I’d be changing my tune if Duncan ran straight for him like Danger did in round 1, that was accidental but the intent was there and they clashed heads.
 

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Sttew

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I want consistency.

Cunnington gets a week for a bump where he didn't leave the ground, there was no obvious hit to the head and the player got up almost immediately. We took it to the tribunal and got it reduced.

Duncan jumped, turned his back, struck the head of the player who will miss a week through concussion. From every angle it looks worse than the Cunnington bump, the effect on the victim is greater, so the MRO should at least be looking at it. If he is given one or two weeks, then it should be up to Geelong whether they except the verdict or go to the tribunal.
Duncan was trying to spoil. If we start rubbing players out for incidents like this we may as well ban any and all physical contact, so no marking or spoiling, no tackles, ban anything where incidental head contact could occur.
 

Obeanie1

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Hall knocked out after Duncan's smother attempt (afl.com.au)

Certainly late, certainly head high and certainly high impact.
When you simply go and tick or cross the boxes then it technically should cop weeks.

Then you look at the play and you think "Geez, that is just bad luck. He never intended to hurt anyone, he jumped to smother and landed on him awkwardly, that's all."

Was it foreseeable?

Did Duncan breech a duty of care?

He did not elect to bump so you can't use those rules to work it out.

The only similar incident I can recall was young Cloke missing the Collingwood grand final way back for a spoiling attempt. He jumped up and turned his back to the contest, extended his arm, reaching to punch the ball, was looking the opposite direction as his fist accidentally hit a player head high. He copped a week.

It is a different one this incident. Very different.
 

Obeanie1

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Duncan was trying to spoil. If we start rubbing players out for incidents like this we may as well ban any and all physical contact, so no marking or spoiling, no tackles, ban anything where incidental head contact could occur.
If you try and spoil and get someone head high you cop a week. That has been proven. Yeo copped a week a few years ago from a clumsy spoil to the head. These days it would be a fine with no previous history.

Not the same as this incident but the point is you elect to spoil and get someone head high you cop a sanction of some sort.
 

Duckimus Prime

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So the new "bump" will be jumping in the air, turning your back and colliding with flailing limbs.
Flailing arms seems to be a bit of a Geelong thing...

Looks about as accidental as most "clumsy" Shane Mumford hits, and the clumsy, accidental knocks that Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell were putting out as the Hawks got old.
 

HairyO

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Flailing arms seems to be a bit of a Geelong thing...

Looks about as accidental as most "clumsy" Shane Mumford hits, and the clumsy, accidental knocks that Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell were putting out as the Hawks got old.
Podsiadly would always lead with his knee. Heaps of players do it. Tex used his boot to shove a defender on the weekend and got pinged for it.
 

HairyO

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Poor example, MRP cleared him, and without replaying the thread on it, looked like late intercept try. Still, that's all you could find? That was 5 years ago. How many fines, suspensions, even citations has he racked up over 10 years?

MRO only gave Hartigan a fine for his late hit on Hawkins. I assume you accepted it because you accepted Duncan breaking Hodge's arm.
 

DEVO

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Duncan was trying to spoil. If we start rubbing players out for incidents like this we may as well ban any and all physical contact, so no marking or spoiling, no tackles, ban anything where incidental head contact could occur.
In the 45+ years I've been watching the footy, I've never seen anyone trying to spoil by turning their back. He may have originally thought to spoil, but by turning 180 degrees it looked more like a late bump in the end.
 

DEVO

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So rubbing out players purely for ‘accidents’ now, geez. It’s a contact sport mate, unfortunately sometimes players will get hurt, I’d be changing my tune if Duncan ran straight for him like Danger did in round 1, that was accidental but the intent was there and they clashed heads.
Isn't that what the MRO is for? To determine if accidental hits to an unsuspecting players head should be punished or not.
 

Shadow89

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Another week, another MRP thread about an accident.

Grow up people - it's a contact sport and accidents happen. Was a downfield free for sure, but it was an accident. Duncan launched himself and got it completely wrong, lol. No malice at all, and a fine at absolute worst for reckless conduct.
 

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tswizzle

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Surprised not to see any Dockers fans here comparing this to the free kick against Andrew Brayshaw that led to Jack Newnes goal after the siren win for Carlton last year. Only minor differences between that and this
 

Linda Lovelace

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I'm not sure who taught you blokes to play football, but I don't remember a coach ever teaching me to spoil with my back. I must have missed that training session.

It's pretty clear that Duncan caught himself in two minds, between spoiling and bumping, and then decided to protect himself, leaving Hall to suffer the consequences of his indecision.

It was quite literally a 'careless' action if nothing else. Nobody is saying Duncan should be hung, drawn and quartered. He should just be given a week to maintain a deterrent on bumping defenceless players and KOing them and maintain the principle that players have a duty of care not to hit each other in the head.

It's ok to accept that chaotic neutral contests will result in accidental head hits. It's not ok to accept that you can smash guys disposing of the ball who can't protect themselves in the head, even if you don't mean to.
 

Spearman

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MRO only gave Hartigan a fine for his late hit on Hawkins. I assume you accepted it because you accepted Duncan breaking Hodge's arm.
very different scenarios, you could see Duncan was first going for the intercept, pulled in when he felt Hodge there, clipped his elbow on Hodges hand. Hartigan hit Hawkins out of frustration when TH had already landed, and look how far away Hartigan's fist was from the ball. Compare that with Duncan's.
Besides that, Duncan's history shows he's a cleanskin.
 

SloppyJoe

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He jumps up to smother and turns his body to protect himself from copping the ball in the face/front of his body, and also to look at where the ball goes. Ends up colliding back first with Hall, who is also airborne.

He clearly wasn't trying to bump him, so just an accident for mine.
 

Handsome.B.Wonderful

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The only similar incident I can recall was young Cloke missing the Collingwood grand final way back for a spoiling attempt. He jumped up and turned his back to the contest, extended his arm, reaching to punch the ball, was looking the opposite direction as his fist accidentally hit a player head high. He copped a week.

It is a different one this incident. Very different.
It reminds me of Ziebell on Aaron Joseph in 2012, not really a bump but a player leaving the ground to make a play on the footy and collecting someone in the head causing a concussion.

Ziebell got 4 weeks.

 

Obeanie1

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It reminds me of Ziebell on Aaron Joseph in 2012, not really a bump but a player leaving the ground to make a play on the footy and collecting someone in the head causing a concussion.

Ziebell got 4 weeks.

Not really like for like though. Ziebell was looking where he was going and what was coming the other way. Jumped off the ground to punch the ball and knocked him out with a side on hip and shoulder with high contact.

Saying that Ziebell's action looked reckless where as Duncan's could only be classed as careless at a stretch.

Still could get weeks but not 4. 1 or 2 at the most.
 

Handsome.B.Wonderful

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Not really like for like though. Ziebell was looking where he was going and what was coming the other way. Jumped off the ground to punch the ball and knocked him out with a side on hip and shoulder with high contact.

Saying that Ziebell's action looked reckless where as Duncan's could only be classed as careless at a stretch.

Still could get weeks but not 4. 1 or 2 at the most.
Definitely not like for like but similar in terms of the act of leaping with no care for the player on the receiving end.

Ziebell has a play on the ball and I don’t believe he was trying to take Joseph out, as the umpire screams multiple times “He just went the footy, he just went the footy”.

This was under the old system which was ruthless on careless/reckless acts, probably gets 2-3 today.

I agree that Duncan is up for 1-2.
 

juss

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It's a clumsy bit of a careleas act that resulted in an injury, but no malice.

I'm on the fence here, I'm not sure we want to go down the path of suspending players for this, I'm not confident it doesn't keep progressing to any action that injures a player gets looked at. To me we are moving closer and closer to a less contact game.
 

BF Tiger

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It's a clumsy bit of a careleas act that resulted in an injury, but no malice.

I'm on the fence here, I'm not sure we want to go down the path of suspending players for this, I'm not confident it doesn't keep progressing to any action that injures a player gets looked at. To me we are moving closer and closer to a less contact game.
I understand your point but I think we need to change the way players think about their actions (tackles, bumps, smothers, etc) given the mounting evidence concerning head trauma. Duncan gets a week(s) and hopefully a player doesn’t leap at an unprotected opponent knocking him out next time.

Duncan wholly took the course that afforded him the most protection whilst placing his opponent in the most vulnerable position. That is not duty of care. DoC might have see Duncan not attempt to smother at all, diving forward rather than leaping or leaping and not turning his body so he could have lessened the blow.
 

Sttew

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It reminds me of Ziebell on Aaron Joseph in 2012, not really a bump but a player leaving the ground to make a play on the footy and collecting someone in the head causing a concussion.

Ziebell got 4 weeks.

Bloody hell, if that reminds you of what happened on Sunday you have a vivid imagination. The Ziebel one is more like Dangerfield. Looks like he lined the Carlton guy for a decent bump
 

Obeanie1

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I understand your point but I think we need to change the way players think about their actions (tackles, bumps, smothers, etc) given the mounting evidence concerning head trauma. Duncan gets a week(s) and hopefully a player doesn’t leap at an unprotected opponent knocking him out next time.

Duncan wholly took the course that afforded him the most protection whilst placing his opponent in the most vulnerable position. That is not duty of care. DoC might have see Duncan not attempt to smother at all, diving forward rather than leaping or leaping and not turning his body so he could have lessened the blow.
So how long before the knees up in a marking contest is stopped?

Been saying it for years that the AFL is playing lip service to head injuries and concussion while they still encourage players to run, jump and knee someone to the back of the head.and we all cheer.

This action occurs multiple times in every game. Jumping and using the knee in a marking contest.

So just how far is the AFL going to take this issue?
 

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