Injury Mitchell Injured

[happydude]

looking forward to eeing rowe give it a shot.

very disappointed about mitchell i liked what i saw

 

[chipzac]

looking forward to eeing rowe give it a shot.

very disappointed about mitchell i liked what i saw

Rowe's injured his shoulder, too!

 

[chipzac]

The good news is that Rowe should be back in about four weeks (and Duigan in six).

 

[Blues_FC]

**** **** **** **** ****!

Poor guy. Let's hope he has a miraculous recovery a la 1AW.

I was probably getting a little ahead of myself thinking that he would come straight in for round 1 and dominate.

Oh well, best of luck to the big guy for a speedy recovery.

GET AROUND HIM!

 

[Claypigeon]

Looking forward to the hero who picks a name out of a hat and posts "We should have drafted "name out of a hat* instead of Mitchell". This should occur shortly or after the two year cooling off period ends.

I hope I'm wrong, but it's not looking good for Mitchell.

Wasn't it Fasolo that Carlton was tipped to pick with No. 42 before the slide of Mitchell won us over. .. Happy we picked Mitchell still, not a fan of Fasolo nor 20-20 hindsight recruiting anyway

 

[Chains]

Rowe's done his AC, Mitchell needs a reco and Duigan has had knee surgery.

 

[Blue since 72]

Wasn't it Fasolo that Carlton was tipped to pick with No. 42 before the slide of Mitchell won us over. .. Happy we picked Mitchell still, not a fan of Fasolo nor 20-20 hindsight recruiting anyway

Agreed. There will be few things more boring than having to go through the 'Mclean syndrome' again.

 

[mac25]

A full reco won't see Mitchell back until mid year at best and even then he'll be tentative for some time.

Was my favourite for the full forward post this year, but seems we'll now have to wait until 2013

There has to be a fair degree of doubt on Mitchell's durability after almost two years of shoulder injuries as to whether he can get his body right to have a real crack at establishing himself, if Waite cannot stand up in 2012, our tall forward structure will be our achilles heel.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Yeah but reality is they are all still yet to prove they can influence games as forwards, that is all based on potential. Waite is a really good forward but his body has become so unreliable so we must nearly expect him to miss games and maybe be on the sidelines again come seasons end. Thornton is a gap filler that is alright pushing up the ground but kicking goals against top sides and playing key position might be another thing, Rowe and Casboult haven't even played AFL yet, Hampson has never kicked over 2 goals in a game and Kreuzer seems to be more miss than hit as a forward. Potential is one thing but results are another and we need some big guys who will stand up against the top 4 sides but we also need plenty of options in the VFL. I recon with Waite in the side taking the best tall forward and Walker taking plenty of attention any of those listed could have an influence but if Waite goes down and the attention shifts then Walker and who ever else is playing as a tall forward may struggle a little more.

I like our tall defender depth with Bower, Henderson, Jamison, McCarthy and Watson fit. I don't like our tall forward depth now that Mitchell is injured as it consists of Waite who is proven but injury riddled, Rowe/Casboult who are not proven and a few ruckmen who are unproven as forwards. I think we need to push another guy along now as depth/another option in this area. It will do Watson good as a defender to spend time attacking the ball and trying to get the ball and working on his marking. It gives us more options and he may even earn a spot in this role. I recon Rowe, Kreuzer and Waite will be playing round 1 so Hampson and Casboult will possibly playing VFL which makes room for one other to play as a tall forward in the VFL as Hampson will spend a lot of time rucking. I would like to see Watson play CHF in the VFL and Casboult and Hampson to rotate throught the ruck and forward line. This really keeps our depth deep and we may even find a player doing this. Us as Carlton supporters should know better than to reject the idea of playing a player out of their usual position.

Not making a lot of sense in this post gspot. First sentence you say the players we have left now that Mitchell is injured are yet to prove themselves at AFL level......Mitchell is yet to prove himself at VFL level, let alone AFL. He has 2 reserves games and a TAC GF in the past 2 seasons. As another poster has said, if we were pinning our improvement hopes on Mitchell we were basing it solely on "potential".

And most people have overlooked the fact that Hendo was sent back because of our tall KP back need, with Jamo and Bower injured and Watson not quite ready. I think he will be sent back forward (no pun intended) sooner rather than later, especially if Bower and Jamo stay fit. Along with Duigs and Laids, Yarran and Russell and a small tagging type like Joseph, we have a very settled, capable and well drilled back half. And if Watson is ready to step up all the better, but I have a feeling Bower and Rusty will be back in the best 22.

And if anyone doubts Hendo's credentials as a CHF they need look no further than the RD12 v Brisbane, one of his last stints at CHF before being switched back. Killed it at CHF.

I know we over rate our own, and I have not seen as much of Mitchell as the track watchers, but seriously some perspective would be a good. Sad for Mitchell, hardly shattering for the rest of the teams prospects in 2012. If thats the worst PS injury we have.........

 

[gbatman]

Bingo!

If we were hanging our hats on Mitchell to drag us up to that next level, then we are not as good as I beleive we are


He didnt play last year and we did fine without him. Our improvement will come from many players, not just one man.


Luke will be back, and I cant wait to see him in the VFL as soon as he gets his shoulder right.

Yes and no, Carlton have a good midfield that can deliver the ball to a forward. Not like the bad old day where we used to kick half volleys to Josh Kennedy's feet and big long bombs on top of his head. With Waite or Rowe at FF taking the best backman and Walker taking the quickest and possibly second best defender or Kreuzer taking the second best defender we have the perfect enviornment to blood a young forward. Young forward comes in, focus goes to prolific goal kicker Walker, Waite as the best mark and most expierence and Kreuzer the tallest while the young tall takes some under sized or rookie defender. It's not like we are a team with no other forwards and he will be playing on the likes or Darren Glass. Just look at Collingwood, Brown was an average forward but put him in a forward line where the best two tall defenders were taken up by Dawes and Cloke and all of a sudden he is a good player. I was thinking along the lines that our team is the best team around to blood a new forward, and I was hoping because of that Mitchell's progress could have been accelerated and we could have tapped his talents early. Lets hope another steps up to this vacant spot, but to make it happen others around him like Kreuzer, Waite or Walker adn maybe Hampson need to fire.

 

[mediumsizered]

Silly question perhaps, but if Bower returns to play as the 3rd tall in defence & Russell/Tuohy slot into defence, how would Laidler go up forward?

Similar size to Walker (but probably plays a bit taller than Walker), has a good pair of hands & is a beautiful kick of the ball.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Silly question perhaps, but if Bower returns to play as the 3rd tall in defence & Russell/Tuohy slot into defence, how would Laidler go up forward?

Similar size to Walker (but probably plays a bit taller than Walker), has a good pair of hands & is a beautiful kick of the ball.

Not silly at all. I also think Russell could play off a hff as he was heading towards before being sent back all those years ago when he was the BF whipping boy and his confidence seemed to be troubling him. Some also think (I am not so sure) that Touhy is a potential hff, and of course there is Collins who was a forward at the Tigers.

Not sure it addresses the percieved issue we have with a "tall" forward. If Waite and Hendo stay fit forward, and Jamo and Bower stay fit back, Thornton as a swingman.....we dont have any issues. If we are to fill the spot with a left field choice I think Watson, who has a fantastic kick on him would make a great forward, if he marked anywhere between centre and the arc he is a chance to goal. Waite at FF, Hendo at CHF as the roaming push up type, Tex on one forward flank also pushing all the way back to the HB line as he currently plays and Watson on the other flank playing more of a stay at home CHF to kick long goals, and of course Eddie and Jeff doing as they do.....we dont have forward issues.

I doubt Mitchell would have played early doors, as good as he may have looked on the track I think there were others still in front of him and I think that hope for a RD1 start was always going to be pinned on Rowe a la Duigs, no point recruiting mature age unless you intend to use them and WH and Ratts had chased their man for 18 months and finally got him, so they have had him in their plans for some time. His shoulder injury is more worrying to me than Mitchell's at this time.

 

[4QTR BLUES]

I believe there is every chance that Jamison will play games as a forward this year, particularly full forward. The guy is probably our best contested mark and has shown that he is extremely quick off the mark. Considering he seems to be practicing his goal kicking a lot at training might indicate he will be used there. Obviously this is dependent on who we are playing but we have no dearth of defenders, who against most oppositions would do an extremely good job.

Jamo = 60 + goal kicker for Carlton.

 

[gbatman]

Silly question perhaps, but if Bower returns to play as the 3rd tall in defence & Russell/Tuohy slot into defence, how would Laidler go up forward?

Similar size to Walker (but probably plays a bit taller than Walker), has a good pair of hands & is a beautiful kick of the ball.

I recon he would go fine, I really think a fit Jamison would go well up forward too but his value down back is far too high. I think Laidler as a forward would be similar to Thornton, good for a couple of goals per game. What we are after is that tall forward who is extra tall and strong. Laidler, like Thornton is tall but not super tall. We are looking at a guy who marks well over head, is strong and is over 195cm. Someone we can kick the ball long to, someone who can split packs and take a few pack marks. We are looking for the guy who can be really dangerous when we go to the top of the square. I think we have a wealth of guys who can play that lead up role really well. Walker is the best, Russell, Laidler, Thornton and Gibbs are all decent leading forward options. This is not the sort of forward we are lacking. We are lacking an extra tall, big, strong guy who can take a contested mark, give us something when we go long to the hot spot and can crash packs and take a pack mark. This is why we have picked up forwards like Mitchell, Rowe and Casboult because they are solid lads over 195cms. It is also why we have been trying Kreuzer and Hampson forward and pushing this pretty hard. When the heat is on against top 4 sides in finals there is often very little space in the forward line and a lot of pressure on the ball carrier. Those sides will force us to go longer forward and that's when the big forwards come into vogue and the leading forwards tend to struggle, particularly towards the end of games. You only have to watch our game V the WCE's or the Grand to see the importance of the big strong forward. The old saying that every one gets tired and slower but tall players don't get any shorter is still well and truly relevant.

On what you said though, Russell used to get a lot of the ball playing as a half forward a few years ago but he used to butcher it a fair bit and miss a lot of goals. His kicking has improved since so it might be worth trying him at half forward, has a long kick and is quick and good over head. Laidler is not so quick but has great hands and uses his body well and is a natural footballer. Kicked some nice goals this year, would be nu mug as a forward. Touhy has a long booming accurate kick and would kick goals, likes to hit the ball pretty hard. Honestly I recon Touhy could play any position and I'd love to see him on the ball more. I recon he could be a very good onballer.

 

[cookie monster]

Moving off topic a little, but rusty is more suited as a HFF for mine. Great shot at goal on the run, strong through the body. Allows bower to play as a HBF/BP

 

[Stig O'Hara]

The Mitchell boy is a 5 year investment.

Give him a year or 2, and he's the size of a moose.

Calm down people.


Quick check kids, is it Sallient, or Salient??

 

[Claypigeon]

The Mitchell boy is a 5 year investment.

Give him a year or 2, and he's the size of a moose.

Calm down people.


Quick check kids, is it Sallient, or Salient??

The point is salient*

*I saw what you did there. ..

 

[mediumsizered]

Not silly at all. I also think Russell could play off a hff as he was heading towards before being sent back all those years ago when he was the BF whipping boy and his confidence seemed to be troubling him. Some also think (I am not so sure) that Touhy is a potential hff, and of course there is Collins who was a forward at the Tigers.

Not sure it addresses the percieved issue we have with a "tall" forward. If Waite and Hendo stay fit forward, and Jamo and Bower stay fit back, Thornton as a swingman.....we dont have any issues. If we are to fill the spot with a left field choice I think Watson, who has a fantastic kick on him would make a great forward, if he marked anywhere between centre and the arc he is a chance to goal. Waite at FF, Hendo at CHF as the roaming push up type, Tex on one forward flank also pushing all the way back to the HB line as he currently plays and Watson on the other flank playing more of a stay at home CHF to kick long goals, and of course Eddie and Jeff doing as they do.....we dont have forward issues.

I doubt Mitchell would have played early doors, as good as he may have looked on the track I think there were others still in front of him and I think that hope for a RD1 start was always going to be pinned on Rowe a la Duigs, no point recruiting mature age unless you intend to use them and WH and Ratts had chased their man for 18 months and finally got him, so they have had him in their plans for some time. His shoulder injury is more worrying to me than Mitchell's at this time.

I'm not totally convinced you have to have a couple of tall forwards. I think it is more a case of having someone who can consistently catch the damn thing & then kick it between those big sticks.

With the amount of ball inside 50 generated by our midfield & our running defenders if we had someone we could rely on to regularly take a mark inside 50, it would take the pressure off Betts, Garlett & Walker. That someone doesn't necessarily have to be 195cm +.

 

[Jeremias]

I believe there is every chance that Jamison will play games as a forward this year, particularly full forward. The guy is probably our best contested mark and has shown that he is extremely quick off the mark. Considering he seems to be practicing his goal kicking a lot at training might indicate he will be used there. Obviously this is dependent on who we are playing but we have no dearth of defenders, who against most oppositions would do an extremely good job.

Jamo = 60 + goal kicker for Carlton.

Sorry, but no. Just no.

Jamison is our best FB by an absolute mile, and if he's fully fit for an entire season there's every chance he'll be considered one of the best in the league.

To move him forward would be absolutely ludicrous.

You are right we do have a number of defenders that are capable of playing senior footy. However none are of the caliber of Jamo.

Jamison will play forward as much as he did in 2011, at an absoute maximum. The only way he'll be forward is if we are absolutely desperate for something different during a game, or if he's forgotten to change ends at the end of a quarter.

 

[40yearBLUE]

I'm not totally convinced you have to have a couple of tall forwards. I think it is more a case of having someone who can consistently catch the damn thing & then kick it between those big sticks.

With the amount of ball inside 50 generated by our midfield & our running defenders if we had someone we could rely on to regularly take a mark inside 50, it would take the pressure off Betts, Garlett & Walker. That someone doesn't necessarily have to be 195cm +.

I am also not convinced we "need" another tall. At least not on top of what we already have.

I am totally convinced we already have our premiership forward line, we had it last year but couldnt keep one of the components on the field for the second half of the season. Walker, Betts, Jeff and ........Waite for it...........Waite at FF.

Hendo at CHF. When Waite was fit Hendo wasnt. When Hendo came in Waite was hampered by injury and then with Jamo and Bower injured we needed Hendo back. With those 2 fit, Hendo is our CHF for mine.

That there is a premiership forwardline. As good as any going around ATM with the possible exception of Hawthorn. Buddy being their big X. If Buddy gets injured or falls away we have them for spread.

 

[goreds]

I am also not convinced we "need" another tall. At least not on top of what we already have.

I am totally convinced we already have our premiership forward line, we had it last year but couldnt keep one of the components on the field for the second half of the season. Walker, Betts, Jeff and ........Waite for it...........Waite at FF.

Hendo at CHF. When Waite was fit Hendo wasnt. When Hendo came in Waite was hampered by injury and then with Jamo and Bower injured we needed Hendo back. With those 2 fit, Hendo is our CHF for mine.

That there is a premiership forwardline. As good as any going around ATM with the possible exception of Hawthorn. Buddy being their big X. If Buddy gets injured or falls away we have them for spread.

Mitchell is not just a 'tall'...

The terms 'presense' and 'aggression' are something that this monster would bring to the table...

Yes we have a forward structure that is well balanced against 3 qtrs of the competition but against the top 4 sides we sometimes lack some anger and intimidation....

Mitchell brings this...

 

[40yearBLUE]

Mitchell is not just a 'tall'...

The terms 'presense' and 'aggression' are something that this monster would bring to the table...

Yes we have a forward structure that is well balanced against 3 qtrs of the competition but against the top 4 sides we sometimes lack some anger and intimidation....

Mitchell brings this...

Ah no. He could, he might, he shows promise of are all terms you could use, he does is not.

I remember the huge promise of a country forward called Oliver.........hows his record stack up against the best forwards?

Not saying Mitchell wont be a champ, truth is none of us know, me included. So as of today, Mitchells injury is a speed bump to our post 2013 success but has little or nothing to do with our 2012 success. None of us are sure he would even have got a game even if fully fit. How bout we wait for the evidence on an actual AFL game.

 

[40yearBLUE]

The pumping up of Oliver was for the potential of the player before he came to the club.
As it turned out Oliver was just a kid that didn't care much for the limelight and the professionalism of an AFL environment.
Mitchell is a totally different beast in terms of desire and attitude, or at least that the way it seems to me as I had never watched Oliver.

Forget the track watchers because we're only there one day of the week, but when the coaches and players such as Walker start talking him up, there is something there to listen to.
It's not the end of the world, but don't be mitsaken that this hasn't thrown us out of whack, even just a bit.

Sorry Harks, I dont buy it that Mitchell was a big part of our 2012 plans. He may have been cutting it up on the track, dont dispute that, just that he was going to make a significant contribution to our season or that was the plan.

I think we ought to at least base our judgements on some actual against opposition form. Rowes recruitment tells me that the club didnt expect Mitchell to impact THIS year. Next year or year after sure but this, he may have played a few games, its not unusual for growing forwards to play half a dozen games in their first or second year. He is a second year player that has yet to debut, so to suddenly think he was going to have a big impact on the game this year......hmmm nice dream but not a percentage play. We all know it takes talls years to reach full power. So I am not fretting too much about the prospects of the team from an injury interrupted season for a player yet to play a game.

There are a million things that can go wrong in the journey from potential to champion. Olivers story is just one of them. That's why we count the actual stats of players in order to call them champs, not their potential.

 

[40yearBLUE]

That's the proof, but again a lot of things open up in the off-season, and on output through this period Mitchell was in front of Rowe, Casboult and Hampson for the FF post.

It has been enough for Ratten to speak glowingly of him and for Walker to highlight him as one to watch.
Mitchell has impressed me on every occasion I have been at training and it looked evident that he was being primed for a round 1 start.
Now, we'll never know how that would have panned out, but I saw a great fit to our forward structure for what Mitchell looked capable of bringing along.

EDIT:
There are always new players that shine through the off-season and carry that form through the season.
Duigan was easy to pick as a round one starter last year and I'll bet The Eagles were glad they took Darling straight to their side, after his impressive off-season.

I dont know because I only saw one training session last ps, but I would be pretty sure that Watson was tearing it up on the track last PS and got his reward in Rd2. I was sucked into the hype on here that he was a ready made FB. How did that work out you think? Will he be a great KP player, probably, but I am sure Ratts 2011 plans didnt revolve around him being a permanent KP defender in his first year. Nor do I think the MC have similar hopes or plans for Mitchell this year. He may have looked like he was ahead of Rowe or Hampson, but these track images and press releases are not always the way things are, just as they seem to be. As I said in a previous post, I would be more concerned with Rowes injury than Mitchells for its implications for 2012 at this stage.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Watson?
The three talls were all sub-par through the off-season, but Watson was the best of the three.
McCarthy had no fitness base and was regularly the first out of most contests, including the yo-yo testing.
Mitchell couldn't hold the ball and looked ordinary below the knees.
Watson could kick.

Watson can still kick and McCarthy has taken his fitness and flexibility up by some, but Mitchell is a whole new animal and I think most that have watched him were taking him very seriously.
You haven't so you don't.

My point about Watson was only to highlight that this time last year, many posters here had Watson as an AA KP player.

I am sure the club takes EVERY players potential seriously. But they prioritise and understand time lines and when players are expected to be able to perform the functions they were recruited for. I just dont think Mitchell was ever going to be a major part of this seasons plans. I totally think he would have debuted, and maybe even played a major portion of the year if he performed to expectation in his first few games. But thats just it, until he actually plays and shows he is capable at that level, not on the track, not in Dubai, not in his few games in a much lower comp, but at this level. Until then, I dont think he is part of the MC's plans. He is just an option that may become viable at some point. Nothing more.

This in no way diminishes my hopes for him. I hope every player shines, including and perhaps especially the likes of McLean because of the flak they cop from their own supporters. But do I think it has derailed our chance of success this year, hell no. Now if we cop a major injury to Jamo, or one of our key mids such as Gibbs, Judd or Murph then that would put a dent in our chances. Notice the difference, players with a PROVEN track record as opposed to someone we think looks pretty good and hope carries that into games with them.