Actually, it is more like moving up from 24th to 7th if you do your sums, but maybe you can't.
Bolton anyone ? Good analogy of hanging on to a first selection perhaps unjustifiably.
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Monfries
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Actually, it is more like moving up from 24th to 7th if you do your sums, but maybe you can't.
Bolton anyone ? Good analogy of hanging on to a first selection perhaps unjustifiably.
Why are people against Stander's trade suggestion?
Two top ten picks would give us the opportunity to draft a highly touted midfielder and key defender.
Where does Monfries fit in a midfield of Watson, Pev, Stanton, Winderlich, McVeigh, Slattery, Lovett, Nash with Hislop, Houli, Dempsey, Jetta, Reimers coming through.
Two top ten picks would give us the opportunity to draft a highly touted midfielder and key defender.
Where does Monfries fit in a midfield of Watson, Pev, Stanton, Winderlich, McVeigh, Slattery, Lovett, Nash with Hislop, Houli, Dempsey, Jetta, Reimers coming through.
Monfries is more likely to become a midfielder than Lovett and quite possibly Houli.
I'm not against trading Monfries, I just don't think that deal is feasible.
Adelaide wouldn't want Johns and I wouldn't want to give our second round pick away as part of the deal either.
I have a fair idea, and I reckon Ant ( miss him already ) has too. Its got something to do with not thinking laterally.
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Lovett and Houli are more likely to complement what we already have in the midfield.
So we get two top 10 picks and we lose two players not in our best 22 - Monfries and Johns + 2nd round draft pick.
I'd be dancing in the street if we could get that.
Monfries can be replaced by Dempsey, Hislop or Houli and Johns can be replaced by anyone.
I am against Stander's suggestion on the basis that I don't think we'd end up with a player that's better than Monfries from either top 10 pick.
This draft is remarkably low in quality and the midfield talent within it is low.
In my opinion, currently there are four midfield standouts:
Trent Cotchin: A good player but hasn't played as much in the midfield as most leading midfield prospects have in the past. I would rather him to Monfries but chances are that he won't slip past top 2-3. There are more question marks over his midfield abilities than Monfries.
Chris Masten: A good midfielder with an excellent motor but he's got to add more polish before he can become an out-and-out star. He's a Scott West type in my opinion but its hard to tell if he'll be as nearly an effective ball winner as he's been as a junior. Monfries has more class in my opinion. I'd prefer him to Monfries but I doubt he'll slip past the top 5.
Rhys Palmer: Only really came into really high considerations after the Championships. He was devastating for Western Australia but he was more often than not a receiver who finished the excellent work of Masten and Rich. Has got spark and an engine, but looks like he could be a frontrunner. I'd like to have him and would prefer him to Monfries, but he's a long way from a sure thing.
Cale Morton: Another receiver-type that drifts up and down the wings. Shapes as a Jay Nash/Ryan Lonie type player. Given our abundance of these types and that it looks like Cale wouldn't progress into centre-square duties, I'd prefer Monfries that has, at the very least, been effective at times.
Grimes, Ebert and Selwood aren't far off this category either.
To me, the above mentioned guys are not shaping up to be all that much better than Angus Monfries and chances are that we'd only get one of the top 4. They look like they'll make it and be decent footballers but, given his ability to win contested ball as well as uncontested ball and give off good disposal, so does Angus.
The way I see it is that we'd be putting ourselves back 3 years. Monfries should develop into a footballer at a similar level to all of the above. Given the amount of youth that's come in in recent years, I think it's time to start looking at the present.
This draft is remarkably low in quality and the midfield talent within it is low.
In my opinion, currently there are four midfield standouts:
Trent Cotchin: A good player but hasn't played as much in the midfield as most leading midfield prospects have in the past. I would rather him to Monfries but chances are that he won't slip past top 2-3. There are more question marks over his midfield abilities than Monfries.
Chris Masten: A good midfielder with an excellent motor but he's got to add more polish before he can become an out-and-out star. He's a Scott West type in my opinion but its hard to tell if he'll be as nearly an effective ball winner as he's been as a junior. Monfries has more class in my opinion. I'd prefer him to Monfries but I doubt he'll slip past the top 5.
Rhys Palmer: Only really came into really high considerations after the Championships. He was devastating for Western Australia but he was more often than not a receiver who finished the excellent work of Masten and Rich. Has got spark and an engine, but looks like he could be a frontrunner. I'd like to have him and would prefer him to Monfries, but he's a long way from a sure thing.
Cale Morton: Another receiver-type that drifts up and down the wings. Shapes as a Jay Nash/Ryan Lonie type player. Given our abundance of these types and that it looks like Cale wouldn't progress into centre-square duties, I'd prefer Monfries that has, at the very least, been effective at times.
Grimes, Ebert and Selwood aren't far off this category either.
To me, the above mentioned guys are not shaping up to be all that much better than Angus Monfries and chances are that we'd only get one of the top 4. They look like they'll make it and be decent footballers but, given his ability to win contested ball as well as uncontested ball and give off good disposal, so does Angus.
The way I see it is that we'd be putting ourselves back 3 years. Monfries should develop into a footballer at a similar level to all of the above. Given the amount of youth that's come in in recent years, I think it's time to start looking at the present.
No. 21st pick would be if we finished 13th (taking into account carltons likely priority pick)which is very possible. The crows IMO will finish 8th or 9th on the ladder which equates to selection 9 or 10. Maybe you need to learn your maths.
Don't sugar-coat it. We already have a top 10 pick to begin with. All we are doing is moving up from 21st to 9th and for that we lose Monfries who is only 20. How many players break out when they are in their early 20s. Heaps.
Yes were are moving up to effectively get that KPP defender we need.
Monfries could break out but I reckon his ceiling won't be that high. He doesn't have the pace or size and we need players to complement Jobe and Slatts, Stanton, etc
He might be better suited to a team with a different dynamic.
I'll bet that if you put this on the Adelaide board that no one will want to do the trade.
Who do you think has the pace and size to really break out that would still be available at pick 9-10?
I don't think there is an obvious answer. Chances are that we could be having this conversation in 3 years time about the guy we got with the pick that we traded Monfries for.
I think we're just setting ourselves back 3 years with a spot on our list.
Is that the one that's rated about the 5th or 6th best defender?
Probably the one that's playing forward.
There haven't been any good defenders in junior footy for years.
Hansen withstanding, who still played his share of footy forward.
Lucy is a perfect example. The AA FB but couldn't play the game.
We won't find a gun defender in the draft, we'll have to develop one.
KING-JAMES
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Rance goes pretty good in defence, so he would be the one we would take. People forget quickly though. Last year Monfries was everyones hero, this season he has struggled with form, but why would we give up on someone who showed so much promise in his first 2 years.
Gus is the sort of bloke that will use his average year as a big motivation in the pre season and work torwards building some confidence and form up for next year. You dont lose ability over night.
Gus is the sort of bloke that will use his average year as a big motivation in the pre season and work torwards building some confidence and form up for next year. You dont lose ability over night.
There's much more chance of developing a pick in the top 10 then someone that is rated at best a 3rd rounder.
Yep, because all the top defenders in the game at the moment were high picks.
Glass is about the only one and it took him a significant amount of time to reach his best.
Harris (Pick 71), Rutten (Rookie).
You just don't find gun defenders early in the draft these days and most of the gun defenders started as forwards.
Alex Rance and Tayte Pears are probably the standouts as key defenders and neither looks a sure thing. Shouild they have been in the draft last year they would have been far later selections. I wouldn't want to give up Monfries for one of them.
I like the idea of Daniher. He's fairly raw as a key defender but he comes with good size and good pedigree. I'm hoping on some Jobe Watson like development.
There is never any gun defenders in the draft. They all have to be developed into defenders.
This is why. When you look at all the TAC cup teams or state teams they are all the best players picked from withen there region. So you will get all the gun midfielders and all the gun forwards. You will hardly ever get a defender unless he is the running type defender.
For example a person who i know was coaching under 16's interleague last season. What the league does is it asked each club to send 2 players down for tryout's from everyteam. There were 33 teams which equaled to 66 players. He asked which kids play key position. 35 kids put there hand up. He then asked how many play key position in the backline. Two kids put there hand up and said they play center half back.
That is why you need to develop your key backmen.
This is why. When you look at all the TAC cup teams or state teams they are all the best players picked from withen there region. So you will get all the gun midfielders and all the gun forwards. You will hardly ever get a defender unless he is the running type defender.
For example a person who i know was coaching under 16's interleague last season. What the league does is it asked each club to send 2 players down for tryout's from everyteam. There were 33 teams which equaled to 66 players. He asked which kids play key position. 35 kids put there hand up. He then asked how many play key position in the backline. Two kids put there hand up and said they play center half back.
That is why you need to develop your key backmen.
No.......... but most of the really good players are high picks.
We need good players not rookie list and late draft hopefuls.
We pick best available and if thats someone that can play defence preferably or midfield or wherever than we take them.
We have a surplus of similar type players that we need to change. It's time to get serious and make some real decisions or wallow in the bottom four for a long time.
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There is never any gun defenders in the draft. They all have to be developed into defenders.
This is why. When you look at all the TAC cup teams or state teams they are all the best players picked from withen there region. So you will get all the gun midfielders and all the gun forwards. You will hardly ever get a defender unless he is the running type defender.
For example a person who i know was coaching under 16's interleague last season. What the league does is it asked each club to send 2 players down for tryout's from everyteam. There were 33 teams which equaled to 66 players. He asked which kids play key position. 35 kids put there hand up. He then asked how many play key position in the backline. Two kids put there hand up and said they play center half back.
That is why you need to develop your key backmen.
It's not always the case. Sam Hunt played Full Back for Melbourne Grammar back in the day. Problem was that the ball got kicked over his head.
In the TAC Cup there are plenty of guys that play as full time defenders however the forwards that they play on are far different moulds from AFL forwards. Playing defense in junior football is almost redundant when making the transition to AFL football.
Put simply, there are guys that play key defense out there but before they can step into an AFL side they've got a lot of developing to do. That's why what Paddy's done this year is so incredible.
Now you're changing your tune.
Yes, we should look to improve our draft position like we did last year, yes we should draft the best available.
But we shouldn't trade into the first round in the hope of finding a gun tall defender. It won't happen, there won't be any.
My tune is not changing.. I'm just clarifying my position.
My point still stands that Monfries does not give us anything that our current midfield does.
Even if he steps up I don't think he's the type of player that will complement our midfield.
If we trade him and get a good deal then we can get best available or best tall. Look at trading and on trading that deal so that somehow we have position and bargaining power to get a KPP defender in the next year or two.
It's not as simple as trade him and get KPP defender in draft.
Im thinking a big pre season is in need for Monfries
Listen carefully- there are a couple of priority picks you have overlooked, and you're becoming fatiguing. Is there a remedial school near Rundle Mall ?
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