Player Watch Most overrated players (current & retired) part 2

[Ishmael_]

Lol bit triggered are we? Average player. Hit outs and impacts on games are different things. We don't have to agree on this believe it or not.

The same argument can be made for Sandilands. Nearly always dominates hitouts, often the Dockers lose the clearances, doesn't doesn't take that many marks, doesn't kick a lot of goals. Many would argue that apart from being 211 cm he's pretty average.

I certainly don't feel that way, I rate Sandi highly. And I've always thought Mumford was a pretty average footballer, who found his role.

My point being, that some players like Sandi and Mumford have presence and their contribution is greater than the sum of their parts.

 

[mike91]

The same argument can be made for Sandilands. Nearly always dominates hitouts, often the Dockers lose the clearances, doesn't doesn't take that many marks, doesn't kick a lot of goals. Many would argue that apart from being 211 cm he's pretty average.

I certainly don't feel that way, I rate Sandi highly. And I've always thought Mumford was a pretty average footballer, who found his role.

My point being, that some players like Sandi and Mumford have presence and their contribution is greater than the sum of their parts.

I agree mate. I can see why people would think that about Sandi too.

 

[Thrawn]

It was a regular topic of conversation: "What's happened to Kouta?" I think he may have had some family issues which badly affected his form for a long long time.

His father died during that period.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

I've often been bemused by the term "over-rated". Who are these people determining the rating of each player?

 

[Ishmael_]

Walker's knee has permanently reduced him IMO, he doesn't have the agility anymore. So harsh to knock him as a result.

Dixon on the other hand was the Comp's leading contested marker last season from memory... while regularly being double teamed against 2 KPDs, he also had minimal help, with poor disposals coming in to him....

I'd say he was anything but overrated. Sure he's had bad kicking days, but so did Kennedy....

I concede Walker's injury, but if he has lost mobility he needs to find another way to present.

Honestly your expectations of Dixon must be quite low to not think he's at least a smidge overrated.

A career average of 1.5 goals a game for a contested marking gun. He's 27 turning 28 and has kicked 7 goals from 10 games this year.

He's a mirage, all the weapons but it never materialises. But hey, perhaps like a fine wine or a few, he'll age well.

 

[Grrr]

The same argument can be made for Sandilands. Nearly always dominates hitouts, often the Dockers lose the clearances, doesn't doesn't take that many marks, doesn't kick a lot of goals. Many would argue that apart from being 211 cm he's pretty average.

I certainly don't feel that way, I rate Sandi highly. And I've always thought Mumford was a pretty average footballer, who found his role.

My point being, that some players like Sandi and Mumford have presence and their contribution is greater than the sum of their parts.

I'd go a bit further, maybe some Freo supporters will set me straight, but has he held back Fremantle due to no other development of ruck man in years. He does nothing much except tap outs, which these days is not enough for a ruck man.
So has he been there so long been detrimental to the side as a whole. Been thinking this for a few years.

 

[gungho]

I've always thought Matthew Scarlett was overrated. Not saying he wasn't a very good defender. But i never saw him as one of the greatest tall defenders. Got gifted a few contentious AA selections IMO.

Dangerfield and Fyfe are a bit overrated too (in terms of comparing them to greats of the game). They are great at a lot of things, but my god they are such bad kicks. Shockingly bad tbh and the commentators just seem to brush over it...

You do realise how much stronger/faster/athletic current professional footballers are to past champions don't you? If Fyfe was playing 30 years ago he'd be known as the guy that was better than Royce Hart and if Dangerfield was playing he would absolutely destroy anyone on him.

 

[Back One Out]

His father died during that period.

Yeah, I thought so. Not sure if his old man suffered a long illness, but it seemed to really knock Kouta around for a long time. It wasn't just a couple of months of indifferent form.

 

[Thrawn]

Yeah, I thought so. Not sure if his old man suffered a long illness, but it seemed to really knock him around for a long time. It wasn't just a couple of months of indifferent form.

It was lung cancer, sadly.

 

[A Swallow]

You do realise how much stronger/faster/athletic current professional footballers are to past champions don't you? If Fyfe was playing 30 years ago he'd be known as the guy that was better than Royce Hart and if Dangerfield was playing he would absolutely destroy anyone on him.

He just said their kicking is average and commentators gloss over it, which is true. Dangerfield’s kicking is horrific at times.

 

[stuv 2 skunk]

Says who? You're comparing apples to oranges.

Harvey, Ricciuto and Ablett jr are the only players to be selected in EIGHT (8) All Australian teams

From 1991-2000, Harvey won more possessions, had more clearances and ran further than anyone. He was an inside ball-winner who sidestepped anyone who tried to tackle him and continually burst clear of the stoppages. He ran harder than anyone else to get to contest after contest. He was basically the 90's version of Chris Judd (but with half the media hype)

People like to exaggerate about some midfielders and say they carry their teams on their back, but this is exactly what Harvey did. He averaged 28 to 30 disposals per game in an era when most of the top midfielders averaged 24 to 26

I think a lot of people underrate him because they judge him on the last 5 years of his career when he was 33yo-37yo and had slowed down & no longer controlled games like he did when he was at his dominant best in the 90's.

1989 - 12 games, 257 disp (21.4)
1990 - 18 games, 443 disp (24.6)
1991 - 23 games, 605 disp (26.3)
1992 - 24 games, 689 disp (28.7) - All Australian, Best & Fairest, EJ Whitten Medal
1993 - 17 games, 434 disp (25.5) - EJ Whitten Medal
1994 - 18 games, 474 disp (26.3) - All Australian, Best & Fairest
1995 - 17 games, 451 disp (26.5) - All Australian
1996 - 21 games, 597 disp (28.4) - All Australian, EJ Whitten Medal
1997 - 25 games, 756 disp (30.2) - All Australian, Best & Fairest, Brownlow Medal, MVP
1998 - 24 games, 735 disp (30.6) - All Australian, Best & Fairest, Brownlow Medal
1999 - 17 games, 486 disp (28.6) - All Australian
2000 - 16 games, 439 disp (27.4) - hamstring injuries
2001 - _9 games, 220 disp (24.4) - hamstring injuries
2002 - 10 games, 194 disp (19.4) - hamstring injuries
2003 - 22 games, 580 disp (26.4) - All Australian
2004 - 23 games, 498 disp (21.7)
2005 - 17 games, 367 disp (21.6)
2006 - 23 games, 476 disp (20.7)
2007 - 19 games, 392 disp (20.6)
2008 - 24 games, 507 disp (21.1)

Can't believe this came from a non saint as a kid I thought he was god. Named my son after the man

 

[Grrr]

Can't believe this came from a non saint as a kid I thought he was god. Named my son after the man

Harvey.

Lucky bastard.

 

[theyellowsash]

Rance. Should be in the vafa

 

[Damon_3388]

It was always more about how he got the ball - pack marks, one v one's and clearances - than what he actually did with it.

Sounds like Nat Fyfe.

 

[Damon_3388]

Rance. Should be in the vafa

Balwyn calling.

 

[iameviljez]

You do realise how much stronger/faster/athletic current professional footballers are to past champions don't you? If Fyfe was playing 30 years ago he'd be known as the guy that was better than Royce Hart and if Dangerfield was playing he would absolutely destroy anyone on him.

If Fyfe played 30 years ago, he'd have the same training and professionalism as champions from 30 years ago.

 

[iameviljez]

If you look over Kouta's 16 year career, he only had 3 or 4 elite seasons. People remember him for his 2000 season and forget how ordinary he was in many other years . There are some champion players who aren't in the Hall of Fame who had much better careers than Kouta. e.g. Simon Black.

Sometimes really, really athletic players just cop one injury and never quite come back the same (usually knees). Hawkins was the same for us when he did his back in 2013 - in 2012, he was basically playing like Superman, and he never really got his leap back. Same goes for when James Kelly broke his leg - still a very, very good footballer, but he lost a lot of his dynamic attacking ability. He was better than Ablett, Bartel and SJ in his first couple of years.

 

[Morro]

For me it is Nic Nat, Doesnt do nearly enough around the ground and never has.

That said, he has massive impact for a terrible footballer if that makes sense.

 

[iameviljez]

For me it is Nic Nat, Doesnt do nearly enough around the ground and never has.

That said, he has massive impact for a terrible footballer if that makes sense.

Agree. I would have Stef Martin any day

 

[Richo83]

The media overrate Rance. Bigfooty have over corrected and underrate him. If the media did their job, they'd credit some of the good defenders out there.

As a general rule though, I think most defenders are overrated now. It's easier being a defender in this era with defences being more organised, working in teams and with teams playing more defensive than in the past. In the 90s you saw a lot of one-on-ones with Carey, not so much anymore. On the flipside, we underrate forwards, especially key forwards.

 

[t_94]

The media overrate Rance. Bigfooty have over corrected and underrate him. If the media did their job, they'd credit some of the good defenders out there.

As a general rule though, I think most defenders are overrated now. It's easier being a defender in this era with defences being more organised, working in teams and with teams playing more defensive than in the past. In the 90s you saw a lot of one-on-ones with Carey, not so much anymore. On the flipside, we underrate forwards, especially key forwards.

Agreed. Pretty much every team has at least one half back flank who gets 30 touches now.

 

[iameviljez]

On the flipside, we underrate forwards, especially key forwards.

Completely agree. It doesn't help that now a 70-goal year is enough for a Coleman - so we look at, say, Josh Kennedy and think well, he's clearly not as good as Modra or Dunstall.

 

[iameviljez]

Agreed. Pretty much every team has at least one half back flank who gets 30 touches now.

Also that you see a lot of forwards who are on the edge of being lost to AFL completely, then they go to the backline and dominate. Now it's Wayne Milera, but others that come to mind include Trav Varcoe, Leon Davis, Aaron Black in the last fortnight, half of Freo's key forwards, Lachie Henderson, Liam Jones. Truth: it's a lot easier to spoil the footy than it is to mark it.

There are a few who have gone the other way, but usually that happens in very, very early developmental years. Silvagni was just a freak.

 

[PhatBoy]

If Fyfe played 30 years ago, he'd have the same training and professionalism as champions from 30 years ago.

This. How do people not make that connection when comparing eras?

 

[Plat]

I've often been bemused by the term "over-rated". Who are these people determining the rating of each player?

No hopers on internet forums and journos who give themselves something to write about?