MPNFL league divisions

[MrNatural]

Am i the only one who thinks that the MPNFL should revert back to a division system based on results rather than geographical location?
The recent results in Casey Cardinia have shown the gulf between the big clubs such as Narre and Cranny, versus the smaller clubs such as HP, and Devon in previous seasons. To a lesser extent Tooradin will struggle long term to compete.
When i first played in the MPNFL in 2004, before they reverted to the goegraphical divisions, it seemed to be far more competitive but as the years have gone on, the gulf between the haves and have nots has increased dramatically.
I know the main issue will be the travel that may be incurred, for example a team like Pakenham travelling to places such as Sorrento, but surely the league would be better off with this, than seeing 200pt drubbings every week.

 

[PINNACLE HEALTH]

Am i the only one who thinks that the MPNFL should revert back to a division system based on results rather than geographical location?
The recent results in Casey Cardinia have shown the gulf between the big clubs such as Narre and Cranny, versus the smaller clubs such as HP, and Devon in previous seasons. To a lesser extent Tooradin will struggle long term to compete.
When i first played in the MPNFL in 2004, before they reverted to the goegraphical divisions, it seemed to be far more competitive but as the years have gone on, the gulf between the haves and have nots has increased dramatically.
I know the main issue will be the travel that may be incurred, for example a team like Pakenham travelling to places such as Sorrento, but surely the league would be better off with this, than seeing 200pt drubbings every week.

Travell times is always the first excuse that pops up but VFL players have to live with it.

Their needs to be a relagation system like the Eastern League.

Cranny & Narre need to be in a premier league for the development of their players & more exposure to their juniors that are wanting to take their footy to another level.
Country Leagues have been travelling for 2hours plus since existance, bus trips can be a good bonding exercise also.
Would crowd numbers decrease?
Possibly to begin with but l think over time numbers would increase to see the best of the best every week.
l reckon say Narre v Mornington would get a huge crowd to Carr st one afternoon for a Granny.

 

[Thurgood2Dawson]

Needs to be looked at, but not all that neccessary

Hampton Park are struggling, but less then 12 months ago were considered a premiership contender and beat the likes of Narre and Berwick early in the year.
Pakky was 10 points off playing for a grand final spot

I know there is a points system which is fine, but player payments need to be addressed. How can smaller clubs, evidenced by Meadows and Now HP, compete with Cranny and Narre, work it out Cranny payments per game would be around the 10k mark, Narres more. Hp would struggle to spend 1k on players per game, no wonder why they cant compete.

everyone will turn around and say its there own faults (screwing players) or why should strong clubs with good membership/sponsorship be punished for running a good organisation. Wont be punishing but if you have a points and monetry cap clamped on surely middle/lower tier players would consider moving to the struggling clubs for the opportunity for a bit of financial gain and regular senior football.

If something isnt done, the poor clubs will fold and you will only see 1 or 2 clubs on the cup for the next 10-20 years

 

[bulldog bark]

Needs to be looked at, but not all that neccessary

Hampton Park are struggling, but less then 12 months ago were considered a premiership contender and beat the likes of Narre and Berwick early in the year.
Pakky was 10 points off playing for a grand final spot

I know there is a points system which is fine, but player payments need to be addressed. How can smaller clubs, evidenced by Meadows and Now HP, compete with Cranny and Narre, work it out Cranny payments per game would be around the 10k mark, Narres more. Hp would struggle to spend 1k on players per game, no wonder why they cant compete.

everyone will turn around and say its there own faults (screwing players) or why should strong clubs with good membership/sponsorship be punished for running a good organisation. Wont be punishing but if you have a points and monetry cap clamped on surely middle/lower tier players would consider moving to the struggling clubs for the opportunity for a bit of financial gain and regular senior football.

If something isnt done, the poor clubs will fold and you will only see 1 or 2 clubs on the cup for the next 10-20 years

Thoroughly agree !

The Points System has become a a toothless tiger that does not perform its function in any way. "Marquee" players and other concessions have watered it down to the point where the wealthy clubs are again dominating every division and the reward for fostering juniors is almost zero.
YCW player payments this year are "rumoured" to be around the $300k mark. Whether this is accurate or not, you can see by the peninsula ladder already that the clubs paying the biggest money are 10 to 15 goals ahead of the rest. The vast majority of their games this year will be uncompetative. Surely thats not what we train, work and turn up for each saturday.

 

[oz1235]

the Travel time comment is a dead set joke. from Pakenham to Rye. It takes an hour so an hour and a quarter to Sorrento. This compared to the VAFA. Distance between South Mornington and the most western club is longer than Pakenham to Sorrento.

 

[Jackie Chan]

Forget about the $$ side of things for a second guys. Apart from this year narre never really paid big $$. They are lucky enough to have an extremly successful culture that draws players to them. Cranbourne have a lot of guys that came through the under 18s playing in there first so again I think the pull is playing in successful teams.
The bigger advantage for those clubs is the massive number of under 18 that are at there club. For example rumor has it that narre had almost 200 players wanting to play under 18s this year. If that's the case they trimmed it down to 3 sides. That's up to say 40-45 kids each year go into the senior club. Weight of numbers suggest 10-12 are going to be very very good, 15 are going to be pretty handy and the rest probably terrific club people that go on the be 200 game players in the reserves.
I take my hat off to those clubs for creating such great and successful cultures. In this case nothing to do with $$ and all to do with winning cultures.

 

[MrNatural]

Forget about the $$ side of things for a second guys. Apart from this year narre never really paid big $$. They are lucky enough to have an extremly successful culture that draws players to them. Cranbourne have a lot of guys that came through the under 18s playing in there first so again I think the pull is playing in successful teams.
The bigger advantage for those clubs is the massive number of under 18 that are at there club. For example rumor has it that narre had almost 200 players wanting to play under 18s this year. If that's the case they trimmed it down to 3 sides. That's up to say 40-45 kids each year go into the senior club. Weight of numbers suggest 10-12 are going to be very very good, 15 are going to be pretty handy and the rest probably terrific club people that go on the be 200 game players in the reserves.
I take my hat off to those clubs for creating such great and successful cultures. In this case nothing to do with $$ and all to do with winning cultures.

Money has alot to do with it.
I heard that Justin Berry was in talks with Devon Meadows (he had played there in the juniors) before his move to Cranbourne, but his decision ultimately came down to money and the meadows couldnt afford to match Cranbourne.
Yes Cranbourne and Narre have built winning cultures around junior development, but its near on impossible for teams like Tooradin, Devon, ROC etc to compete with those weight of numbers

 

[fairdinkum]

ROC etc to compete with those weight of numbers

Isn't ROC's junior club now one of the strongest in the DDJFL?

If so, it is only a matter of time before this starts filtering through to the senior club.

Officer is booming as Pakenham sprawls further and further in every direction and more young families = more junior players = plenty to look forward to for ROC.

 

[MrNatural]

Isn't ROC's junior club now one of the strongest in the DDJFL?

If so, it is only a matter of time before this starts filtering through to the senior club.

Officer is booming as Pakenham sprawls further and further in every direction and more young families = more junior players = plenty to look forward to for ROC.

I dont much about the junior leagues so cant comment on that.
It seems alot of these lesser clubs struggle to hold any talent they do bring up through the juniors.
I can only speak from experience at my previous club, but alot of talent has goes to their cross town rivals

 

[PINNACLE HEALTH]

I dont much about the junior leagues so cant comment on that.
It seems alot of these lesser clubs struggle to hold any talent they do bring up through the juniors.
I can only speak from experience at my previous club, but alot of talent has goes to their cross town rivals

You will never stop some juniors crossing clubs or Leagues to play with mates etc.. but if you can manage to create an inviting culture you will keep most.

Thats why Junior coaches are as, if not, more important than the Senior coaches because clubs need them to install a strong disire into the Juniors to stay together & play Seniors.

There was one stage there at Narre when the Clarke brothers were playing there along with a dozen other Juniors that came up through the ranks.
During that period they played in multiple premierships together which created a succesful culture that they wanted to be apart of & knocked back lucrative cash offers from other clubs.

Other Clubs like Doveton & Cranbourne have experienced the same in the past.

 

[MrNatural]

There was one stage there at Narre when the Clarke brothers were playing there along with a dozen other Juniors that came up through the ranks.
During that period they played in multiple premierships together which created a succesful culture that they wanted to be apart of & knocked back lucrative cash offers from other clubs.

Until they packed their bags for the hills of Gembrook

 

[Jackie Chan]

Berry never played juniors at meadows mr natural. Half a year as a senior footballer was his only time at meadows. I don't blame players like the Clark boys for leaving after achieving want they wanted to at narre. Maybe your a touch jealous that you could earn a $$ playing footy...
Everything goes in cycles.. ROC now have a colts team because there are in the growth cooridor. All sides in the area if they are smart will benefit from the increase in population.

 

[Jackie Chan]

Money has alot to do with it.
I heard that Justin Berry was in talks with Devon Meadows (he had played there in the juniors) before his move to Cranbourne, but his decision ultimately came down to money and the meadows couldnt afford to match Cranbourne.
Bullshit don't buy that at all. Berry went back to his home club to finish his career and good on him. He got paid what he deserve and could probably get a lot more else where.

 

[MrNatural]

Berry never played juniors at meadows mr natural. Half a year as a senior footballer was his only time at meadows. I don't blame players like the Clark boys for leaving after achieving want they wanted to at narre. Maybe your a touch jealous that you could earn a $$ playing footy...
Everything goes in cycles.. ROC now have a colts team because there are in the growth cooridor. All sides in the area if they are smart will benefit from the increase in population.

My mistake.
Nonetheless, he was approached by the Meadows to join them, and from what i hear, he laughed at them when he heard how much they were offering. I dont blame him for going to Cranny, made the better decision in a financial and success sense. So good on him.
All i was pointing out, was the fact that the smaller clubs will forever find it hard to improve and compete with examples such as this. Another issue teams like Meadows have, is the fact that most potential players dont even know where it is!

 

[The full package]

When I first played MPNFL it was the current system it is now, then we reverted to Zone Division's. Zone divisions doesn't work as the clubs don't make any money. Low gates is the problem. No local rivalry, and no atmosphere at the games.

Glad it is what it is today where you get packed grounds again and clubs make money on their home games.

 

[MrNatural]

When I first played MPNFL it was the current system it is now, then we reverted to Zone Division's. Zone divisions doesn't work as the clubs don't make any money. Low gates is the problem. No local rivalry, and no atmosphere at the games.

Glad it is what it is today where you get packed grounds again and clubs make money on their home games.

The geographic setup works in to generating more money from gate takings, but when you start getting thrashings like we've seen this year, then supporters stop showing up anyway.
Clubs like Devon Meadows gave up rivalries with Cranbourne and Tooradin and moved to Nepean because they couldn't compete with the big clubs.
What's the point of the league if its just a two horse race?
Hopefully the other clubs can improve over the summer and challenge Narre and Cranny.

 

[fairdinkum]

Clubs like Devon Meadows gave up rivalries with Cranbourne and Tooradin and moved to Nepean because they couldn't compete with the big clubs.

How did that work out for them?

As I understand it, they won about as many games this season as they normally did back in CC.

 

[bradrowe#32]

Are they still planning to merge the Casey Cardinia with the Ellinbank and (some teams from) the Yarra Valley leagues?

 

[MrNatural]

How did that work out for them?

As I understand it, they won about as many games this season as they normally did back in CC.

They won only one game last year in CC, this year they won five, so its an improvement at least.
In the long run, DM will be better off in Nepean than CC

 

[MrNatural]

Are they still planning to merge the Casey Cardinia with the Ellinbank and (some teams from) the Yarra Valley leagues?

There were whispers around, but i don't see it getting up

 

[fairdinkum]

They won only one game last year in CC, this year they won five, so its an improvement at least.
In the long run, DM will be better off in Nepean than CC

They would have beaten Hampton Park twice this season had they remained in CC.

There's two wins already - an improvement on 2011.

 

[MrNatural]

They would have beaten Hampton Park twice this season had they remained in CC.

There's two wins already - an improvement on 2011.

In the long run they werent going to compete with the bigger clubs with bigger population bases.

 

[Thurgood2Dawson]

Almost time for CC to leave the MPNFL and create a new comp, combine with the EDFL, make it 2 divisions.
Weaker clubs then have a chance at really re building. its an Hour from Cranbourne to Warragul so travel is nothing. only flaw is what to do with keysey, would be alot futher for them to travel, plus there jumpers are putrid

 

[MrNatural]

Almost time for CC to leave the MPNFL and create a new comp, combine with the EDFL, make it 2 divisions.
Weaker clubs then have a chance at really re building. its an Hour from Cranbourne to Warragul so travel is nothing. only flaw is what to do with keysey, would be alot futher for them to travel, plus there jumpers are putrid

I doubt it will happen.
As for keysy, TBH i dont know why they are even in CC.
Keysborough is not even in the area. They are better off in the SFL i wouldve thought

 

[bradrowe#32]

I doubt it will happen.
As for keysy, TBH i dont know why they are even in CC.
Keysborough is not even in the area. They are better off in the SFL i wouldve thought

Agreed, especially with teams like Dingley and Springvale just up the road. They'd have some big rivalries there. I think they were going to make the move last year, but decided against it.