Nat Wars; The Beetrooter Strikes Back (An $80m production)

[skybeau]

Two MPs run up $200,000 tab on private flights to work in Canberra

Two National Party MPs have racked up a combined bill of $200,000 chartering private flights to and from their electorates to attend sessions of Parliament in Canberra since the change of government.

www.smh.com.au

One Sweet Jesus semantics award for you.

And the article says he was approved to do this, it's not like was hiding the cost. And that it was open to other MPs to seek approval. Methinks your ire needs to be directed elsewhere if you are truly unhappy about this.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Two MPs run up $200,000 tab on private flights to work in Canberra

Two National Party MPs have racked up a combined bill of $200,000 chartering private flights to and from their electorates to attend sessions of Parliament in Canberra since the change of government.

www.smh.com.au

Ok so 2017 is the article so will compare from that time when I get a chance (will do January to March quarters from 2013 on). Seems like others were doing it (need to check this Gary gray in 2010)

 

[Caesar]

Methinks your ire needs to be directed elsewhere if you are truly unhappy about this.

I’m not unhappy about it

But a crook is a crook and there’s way too many people in here making him out to be a great bloke

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I’m not unhappy about it

But a crook is a crook and there’s way too many people in here making him out to be a great bloke

Were you this upset over corrupt water rights sales, or 1000% mark ups on property sales, or tractors running over key evidence?

 

[Caesar]

Were you this upset over corrupt water rights sales, or 1000% mark ups on property sales, or tractors running over key evidence?

If I notice a big group lauding the people who did those things as top blokes, I’ll be the first to point them out

 

[Over The Post]

Caesar might not be, but I bloody am

 

[Chief]

Rick Wilson has Kalgoorlie which has an airport with commercial flights.
And you would expect him to drive it would you? So you’d need to pay a driver for the 6 hour trip.

He’s got arms and legs, yeah? A driver’s license?

 

[Crankyhawk]

He’s got arms and legs, yeah? A driver’s license?

I am under impression that mps get driven everywhere

 

[Johnny Bananas]

One Sweet Jesus semantics award for you.

Just one?

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Yep, pretty much.

The Nationals is not a serious party for country people – just a collection of bogus stereotypes | Van Badham

Barnaby Joyce’s leadership is not a good fit with the evolved values of traditional rural voters

www.theguardian.com

 

[Over The Post]

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Yep, pretty much.

The Nationals is not a serious party for country people – just a collection of bogus stereotypes | Van Badham

Barnaby Joyce’s leadership is not a good fit with the evolved values of traditional rural voters

www.theguardian.com

I don't buy it. If most of the voters in Nationals electorates were really much more socially liberal than the party, they would either vote for another candidate that better reflects their values, or the National Party would have moved in a more socially liberal direction by now. This is especially true of the people of New England. I don't believe for a second that there isn't anyone who can fight for the interests of that community properly while being more socially liberal than the Beetrooter. We've seen a couple of independents break through the Nationals domination but I'll believe it's a wide trend across the nation when I see it happen.

 

[Crankyhawk]

I don't buy it. If most of the voters in Nationals electorates were really much more socially liberal than the party, they would either vote for another candidate that better reflects their values, or the National Party would have moved in a more socially liberal direction by now. This is especially true of the people of New England. I don't believe for a second that there isn't anyone who can fight for the interests of that community properly while being more socially liberal than the Beetrooter. We've seen a couple of independents break through the Nationals domination but I'll believe it's a wide trend across the nation when I see it happen.

Or they are politically unaware and trust the nationals brand while only very few people actually attend branch meetings to select candidates

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I don't buy it. If most of the voters in Nationals electorates were really much more socially liberal than the party, they would either vote for another candidate that better reflects their values, or the National Party would have moved in a more socially liberal direction by now. This is especially true of the people of New England. I don't believe for a second that there isn't anyone who can fight for the interests of that community properly while being more socially liberal than the Beetrooter. We've seen a couple of independents break through the Nationals domination but I'll believe it's a wide trend across the nation when I see it happen.

I don’t think it’s that simple that because more progressive desires are being expressed in rural communities, we’ll automatically see a greater range of options offered to punters at the rural ballot box.

Don’t forget, the population densities are far lower than in urban centres and critical masses are far less certain to occur. News and notions travel very differently in the bush.

Also, I read Gabrielle Chan’s book “Rusted Off” that Badham mentioned. Although I highly recommend it, one conclusion I drew from it is one that I felt Chan could not bring herself to state, though her findings led inexorably to it - country folk so dislike any suggestion of being lectured to by what they perceive as urban know-alls, that they will not just willingly, but proudly continue to vote against their own interests for a lesser-quality Nat candidate, than vote for any alternative candidate with a whiff of urban sophistication about them.

For all Chan’s sensitive, nuanced, first-hand elaboration of the truth of rural life, it really was very unflattering in the end.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I don’t think it’s that simple that because more progressive desires are being expressed in rural communities, we’ll automatically see a greater range of options offered to punters at the rural ballot box.

I'm sure there are plenty of existing options offered that are more socially progressive than the National Party.

Don’t forget, the population densities are far lower than in urban centres and critical masses are far less certain to occur. News and notions travel very differently in the bush.

That makes sense, fair enough. I haven't lived long enough in the bush to know.

country folk so dislike any suggestion of being lectured to by what they perceive as urban know-alls, that they will not just willingly, but proudly continue to vote against their own interests for a lesser-quality Nat candidate, than vote for any alternative candidate with a whiff of urban sophistication about them.

Can't speak to the veracity of that statement, but if it's true, being so defensive against any outside perspective as to reject it without careful consideration and double down on existing behaviour, sounds like a fundamental weakness in identity. I feel as though a group truly comfortable with their place in the world would be willing to listen to other opinions without viewing them as an attack by outsiders.

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I'm sure there are plenty of existing options offered that are more socially progressive than the National Party.

I'm sure there are - perhaps I didn't phrase that as well as I might have. The problem is that insufficient rural folk are voting for them.

Can't speak to the veracity of that statement, but if it's true, being so defensive against any outside perspective as to reject it without careful consideration and double down on existing behaviour, sounds like a fundamental weakness in identity. I feel as though a group truly comfortable with their place in the world would be willing to listen to other opinions without viewing them as an attack by outsiders.

Quite agree. But that was the unfortunate takeaway I had from Chan's book. By all means read it and let me know your thoughts on it.

 

[Caesar]

country folk so dislike any suggestion of being lectured to by what they perceive as urban know-alls, that they will not just willingly, but proudly continue to vote against their own interests for a lesser-quality Nat candidate, than vote for any alternative candidate with a whiff of urban sophistication about them.

I don’t think it is about a dislike of being lectured to. I think it is an inherent distrust of anyone who claims to be able to be both urban and rural in outlook. Country people don’t see country interests as aligned with city interests in any way, shape or form.

They’re under no illusions of the disadvantages in our electoral system of being a small and low-density demographic, and the expectation of being railroaded by urban interests is founded in many years of bitter experience.

 

[madmug]

I don’t think it is about a dislike of being lectured to. I think it is an inherent distrust of anyone who claims to be able to be both urban and rural in outlook. Country people don’t see country interests as aligned with city interests in any way, shape or form.

They’re under no illusions of the disadvantages in our electoral system of being a small and low-density demographic, and the expectation of being railroaded by urban interests is founded in many years of bitter experience.

Yes it's been hard for the landed gentry to adjust to the thousand year old democratic principle of one man one vote.

I feel for them & the Beetroot. I really do.

 

[Caesar]

the landed gentry

That’s a pretty ignorant way to characterise a group of people who are generally poorer and have worse health and educational outcomes than those who live in cities

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

I don’t think it is about a dislike of being lectured to. I think it is an inherent distrust of anyone who claims to be able to be both urban and rural in outlook. Country people don’t see country interests as aligned with city interests in any way, shape or form.

They’re under no illusions of the disadvantages in our electoral system of being a small and low-density demographic, and the expectation of being railroaded by urban interests is founded in many years of bitter experience.

Just OOI, have you read Chan’s book?

 

[Over The Post]

I feel as though a group truly comfortable with their place in the world would be willing to listen to other opinions without viewing them as an attack by outsiders.

We're talking places where you're considered a brash new arrival and not a local because you have only been there 45 years.

Small-town and big-distance parochialism has to be seen to be believed. Toss in an inability to see much further than the next couple of seasons and you have a recipe for Nationals. Caesar pretty much has nailed it.

 

[madmug]

That’s a pretty ignorant way to characterise a group of people who are generally poorer and have worse health and educational outcomes than those who live in cities

Then get the landed Gentry, miners etc who make the money off the land to pay for more services then. Its people like the Beetroot who stopped the increased mining tax.

Just blaming people who live in cities for living in cities, is pretty ignorant.

 

[Caesar]

Just OOI, have you read Chan’s book?

Yes. I thought it was fine as far as it went. I was surprised it focused so exclusively on federal government and federal issues, especially given she was writing about NSW

Although I suppose that is possibly a function of Chan being a federal lobbyist

Just blaming people who live in cities for living in cities, is pretty ignorant.

Nobody is doing that

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

Yes. I thought it was fine as far as it went. I was surprised it focused so exclusively on federal government and federal issues, especially given she was writing about NSW

Although I suppose that is possibly a function of Chan being a federal lobbyist

Lobbyist? She's a journalist.

 

[Caesar]

Lobbyist? She's a journalist.

By training sure but as far as I’m aware these days she mostly works with Citizen’s Climate Lobby