Nathan Lyon

[Hellgood]

This is the first time I have watched Lyon too - but I am really impressed. He has a lot of variety, is really thinking through what he is doing and it seems Clarke is giving him the fields to take advantage. He is clearly laerning with each game but I like the way he goes about it.

Doherty was just too 1-dimensional and Beer, well he rarely bowled a ball that would scare a batsmen.

I agreed re Beer when he played in that Ashes test, but since seeing him play for WA earlier this year it seems he has improved quite a lot. Took a fair bit of stick from Ryder and Taylor in the tour match which may set him back in the selectors minds a bit though.

 

[mattymac]

best we've got and plays good positive cricket. learns fast. turns the ball. finds good areas and hits them

can't wait to see him develope a couple new deliveries as he developes

the search for a spinner is finally over.

 

[Tyberious Funk]

7 wickets in a test is generally a good result for a young spinner. But in a Brisbane test, where the conditions generally favour the quicks... it's an outstanding effort. Sure, his wickets were mostly tailenders. But it's not a bad sign to see a spinner cleaning up the tail.

Just hope he manages to keep his confidence up, because playing against the Indians will be hard work.

 

[Bucking Beads]

He will keep getting better and that really is the beauty of it. He throws it up gets nice shape and drop plus spins it enough. Hopefully he does well against India for they are a huge test.

 

[aussie1st]

Best effort by an off spinner on the Gabba which is pretty impressive given the names that have come by. Of course playing NZ instead of the great Aussie batting lineup back in the day helps.

 

[Copernicus]

I have not seen a lot of him, but from what I have seen, I am impressed. He gets a good amount of turn for an offie, but he also keeps an end tied down well. Plenty of promise shown.

Certainly, the Indians will be his big test. If he can get some wickets and stay economical against them, then that will show his true colours.

 

[frankrizzo]

Unless he loses his turn he'll be fine. The only problem with Hauritz was his lack of turn.

People still talk like haurtiz was dropped because of some huge drop in form....

In the 10 tests he played before being dumped he averaged 36 with the ball and 34 with the bat, if johnson had produced that in his last ten games you think he would be on the chopping block?

haurtiz was dropped after india because somebody had to be sacrificed so the large group of nonperforming seniors could squeak their way into another(ultimately failed) ashes campaign.

When you have a skipper trying to change a bowlers action to bowl "more like singh" in the middle of a test match it's clear the skipper is as clueless captaining offies as he is playing them.

Ponting's captaincy was abhorrent in india, he should have been sacked as captain after that series but instead somehow losing in India became the spinners fault, ponting clearly wanted to reunite the bulk of his failed 2009 ashes team and he didn't want haurtiz, doherty was his pick that should be clear from the pre ashes press conferences.

Guess that all came off as a bit of a rant but i just worry that if lyon doesn't win games against india he will be the easy scapegoat again so that others can slide by on mediocre form so we dump lyon because he didn't crush india and the merry-go-round recommences.

 

[Tyberious Funk]

Guess that all came off as a bit of a rant but i just worry that if lyon doesn't win games against india he will be the easy scapegoat again so that others can slide by on mediocre form so we dump lyon because he didn't crush india and the merry-go-round recommences.

Relax. Ponting is no longer captain, and Michael Clarke seems to be very good at working with his spinners. I think Lyon will get a fair shot.

 

[rickyp]

Doherty's biggest problem was being selected as a Test bowler on ODI form. He is still a good one day bowler, and this shouldn't be forgotten.

Lyon has looked great so far, India will be a good test but I get the feeling he's up for it.

 

[Phone]

I've noticed that both Boyce and Doherty have been bowling pretty well this season. And Holland and Beer haven't done too badly either. How does Lyon rate against some of these guys? Is he just a seat-warmer that got a bit lucky with a few wickets?

To give direct answers, he's better than every other spinner bar maybe Hauritz with whom he's also very much like. Pitches a little bit closer to the stumps than Hauritz, meaning there's less chance of edges off cuts but maybe more more bat pads. But they share the same basic theory. throw it up around the area of the foot marks, hope for drift and dip, hope you beat them with it, spin to finish the job. With bounce playing it's part. I always think of the cricinfo comment sent in by some guy during Lyon's debut: "Australia have searched their country far and wide to find a spinner exactly like Nathan Hauritz."

As for seat warmer. No. Unless they go back to Hauritz which you would think it's unlikely, no matter if Lyon's form goes and Hauritz stars. Batting might perhaps cost Lyon at some stage in the short term, but I dunno know, he seems to have the basics there so that could rise and rise. For the SL tour, he pretty much got picked because they judged his action to be better than the other ones. so better than SOK and Beer pretty much. so he's ahead of all the other spinners, obviously. I do think he's been a bit lucky, in his debut there were 3 stunning catches - one by him - on a pitch he'll never get to bowl on again. And NZ batted like morons in this test, and in between not much. But you shouldn't drop someone based on luck! It's when it becomes a trend...

There's two problems for Lyon off the top of my head, one that can be fixed and one that can't. The one that can be fixed is that because he's so new, he doesn't really have the fitness base. So as the games goes on he struggles more and more if he has to bowl a lot of overs. We've already see it, kinda. I think his first innings performance has been better than his second in every test so far. So that might really come into effect during the India series if they bat like they can. But over time it'll be fine. And who knows it might already be improving.

The other problem that can't be fixed is the foot marks bit. You need a left arm bowling to create those. See: Starc. So if there isn't a left hander in the team, Lyon may be in trouble. May. I think Hobart would be a pretty good test to see how he goes without the left armer. Although NZ could play Trent Boult and **** the test up.

They might be others, but those are the two things that might cost Lyon

 

[Bucking Beads]

India will have Zaheer Khan making foot marks for him as well.

 

[Phone]

It's Zaheer Khan on an overseas tour I wouldn't count on it

It might not be a big deal for him tho. We don't really know because we played a left armer this test pretty much for him.

 

[Blue Dimension]

He has been outstanding in his efforts thus far. We've got to remember he is only 24 also. He will learn plenty over the next few years with the more experience he gains.

Look at Swann for example. Wasn't till his late 20's that he actually got it all together. Lyon looks a great prospect for Australia.

 

[Doodlesweaver]

Don't got expecting too much against India and he'll be fine. Clarke will support him better than Punter would, but it's highly unlikely that he is going to worry the Indian line-up too much this early in his career. Not on Aussie pitches.

However, he may collect Tendulkar a couple of times. That guy has made half his career out of getting out to unheralded spin bowlers.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Lyon got turn in the T20 matches, without large footmarks and 0 left armers for South Australia. He also gets drift, rather than hopes for it. You are underrating him a fair bit Phone and I've seen quite a bit of him here in SA from the T20 and Shield that he played last year.

 

[Phone]

T20 /=/ Tests.

Note I said May. There's only one way to find out if he'll need the assistance of foot marks at test level. Personally I don't think he will that much, because of the drift and bounce.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Getting turn is getting turn. Getting drift is getting drift. Doesn't matter if you are in the whites or colours.

 

[Selective Retention]

Don't got expecting too much against India and he'll be fine. Clarke will support him better than Punter would, but it's highly unlikely that he is going to worry the Indian line-up too much this early in his career. Not on Aussie pitches.

However, he may collect Tendulkar a couple of times. That guy has made half his career out of getting out to unheralded spin bowlers.

Yeah I suspect he will cop a bit from the Indians but hopefully he has now done enough to weather that and they keep selecting him if it happens. I really like him. He's middle ground between Krejza and Hauritz. Gets enough drift and turn to be genuinely threatening, which Hauritz lacks, but doesn't pull down a heap of short shit like Krejza.

 

[Bucking Beads]

Lyon will get reasonably favorable conditions at the SCG, MCG and Adelaide Oval.

 

[dajesmac]

Best spinner available atm. Very handy bowler, I'd like to see more of him.

 

[Sylvia Saint]

Looks the goods.

I suspect he'll be carted in Adelaide (1st innings) by the Indians, but he throws the ball up, gets the ball to spin and most importantly has the knack of taking wickets. He's never going to be Warney... but he's a hell of a lot better than the Xavier Doherty's and Michael Beer's of this world.

 

[frankrizzo]

Lyon will get reasonably favorable conditions at the SCG, MCG and Adelaide Oval.

I don't think i can remember spin friendly conditions for the boxing day test in quite some time.

Warnie took a 5 for on boxing day 5 years ago but that was more to do with english batting than any help from the pitch, if anything the mcg has been a spinners graveyard in recent years at least in tests.

 

[Doodlesweaver]

Yeah I suspect he will cop a bit from the Indians but hopefully he has now done enough to weather that and they keep selecting him if it happens. I really like him. He's middle ground between Krejza and Hauritz. Gets enough drift and turn to be genuinely threatening, which Hauritz lacks, but doesn't pull down a heap of short shit like Krejza.

Yes, his control of length is good, in fact for such a young bowler it's excellent. But he'll get attacked against the Indians. It will be a good challenge for him to not get tricked into bowling too short.

I've seen Swann get rattled when not taking wickets and someone is playing him well. Starts losing control of length AND line and it doesn't take long for it to happen either.

And it will be a challenge for the selectors as well to show some backbone.

 

[Slax]

It's pretty much agreed that Lyon will get the full summer as our spinner, the question mark on his long term prospects will be answered against the Indians, play well in that series and he will have the spinners spot tied down for quite a few years to come.

Also agree that Clarke will be more patient with spinners and use him as an attacking option not just someone to improve the over rate.

 

[JimDocker]

Lyon has done very well for a young offie. He turns the ball a good amount, varies just enough and bowls a tight line and length.

Basically, he does not look out of place playing test cricket.

Also, how funny was it watching him in South Africa in the second test when Cummins and Johnson were trying to knock off the last few runs? The camera kept panning onto him and he looked like he was going to vomit and cry.