Nathan van Captain

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I was pleased to read this comment from Simon Goodwin yesterday:

"They've both (Rutten and VB) stepped up a lot. Nathan's last quarter against Brisbane was what true leadership is all about. It's about action and it's about performing under pressure and Nathan did that."

Shows that performance and ability will still be the most significant factors when we choose our skipper.

 

[FR0GGY]

I agree.

VB is a captain in the same mould that Cassis and Vandenbergh are captains. You'd give it to him in the hope it might make him better.

Would be happy if VB was half the player Cassisi is.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Congratulations you, who takes the internet way too seriously, you're not a pathetic loser at all, no really.

Lol. 'Loser'. Step your insult game up son. You cant even fill the 'internet tough poster' role well. Maybe if you puff your chest towards the keyboard some more someone will take you seriously?

 

[Southerntakeover]

And it wouldnt be the first time the club made a poor decision. The last 12 months have shown a few examples of that.

Not a poor decision at all. Its the right decision.

 

[aneale]

Providing he's in the best 22 in 18 months, then its a Vandenberg situation like at Hawthorn where everyone loves the bloke has good leadership qualities but the match committee can't legitimately pick him each week.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Providing he's in the best 22 in 18 months, then its a Vandenberg situation like at Hawthorn where everyone loves the bloke has good leadership qualities but the match committee can't legitimately pick him each week.

Who is going to replace him?
I see his place in the side safer than Stevens,Symes,Reily and even Mackay. Even if he doesn't make it as a midfielder, he'd be a much better HBF than Doughty.

His place in the side is pritty safe for the next 18 months, all being equal of course.

 

[aneale]

Who is going to replace him?
I see his place in the side safer than Stevens,Symes,Reily and even Mackay. Even if he doesn't make it as a midfielder, he'd be a much better HBF than Doughty.

His place in the side is pritty safe for the next 18 months, all being equal of course.

Well Stevens is a tall, so they aren't playing for the same spot. I'm not a massive fan of Dogga but his aerial world is that far above VB's its not funny so I don't see him as a threat to his HBF position just yet, certainly not next year at any rate.

McKay is more of a line breaker and ball carrier and had better disposal but has loafed a bit this year, Reilly penetration is better and is usually better by foot and Symes could very well go out for Otten anyway. With the emergence of guys like Martin and Jaensch who are both highly skilled (as opposed to VB) along with expected improvement in Sloane and Danger as well by 2012. Vince should be well and truly entrenched and IMO a better footballer and if Knights stays and his injury free he is also in the mix.

If Clarke comes out and says that VB isn't a automatic selection at the table now after this season, then when will he?

 

[Southerntakeover]

Providing he's in the best 22 in 18 months, then its a Vandenberg situation like at Hawthorn where everyone loves the bloke has good leadership qualities but the match committee can't legitimately pick him each week.

The threat on van Berlo's spot in the team is a bigfooty invention.

Hes never been dropped, nor have the club ever communicated that he has ever been in serious risk of it, and there really isnt any credible reason ive seen put forward as to why this should change in the short to mid term future.

 

[Elite Crow]

The threat on van Berlo's spot in the team is a bigfooty invention.

Hes never been dropped, nor have the club ever communicated that he has ever been in serious risk of it, and there really isnt any credible reason ive seen put forward as to why this should change in the short to mid term future.

You had an assistant coach of the club yesterday state that the only concern was at times his place in the team was up for debate and he fell in at 16-22. Yes he may not have been dropped but thats hardly a ringing endorsement that he is in our top level of players and worthy of captain based on ability.

I told you that yesterday, you either think I am bullshitting or have decided to ignore it because it doesnt suit your sales pitch.

 

[Southerntakeover]

You had an assistant coach of the club yesterday state that the only concern was at times his place in the team was up for debate and he fell in at 16-22. Yes he may not have been dropped but thats hardly a ringing endorsement that he is in our top level of players and worthy of captain based on ability.

I told you that yesterday, you either think I am bullshitting or have decided to ignore it because it doesnt suit your sales pitch.

Yes, ive decided not to take your account as gospel given the inability to verify. Would be very suprised if Clarke had communicated that they were strongly considering dropping van Berlo.

Ultimately i actually believe vB's position at the club is more secure than Clarkes.

P.s. theres no need for a sales pitch. Ultimately, whether you agree or not is fairly immaterial.

 

[macca23]

To all those crapping on that VB is a doubtful selection each week or other dribble along that line, Name when he was last dropped .... if ever!!

He's another who had a poor pre-season with his due to a bad back - the most debilitating injury you can have because you can do nothing because of the pain. You have to have had one to know it.

For him to fight on and do as well as he has speaks volume sfor his persistence and courage.

With a proper pre-season behind him he'll get right back to the top form he showed in 2009 before the back injury.

IMO all the negative comments are nothing more than a combination of ignorance, wishful thinking and imagination.

But if it makes you feel better, then so be it.

 

[Glenno23]

To all those crapping on that VB is a doubtful selection each week or other dribble along that line, Name when he was last dropped .... if ever!!

He's another who had a poor pre-season with his due to a bad back - the most debilitating injury you can have because you can do nothing because of the pain. You have to have had one to know it.

For him to fight on and do as well as he has speaks volume sfor his persistence and courage.

With a proper pre-season behind him he'll get right back to the top form he showed in 2009 before the back injury.

IMO all the negative comments are nothing more than a combination of ignorance, wishful thinking and imagination.

But if it makes you feel better, then so be it.

Its rather sad that we as supporters can be so harsh on players that give their absolute all. Well not in ALL cases, but VB always gives 100% no doubt

Its ok to have a difference of opinion on who you think should be captain etc, but at least do it respectfully and not say "x" player is not hard, not courageous etc

 

[Elite Crow]

Yes, ive decided not to take your account as gospel given the inability to verify. Would be very suprised if Clarke had communicated that they were strongly considering dropping van Berlo.

Ultimately i actually believe vB's position at the club is more secure than Clarkes.

P.s. theres no need for a sales pitch. Ultimately, whether you agree or not is fairly immaterial.

Curious to know if anyone else from Big Footy heard the discussion on 5AA.

To all those crapping on that VB is a doubtful selection each week or other dribble along that line, Name when he was last dropped .... if ever!!

He's another who had a poor pre-season with his due to a bad back - the most debilitating injury you can have because you can do nothing because of the pain. You have to have had one to know it.

For him to fight on and do as well as he has speaks volume sfor his persistence and courage.

With a proper pre-season behind him he'll get right back to the top form he showed in 2009 before the back injury.

IMO all the negative comments are nothing more than a combination of ignorance, wishful thinking and imagination.

But if it makes you feel better, then so be it.

So Macca, what do you think of Matty Clarke's comments that the concern is that VB hasnt been a walk up start. Rucci was shocked and pressed Clarke who responded that he had in the past fallen into the 16-22 bracket at selection.

I dont think VB should be dropped and given our list changes is very unlikely to be going forward, but I also dont believe that he is in the top 10 of our most important players as we hopefully build towards a premiership.

If someone can back up what I heard or if Rucci happens to write about it, then yourself and ST may need to concede thats those who dont want VB as Captain may have a point.

 

[Elite Crow]

Its rather sad that we as supporters can be so harsh on players that give their absolute all. Well not in ALL cases, but VB always gives 100% no doubt

Its ok to have a difference of opinion on who you think should be captain etc, but at least do it respectfully and not say "x" player is not hard, not courageous etc

And who has said that?

 

[Glenno23]

And who has said that?

taylor walker_13 called VB soft a few weeks back

 

[Southerntakeover]

So Macca, what do you think of Matty Clarke's comments that the concern is that VB hasnt been a walk up start. Rucci was shocked and pressed Clarke who responded that he had in the past fallen into the 16-22 bracket at selection.

See, this is why i want to verify for myself, with the exact wording and statements.

This is a different statement to van Berlo is within the 16-22 players, and seems to suggest a fluidity.

 

[macca23]

Curious to know if anyone else from Big Footy heard the discussion on 5AA.



So Macca, what do you think of Matty Clarke's comments that the concern is that VB hasnt been a walk up start. Rucci was shocked and pressed Clarke who responded that he had in the past fallen into the 16-22 bracket at selection.

I dont think VB should be dropped and given our list changes is very unlikely to be going forward, but I also dont believe that he is in the top 10 of our most important players as we hopefully build towards a premiership.

If someone can back up what I heard or if Rucci happens to write about it, then yourself and ST may need to concede thats those who dont want VB as Captain may have a point.

Clarke's comments - if that's exactly what he said ad verbatim - are totally irrelevant as the facts are that he does get picked every week. He's never been dropped so IMO that makes him a walk up start.

This year he would have dropped down the pecking order somewhat because of the lack of a pre-season with his debilitating back injury, but 100% fit, he IS a walk up start and history proves that.

Clarke is good for radio as he always likes to be a bit controversial so I wouldn't read too much into that comment. The fact that Rucci was shocked to hear it - as any rational person would have been - supports that view.

Besides, I do know that the club has been grooming VB for the captaincy for at least the past 2 years, because he IS a regular player and has the personal qualities that the club values in a captain. He is their preferred candidate.

As for all the other garbage that he is soft, doesn't go in hard enough doesn't get the ball enough, well blah blah blah, quack quack quack, that's all that's worth!!

We all have our preferences - that's fair enough. Neither are we the ones to select the skipper, so we'll all have to accept whoever the players and the club come up with, and respect that player for being their choice as they know far better than we do.

But there's no doubt that at this stage VB is the favourite to be the next skipper, and for those miniscule brained morons who have rubbished him just because he's not their choice is nothing more than being simple minded on their part.

 

[FR0GGY]

Clarke's comments - if that's exactly what he said ad verbatim - are totally irrelevant as the facts are that he does get picked every week. He's never been dropped so IMO that makes him a walk up start.

This year he would have dropped down the pecking order somewhat because of the lack of a pre-season with his debilitating back injury, but 100% fit, he IS a walk up start and history proves that.

Clarke is good for radio as he always likes to be a bit controversial so I wouldn't read too much into that comment. The fact that Rucci was shocked to hear it - as any rational person would have been - supports that view.

Besides, I do know that the club has been grooming VB for the captaincy for at least the past 2 years, because he IS a regular player and has the personal qualities that the club values in a captain. He is their preferred candidate.

As for all the other garbage that he is soft, doesn't go in hard enough doesn't get the ball enough, well blah blah blah, quack quack quack, that's all that's worth!!

We all have our preferences - that's fair enough. Neither are we the ones to select the skipper, so we'll all have to accept whoever the players and the club come up with, and respect that player for being their choice as they know far better than we do.

But there's no doubt that at this stage VB is the favourite to be the next skipper, and for those miniscule brained morons who have rubbished him just because he's not their choice is nothing more than being simple minded on their part.

But thats the thing he shouldnt be a walk up start, he should be picked for what he does on match day not what he does during the week. And to me he doesnt perform week in and week out on match day. And where others get dropped after a few bad games in a row he keeps getting picked.
I always likened his sittuation to Watson in the test team early on. Hed get an injury and be straight back in without really saying pick me, pick me with form. The only difference is watson has actually improved. To me a captain should absolutely be a lock in the 22.

 

[rooboy]

But thats the thing he shouldnt be a walk up start, he should be picked for what he does on match day not what he does during the week. And to me he doesnt perform week in and week out on match day. And where others get dropped after a few bad games in a row he keeps getting picked.
I always likened his sittuation to Watson in the test team early on. Hed get an injury and be straight back in without really saying pick me, pick me with form. The only difference is watson has actually improved. To me a captain should absolutely be a lock in the 22.

I'm with you Froggy. VB may still be suffering from back pain, and I think he does give his all, but he makes a lot of stuff ups, and IMO doesn't do a massive amount on the field that says he is an automatic pick every week. I always find it amusing that our so called bad boys, Johncock and Thommo do more by their example on the field than VB ever has.

When VB plays well, he normally plays very well, but doesn't do it anywhere near enough.

Look I know it won't happen, but I for one would love Thommo to be our next captain. VB can be the media spokesman.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Its amazing Macca.

No matter what you do, they'll just keep repeating the same ill thought out statements as a response, then sit back satisfied.

 

[FR0GGY]

I would love to be proven wrong in the future and for VB to become a star. But i cant imagine you could rank him in the top 10 players most important to the club. And if you can maybe your respose is ill thought out.
Players i consider more important than VB (no particular order). Thompson, Tippett, Walker, Dangerfield, Kights, Vince, Rutten, Porplyzia, Johncock, Douglas, (Davis, Sloane if these two continue as they have shown more than VB early on.)
So please tell me where i am wrong. I agree its all personal opinion but i think most would agree that all the above names would be picked first. I believe that captain should be close to being in your top 5 players certainly top 10. To give it to someone who trains well, speaks well imo is a mistake.

 

[Glenno23]

I would love to be proven wrong in the future and for VB to become a star. But i cant imagine you could rank him in the top 10 players most important to the club. And if you can maybe your respose is ill thought out.
Players i consider more important than VB (no particular order). Thompson, Tippett, Walker, Dangerfield, Kights, Vince, Rutten, Porplyzia, Johncock, Douglas, (Davis, Sloane if these two continue as they have shown more than VB early on.)
So please tell me where i am wrong. I agree its all personal opinion but i think most would agree that all the above names would be picked first. I believe that captain should be close to being in your top 5 players certainly top 10. To give it to someone who trains well, speaks well imo is a mistake.

Nick Maxwell certainly is not top 5 at the Pies, but has done a very good job as captain. Might just scrape into their top 10.

Of the names you mentioned for us at least 8 are no where near the captaincy

Only a couple of those names would be decent captain material.

 

[weneverland]

Clarke's comments - if that's exactly what he said ad verbatim - are totally irrelevant as the facts are that he does get picked every week. He's never been dropped so IMO that makes him a walk up start.

Well your definition of " a walk up start" is different to mine. I would have thought that if a persons position in the team had to be debated the he isn't a walk up start.

 

[FR0GGY]

i wasnt saying theyre captaincy material. But a captain should be both a good player and be captaincy material. Rutten is ahead as a player and close as a captain. Thompson imo is closer to VB captaincy wise than VB is to Thompson inspirationally and player wise. I was an advocate for Dangerfield but he has showed that he is certainly not up to it for a while yet.

 

[weneverland]

Its amazing Macca.

No matter what you do, they'll just keep repeating the same ill thought out statements as a response, then sit back satisfied.

As opposed to those who ignore any evidence that contradicts their own beliefs.