Opinion Naughton is a decent forward

F or D?

  • Forward

    Votes: 73 59.8%
  • Defender

    Votes: 43 35.2%
  • Wing

    Votes: 6 4.9%

  • Total voters
    122

bobs head soup

Peanuts Peanuts
Sep 14, 2015
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I'm just talking a 1-2 week experiment here. If it works, he can stay in defence, and if not, he can go back up forward and stay there. Not once did I indicate he should be a swingman who is constantly shifting back and fourth between attack and defence.
The thing is we spent a big chunk of the offseason working on forward structures and cohesion with the midfield. As it is paying dividends, makes no sense to pull out the guy who is basically the lynchpin.

Naughton is still learning as a forward and we are learning as a team, now is not the time to stifle that development.
 

mattwa

Club Legend
Jun 10, 2007
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Another example of a gun KPF > KPD. Look where Darcy Moore is playing atm..
 
Naughty is a CHF of the highest quality. The odd miss does not dilute his overall value, especially his work taking contested marks between the arcs and distributing to runners. Moving him back is what the old bulldogs would do. Bevo’s Bulldogs know what they’ve got.
 
Let’s look at the other premiership contenders:

1. Port - I’d rather Naughton on Dixon. Bruce and English should be able to compete with aliir. Dixon is a bigger threat than aliir IMO.

2. Melbourne - I’d rather him forward. May and lever are bigger threats than mcdonald, brown or Jackson (Jackson is looking goooooood tho).

3. Geelong - I’d rather him on cameron. He’s a bigger threat than Henderson, Kolodjashnij or Stewart.

4. Richmond - I’d rather him on lynch. He’s a bigger threat than Balta. That’s marginal though.

5. West coast - tough one like Richmond. McGovern is their biggest threat, but kennedy and darling gave our defenders a fair kick in the balls in Round 2.


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Boristown

Premiership Player
May 24, 2015
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Let’s look at the other premiership contenders:

1. Port - I’d rather Naughton on Dixon. Bruce and English should be able to compete with aliir. Dixon is a bigger threat than aliir IMO.

2. Melbourne - I’d rather him forward. May and lever are bigger threats than mcdonald, brown or Jackson (Jackson is looking goooooood tho).

3. Geelong - I’d rather him on cameron. He’s a bigger threat than Henderson, Kolodjashnij or Stewart.

4. Richmond - I’d rather him on lynch. He’s a bigger threat than Balta. That’s marginal though.

5. West coast - tough one like Richmond. McGovern is their biggest threat, but kennedy and darling gave our defenders a fair kick in the balls in Round 2.


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Not just about neutralizing threats though. You have to score enough to win.

For example, he gave McGovern a bit of a bath in that Eagles game, no way Dogs win if he doesn't play forward.
 

Golden_6

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Aug 15, 2014
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Definitely stay forward, with the ability to go back in close game or if someone gets off the chain.

Until opposition forwards start to kick bags against us regularly then why would we move him? We need to continue to capitalize on our dominant midfield and play to our strengths. He seems to be taking the next step as a player by being more consistent throughout games and hasn't really gone missing this year like we saw at times in the past.

Goals =14th
Contested Marks = 3rd
Marks inside 50 = 2nd
Marks on Lead = 2nd

All of the above don't take into consideration how much easier he makes it for Bruce & English.
 
Sep 22, 2008
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Definitely stay forward, with the ability to go back in close game or if someone gets off the chain.

Until opposition forwards start to kick bags against us regularly then why would we move him? We need to continue to capitalize on our dominant midfield and play to our strengths. He seems to be taking the next step as a player by being more consistent throughout games and hasn't really gone missing this year like we saw at times in the past.

Goals =14th
Contested Marks = 3rd
Marks inside 50 = 2nd
Marks on Lead = 2nd

All of the above don't take into consideration how much easier he makes it for Bruce & English.
It’s also not taking into consideration the scoring opportunity he provides by being one of our best pressure forwards, and bringing the ball to ground. Should be in the top 5 for goals kicked if he straightens up his kicking just a little bit.
 

Golden_6

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 15, 2014
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It’s also not taking into consideration the scoring opportunity he provides by being one of our best pressure forwards, and bringing the ball to ground. Should be in the top 5 for goals kicked if he straightens up his kicking just a little bit.
I almost added another one, he’s 16th in the comp at forward 50 ground ball gets which is absurd given how often he’s competing in the air.
 
Another example of a gun KPF > KPD. Look where Darcy Moore is playing atm..

That's where he started off , he was a not very effective forward who spent some time in the VFL before returning as an excellent KPD.
From the little I've seen he's still a better defender. Kicked 5 on debut against us of course.
 
Sep 7, 2015
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Let’s look at the other premiership contenders:

1. Port - I’d rather Naughton on Dixon. Bruce and English should be able to compete with aliir. Dixon is a bigger threat than aliir IMO.

2. Melbourne - I’d rather him forward. May and lever are bigger threats than mcdonald, brown or Jackson (Jackson is looking goooooood tho).

3. Geelong - I’d rather him on cameron. He’s a bigger threat than Henderson, Kolodjashnij or Stewart.

4. Richmond - I’d rather him on lynch. He’s a bigger threat than Balta. That’s marginal though.

5. West coast - tough one like Richmond. McGovern is their biggest threat, but kennedy and darling gave our defenders a fair kick in the balls in Round 2.


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I'd rather let our opponents worry about how they're going to negate Naughton.
 

bobs head soup

Peanuts Peanuts
Sep 14, 2015
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There are many variables of course, but as a broad concept it probably makes sense to play a versatile gun kpp forward when the team is going well and back when struggling.

Best example is peak Chris Grant almost winning Brownlows as a kpd in a crap Dogs team in 1996, then as a kpf in a hot Dogs team in 1997.

Or even Ted Whitten on blustery Western Oval games playing CHF with the wind and CHB into the wind.
 

WallyStringhaus

Club Legend
Aug 27, 2015
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I think Dermie sums it up best;


20210427_175557.jpg
 
Oct 19, 2012
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Minas Morgul
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The “as soon as Naughton sorts his goal-kicking out” line of thinking is......................a wishful line of thinking. In line with my “Sam Darley will come good” line of thinking.


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So the resolution is to push him back and watch him expose our defense with his under par kicking??

Nobody ever felt the need to move Cloke or N.Riewoldt back when their kicking was horrific.
 
Oct 19, 2012
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Minas Morgul
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Oliver Gigacz

Not sure if you take requests but here goes:

Any chance you could find Naughton's career shot accuracy and tell me how far it is below the league average?

My suspicion is that it's below average but not dreadful.

62goals, 49 Behinds.

Its been underpar this season but on goals vs behinds it seems reasonably fine.
 
It’s also odd that thinking the team would be better if Naughton played back, somehow seems to be interpreted as:

A) Thinking Naughton sucks as a forward
B) Not being completely stoked when he plays well forward

Naughtons my second favourite player (behind Bailey Williams). I think he is the best key position player in the league. I think he could win a brownlow at CHB.

Anyone who saw Chris Grant plays knows that it’s not always cut and dry where your best key position player should play. The pies are going through the same thing with Moore right now.

He’s having a great season. So fun to watch.


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So the resolution is to push him back and watch him expose our defense with his under par kicking??

Nobody ever felt the need to move Cloke or N.Riewoldt back when their kicking was horrific.

Field kicking and goal kicking are two different things. Agree??

His field kicking was more than fine when he played back for us.


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Oct 19, 2012
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Minas Morgul
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Field kicking and goal kicking are two different things. Agree??

His field kicking was more than fine when he played back for us.


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I agree field kicking and goal kicking are different. But Naughton is taking a lot of his kicks from up forward from marks. He will be doing the same in the backline.

I don't think Beveridge will want to expose this weakness in his game.

Plus your point about Moore is different, especially when Collingwood's midfield has been guttered and is ageing. Meanwhile our's is in the prime for the next 3-5. I also think these Intercept Defenders can be heavily exposed and can actually be to your determent if pressure up ground is lacking.

Its also his 2nd efforts to apply pressure and ability to win ground balls that are vital to our forward setup.

Might be in the minority but I believe the talent in the backline is far better than the talent up forward.

Anyway I've made all these points in previous posts and I understand the rationale for him to go back. But just not with this midfield.
 
Sep 22, 2008
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Oliver Gigacz

Not sure if you take requests but here goes:

Any chance you could find Naughton's career shot accuracy and tell me how far it is below the league average?

My suspicion is that it's below average but not dreadful.

Look at Naughty on this, literally shows every shot he’s ever taken.

as expected he’s pretty much on par with expected scores, up until this year where he’s been really really bad. I think it’s just a case of the yips atm, he’s honestly no where near as bad as it’s made out on here (up until this year anyway).

Hes probably never going to have that natural ability to kick freakish goals in general play or from the boundary consistently but the vast majority of his shots at goal come from marks inside 50, set shots is something you can definitely tidy up to an efficient enough level, even with a clunky action. I found it funny both Dunks & Treloar answered Naughty when asked who they’d want to kick after the siren to win. I bet he takes set shot after set shot at training and nails them, it’ll come in game eventually.

No one has a problem with Timmy forward, but Naughty is wayyyy more accurate.
 
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