Aussies NBC Sports 100 Greatest Olympians

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GreyCrow said:
More to separate Modern v All Time.

Happy to do an all time top 5 but Phelps is still number 1

1. Phelps
2. Paavo Nurmi
3. Mark Spitz
4. Aladar Gerevich
5. Birgit Fischer

Weighted towards longevity. All Summer. Weighted for Gold Medals.
Click to expand...

How many Swimming medals equate to a track / field medal? About 1:3?? And so how does Bolt measure up v Phelps?
It's not like on the track you have the sprints offering medals for the sideways and backwards techniques and a medley to boot it's just get down the other end the fastest.
 

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Jack Gun Cyril Stun said:
How many Swimming medals equate to a track / field medal? About 1:3?? And so how does Bolt measure up v Phelps?
It's not like on the track you have the sprints offering medals for the sideways and backwards techniques and a medley to boot it's just get down the other end the fastest.
Click to expand...
Bolt has 4 Gold Medals on his own. Phelps has 11 Gold

Maybe this might answer your question
 
I'm surprised they could fit in 2 Aussies
Sure, they can be excused for excluding Fraser, as the list does have athletes who had the "spirit of the games,"
But they then forget John Landy, who epitomised the spirit of the games

And Betty Cuthbert, who launched women's athletics
 
Mitchell Madness said:
And Betty Cuthbert, who launched women's athletics
Click to expand...

Shirley Strickland was doing it very strongly before Betty. Actually Shirley did it whilst single, then as a mother.

Decima Norman started the womens athletic surge in Australia, but due to circumstances, I don't think she made it to the Olympics.
 
Jack Gun Cyril Stun said:
How many Swimming medals equate to a track / field medal? About 1:3?? And so how does Bolt measure up v Phelps?
It's not like on the track you have the sprints offering medals for the sideways and backwards techniques and a medley to boot it's just get down the other end the fastest.
Click to expand...

Athletics......... Swim
????................50m Free
100m............. 100m Free + 100m Back + 100m Breast + 100 Butter Fly
200m............. 200m Free + 200m Back + 200m Breast + 200 Butter Fly
400m............. 400m
800m/1500m... 800m/1500m
100/110m Hurdles.....200m Medley
400m Hurdles...........400m Medley
4x100m........... 4x100m Free + 4x100m Medley
4x400m........... 4x200m Free

They don't have 100m backwards or sideways running in athletics. Not sure if Bolt could win those.

The only event track athletes and field athletes swap between is Long Jump

The only field events that athletes double up in is the Discuss and Shot Put

So a 1:3 or 1:4 ratio is fair enough.

Edit: I should have in my post said a gold medal is a gold medal and equally worth the same which ever of the two sports you look at. But in swimming it is easier to do multiple evens compared to athletics. A sprinter in athletics might have a crack at 2 events + 1 relay and the absolute best will ad long jump to their events, but that is very rare - Owens, Blankers-Koern and Lewis are the only ones that readily come to mind. In swimming it might be 2 sprints + 2 or 3 relays.
 
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iluvparis said:
Has any male athlete ever done the flat/hurdles double over the equivalent distance at an Olympics?
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Nope. But you can check both Olympics and World Champs at the following links.

There has been a few hurdlers who have run in the relays who have done the double, most so 400m hurdlers over 110m. Kerron Clement of the USA had done it twice at 2 world championships. He was a 400m runner who took up hurdles and has one of the worst hurdling styles I've ever seen. I know he got Silver in Beijing in 400m hurdles and gold in relay. So that made me check Angelo Taylor who beat him in Beijng, he also ran the relay so he did that double.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_medalists_in_athletics_(men)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_Championships_in_Athletics_medalists_(men)
 
Gail Devers was the World 100m Hurdles champ a couple of times, but kept falling at the Olympics. She did win the flat 100M twice, however. Mid-late 90s. She was certainly good enough, but Hurdles is tough.

Harrison Dillard was a hurdler who was the World record holder in 1948. He missed qualifying for the Olympics, but qualified in the 100m. He won gold.
He came back in 52 and won the 110m Hurdles.

Triple and Long jumpers usually do both events right up until they reach World Champ/Olympic level, but then specialise in one or the other because the physical impact on the body is different. Nevertheless, in a one-off event, a world top 8 triple-jumper could probably pull out a top-8 long-jump.

Similar with Discus and shot-putters. It's only when you really specialise and do the specific pliometric weight-bearing exercises that they tend to fall off. It was common up to the 1950s (1960s for the women) for athletes to do both at Olympic level. It's still pretty common at most National levels.

I actually think there are too many Olympic track events. If you want to do sprints - there should be one sprint. Similar with middle- and Long distance. And field. I think we need to just find the best pure athletes. So we want the best sprinter, thrower, jumper.
So -
100m - keep
200m (my favourite event) - drop
400m - keep.
800m - drop.
1500m - keep.
5/10000m - choose one.
Marathon - keep.
110/100m Hurdles - keep
400m Hurdles (at which I have coached national junior reps) - drop
Steeple - drop - just do serious cross-country including jumps, hills, mud, sand etc.

Field
Long Jump - keep
TJ - drop (it's a track version of butterfly or backstroke)
Hj - keep (I think - keep either that or LJ - maybe get5r rid of LJ).
Shotput - keep
Jav - keep
Hammer - drop
discus - drop

I just think that there are far too many 'fiddle' events that are basically just a repeat of another event with a slight wrinkle - eg, slightly longer, some technical rules about what you can and can't do (you will notice I haven't mentioned walks at all:p). There is no justification in swimming to do anything except freestyle.

All the other events are great fun to do and train for - but it's hard to get too excited about 'The best In the world at "swimming while moving my arms in a particular way and only lifting my head in the approved manner".

Faster, Higher, stronger - not cleverer, more flexible, or trickier.
.
 
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Wallaby said:
Gail Devers was the World 100m Hurdles champ a couple of times, but kept falling at the Olympics. She did win the flat 100M twice, however. Mid-late 90s. She was certainly good enough, but Hurdles is tough.

Harrison Dillard was a hurdler who was the World record holder in 1948. He missed qualifying for the Olympics, but qualified in the 100m. He won gold.
He came back in 52 and won the 110m Hurdles.

Triple and Long jumpers usually do both events right up until they reach World Champ/Olympic level, but then specialise in one or the other because the physical impact on the body is different. Nevertheless, in a one-off event, a world top 8 triple-jumper could probably pull out a top-8 long-jump.

Similar with Discus and shot-putters. It's only when you really specialise and do the specific pliometric weight-bearing exercises that they tend to fall off. It was common up to the 1950s (1960s for the women) for athletes to do both at Olympic level. It's still pretty common at most National levels.

I actually think there are too many Olympic track events. If you want to do sprints - there should be one sprint. Similar with middle- and Long distance. And field. I think we need to just find the best pure athletes. So we want the best sprinter, thrower, jumper.
So -
100m - keep
200m (my favourite event) - drop
400m - keep.
800m - drop.
1500m - keep.
5/10000m - choose one.
Marathon - keep.
110/100m Hurdles - keep
400m Hurdles (at which I have coached national junior reps) - drop
Steeple - drop - just do serious cross-country including jumps, hills, mud, sand etc.

Field
Long Jump - keep
TJ - drop (it's a track version of butterfly or backstroke)
Hj - keep (I think - keep either that or LJ - maybe get5r rid of LJ).
Shotput - keep
Jav - keep
Hammer - drop
discus - drop

I just think that there are far too many 'fiddle' events that are basically just a repeat of another event with a slight wrinkle - eg, slightly longer, some technical rules about what you can and can't do (you will notice I haven't mentioned walks at all:p). There is no justification in swimming to do anything except freestyle.

All the other events are great fun to do and train for - but it's hard to get too excited about 'The best In the world at "swimming while moving my arms in a particular way and only lifting my head in the approved manner".

Faster, Higher, stronger - not cleverer, more flexible, or trickier.
.
Click to expand...
As opposed to novelty swimming events
 
Jack Gun Cyril Stun said:
How many Swimming medals equate to a track / field medal? About 1:3?? And so how does Bolt measure up v Phelps?
It's not like on the track you have the sprints offering medals for the sideways and backwards techniques and a medley to boot it's just get down the other end the fastest.
Click to expand...
1 athletics gold =8 swimming
 

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Wallaby said:
Gail Devers was the World 100m Hurdles champ a couple of times, but kept falling at the Olympics. She did win the flat 100M twice, however. Mid-late 90s. She was certainly good enough, but Hurdles is tough.

Harrison Dillard was a hurdler who was the World record holder in 1948. He missed qualifying for the Olympics, but qualified in the 100m. He won gold.
He came back in 52 and won the 110m Hurdles.

Triple and Long jumpers usually do both events right up until they reach World Champ/Olympic level, but then specialise in one or the other because the physical impact on the body is different. Nevertheless, in a one-off event, a world top 8 triple-jumper could probably pull out a top-8 long-jump.

Similar with Discus and shot-putters. It's only when you really specialise and do the specific pliometric weight-bearing exercises that they tend to fall off. It was common up to the 1950s (1960s for the women) for athletes to do both at Olympic level. It's still pretty common at most National levels.

I actually think there are too many Olympic track events. If you want to do sprints - there should be one sprint. Similar with middle- and Long distance. And field. I think we need to just find the best pure athletes. So we want the best sprinter, thrower, jumper.
So -
100m - keep
200m (my favourite event) - drop
400m - keep.
800m - drop.
1500m - keep.
5/10000m - choose one.
Marathon - keep.
110/100m Hurdles - keep
400m Hurdles (at which I have coached national junior reps) - drop
Steeple - drop - just do serious cross-country including jumps, hills, mud, sand etc.

Field
Long Jump - keep
TJ - drop (it's a track version of butterfly or backstroke)
Hj - keep (I think - keep either that or LJ - maybe get5r rid of LJ).
Shotput - keep
Jav - keep
Hammer - drop
discus - drop

I just think that there are far too many 'fiddle' events that are basically just a repeat of another event with a slight wrinkle - eg, slightly longer, some technical rules about what you can and can't do (you will notice I haven't mentioned walks at all:p). There is no justification in swimming to do anything except freestyle.

All the other events are great fun to do and train for - but it's hard to get too excited about 'The best In the world at "swimming while moving my arms in a particular way and only lifting my head in the approved manner".

Faster, Higher, stronger - not cleverer, more flexible, or trickier.
.
Click to expand...


Gee I reckon your harsh on the 200m and discus athletes!!
I enjoy the 200 nearly as much as the 100m not that is any revommendAtion.
But I don't mind the idea of basically doubling the distances from 100m so tick the 200,400,800,1500 and though not having been being a distance athlete I am still happy to watch the 5k and 10k.
Agree re the hammer throw and possibly triple jump as not sure you need 3 jumps, just go the high and long.

The 400m hurdles is an interesting one, I can't Edwin Moses out of my head so am swayed to favour it.

I like your idea re the cross country really incorporating all terrain and yes the walks are an embarrassment for mine, too techinal and honestly just run for ##### sake.
 
sydney eagle said:
Must be for humour value. If courage came into it they should have had Gabrielle Anderson-Schiesse (spelling ?) the Swiss marathon rummer who came last in 1984 !
Click to expand...
That was horrible to watch

Through my fingers. Just melting before our eyes. Also go back to ? 1908/12 Dorandro Petro. Similar circumstances to Scheisse
 
Gavin Excell said:
1 athletics gold =8 swimming
Click to expand...

I'd probably go this ratio too. Possibly be even greater, but from a different perspective. Running is natural for just about everyone on earth (let's forget smartass comparisons to disabled, people born without legs etc), whereas learning to swim, having access to lessons, pools etc isn't. Phelps is extraordinary. But if Bolt goes the 100m, 200m, that'll do me.
 
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