Prediction New player roles 2021

BlueJet

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Speaking of things SOS related...

I like JSOS to the backline.

He lacks the speed and agility to get separation in the forwardline. Lacks speed and endurance to be a full-time mid.

What he does have is footy smarts, he reads the ball well and plays with desperation. He has shown good defensive nous during his limited time spent tagging. He has good vision, nice skills too and can kick to advantage.

I think he'd be a good 3rd tall in the backline (as long as he's not playing on super quick players).

Granted he is competing with Plowman, Marchbank and Doc for that role of 3rd tall/defensive sweeper. But I think backline is what best suits his strengths and most hides his weaknesses.
Long term, I feel it's a defensive midfield role or bust for Jack.
Unfortunately he's relatively slow, isn't a great user of the footy, isn't exactly powerful and can be prone to fumbling, unfortunately I feel he'd be a liability down back, hopefully I'm proven wrong but from casting an eye over opposing forward lines, I struggle to find a favourable match up for him.
 

Doro

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I wouldn't mind seeing Dow spending some time across half back in the VFL. Might help him improve the defensive side of his game as he builds his tank.
 
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The question should be, if Cripps spends less time on fitness, midfield drills, contested ball - ie, he trains as a forward - would he still be a bad kick for goal from a set shot?

He's still training ostensibly as a midfielder. Wonder how much time midfielders devote to goalkicking over the course of a) a preseason and b) home and away training.

Our mids are terrible at taking set shots. Cripps Setters Curnow (Dow when he plays) are the chief culprits. It's holding Crippa back from becoming an even more dominant player because he is unable to finish off his good work and use his height mismatch to his advantage. We need a lot more scoreboard pressure from our midfield. To their credit Walsh and Gibbons have worked on their kicking for goal.
 
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He's already been confirmed to be playing down back again this year
I think it was also said that he would be getting 5-6 minutes at a time in the midfield as a bit of a spark, so that's anything thing to consider.

Assuming Willo will be playing on a wing for most the year, he could be the one to rotate with SPS or even Williams too.
 
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I like your post for a whole lot of reasons. But don’t forget the problem here... he can’t kick for goal. Not only that, try and name a player on the list you would less prefer kicking for goal. Liam Jones and Plowman are about the only two I can come up with. Yes, goal kicking can be taught (Casboult at times), but there’s something about his makeup which suggests that he’s very fragile in front of the big sticks.
Too much pressure on himself. Feels he 'has to' nail it everytime. Then, recalling everytime he has missed brings more pressure.

Add to that being knackered.
 

gbatman

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I can see McGovern being moved to defence. McGovern is a good footballer, has all the skill and athleticism but hasn't fitted into our forward line well. Not sure why, some guys just don't play other roles well and I think McGovern needs to be more of a focal point up forward to do well and with McKay, Casboult and Curnow later on that's going to be hard. It takes a lot of nouse to play that second or third fiddle and he may not have that.

I think as a backman he is an ideal 3rd tall defender. He'd be great dropping off as a lose man and intercepting but should be tall and athletic enough to be able to play on a range of opponents.

At this stage we have Plowman in this role. McGovern is considerably the better raw footballer than Plowman. Taller, quicker,more agile and better offensively. Plowman doesn't often get beaten but he does get exposed at times. Whether McGovern would be exposed is yet to be seen. I see McGovern being able to do what Plowman doesn't and that is zone off and intercept as well as not get exposed for pace or lack of height as Plowman does at times. Could Plowman play as a general defender rather than a third tall? That remains to be seen as well. I would think this would be unlikely as we would be looking for more run and attack from someone in this role.

This isn't an area we are desperate to upgrade on but is an area we could IMO.

O'Brien is another. Perhaps he is going to be a later maturing player but seeing Walsh and Newnes play wing and bring the physicality to the team that O'Brien doesn't makes it hard to see him find a spot in our team. We have a few small forward types on the list now but I was thinking perhaps this could be a new role for O'Brien. He's skilled, quick and has endurance and he's kicked a few nice goals over his time. Forward line might be the role for him as a hard running high half forward or as a close to goal pressure forward type who kicks the odd goal a game. It's worth a shot. He's got talent and athletic ability but he lacks physicality.

Owies into the centre. He's built well enough for it and he has some nice skills. A basketball background doesn't hurt as it helps with spatial awareness, or at least it can. I just see him as someone who could contribute in the middle. I know you have to be tough and have the intensity to play in the centre but that needs to be tested out. He kicks goals in the reserves but he kicks them in ways which I can't see him getting them at AFL level. There is talent there and he looks like a footballer, perhaps there's another role he can fulfil. Possibly even defensive? Not that we are looking for more backmen.

Cripps. I would like Cripps to scrap the whole lose weight and stay lean approach and go the more Dustin Martin approach. Embrace his size and strength and become a more impact player. There were times last season where we were better around the ball without Cripps. The West Coast game comes to mind. With Cripps in there we are very reliant on him winning the ball and we are predictable. With him out of there we are playing more an unpredictable team game and sometimes that works better. We have drafted a hoard of young onballers and for their development, it's going to be tough if they are standing at a contest and the ball rarely goes to them. It's going to be hard to develop offensive onballers if they are always being defensive at stoppages. So what do I want to do with Cripps? It's clear he's good at winning the ball as a forward however his kicking needs to improve and it will if he trains in that area. His technique is fine. IMO if things work well for us we could have a dominant onball group without Cripps. All these talented centermen we have drafted, we should be strong in that area. Play Cripps forward a lot more and use him as a big strong impact player in both the forward line and center much as Richmond use Martin. Let Setterfield, Curnow, Kennedy, Stocker, Dow, Walsh, Kemp, Williams, Philp (2022 free agents) go into the centre and win more ball.
 

skadoosh

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I can see McGovern being moved to defence. McGovern is a good footballer, has all the skill and athleticism but hasn't fitted into our forward line well. Not sure why, some guys just don't play other roles well and I think McGovern needs to be more of a focal point up forward to do well and with McKay, Casboult and Curnow later on that's going to be hard. It takes a lot of nouse to play that second or third fiddle and he may not have that.

I think as a backman he is an ideal 3rd tall defender. He'd be great dropping off as a lose man and intercepting but should be tall and athletic enough to be able to play on a range of opponents.

At this stage we have Plowman in this role. McGovern is considerably the better raw footballer than Plowman. Taller, quicker,more agile and better offensively. Plowman doesn't often get beaten but he does get exposed at times. Whether McGovern would be exposed is yet to be seen. I see McGovern being able to do what Plowman doesn't and that is zone off and intercept as well as not get exposed for pace or lack of height as Plowman does at times. Could Plowman play as a general defender rather than a third tall? That remains to be seen as well. I would think this would be unlikely as we would be looking for more run and attack from someone in this role.

This isn't an area we are desperate to upgrade on but is an area we could IMO.

O'Brien is another. Perhaps he is going to be a later maturing player but seeing Walsh and Newnes play wing and bring the physicality to the team that O'Brien doesn't makes it hard to see him find a spot in our team. We have a few small forward types on the list now but I was thinking perhaps this could be a new role for O'Brien. He's skilled, quick and has endurance and he's kicked a few nice goals over his time. Forward line might be the role for him as a hard running high half forward or as a close to goal pressure forward type who kicks the odd goal a game. It's worth a shot. He's got talent and athletic ability but he lacks physicality.

Owies into the centre. He's built well enough for it and he has some nice skills. A basketball background doesn't hurt as it helps with spatial awareness, or at least it can. I just see him as someone who could contribute in the middle. I know you have to be tough and have the intensity to play in the centre but that needs to be tested out. He kicks goals in the reserves but he kicks them in ways which I can't see him getting them at AFL level. There is talent there and he looks like a footballer, perhaps there's another role he can fulfil. Possibly even defensive? Not that we are looking for more backmen.

Cripps. I would like Cripps to scrap the whole lose weight and stay lean approach and go the more Dustin Martin approach. Embrace his size and strength and become a more impact player. There were times last season where we were better around the ball without Cripps. The West Coast game comes to mind. With Cripps in there we are very reliant on him winning the ball and we are predictable. With him out of there we are playing more an unpredictable team game and sometimes that works better. We have drafted a hoard of young onballers and for their development, it's going to be tough if they are standing at a contest and the ball rarely goes to them. It's going to be hard to develop offensive onballers if they are always being defensive at stoppages. So what do I want to do with Cripps? It's clear he's good at winning the ball as a forward however his kicking needs to improve and it will if he trains in that area. His technique is fine. IMO if things work well for us we could have a dominant onball group without Cripps. All these talented centermen we have drafted, we should be strong in that area. Play Cripps forward a lot more and use him as a big strong impact player in both the forward line and center much as Richmond use Martin. Let Setterfield, Curnow, Kennedy, Stocker, Dow, Walsh, Kemp, Williams, Philp (2022 free agents) go into the centre and win more ball.
Plowman - Jones - McGovern
Doc - Weitering - Saad

Samo to bench and Williamson to wing. Does this work?
 
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I don't see Gov becoming a permanent defender. He'll play forward as the third tall but has the capacity to move back if we need him mid game due to injury/matchup issues, maybe the occasional whole game if we're short down back.

Samo will play hbf with a few minutes moving higher up the ground. That's already been established by Amos.

I like Cripps forward when he roams in briefly, starting in the midfield, catching defenders out when he moves forward. Not so much the Dusty role, where he's pretty much a forward who attends centre bounces. Cripps' best work is as a midfielder, let him play as a midfielder.

I think the same of Danger, all this talk of him being a good forward... can take a mark, can't kick for goal... he's twice the player as a midfielder. I think the same of Cripps. Play as a pure inside mid and when opportunity arises, get forward, clunk a mark and have a shot.

If the talk is to 'rest' him forward for large parts of the game, I'd probably rather limit those forward stints to a few minutes at a time and let him spend more time on the bench where he can actually rest before returning to the field to have an impact.
 
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I can see McGovern being moved to defence. McGovern is a good footballer, has all the skill and athleticism but hasn't fitted into our forward line well. Not sure why, some guys just don't play other roles well and I think McGovern needs to be more of a focal point up forward to do well and with McKay, Casboult and Curnow later on that's going to be hard. It takes a lot of nouse to play that second or third fiddle and he may not have that.

I think as a backman he is an ideal 3rd tall defender. He'd be great dropping off as a lose man and intercepting but should be tall and athletic enough to be able to play on a range of opponents.

Owies into the centre. He's built well enough for it and he has some nice skills. A basketball background doesn't hurt as it helps with spatial awareness, or at least it can. I just see him as someone who could contribute in the middle.
Nice post, really interesting stuff.

Personally, I have big doubts about Charlie. Even if he was to play again at senior level I just don't see it being a long term thing, so right now we shouldn't be working around him. Also, Casboult probably only has 2 or so years left in him, so if we aren't playing Gov up forward we need to find another KPF.

If McGovern was to be moved into defence, who's spot would he take? Along with our 2 KPDs, Marchbank and Plowman are at that medium size and can easily take the 3rd tall.

Similar stuff goes for Owies, who's spot would he take in the midfield? Walsh, Williams, SPS, Murphy, Cunners, Carroll, Willo, Philp, O'Brien and Fogarty seems like a really solid amount of wingers/outside mids which he would need to beat in order to crack into the team.

Either way, should be cool to watch what the coaches come up with in 2021!
 
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I don’t think there will be too many, Teague seems pretty sure of the structure he wants already. The team didn’t change a real lot last year from the 22 that we played in round one.

Williamson is one who could see a change. The wing role under Teague is a gut running role where you stay back from the contest and get ready to sprint either forward or back as required. If our defence can cover the loss of him this role would suit Williamson well.

I would still like to have a third tall defender in an intercept marking role, especially as we are prone to some big lapses during games where the opposition get right on top of us and the ball goes into their forward line with ease. If Marchbank doesn’t make it back you could definitely see McGovern getting a chance there.

The last one is not an individual player but a team thing, last year to me it seemed we played a four man on ball rotation and a three man wing rotation. I like the wing rotation but I really thought we cost ourselves with the midfielders not being given enough rest, they were ****ed at the end of the year and it’s also not like we had a forward line full of Stephen Milne types. Fisher, Cuningham, Gibbons and Martin were all capable of playing more midfield minutes but instead we generally let four blokes do the work of 6-7. I’d like to see our midfielders rotate more often with our forwards next year.
 

gbatman

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Nice post, really interesting stuff.

Personally, I have big doubts about Charlie. Even if he was to play again at senior level I just don't see it being a long term thing, so right now we shouldn't be working around him. Also, Casboult probably only has 2 or so years left in him, so if we aren't playing Gov up forward we need to find another KPF.

If McGovern was to be moved into defence, who's spot would he take? Along with our 2 KPDs, Marchbank and Plowman are at that medium size and can easily take the 3rd tall.

Similar stuff goes for Owies, who's spot would he take in the midfield? Walsh, Williams, SPS, Murphy, Cunners, Carroll, Willo, Philp, O'Brien and Fogarty seems like a really solid amount of wingers/outside mids which he would need to beat in order to crack into the team.

Either way, should be cool to watch what the coaches come up with in 2021!

I don't have doubts about Curnow. He'll be back and he'll be very good.

McGovern takes Plowman's role. Taller, quicker, better natural football ability, better offensive capabilities. An upgrade IMO but that is purely on potential and is yet to be proven. Plowman goes onto a smaller role but most likely gets pushed out of that by quicker more offensive players like Saad, Docherty, Williamson, SPS, Newman etc.

Marchbank plays as a 4th tall and running defender. He's an elite runner who is strong in the air. Weitering, Jones, McGovern, Marchbank. Two KPP. Two tall mobile and quick pockets. Rotate three running half backs. Docherty, Saad and another and that's very similar to many premiership backlines I have seen. Richmond recently. Collingwood 2010 just off the top of my head.

McGovern needs to be a main focus if up forward or play in defence.

Owies to play on the ball in the reserves first. If he goes well enough then we look at a senior spot.

Coaches will reward effort, competitiveness and results. Players need to go up a gear and we could be a big deal again.
 
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I don't have doubts about Curnow. He'll be back and he'll be very good.

McGovern takes Plowman's role. Taller, quicker, better natural football ability, better offensive capabilities. An upgrade IMO but that is purely on potential and is yet to be proven. Plowman goes onto a smaller role but most likely gets pushed out of that by quicker more offensive players like Saad, Docherty, Williamson, SPS, Newman etc.

Marchbank plays as a 4th tall and running defender. He's an elite runner who is strong in the air. Weitering, Jones, McGovern, Marchbank. Two KPP. Two tall mobile and quick pockets. Rotate three running half backs. Docherty, Saad and another and that's very similar to many premiership backlines I have seen. Richmond recently. Collingwood 2010 just off the top of my head.

McGovern needs to be a main focus if up forward or play in defence.

Owies to play on the ball in the reserves first. If he goes well enough then we look at a senior spot.

Coaches will reward effort, competitiveness and results. Players need to go up a gear and we could be a big deal again.

If Gov goes back, can't see him taking Plow's role, more likely Marchbank's role

Personally, I believe Teague will want Gov as a forward
 

gbatman

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Plowman - Jones - McGovern
Doc - Weitering - Saad

Samo to bench and Williamson to wing. Does this work?

The idea of a fast and tall defence who rotates the half backline interests me. I want to see it tried.

McGovern Weitering Marchband
Docherty Jones Saad

One of: SPS Williamson Newman

Beat them in the air, beat them for speed. Defend hard.

I've seen teams win flags with a similar structured defence. Richmond for one. Those tall guys who are not KPP who have pace and can run have a big offensive and defensive role to play IMO they offer a big advantage.
 

gbatman

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If Gov goes back, can't see him taking Plow's role, more likely Marchbank's role

Personally, I believe Teague will want Gov as a forward

He might but it has to work and it hasn't been. If it's not working you have a very talented player, more talented than Plowman being wasted.

However, in the theme of this thread if McGovern does play forward I want him to be second ruck. That is in a future team with McKay, Curnow and no Casboult.
 
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He might but it has to work and it hasn't been. If it's not working you have a very talented player, more talented than Plowman being wasted.

However, in the theme of this thread if McGovern does play forward I want him to be second ruck. That is in a future team with McKay, Curnow and no Casboult.

I don't think Gov has the commitment, discipline and concentration levels to force Plow out

Casboult is still a valuable, durable banger, much more than Gov has ever shown in terms a chopout ruck

Hopefully the club adds Marsh, who I see as a versatile player, similar to McIntosh at the Tigers, who would be a better replacement for Levi
 

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My role change is around Cripps to the forward line. Not a 100% complete move but a higher split of times. Eventually I’d rather the split was more forward. Either this year or next year I’d like to see him train with forwards.

Why?
Cripps is a strong mid from an attacking viewpoint. He can’t stop midfield rebound....like at all. Opposition teams are getting smarter by showing him up defensively. He has no speed and can’t turn. The agility you have at 20 for big guys starts to reduce mid 20s. Anyone notice over last three seasons the club says how they are slimming him down but to the naked eye he is slower again season on season (always looks banged up now). Strategically as an opposition coach...I would get the ball into either Marc. Murphy or Cripps direct opponent. From there it is a free kick inside 50. Cripps is still amazing on the attacking side Of things.

As a player and clubman, he is determined and team orientated. If you ask him to play KPF he will learn that craft 100%. Right now he is just been thrown fwd for spells.

We have a gap there right now with c curnow out. JSOS, McGovern and Kennedy, all lack the centremetres to a degree For the role. Casbault I get but the truth is he is just Too unreliable. I raved about him for three weeks early in the season, then I never saw him impact at all second half of season. Id prefer Cripps gets a shot As the second tall.

I think the midfield characteristics require running, tackling and efficient kicking. Some other stuff as well but those basics are non negotiable. As barker indicated, sometimes another mix of midfielders in there gave us a better outcome.
Cripps contested ball winning and handball vision are phenomenal
In finals this will be massive
 
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He might but it has to work and it hasn't been. If it's not working you have a very talented player, more talented than Plowman being wasted.

However, in the theme of this thread if McGovern does play forward I want him to be second ruck. That is in a future team with McKay, Curnow and no Casboult.
McGovern in the ruck? At only 190cm he's going to be up against opposition ruckman 10-15cm taller.

I think Teague mentioned that McKay will be doing some ruck work over the pre-season, so I would much prefer that.

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I don't have doubts about Curnow. He'll be back and he'll be very good.

McGovern takes Plowman's role. Taller, quicker, better natural football ability, better offensive capabilities. An upgrade IMO but that is purely on potential and is yet to be proven. Plowman goes onto a smaller role but most likely gets pushed out of that by quicker more offensive players like Saad, Docherty, Williamson, SPS, Newman etc.

Marchbank plays as a 4th tall and running defender. He's an elite runner who is strong in the air. Weitering, Jones, McGovern, Marchbank. Two KPP. Two tall mobile and quick pockets. Rotate three running half backs. Docherty, Saad and another and that's very similar to many premiership backlines I have seen. Richmond recently. Collingwood 2010 just off the top of my head.

McGovern needs to be a main focus if up forward or play in defence.

Owies to play on the ball in the reserves first. If he goes well enough then we look at a senior spot.

Coaches will reward effort, competitiveness and results. Players need to go up a gear and we could be a big deal again.
At no time has Brackets shown he is fit, durable or willing to work himself to exhaustion to help out team mates, all the things that Plowman brings week in week out.

You are saying he could be a better option than Plowman based on potential? This is the Plowman that finishes consistently inside the top 5 in our B&F and held Danger, Dusty, Papley, Cameron, Butler and Gray to one goal between them ... albeit that Gray goal was costly after a bad turnover on the wing from our mids.

Plowman doesn’t have the raw top speed of Brackets but runs midfielder distances, McGovern won’t get to choose when he rests in defense, he will need to almost double his running capacity to get close.

Plowman is durable, McGovern broke down consistently last season leaving us one short in several games. When this happens in defence then Weitering and Jones will have to play 100% game time.

Would rather our defenders be capable of defending, not picked because their instinct is to attack. Saad is the offensive weapon out of defence, capably supported by Doc and SPS ... Weitering no slouch either. Plowman is the guy that covers these attacking moves so we at least provide a contest after a turnover. If Brackets joins in the attacks, it leaves us dangerously exposed on the turnover.

Seen nothing from McGovern that suggests he has the ability to sacrifice his own game to shut someone else out of the contest or is willing to work hard enough both physically and mentally for an entire game. Can’t pick and choose when to chase in defense.

If ... and this is a huge if ... McGovern becomes an upgraded defensive option for Plowman, sides will find it almost impossible to score against us. There would be at least a dozen sides that would offer Plowman a contract if, despite the pivotal role he plays for us, he was pushed out of the senior side.
 
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At no time has Brackets shown he is fit, durable or willing to work himself to exhaustion to help out team mates, all the things that Plowman brings week in week out.

You are saying he could be a better option than Plowman based on potential? This is the Plowman that finishes consistently inside the top 5 in our B&F and held Danger, Dusty, Papley, Cameron, Butler and Gray to one goal between them ... albeit that Gray goal was costly after a bad turnover on the wing from our mids.

Plowman doesn’t have the raw top speed of Brackets but runs midfielder distances, McGovern won’t get to choose when he rests in defense, he will need to almost double his running capacity to get close.

Plowman is durable, McGovern broke down consistently last season leaving us one short in several games. When this happens in defence then Weitering and Jones will have to play 100% game time.

Would rather our defenders be capable of defending, not picked because their instinct is to attack. Saad is the offensive weapon out of defence, capably supported by Doc and SPS ... Weitering no slouch either. Plowman is the guy that covers these attacking moves so we at least provide a contest after a turnover. If Brackets joins in the attacks, it leaves us dangerously exposed on the turnover.

Seen nothing from McGovern that suggests he has the ability to sacrifice his own game to shut someone else out of the contest or is willing to work hard enough both physically and mentally for an entire game. Can’t pick and choose when to chase in defense.

If ... and this is a huge if ... McGovern becomes an upgraded defensive option for Plowman, sides will find it almost impossible to score against us. There would be at least a dozen sides that would offer Plowman a contract if, despite the pivotal role he plays for us, he was pushed out of the senior side.

There is no chance McGovern displaces Plowman in defence.
Getting Saad and Williams and Marchbank back into the team makes Plowman even more important as a pure lockdown defender which he does well.

If Gov can’t get a game in our forward line there is no chance he gets a game in our backline.

He’s fighting it out as the third tall and that’s it. He’s not a lock for mine. I like Jack Martin as a marking/roving forward option and Jack can play there too. When Charlie comes back then there’s the option of Levi as the third tall relief ruck option as well. Big year coming up for McGovern if he wants to stay at the club
 
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