New sub rule - Strategies

[Jelly Bean]

Keeping things simple.

1. Changes to the Premiership 22 IMO: Out:T.Goldsack, J.Blair, B.Johnson.
In: C.Tarrant, B.Dick, A.Krakouer.

2. Sub Player IMO: C.Tarrant for a variety of reasons.

B: A.Toovey N.Brown N.Maxwell
HB:H.O'Brien B.Reid H.Shaw
C: D.Thomas S.Pendlebury S.Wellingham
HF:A.Didak T.Cloke D.Beams
F: B.Dick C.Dawes S.Sidebottom
R: D.Jolly D.Swan L.Ball
INT: B.Macaffer A.Krakouer L.Brown
SUB:C.Tarrant
EMERG: B.Johnson L.Davis T.Goldsack

Forgetting about the positions, I almost entirely agree with the 22, except that I have L Davis in and L Brown out (I think that we will need to be one player smaller this year).

For mine, Tarrant is clearly best 18, and as stated, I feel the sub needs to be someone who is capable of providing fresh legs where we would most need those fresh legs (in the instance there is no injury) and that is midfield. So the sub would be the lowest ranked midfielder in the side on the day.

Tarrant should be in our forward line.

 

[Swooop]

Forgetting about the positions, I almost entirely agree with the 22, except that I have L Davis in and L Brown out (I think that we will need to be one player smaller this year).
.

I'm interested you seem to be a big fan of Leon.

I didn't think he was good enough last year and TBH didn't really buy this forward pressure notion.

I thiught he looked an old man out of his depth in the finals that he played.

Of course, his apparent loss of speed could have been due to injury, which I suspect it was, given the speed of the decline.

But is the injury chronic degenerative ie won't recover to any significant degree or something more remediable...

Not sure if you know more than I re this situation, but interested to hear your take on young Leon and his merits

 

[Takahashi Tank]

Cheers Jelly Bean

A few points though mate.

1. L.Brown is the perfect forward/pinch hit ruckman and IMO should not be out of the 21 at all as Jolly needs support and Dawes etc should not be used.

2. C.Tarrant IMO in the side I posted above IMO makes the team too tall so gets the SUB role as he is definitely best 22, but really the sub role should be for a mf like Leon or Bj or Goldi.

Quite the paradox.

 

[Subtemperate]

Malthouse is a horses for courses coach, no doubt the 22 would be different depending on who we play. Tarrant would be in the best 21 I feel... and whilst you could debate whether he could play defense or forward.... I think he has the ability to play on a wing too.... So his ability to play pretty much anywhere makes him a certainty.

It would definately be a midfielder if I was coach.... they think that this will limit rotations... and if you an injury to a midfielder and only have a tall as sub... your midfield will suffer.... so I can't see it being a tall.... We have enough talls to move about without having one as sub.

So really I couldn't call who would be left out... but I would just say it will change constantly....

 

[Ed D]

That round 19 win against Geelong is a good example of how the Pies can play with a midfielder type sub, even if a tall goes down. We lost Reid halfway through the 1st qtr and ended up running Geelong off their feet.

 

[Swooop]

'Next best mid' will likely be it on balance, agree.

With the injury scenario; to cover KPP's injuries, there should be sufficicent flexibilty in the team to juggle positioning, to allow an extra mid to come on as a sub. And if it was mid who got injured, then better still to have a mid as the sub.

You'd prefer to replace an injured tall/medium tall with a mid, than replace an injured mid with a tall/medium tall, in general.

Without the injury scenario; a fresh mid would be the most destructive as a fresh pair of legs later in the game you'd think.

 

[Jelly Bean]

I'm interested you seem to be a big fan of Leon.

I didn't think he was good enough last year and TBH didn't really buy this forward pressure notion.

I thiught he looked an old man out of his depth in the finals that he played.

Of course, his apparent loss of speed could have been due to injury, which I suspect it was, given the speed of the decline.

But is the injury chronic degenerative ie won't recover to any significant degree or something more remediable...

Not sure if you know more than I re this situation, but interested to hear your take on young Leon and his merits

Yeah, maybe I am one of Leon's last true believers, and I was calling for his head after the first GF, but he often seems just a few percent off doing something special.

And I can't get his 09 performances out of my head. His all round footskills are around the best in the club, and if he can get back towards his 09 form, he is extremely valuable.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Cheers Jelly Bean

A few points though mate.

1. L.Brown is the perfect forward/pinch hit ruckman and IMO should not be out of the 21 at all as Jolly needs support and Dawes etc should not be used.

2. C.Tarrant IMO in the side I posted above IMO makes the team too tall so gets the SUB role as he is definitely best 22, but really the sub role should be for a mf like Leon or Bj or Goldi.

Quite the paradox.

Fair enough on L Brown, but in my view that means Dawes then is dropped. Tarrant should be in.

Our tall forward set up should contain two primary marking targets and a resting ruckman. Cloke is obviously one of those marking targets.

My argument is that Tarrant is our next best one, and either Brown or Dawes fill the forward / resting ruckman role. I am not too picky either way which one of these it is, but I am firm that Tarrant in our forwardline will make our side better.

And I definitely feel that our sub will be a running player, as I have been saying.

 

[Swooop]

Yeah, maybe I am one of Leon's last true believers, and I was calling for his head after the first GF, but he often seems just a few percent off doing something special.

And I can't get his 09 performances out of my head. His all round footskills are around the best in the club, and if he can get back towards his 09 form, he is extremely valuable.

Thanks Jelly Bean.

He has dazzled us with his skills for years and we still get the odd dazzle here and there, but as you say yourself, he often seems a few percent off doing that something special.

I was much happier with Goldy being picked instead for GF2 being a more 'workman-like' player, a guaranteed 12-14 possessions, rather than 2-8 possies, one of which was dazzling.

TBH, I doubt he'll get many games at all this year, barring injuries or unless he was injured in 2010 and he shakes that injury, regaining his 09 form which was sublime.

 

[JollyBallsUp]

Thanks Jelly Bean.

He has dazzled us with his skills for years and we still get the odd dazzle here and there, but as you say yourself, he often seems a few percent off doing that something special.

I was much happier with Goldy being picked instead for GF2 being a more 'workman-like' player, a guaranteed 12-14 possessions, rather than 2-8 possies, one of which was dazzling.

TBH, I doubt he'll get many games at all this year, barring injuries or unless he was injured in 2010 and he shakes that injury, regaining his 09 form which was sublime.

I have heard that he has been baltling groin problems all of last season. Not sure how true this is but it it were to be correct than it would explain his lack of speed at time last season.

I also agree that he will be hard pressed to be a regular in this years team. Much like Lockyer last season you would think, unless injuries hit the club.

 

[Quicky]

Horses for courses.

It won't be a set position. It will be rotated weekly depending on the opposition and used to give us the best chance of winning.

I do see benefits in perhaps allowing some of our players to have a "rest" or "half-days" against certain sides for freshness throughout the season or upon return from say injuiry to ease them back into things but there is no way known that we will have the same sub in our line-up every week.

As for the mention and discussion of Tarrant, he is definitely best 18 or 21 for mine but he will probably at some stage go through the sub position as part of MM's rotating selection policy. Ditto Macaffer and Wellingham.

This. It will almost surely be rotated throughout the year depending on match ups and the opposition. This was the trend last year with our selection and I don't see it changing with the sub rule. The beauty of our team is that we have alot of players with positional flexibility. I agree with Jelly Bean that the sub will trend towards flexible midfield types.

'Next best mid' will likely be it on balance, agree.

With the injury scenario; to cover KPP's injuries, there should be sufficicent flexibilty in the team to juggle positioning, to allow an extra mid to come on as a sub. And if it was mid who got injured, then better still to have a mid as the sub.

You'd prefer to replace an injured tall/medium tall with a mid, than replace an injured mid with a tall/medium tall, in general.

Without the injury scenario; a fresh mid would be the most destructive as a fresh pair of legs later in the game you'd think.

I agree with this also. If we were to go down a tall it would be easier for us to cover that area from within the team. Maxy, Goldy, Harry, Macaffer could all be utilised in taller roles if required due to an injury to a KPP. It would be harder to replace the run of a small with a tall utility type which would be a massive disadvantage the way footy is being played atm.

 

[Swooop]

I have heard that he has been baltling groin problems all of last season. Not sure how true this is but it it were to be correct than it would explain his lack of speed at time last season.

Only really Leon and the club would know, but I think groin issues are the most likely as you say.

He looks like he shuffles at a fast pace, ie he can't 'lift his legs' properly.This mainly comes from a problem from the hip flexors round the groin area.

He wears those tight cycle pants things under his footy shorts, again this makes me think the problem is that area.

If so, there may be some hope that he can recover form this and regain his former pace.

If that were the case, then maybe Leon himself might make a reasonable sub option. But he needs his pace back, on last years form, he'd struggle.