NFL New to NFL - Please Explain

[haterade]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

It was a perfect pass, there wasnt much the defenders can do as far as playing the ball. In retrospect, the only chance they had was to go after the receiver ( instead of going after the ball) and push him out of bounds before his feet touched inside the endzone.

 

[thebigboy]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

The real question should be how are there 3 defenders in the corner of the enzone and none of them think to play tight on Santonio Holmes.

 

[greennick]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

No, the real question is why didn't Ben throw it to an open Heath Miller in the middle of the end zone?

Santonio was the 3rd option on the play.

The first was Ward (fell to the ground underneath some players), the second was Moore (was covered earlier, but open a few yards out by the time Ben threw it).

Miller was the fourth option and was wide open. He would have been the best option at the time, however I think it is always hard to see the options right in front of you on a football field.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

One card player raised his arm trying to tip the ball as it flew into Holmes, the second card player stumbled and the third card player you see actually trying to punch the ball out of Holmes hands as he reaches Holmes and the ball enters Holmes hands. It's in the replay in slo-mo.

 

[mcgarnacle]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

it appears as though there's 3 defenders on him, but in the vid, the shot pans to the endzone after Roeth has thrown the ball. The defenders would have been in their zone/man responsibilities directly after snap and then responded to Roeth's fakes. He initially looks to go to the RB in flats on the right, then a pump to the outside receiver running a hook down the seam, then he looks to the left of scrimmage before going to Holmes in the corner back on the right. Roeth's eyes would have been darting all over the place given the shifting in his body......after all he had 5 receiving options immediately after the snap. neither the TE or RB started in pass protection. lucky there was no LB blitz. just one could have broken the play down. From that vid, Holmes looks to be option #4. a QBs eyes and his body shifts affect the movement of a defender in pass coverage.

 

[Wizard]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Should have had Benny Graham in as a DB, he could have saved the day.

Pffffft!!!!!

 

[Woodson]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

lucky there was no LB blitz. just one could have broken the play down. From that vid, Holmes looks to be option #4. a QBs eyes and his body shifts affect the movement of a defender in pass coverage.

Extraordinary really. No pass rush. On the flipside, I have no doubt had the Steelers not pass rushed Warner on that last pass, could of easily been a cliff hanger finish of all finale's. Definately a fumble. Woodley playing like a vet already. That was ONE heck of a SPOIL right there!!!

 

[Wizard]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Extraordinary really. No pass rush. On the flipside, I have no doubt had the Steelers not pass rushed Warner on that last pass, could of easily been a cliff hanger finish of all finale's. Definately a fumble. Woodley playing like a vet already. That was ONE heck of a SPOIL right there!!!

Definately a fumble my ass.

 

[Paradiso]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Extraordinary really. No pass rush. On the flipside, I have no doubt had the Steelers not pass rushed Warner on that last pass, could of easily been a cliff hanger finish of all finale's. Definately a fumble. Woodley playing like a vet already. That was ONE heck of a SPOIL right there!!!

Wow... You really thought that was a fumble? The homerism is shining through Woody

 

[Woodson]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Wow... You really thought that was a fumble? The homerism is shining through Woody

I'm referring to the last one. The other one was a poor second guess that even at the time I wasn't convinced the initial call was correct and Whisenhunt challenged and got it reversed. No issues there.

One more thing is that Gandy was the 'weak link' exposed on the Cards O-line. Silverback (#92) has been denied holding calls for much of the season and they found Gandy out.. even when the flag went up I was holliering ...Gaaaaaannndy, Gaaaaaandy, Good one Gandy.

Being in the know to when it's a fumble as opposed to having the ball jarred lose while the eyes are looking for a target and no forward motion while the O-line exploited once again is just something the Cards couldn't overcome. Defense Wins Championships. Simple as that.

 

[mcgarnacle]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Definately a fumble my ass.

the first one earlier in the game that was reviewed was definately not a fumble, but the one on the last Cardinals offensive play was, IMO.

Really Wiz, it comes down to the foul on the holder, which IMO was also there. same result for Pittsburgh but they got to take off time from the clock. this resulted in the Cardinals having less time to respond to the Steelers last TD, needing to take timeouts on each play, and then needing to go the hail mary before they needed too had the holder not been fouled. and i reckon the cards wouldve got them too. they were moving the ball very well in the 4th qtr. but its all hypo's now.

 

[greennick]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Definately a fumble my ass.

The final one?

That definitely was a fumble. The commentators (both NBC and ESPN), the referees, the replay referee, everyone on ESPN since, the VP of officiating, all agree it was clearly a fumble. I think the only ones who don't are Cards fans!

The 3rd quarter one definitely was not, when watching the game I told everyone I would challenge it. Nor surprise it was reviewed and reversed.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

If the Steelers were the Raiders in that game, and that last second "fumble" went to the booth, you can bet your ass it would've been overturned as an incomplete pass, and Pereira and the NFL spin-doctoring machine would've all said "yes it was an incomplete pass". Why? Because it's an INTERPRETATION, a "judgment" call.

In fact, the Holmes TD would've been "incomplete", the roughing the holder would've been ignored, and the endzone celebration would've been flagged if they didnt rule it incomplete which they would have.

 

[greennick]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

For those who want a breakdown of the Holmes TD:

http://www.nfl.com/partner?partnerType=game-of-the-week&season=2008&seasonType=REG&week=21

click on "Anatonmy of a Play"

Is a great run down on why the play worked.

 

[Woodson]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

If the Steelers were the Raiders in that game, and that last second "fumble" went to the booth, you can bet your ass it would've been overturned as an incomplete pass, and Pereira and the NFL spin-doctoring machine would've all said "yes it was an incomplete pass". Why? Because it's an INTERPRETATION, a "judgment" call.

In fact, the Holmes TD would've been "incomplete", the roughing the holder would've been ignored, and the endzone celebration would've been flagged if they didnt rule it incomplete which they would have.

I don't think you are being fair dinkum on that latter comment GG. It's clear as daylight that Holmes feet are down and possession of ball in the hands of the MVP. It's just clear that you didn't want the Steelers to win so Steelers fans on this forum wouldn't have 'debate points' to claim when you go hunting for facts. You can still be the Conspiracy Captain of the forum. That I can't deny you GG.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Did I say it wasnt? Just that if that were the Raiders, the calls would be different.

 

[Woodson]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

Did I say it wasnt? Just that if that were the Raiders, the calls would be different.

what I was referring to was that you really think if Holmes wore a Raiders guernsey on that same play, it would be seen different?? Conspiracy all the way.. in that case. But I truly believe once AD passes on, the Raiders will be 'embraced' by the NFL.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

It may be difficult, but watch some Raiders games and you'll understand/see.
It's not a myth.

 

[greennick]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

It may be difficult, but watch some Raiders games and you'll understand/see.
It's not a myth.

The immaculate reception was the right call!

 

[Exe Gesis]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

The rules at the time, it was not a right call.
Also, as John Madden himself has asserted to this day, the officials never signaled a TD. Never even made a "call". They just telephoned about security and ran off the field.

 

[greennick]

Re: Question - In the NFL are they allowed to spoil the ball?

The rules at the time, it was not a right call.
Also, as John Madden himself has asserted to this day, the officials never signaled a TD. Never even made a "call". They just telephoned about security and ran off the field.

John Madden is just bitter.

I am going to start a thread on this so we can debate it.

 

[greennick]

Why are Left-Tackles More Important than Right-Tackles?

Why is that so? Why are Left Tackles worth so much more than Right Tackles? Or more pertinently, why are decent Left Tackles so much more rare than decent Right Tackles??

 

[fuey]

Re: Lt > rt

Why is that so? Why are Left Tackles worth so much more than Right Tackles? Or more pertinently, why are decent Left Tackles so much more rare than decent Right Tackles??

SImply, the LT protects the blindside (in most cases, obviously it switches for lefties, where the RT is more important).

If a DE comes around the RT, the QB is more likely to see it coming, and will be able to take action, whether that be scramble or brace for a big hit.

A QB gets hit from behind and without warning, they'll be in a world of pain (for the game, next week, all season???), cos we all know how much defenders love to hit QBs legally, and if they have that chance they'll make sure they get their money's worth.

 

[greennick]

Re: Lt > rt

Why can't players switch between LT and RT then? I would have thought they would have similar skills.

 

[footylover18]

Re: Lt > rt

Why is that so? Why are Left Tackles worth so much more than Right Tackles? Or more pertinently, why are decent Left Tackles so much more rare than decent Right Tackles??

It's not that left tackles are so rare, it's that great great tackles are rare. someone who has the skill set to become an awesome tackle will invariably be groomed on the left side, since that is the side that is more important (as explained by fuey).

If you're interested in this i recommend a book by Michael Lewis called "The Blind Side". Awesome book.