No More Excuses About Where The Grand Final Is

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Pappagallo

GFG - Good For Good
Jun 12, 2012
17,783
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Afraid not......Grand Final will be at the MCG until 2057.

As it should be.

You're in our competition......remember that.

Be grateful you got an invitation.

You're welcome to leave at anytime.

God bless.
This should be engraved into a marble slab in the lobby of AFL House if it isn’t already.
 

PP34

Finals MVP
Oct 8, 2009
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If this season proves one thing, it's if you wanna win an AFL flag you have to turn up and win games regardless of the circumstances.

Complaining about it is a loser's mentality.

It's a bit like life when you think about it.
That has been the mantra of any interstate team that has won the flag at the MCG as well.

Eagles fans love to whinge but their team didn't play the woe is me card in 2018 and they beat a Pies side who had a loud crowd and quick start.
 

bzparkes

Brownlow Medallist
May 2, 2006
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If there's no more excuses about where the GF is held, then why can't it be held at the highest ranked team's ground?

Having the GF at a venue which significantly advantages MCG tenants seems pretty amateurish. Ok for a suburban comp but I think whoever finishes the highest should get the deserved advantage.

No excuses...
 

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Scotland

TheBrownDog
May 5, 2006
56,884
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That has been the mantra of any interstate team that has won the flag at the MCG as well.

Eagles fans love to whinge but their team didn't play the woe is me card in 2018 and they beat a Pies side who had a loud crowd and quick start.
We are 14-5 in finals in Perth and 10-1-17 in finals in Melbourne.

Our Grand Final record is 4-3 with 3 wins and 2 losses against Victorian opponents. 1-1 against teams that were MCG tenants.

If people believe that a Collingwood vs West Coast GF played at Collingwood's home ground isn't an advantage to Collingwood then good luck to them.
 

Boston tiger

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May 10, 2010
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If there's no more excuses about where the GF is held, then why can't it be held at the highest ranked team's ground?

Having the GF at a venue which significantly advantages MCG tenants seems pretty amateurish. Ok for a suburban comp but I think whoever finishes the highest should get the deserved advantage.

No excuses...
So the venue for the Grand Final is decided 6 days before hand or are you saying if you finish top your team gets to host the GrandFinal even if you aren’t in it ?
 

PP34

Finals MVP
Oct 8, 2009
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We are 14-5 in finals in Perth and 10-1-17 in finals in Melbourne.

Our Grand Final record is 4-3 with 3 wins and 2 losses against Victorian opponents. 1-1 against teams that were MCG tenants.

If people believe that a Collingwood vs West Coast GF played at Collingwood's home ground isn't an advantage to Collingwood then good luck to them.
Didn't say it wasn't an advantage.

I just hate the way some carry on as though the MCG is such a big factor in determining who wins the grand final every year.

I strongly think that if a team is good enough they'll win it. Of all the interstate teams to lose to Vic sides in grand finals recently I don't think the ground made a big difference.

The Crows came up against a rampant Richmond side. I think the last few seasons prove that 2017 was the start of something special for Richmond. Some liked to argue back in 2017 that it was a one off sort of fluke helped by the MCG. 2018-2020 prove this Richmond side wasn't a fluke. Richmond was vastly superior last year and GWS played their grand final the week earlier.

The Swans didn't show up in two grand finals. I don't think 2014 can be pinned at all to any sort of home ground advantage. Hawthorn dismantled them just like they did West Coast in 2015. Just a very good footy side that showed up time and time again on the big stage. The Dogs weren't even an MCG tenant and went through one of the toughest runs to a final. I don't think an MCG grand final just made them magically superior. They were a team that was rolling.

Freo were your typical Ross Lyon footy team. Hawthorn were a much more talented team.

Port was garbage in 2007 and the Cats were at the start of what turned out to be a dynasty.

The two sides in recent times to win away at the MCG on grand final have been West Coast and Sydney. Both were genuinely very good footy sides who showed up on the day.

Sydney were the team in both 2014 and 2016 I probably expected to win. They got belted in 2014. Almost nobody showed up. Is that down to the ground? Surely when a whole team performs so terribly you cannot blame a home ground advantage.

If people want to whinge about an advantage Victorian clubs have I'd argue Victoria being such a big footy state is a far greater advantage than the MCG. The fact that in 20 years we now look on the midst of the third Victorian club to win three flags and be dominant for a number of years has to say something about being based in Victoria.
 

GoGeta

Team Captain
Mar 4, 2013
382
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If you Victorians think hubbing for 15 weeks in Queensland is the equivalent of traveling every 2nd game for:

34 years like West Coast Eagles

30 years like Adelaide Crows

26 years like Fremantle

24 years like Port Adelaide

Then you really do have your heads up your own arses.

And by the way the Eagles and Dockers both hubbed for 10 weeks in Queensland this year also.
f*n Boohoo, Eagles fans becoming known as the biggest sooks in the AFL
You should be kissing Victorians feet for letting you traitors even play in the AFL!

If you don't like it try and secede from the country AGAIN and live off of Mining.
 

Scotland

TheBrownDog
May 5, 2006
56,884
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Didn't say it wasn't an advantage.

I just hate the way some carry on as though the MCG is such a big factor in determining who wins the grand final every year.

I strongly think that if a team is good enough they'll win it. Of all the interstate teams to lose to Vic sides in grand finals recently I don't think the ground made a big difference.

The Crows came up against a rampant Richmond side. I think the last few seasons prove that 2017 was the start of something special for Richmond. Some liked to argue back in 2017 that it was a one off sort of fluke helped by the MCG. 2018-2020 prove this Richmond side wasn't a fluke. Richmond was vastly superior last year and GWS played their grand final the week earlier.

The Swans didn't show up in two grand finals. I don't think 2014 can be pinned at all to any sort of home ground advantage. Hawthorn dismantled them just like they did West Coast in 2015. Just a very good footy side that showed up time and time again on the big stage. The Dogs weren't even an MCG tenant and went through one of the toughest runs to a final. I don't think an MCG grand final just made them magically superior. They were a team that was rolling.

Freo were your typical Ross Lyon footy team. Hawthorn were a much more talented team.

Port was garbage in 2007 and the Cats were at the start of what turned out to be a dynasty.

The two sides in recent times to win away at the MCG on grand final have been West Coast and Sydney. Both were genuinely very good footy sides who showed up on the day.

Sydney were the team in both 2014 and 2016 I probably expected to win. They got belted in 2014. Almost nobody showed up. Is that down to the ground? Surely when a whole team performs so terribly you cannot blame a home ground advantage.

If people want to whinge about an advantage Victorian clubs have I'd argue Victoria being such a big footy state is a far greater advantage than the MCG. The fact that in 20 years we now look on the midst of the third Victorian club to win three flags and be dominant for a number of years has to say something about being based in Victoria.
Richmond benefited in 2017 because they got Geelong first up who for some reason stopped being able to win finals regularly at the MCG after 2011 and then GWS and then Adelaide. 3 games on the bounce at their home ground with only one of them earned. Quirk of being a Melbourne based team. Freo have been around for 25 years and we have never played them in a final. Richmond had lost to Geelong at KP, GWS at Spotless and were flogged by Adelaide at AO during the season, and were flogged by WC in 2018 in Perth. Last year they beat us by 6 points at the MCG and that result was pivotal. The draw being uneven relative to the number of clubs is also a big factor each year. Credit to them that in 2019 and 2020 they have won finals away from home.

As I said, we are 14-5 in Perth finals. That's the net effect of travelling cross country and playing at a venue that you visit at most twice a year, always against a higher ranked side excluding potential prelims. Which is exactly that WC did in the 2018 GF. Flew cross country for our 3rd game at the G all year. Collingwood (after an away prelim, in Melbourne by chance) played their 17th. Media 'experts' tipped against us on the basis of where the game was played. I find it bizarre that people just up and decide it's not a factor.

But yes, it's not the only factor. In 2011 we finished 4th and played Collingwood and Geelong. We weren't beating either in a month of Sundays in a GF anywhere. 2015 we weren't a better side than Hawthorn, we just had a slightly better H&A season and finished second. We were good enough to beat them once here but they were much stronger 3 weeks later.
 

bzparkes

Brownlow Medallist
May 2, 2006
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So the venue for the Grand Final is decided 6 days before hand or are you saying if you finish top your team gets to host the GrandFinal even if you aren’t in it ?
No, I'm saying that if 1st and second both qualify for the GF then the minor premier gets to host it.

Didn't think it was difficult to understand tbh.
 

bzparkes

Brownlow Medallist
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f*n Boohoo, Eagles fans becoming known as the biggest sooks in the AFL
You should be kissing Victorians feet for letting you traitors even play in the AFL!

If you don't like it try and secede from the country AGAIN and live off of Mining.
Wish we'd just started our own league and let the VFL minnows die off back in 1987 tbh.
 

FreoFan85

Rookie
Jun 29, 2020
29
31
AFL Club
Fremantle
I love hearing the “ If you’re good enough you will win it every year.” There is clearly a home ground advantage for a grand final. Every sport in the world is not wrong.

Look at the olympics as a prime example.... we have had it in Australia twice, once when we were still really developing our population size (we also smashed it in these olympics).

Surprise surprise, in what olympics do you think Australia won the most medals in????
 
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garlic munchers

Club Legend
Oct 3, 2006
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If I invite you to a party of mine......you don't get to dictate where the gathering takes place.
LOL, a Victorian having a party. Will dictator dan allow it?

Probably watch the grannie at the Wembley Hotel with a few hundred other people & I’ll try & spare a very brief thought about our poor Melbourne cousins who have completely *ucked their management of Covid.
 

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doppleganger

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Jun 4, 2005
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Sure, it's a home state final. And you accept that teams can earn the right to play those games in their home state?
AFL determined it was in the leagues best interest to not stage all early finals in Melbourne.

If you have an Eagles v Swans game, more crowd interest by fixturing that outside of Melbourne.

Hence home State finals ruling was brought in. With the venue at the discretion of AFL Commission.

Once the ruling is in, it is applied across the board. The AFL determines best venue in the State for the game.

States that have multiple venues are aware that the AFL Commission fixtures the games as they see fit. States with just one suitable venue have just run with earning home finals.

The games are not home finals, if Freo played H&A games at Freo Oval they ain’t gauranteed a final there...as AFL Commission would 99% decide to schedule it at Optus.
 

TryAnHit

All Australian
Mar 1, 2012
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The problem is the interstate sides get so few games at the MCG 1-2 per year so is a huge draw back when move there in a final.

I am Supprised more interstate teams don't try and schedule matches there, say Adel V Port agree to play 1 showdown there a year and rotate the home game there, would be a + for both sides experience there.
 

Sweet Jesus

Brownlow Medallist
Dec 20, 2014
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AFL determined it was in the leagues best interest to not stage all early finals in Melbourne.
Why?

If it's all about maximising crowd numbers, why play any games at Giants Stadium?

Hence home State finals ruling was brought in. With the venue at the discretion of AFL Commission.

Once the ruling is in, it is applied across the board. The AFL determines best venue in the State for the game.

States that have multiple venues are aware that the AFL Commission fixtures the games as they see fit. States with just one suitable venue have just run with earning home finals.

The games are not home finals, if Freo played H&A games at Freo Oval they ain’t gauranteed a final there...as AFL Commission would 99% decide to schedule it at Optus.
But you accept that teams can earn finals in their home states. It is not simply about maximising crowds.

The evidence for this is the Giants playing the Dogs in front of 20,000 people in NSW. If crowd size was the only consideration, those games would be played in Melbourne.

So teams can earn finals in their home state, independent of any consideration of crowd size.
 

doppleganger

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We are 14-5 in finals in Perth and 10-1-17 in finals in Melbourne.
Should split out GFs from the earlier finals

14-5 in wk1-3 finals in Perth
6-1-14 in wk1-3 finals in Melbourne

Pretty similar, reflecting that when hosting you are meant to be the ‘better’ team in wk1-3.

4-3 in GFs
3-2 in GFs against vic teams

Our Grand Final record is 4-3 with 3 wins and 2 losses against Victorian opponents. 1-1 against teams that were MCG tenants..
Pretty strong record.
Much better than the sub 30% wk1-3 finals record

If people believe that a Collingwood vs West Coast GF played at Collingwood's home ground isn't an advantage to Collingwood then good luck to them.
It is an advantage, but what is the magnitude?

Components that people believe contributes to the home advantage.

Crowd, Routine, Travel, Ground Familiarity, Psychological factors related to defending ‘home turf’

If people believe that all the components that make up an advantage remain unchanged in a GF then good luck to them.
 

LoungeLizard

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 15, 2009
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Well that's interesting.

Maybe don't say it too loudly around the 'it was always the national competition' crowd. How many of your 15 flags were won in a national comp? 1? 2? More? None?
Realistically, none, it's not a true national comp, it's just the VFL with SOME footy states and 3 (2 if you count Brisbane as Fitzroy) non footy state teams added.

There are still footy states not represented.

So realistically WC have won 4 VFL cups.
 

radiojake

Brownlow Medallist
Nov 28, 2011
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The more that I think about the OP, the stupider it actually gets

"No more excuses where the GF is - Two Vic sides made it and it's in Brisbane"

The issue has never been about Non-Vic sides not being able to make the GF - There has been a Non-Vic side in the GF every year since 2012 until this year - I just don't know why Vic supporters can't acknowledge that the big Vic clubs get an advantage over non-MCG tenants when it comes to GFs - Even just being able to play in front of 90.000+ crowd a couple of times during the season / finals as a build up would be a huge factor

Anyway lucky you guys shipped a bit of turf up to QLD, god forbid you couldn't bend down and sniff some dirt
 

B4Bear

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 6, 2011
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If you Victorians think hubbing for 15 weeks in Queensland is the equivalent of traveling every 2nd game for:

34 years like West Coast Eagles

30 years like Adelaide Crows

26 years like Fremantle

24 years like Port Adelaide

Then you really do have your heads up your own arses.

And by the way the Eagles and Dockers both hubbed for 10 weeks in Queensland this year also.
And they were sh*t too. Playing the rest at home papered over the cracks.
 

Stabby McGee

Team Captain
Jul 30, 2011
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Supporting Melbourne makes you cry?

Is that why you live vicariously through more successful Victorian sides?

Melbourne are impotent but at least Geelong and Richmond made the GF! Does that make it better?
Dammed if your monkey avatar isn’t the best representation of a poster in this cesspool of half wits and teenage boys. Kudos to you for picking it so well.

And vicariously (did you look that up?) man, seriously? I dislike both teams. I was hoping for a Port / Brisbane GF, but hey, why ruin a good story with facts, eh?

I have zero problem with any team from interstate - some are fun to watch, some crap, and that changes year to year, but that is irrelevant to my original post. It’s the irrational hatred of all things Victorian you foreigners spout off about everything that comes up. So, even though we don’t give two fu**s about anything east of Horsham it’s fair play to smack you upside the head on occasion as you do with unruly children that won’t behave
 

kranky al

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If you Victorians think hubbing for 15 weeks in Queensland is the equivalent of traveling every 2nd game for:

34 years like West Coast Eagles

30 years like Adelaide Crows

26 years like Fremantle

24 years like Port Adelaide

Then you really do have your heads up your own arses.

And by the way the Eagles and Dockers both hubbed for 10 weeks in Queensland this year also.

without their families*
ftfy
 

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