Society/Culture Nobody has anything new to say about God.

Janus

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Allow me to help you out and get your persecution of woo woo back in track :D

It's time to go even further down the rabbit hole :)

There's a monument called the Georgia Guidestones, erected in 1980 and commissioned by a man named R.C Christian which outlines their plans:

  1. Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.
  2. Guide reproduction wisely — improving fitness and diversity.
  3. Unite humanity with a living new language.
  4. Rule passion — faith — tradition — and all things with tempered reason.
  5. Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.
  6. Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.
  7. Avoid petty laws and useless officials.
  8. Balance personal rights with social duties.
  9. Prize truth — beauty — love — seeking harmony with the infinite.
  10. Be not a cancer on the earth — Leave room for nature — Leave room for nature.

R.C is short for Rosicrucian. The modern father of Rosicrucianism is Christian Rosenkretz. The Georgia Guidestones were also built by the Freemasons (an offshoot of Rosicrucianism, which is far older)

This is reportedly contained in a time capsule buried at the site...unfortunately it is only a partial transcription:

"To whomever comes across this presenting:

Contained herein are keys that have been awaited to be placed here in proper sequencing and in proper order to announce the return and the activation of those events of prophecy that that signal these events. Those who have guarded this great mystery and who have guarded the evolution of the human species itself are returning. It has begun.

This monument known as the Georgia Guide Stones (sic) shall find threads unto the revelation of the mystery in the name R.C. Christian otherwise known unto that contingency that is responsible for the erection of this monument as Christian Rosenkretz (1378-1484).

This presentation of keys upon the finding of it is to be delivered to the Elberton Star. The Elberton Star is to deliver it to the Atlanta Rosicrucian Society. The Rosicrucian contact number is 1. That number is derived from the synchronistic mystery of 404-2994-4172 in Atlanta.

It is only those with the understand (sic) of the rose and its return who will be capable of deciphering the codes and the keys that are contained herein:

Unto this great mystery shall it in due time be unveiled likened unto… Great portal reads only, “Know thyself.” Come indeed the bridegroom bearing the knowledge of the perfect… to bring forth the gold and this the purity of the rose.. This monument has now been activated

You are greatly loved mankind. Once we saw through the glass … shall see face to face. Do not fear. We are with you through the"

As someone who is learning alchemy, you can see the whole concept of bringing forth the gold and the purity of the rose being key words for the creation of the Philosopher's Stone. "Know thyself" was inscribed above the portal at the Oracle at Delphi and is a key phrase that alchemists use in the process of turning “lead” into “gold” by understanding both our strength and our weaknesses. “Gold refined by fire.”

The Bridegroom refers to this scripture:

“But while they were on their way to buy the oil, the bridegroom arrived. The virgins who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet. And the door was shut.“ This parable talks all about the ten discreet virgins who brought with them enough oil (black/lead) for their lamps (fire/gold), and ten that didn’t. It means you have to be prepared - “know thyself” and actively become a great contributor to society by understanding what your talents are while also acknowledging what weaknesses you have. This is another Rosicrucian teaching.

This is a guidebook for ascension to the next stage of evolution, guided by those who used to visit us as gods but no longer do because we have grown too advanced in logical, rational thinking to believe in them anymore.

Are these people crazy? Sure. But they also have money and are in control of everything. You want to know who the Illuminati are, Rosicrucians are it.
 

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jason pm

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I acknowledge the benefits of meditation, but what does any of this have to do with "god"?
I'm with you Snake when it comes to institutionalized religious style god belief as far as the version I have observed and experienced, it is a load of horseshit and merely a power/distraction mechanism IMO.

It has symbols, mythology etc. that are useful for those who dig into it deeper but I can't be bothered with that. I do though think that we in all likely hood have a connection to the natural world (which we are part of) that meditation may be able to help with. This it what some on here see as "god", they see it as completely natural, just not understood by the masses at this moment in time.

I am close with 2 people who have gone the whole way with DMT and I trust what they told me about their experience hence why I tried it. They both said they felt a oneness with everything, a detachment from the self, boundless love.
 

Total Power

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I am close with 2 people who have gone the whole way with DMT and I trust what they told me about their experience hence why I tried it. They both said they felt a oneness with everything, a detachment from the self, boundless love.
There are many ways to "alter" your state of consciousness, but LSD is temporary and there are side effects.

I have taken liquid lsd and ketamine in my time. Can provide positive insights, but also has severe backlashs of various kinds. That you can get similar experiences from electrical helmuts, or DMT or whatever weird stimulus you'd like to use, is already known to me. Ketamine experiences was what prompted me to check my atheism at the door and look into spirituality!

Ketamine has had some effects on me which are staggering. Out of body experiences being one of them.

Let's not muck around though, if you want a serious spiritual experience on drugs, go for the Grand Daddy of all drugs and smoke some DMT. If you don't feel like killing yourself afterwards, I'm told it's a hell of a ride!!

The spiritual viewpoint though, is that by taking drugs, you're experiencing the "infernal" (negative) worlds of consciousness, as you are not working with the "Holy Spirit", but against it.

Like I've said a million times, I got no problem hearing about neuroscience or whatever, but let's not beat around the bush here, what we are talking about makes String Theory look like Kindergarten. Yet most are happy to write religions off as a primative urge, or a form of brain dysfunction. Hey, maybe it is brain product, but all I ask is for people to not oversimplify the complexity of what we are dealing with. It's an absolutely stunning area of research and you might be in for some shocks!!
 

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  1. Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.
You do realise this means killing off 5,500,000,000 people, or at the very least sterilising them and forcing them to live without fulfilling the natural urge to have children....? You can't just put something so monstrous on a list and then move on to the next itrem like it is no big deal.
 

Janus

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Let's go into some esoteric woo woo shit, cause it's super fun :) You're about to get a brief insight into my belief system:

Lesson 1 - In order to get where you want to go, you need to know where you are.

Rosicrucians love their astrology and alchemy. They're also heavily into using symbols to communicate their ideas, because they believe that it can hide the wisdom better from prying eyes. Note the similarities between this diagram:




And this one, which is a traditional astrological map:



So we can see that, from the central point:

Earth = Of God and Nature

'Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness...'

This is self explanatory - Earth is both a product of evolution (nature) and divine influence (god). This is the highest level one can achieve - the perfect balance, harmonising the physical and the spiritual. This is 'Keter' - the Crown, where one becomes as god and is given an incorruptible crown of immortality. This is where we are trying to get to. God in man - the Kingdom of Heaven is within you. The Philosopher's Stone of Alchemy. Buddhahood.

Luna (Moon) = Four Spirits of God in One Godly Being

The Four Spirits of God are the Four Creatures described in Revelation - also found in the city that Hermes Trismegistus built: the bull, the eagle, the lion and the man. At each phase of the moon (new, waxing, full, waning), the city of Hermes would be bathed in a different colour light to reflect the nature of the All at that point in time.

The bull (Egyptians had the Apis bull) represents steadfastness and courage. The eagle represents wisdom (the Egyptians had Horus, this is where the all-seeing eye of Horus comes from). The lion represents power (Maahes is the lion-headed Egyptian god of war). Lastly, the man represents love for mankind (principled love - agape).

This is also reflected in the four primary names of God:

Yod-heh-vav-heh ('He becomes') = Wisdom/the Eagle
Yod-heh-vah-heh Tseva-ohth ('He becomes armies') = Power/the Lion
Atah Gibor Le-olam Adonai ('You, O Lord, are Mighty Forever') = Steadfastness/the Bull
Eheyh Aser Eheyh ('I am who I am') - The primal quality of God is love/the Man


Mercury = Fourfold Mirror of God's Nature

In Astrology, Mercury can be either a benefic or a malefic planet depending on the actions of the other planets. In a similar vein, the nature of god is determined by our actions. Mercury is the messenger planet - it is about communication, and communication is a two way street. is also the Roman name for Hermes - the Egyptian God Thoth. And the seven Hermetic principles show exactly what the nature of God is. "As above, so below." Which means that the nature of God is the nature of man. "Prick us, do we not bleed? Tickle us, do we not laugh? Poison us, do we not die? Wrong us, shall we not revenge?"

These are reflected in the following sefirot - Binah (understanding), Chokmah (wisdom), Gevurah (strength), Chesed (loving-kindness).

The lesson of this sphere is to understand that change is a natural part of life, but that we can control our mental and emotional state and how we react to that change if we display those four qualities of understanding, wisdom, strength and loving-kindness.

Note: the pentagram is a symbolic representation of the godly aspects of the tree of life...as is the Egyptian ankh and Christian cross:

upload_2018-12-6_13-28-0.png




Interesting, right? :) This is also what Leonardo Da Vinci's famous Vitruvian man drawing was about - the man drawn in a cross like position and the man drawn in a star like position. Da Vinci was an alchemist too. Of course, those who don't know what the circle and the square in that particular sketch represent (a archetypal beginning of the creation of the Philosopher's Stone) wouldn't have the faintest clue.

Venus = Mirror of the Created Nature

'For God loved the world so much....'

Venus is associated with love, grace and beauty. It is the reflection of our perfect selves - the nature of what we were and what we could be again, not what we are. This is man in the symbolic Garden of Eden. The reason why females are given the symbol of Venus as their gender is due to the consecration of the sacred feminine, which encapsulates everything divine. It is a symbol of pure selflessness and self-sacrifice.

The lesson of this sphere is that true ascension is only possible when we give of ourselves completely and discard the physical as of no consequence.

Reflected in the sefirot Tiferet (beauty).

Sol = Fourfold Mirror and Power, Might and Effect of Nature

The Sun keeps everything in it's place in our solar system. It generates heat, light, keeps our planet locked in orbit. Symbolically, this reflects our inability to live without the four major elements which are the building block on which everything else rests. Air is symbolic of all gasses. Earth is symbolic of all solid matter. Water is symbolic of all liquid. And Fire is symbolic of heat. This also is reflected in our own nature mentally. How our attitude is affected by the world around us, and how we can be refined by the trials and tribulations that we face.

The lesson of this sphere is to accept things for what they are and understand that nothing physical is permanent - it can also phase into a different state.

Reflected in the sefirot Netzach (victory).

Mars = Fourfold Kingdom and Beauty of the United Nature

On the surface, the war-like aspects of Martial spirits would seem counter-intuitive to anyone seeking to ascend to immortality. But remember that one of the four aspects of 'God' is Tsevaoth - the Warrior. It is important to have the ability to defend against those who would seek to harm us. And protecting those that we love is an admirable quality.

The lesson of this sphere is to know when aggression and other forms of violence are acceptable and measure our response accordingly.

Reflected in the sefirot Hod (splendor).

Jupiter = Fourfold Mirror of the Unified Natural Human Being

"The second (greatest commandment) is 'You must love your neighbour as yourself.'"

Jupiter is all about how we relate to others socially. It is the first of the social planets, and it inspires things that instil a sense of community like morality, gratitude, hope, honour. It tells us where we fit in with the universe. When we are being altruistic, kind or serving humanity, we are living in this sphere.

The lesson of this sphere is to make sure we understand that we are all connected to one another and the ignorance of others is no excuse for exploitation or derision.

Reflected in the sefirot Yesod (foundation)

Saturn = CHAOS

When people have no understanding or relation to the previous aspects of their nature, the only thing that is left is their own base instincts, which are described as Satanic, physical and earthly. Separated from both love of god and of man, the people who allow Saturn to rule their lives are nihilistic. They choose their own path regardless of the consequences to anyone else. All the evil in the world is based around people who follow this life course.

Reflected in the sefirot Malchut (sovereignty).

Next, we'll talk about the Tarot and how it is related to Astrology and the Tree of Life. All this shit is connected.
 

Total Power

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Let's go into some esoteric woo woo shit, cause it's super fun :) You're about to get a brief insight into my belief system:

Lesson 1 - In order to get where you want to go, you need to know where you are.

Rosicrucians love their astrology and alchemy. They're also heavily into using symbols to communicate their ideas, because they believe that it can hide the wisdom better from prying eyes. Note the similarities between this diagram:




And this one, which is a traditional astrological map:



So we can see that, from the central point:

Earth = Of God and Nature

'Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness...'

This is self explanatory - Earth is both a product of evolution (nature) and divine influence (god). This is the highest level one can achieve - the perfect balance, harmonising the physical and the spiritual. This is 'Keter' - the Crown, where one becomes as god and is given an incorruptible crown of immortality. This is where we are trying to get to. God in man - the Kingdom of Heaven is within you. The Philosopher's Stone of Alchemy. Buddhahood.

Luna (Moon) = Four Spirits of God in One Godly Being

The Four Spirits of God are the Four Creatures described in Revelation - also found in the city that Hermes Trismegistus built: the bull, the eagle, the lion and the man. At each phase of the moon (new, waxing, full, waning), the city of Hermes would be bathed in a different colour light to reflect the nature of the All at that point in time.

The bull (Egyptians had the Apis bull) represents steadfastness and courage. The eagle represents wisdom (the Egyptians had Horus, this is where the all-seeing eye of Horus comes from). The lion represents power (Maahes is the lion-headed Egyptian god of war). Lastly, the man represents love for mankind (principled love - agape).

This is also reflected in the four primary names of God:

Yod-heh-vav-heh ('He becomes') = Wisdom/the Eagle
Yod-heh-vah-heh Tseva-ohth ('He becomes armies') = Power/the Lion
Atah Gibor Le-olam Adonai ('You, O Lord, are Mighty Forever') = Steadfastness/the Bull
Eheyh Aser Eheyh ('I am who I am') - The primal quality of God is love/the Man


Mercury = Fourfold Mirror of God's Nature

In Astrology, Mercury can be either a benefic or a malefic planet depending on the actions of the other planets. In a similar vein, the nature of god is determined by our actions. Mercury is the messenger planet - it is about communication, and communication is a two way street. is also the Roman name for Hermes - the Egyptian God Thoth. And the seven Hermetic principles show exactly what the nature of God is. "As above, so below." Which means that the nature of God is the nature of man. "Prick us, do we not bleed? Tickle us, do we not laugh? Poison us, do we not die? Wrong us, shall we not revenge?"

These are reflected in the following sefirot - Binah (understanding), Chokmah (wisdom), Gevurah (strength), Chesed (loving-kindness).

The lesson of this sphere is to understand that change is a natural part of life, but that we can control our mental and emotional state and how we react to that change if we display those four qualities of understanding, wisdom, strength and loving-kindness.

Note: the pentagram is a symbolic representation of the godly aspects of the tree of life...as is the Egyptian ankh and Christian cross:

View attachment 592797



Interesting, right? :) This is also what Leonardo Da Vinci's famous Vitruvian man drawing was about - the man drawn in a cross like position and the man drawn in a star like position. Da Vinci was an alchemist too. Of course, those who don't know what the circle and the square in that particular sketch represent (a archetypal beginning of the creation of the Philosopher's Stone) wouldn't have the faintest clue.

Venus = Mirror of the Created Nature

'For God loved the world so much....'

Venus is associated with love, grace and beauty. It is the reflection of our perfect selves - the nature of what we were and what we could be again, not what we are. This is man in the symbolic Garden of Eden. The reason why females are given the symbol of Venus as their gender is due to the consecration of the sacred feminine, which encapsulates everything divine. It is a symbol of pure selflessness and self-sacrifice.

The lesson of this sphere is that true ascension is only possible when we give of ourselves completely and discard the physical as of no consequence.

Reflected in the sefirot Tiferet (beauty).

Sol = Fourfold Mirror and Power, Might and Effect of Nature

The Sun keeps everything in it's place in our solar system. It generates heat, light, keeps our planet locked in orbit. Symbolically, this reflects our inability to live without the four major elements which are the building block on which everything else rests. Air is symbolic of all gasses. Earth is symbolic of all solid matter. Water is symbolic of all liquid. And Fire is symbolic of heat. This also is reflected in our own nature mentally. How our attitude is affected by the world around us, and how we can be refined by the trials and tribulations that we face.

The lesson of this sphere is to accept things for what they are and understand that nothing physical is permanent - it can also phase into a different state.

Reflected in the sefirot Netzach (victory).

Mars = Fourfold Kingdom and Beauty of the United Nature

On the surface, the war-like aspects of Martial spirits would seem counter-intuitive to anyone seeking to ascend to immortality. But remember that one of the four aspects of 'God' is Tsevaoth - the Warrior. It is important to have the ability to defend against those who would seek to harm us. And protecting those that we love is an admirable quality.

The lesson of this sphere is to know when aggression and other forms of violence are acceptable and measure our response accordingly.

Reflected in the sefirot Hod (splendor).

Jupiter = Fourfold Mirror of the Unified Natural Human Being

"The second (greatest commandment) is 'You must love your neighbour as yourself.'"

Jupiter is all about how we relate to others socially. It is the first of the social planets, and it inspires things that instil a sense of community like morality, gratitude, hope, honour. It tells us where we fit in with the universe. When we are being altruistic, kind or serving humanity, we are living in this sphere.

The lesson of this sphere is to make sure we understand that we are all connected to one another and the ignorance of others is no excuse for exploitation or derision.

Reflected in the sefirot Yesod (foundation)

Saturn = CHAOS

When people have no understanding or relation to the previous aspects of their nature, the only thing that is left is their own base instincts, which are described as Satanic, physical and earthly. Separated from both love of god and of man, the people who allow Saturn to rule their lives are nihilistic. They choose their own path regardless of the consequences to anyone else. All the evil in the world is based around people who follow this life course.

Reflected in the sefirot Malchut (sovereignty).

Next, we'll talk about the Tarot and how it is related to Astrology and the Tree of Life. All this shit is connected.

It's amazing how when we investigate the origins of religion, they all have the same meaning. The Cross is a very powerful symbol, found across all religions and all cultures, in different forms.
 

Janus

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That's the central teaching in Hinduism and Buddhism. You should google the concept of dependent origination. Not an easy concept of grasp.
Hmmm. Is it like saying the current state (rain) is dependent on the previous state (formation of clouds by evaporation and condensation), which will be determined by the future state (run off of rainwater into the ocean)? Everything in the cycle is codependent and only exists if the others exist, and the amount and quality of the rain is determined by the influences of the other stages.

It’s the same with the life cycle - we are a product of the ignorance we displayed in a previous life, which colours our thoughts and emotions in this one since we have a kind of lifebank memory - an awareness of what we are doing and how that will influence our future lives, but an ignorance of what we did previously that is actively influencing this one.

In Hermetic teachings, it would be the principle of cause and effect: the cause is our previous life, the effect is our present life, which in turn is the cause of our future life, which finally becomes the effect when it becomes our next “present” life (but in the future). That which was, is. That which will be, is.And the cycle never ends unless one breaks free from it by escaping to a higher plane of existence.

Have I got an understanding of it? Or am I way off?
 

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I acknowledge the benefits of meditation, but what does any of this have to do with "god"?
After 200 pages you've finally realised you and TP were talking to different meanings of "god" all along.

As Jason said, there's a difference between the made up religous god character and god-like concepts such as an inner god or some force that connects the natural world.
 

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I acknowledge the benefits of meditation, but what does any of this have to do with "god"?
to reach enlightenment.

Not that you have any right to dictate how threads evolve but in your ideal world, would this thread only discuss organise religion?

Most of the God threads end up discussing meditation, ffs.
 

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Ketamine has had some effects on me which are staggering. Out of body experiences being one of them.

!!
Ketamine deserves a thread on its own. It is a dissociative and will affect you like nothing else does. I've heard about experiments whereby people were sharing thoughts and I have had 1st hand experience in this.

It is now being used in clinical trials to treat depression.

It is mind boggling the stuff that happens on ketamine.

DMT is another. If you take DMT chances are you will understand there is more going on than what we see. Definitely makes you spiritual. I was on the fence before experiencing DMT now having consumed it many times (and having DMT experiences that cannot be put into words) I have no doubt there is more to this existence than just living and dying.

Ditto shrooms. If you take enough of those the experiences transcend what you experience on DMT - or up there anyway. But you need to take a lot. Not for the faint hearted because it can be somewhat terrifying.

I've had a few bad DMT experiences but mostly good. I've had an arse kicking on mushrooms, which was fking terrifying and goes for 4 hours. Unlike the 20 minute DMT experience. Acid, is good but wont take you to places shrooms and DMT will.
 

Janus

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Ketamine deserves a thread on its own. It is a dissociative and will affect you like nothing else does. I've heard about experiments whereby people were sharing thoughts and I have had 1st hand experience in this.

It is now being used in clinical trials to treat depression.

It is mind boggling the stuff that happens on ketamine.

DMT is another. If you take DMT chances are you will understand there is more going on than what we see. Definitely makes you spiritual. I was on the fence before experiencing DMT now having consumed it many times (and having DMT experiences that cannot be put into words) I have no doubt there is more to this existence than just living and dying.

Ditto shrooms. If you take enough of those the experiences transcend what you experience on DMT - or up there anyway. But you need to take a lot. Not for the faint hearted because it can be somewhat terrifying.

I've had a few bad DMT experiences but mostly good. I've had an arse kicking on mushrooms, which was fking terrifying and goes for 4 hours. Unlike the 20 minute DMT experience. Acid, is good but wont take you to places shrooms and DMT will.
Please let me know where to get this stuff. If I’m dreaming about escaping a cataclysmic global flood on the huge airships NASA say they want to build to live in the atmosphere of Venus, I can’t wait to see what I’ll see on DMT and Psilocybin :)
 

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Hmmm. Is it like saying the current state (rain) is dependent on the previous state (formation of clouds by evaporation and condensation), which will be determined by the future state (run off of rainwater into the ocean)? Everything in the cycle is codependent and only exists if the others exist, and the amount and quality of the rain is determined by the influences of the other stages.

It’s the same with the life cycle - we are a product of the ignorance we displayed in a previous life, which colours our thoughts and emotions in this one since we have a kind of lifebank memory - an awareness of what we are doing and how that will influence our future lives, but an ignorance of what we did previously that is actively influencing this one.

In Hermetic teachings, it would be the principle of cause and effect: the cause is our previous life, the effect is our present life, which in turn is the cause of our future life, which finally becomes the effect when it becomes our next “present” life (but in the future). That which was, is. That which will be, is.And the cycle never ends unless one breaks free from it by escaping to a higher plane of existence.

Have I got an understanding of it? Or am I way off?
Kinda of. The fact is, the concept of "self" or "you" is a series of psychological aggregates, which rise with desire and eventually burn out, only to be replaced with new desires. Until such time as you stop the cycle of aggregates, you will continue to be born and reborn, in this physical shell or the next one.

As you cannot define "self" as something which is impermanent, such as your desire defects, you cannot therefore state that it is a you, or your "self" experiencing rebirth. Dependent origination is my favourite Buddhist explanation of being, as it ties in the role of consciousness and karma (which are actually one and the same thing).

Nirvana effecitely eliminates the "ever after". It doesn't state that 'being' ceases to exist, just that the causation of our ties to the Samsara are extinguished.

To quote a buddhist master:

”The teaching of causal interdependence is the most important of Buddhist principles. It describes the law of nature, which exists as the natural course of things. The Buddha was no emissary of heavenly commandments, but the discoverer of this principle of the natural order, and the proclaimer of its truth to the world. From DO

The progression of causes and conditions is the reality which applies to all things, from the natural environment, which is an external, physical condition, to the events of human society, ethical principles, life events and the happiness and suffering which manifest in our own minds. These systems of causal relationship are part of the one natural truth. Our happiness within this natural system depends on having some knowledge of how it works and practicing correctly within it, through addressing problems on the personal, social, and environmental levels. Given that all things are interconnected, and all are affecting each other, success in dealing with the world lies in creating harmony within it.”


The trick is to break the cycle.

For example in the book Nagarjuna's Reason Sixty by Loizzo, Candrakirti says:

"the perfectly enlightened buddhas-proclaimed, "What is dependently created is uncreated."

So you might be surprised but i agree with Snakey about creation of "life" being "uncreated" (but not in a materialistic sense). The balancing properties of the Universe is sufficient!
 

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Just changing tack I have enjoyed reading this story about Peter Hitchens and journey on becoming a Christian. I think if two brothers with separate beliefs can still have a close relationship then maybe the rest a chance for the rest of us.

https://www.premierchristianity.com/Blog/How-an-atheist-journalist-became-a-Christian-believer

How an atheist journalist became a Christian believer


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The story of Peter Hitchens' adult conversion to Christianity traced a very different path to that of his arch-atheist brother Christopher

Christopher Hitchens, along with Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett, and Richard Dawkins was one of the so-called “four horsemen of the New Atheism” that led the charge against religion around the turn of the century. As a professional journalist, Christopher Hitchens was possibly the most eloquent of the four, and his wit and humour accomplished more for the cause than the bluster of the other three combined.

Christopher Hitchens' popularity was so great that atheists and Christian apologists alike mourned his passing in 2011, as did his brother, Peter. Peter Hitchens, also a journalist, was an outspoken atheist like his brother. Despite their similar professions, views, and upbringing, the two brothers were always at odds, practically since childhood. Though both were raised in a nominal faith, they began their slide into atheism in early adulthood.

Peter’s journey toward atheism began when he was still in boarding school at the age of 15. He chose to make his rebellion against religion and all of the conventions of his upbringing official by the ceremonial burning of his Bible – a gift from his parents - in the school yard. "We were sure that we, and our civilisation, had grown out of the nursery myths of God, angels and Heaven."

After burning the book, he intentionally began to do the things he had always been instructed were wrong: using foul language, mocking the weak, lying, stealing, using drugs and betraying friends and family members. Peter describes the cultural mindset that he believes led him and his brother away from organised religion:

“I have passed through the same atheist revelation that most self-confident British members of my generation - I was born in 1951 --have experienced. We were sure that we, and our civilisation, had grown out of the nursery myths of God, angels and Heaven. We had modern medicine, penicillin, jet engines, the Welfare State, the United Nations and ' science', which explained everything that needed to be explained.”

It was not, however, a tragedy or desperate turn of events that caused Peter Hitchens to turn back to his childhood faith. As he grew out of his young rebellion and into his established trade of journalism, he became modestly successful. He enjoyed a pleasant relationship with his girlfriend, and was able to pursue his interests and distractions such as holidays on the continent.

It was on the heels of this sobering incident that Christmas came, and with it, a much more uplifting experience. For many years, Hitchens had feigned disdain for the Christmas season, however now he began to truly enjoy the caroling and joy that came along with the seasonal celebration. Following this, Hitchens held his wedding in a church, became baptised, and generally began to participate in church affairs, even as his confidence in political solutions to world problems began to dwindle and fade.

Becoming a Christian in the world of journalism has no small amount of stigma attached to it, and given his formerly radical stances, Hitchens tried to conceal his growing faith from his friends and colleagues. However, as the years passed, Hitchens began to make his Christian faith part of his identity as a journalist, and especially as his brother achieved fame for his atheist stance, to distance himself from his now-famed sibling. This has ultimately had the effect of carving out a unique niche for Hitchens who now uses his position as a journalist to campaign for the various causes his worldview leads him to embrace.
 

nicky

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The meditation i do is hard work, as in your body experiences physical pain (in the beginning), it is not all zen stillness. It is hard work bur after days of sitting in silence you get benefits. One of the benefits i have experienced is that it removes emotional blocks. The physical sensation is intense.

To get these benefits i have had to meditate for 100s of hours. Well actually, if you do a 10 day silent retreat i got the intense emotional block removals after 7 days.

I have sound bowls, if i take lsd and play the sound bowls the vibrations heal and remove blocks very quickly and efficiently. Ditto mushrooms.

DMT, can give you benwfit that you'd get from 1000 hours of meditation, in 10 minutes.

Remarkable.

And these things are class a illegal. What a joke.
 

Total Power

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  1. You’re like a puppy who pisses on the carpet...annoying but in a cute way.
Stop giving the troll oxygen, i have tried to be patient with him, but his constant adhoms state he is not here for a discussion. Posting unintelligible memes and the same strawman arguments like quoting Deepak Chopra, the joke is on him. I have repeatedly tried to explain in simple language, the concept of emptiness, dependent origination etc. I cannot show it under a microscope nor i can show it on a computer screen. That fact that i repeatedly said the concept of shunyata (zero) can be experienced through meditation by stalling your phsyical and emotional centres only to get a reply in some meme. Yet i am continually asked to "prove it". Yes that's right, let me meditate for you. Being ignorance has its limit, i had enough of his nonsense.
 

Janus

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Stop giving the troll oxygen, i have tried to be patient with him, but his constant adhoms state he is not here for a discussion. Posting unintelligible memes and the same strawman arguments like quoting Deepak Chopra, the joke is on him. I have repeatedly tried to explain in simple language, the concept of emptiness, dependent origination etc. I cannot show it under a microscope nor i can show it on a computer screen. That fact that i repeatedly said the concept of shunyata (zero) can be experienced through meditation by stalling your phsyical and emotional centres only to get a reply in some meme. Yet i am continually asked to "prove it". Yes that's right, let me meditate for you. Being ignorance has its limit, i had enough of his nonsense.
I consider him to be a test of infinite patience :)
 

Janus

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Kinda of. The fact is, the concept of "self" or "you" is a series of psychological aggregates, which rise with desire and eventually burn out, only to be replaced with new desires. Until such time as you stop the cycle of aggregates, you will continue to be born and reborn, in this physical shell or the next one.

As you cannot define "self" as something which is impermanent, such as your desire defects, you cannot therefore state that it is a you, or your "self" experiencing rebirth. Dependent origination is my favourite Buddhist explanation of being, as it ties in the role of consciousness and karma (which are actually one and the same thing).

Nirvana effecitely eliminates the "ever after". It doesn't state that 'being' ceases to exist, just that the causation of our ties to the Samsara are extinguished.

To quote a buddhist master:

”The teaching of causal interdependence is the most important of Buddhist principles. It describes the law of nature, which exists as the natural course of things. The Buddha was no emissary of heavenly commandments, but the discoverer of this principle of the natural order, and the proclaimer of its truth to the world. From DO

The progression of causes and conditions is the reality which applies to all things, from the natural environment, which is an external, physical condition, to the events of human society, ethical principles, life events and the happiness and suffering which manifest in our own minds. These systems of causal relationship are part of the one natural truth. Our happiness within this natural system depends on having some knowledge of how it works and practicing correctly within it, through addressing problems on the personal, social, and environmental levels. Given that all things are interconnected, and all are affecting each other, success in dealing with the world lies in creating harmony within it.”


The trick is to break the cycle.

For example in the book Nagarjuna's Reason Sixty by Loizzo, Candrakirti says:

"the perfectly enlightened buddhas-proclaimed, "What is dependently created is uncreated."

So you might be surprised but i agree with Snakey about creation of "life" being "uncreated" (but not in a materialistic sense). The balancing properties of the Universe is sufficient!
Ah, that makes perfect sense :)

It's been scientifically proven that the amount of matter in the universe is constant, it's just in a never ending state of transience between different states of 'being'. Even in the Genesis account it shows that man was transmuted from dust into being a human, symbolically describing the process of something as insignificant (like a single celled organism) transforming into something complex (man) by the 'breath of god/Brahma'. That which is physical has no beginning and no end. There is no such thing as death, merely a transition from one form of existence to another. Consciousness is eternal.

The Hermetic principle of Cause and Effect is exactly what you describe. Anything that happens in the physical universe is merely a product of that which happened before, whether we are aware of it or not. The concept of the mind being the manifestation of these things is reflected in the first Hermetic principle - the All is Mind, the Universe is Mental.

I guess the difference between a Hermetist and a Buddhist is this: the Buddhist believes that the circle of life is a fixed plane of birth, death and rebirth into various states of being until one escapes the Samsara and reaches Nirvana, and then achieves 'oneness'.

The Hermetist believes that life is not a circle, but more of an Archimedes screw of several planes of existence - with souls travelling up and down between each plane as they learn the lessons they need to ascend back to the All and then back down again, with the cycle starting anew. Sometimes, we are required to go back to a previous plane of existence because our soul didn't learn the lesson correctly. Consider it a system of education, rather than of punishment, with different grades.

Those who ascend will have an awareness of the lessons they have learned before - when people have a sixth sense about things, it is that awareness manifesting itself into the conscious world. The pursuit of the Philosopher's Stone is the ability for one to manifest themselves into whatever they want to be. To return to the school as teachers/ascended masters rather than as a student.
 

Snake_Baker

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Pfffft, as if!
Thread starter #4,948
After 200 pages you've finally realised you and TP were talking to different meanings of "god" all along.

As Jason said, there's a difference between the made up religous god character and god-like concepts such as an inner god or some force that connects the natural world.
There is no god outside of my consciousness.
 

Janus

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Lesson Two - In order to get where you are going, you need to know the path

The Tarot is the most esoteric of all information systems. Its origin, once again, came from Hermes Trismegistus. And as Astrology is connected to the Tree of Life, so the Tarot is connected to the Tree of Life, since all three systems come from the same source.

This will take a few posts because there's a lot of stuff to cover :)

The 22 major arcana tell us the path on which every soul is walking to reach enlightenment and the important lessons every soul must learn along the way. The first two cards are:

0 - The Fool - Chokhmah (Wisdom) to Keter (Crown)

The name of this card, and the traditional depiction of it, lends itself to the idea of someone who has their head in the clouds and is unaware of their surroundings. A lot of people would consider this to have negative connotations. It is the concept of 'ignorance is bliss'.

However, in my mental Tarot deck, this card is actually Innocence. It is purity in it's most basic form, the child like attitude one must have if we are to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. This is Eve reaching out to taste of the Tree of Knowledge - the Bible tells us that she was "thoroughly deceived" by the Devil, which meant that she was, in effect, not culpable for what she did due to the lie that she had been told. It is actually to this state that we are trying to reach, hence why the number of this card is zero, or the ouroboros. Nietzsche said that the third and final stage of human development is that of the child, where everything is about infinite possibility. It a purely mental state - pure consciousness. Unfortunately, the advent of physical reality means that we learn pretty quickly that not everything is possible in our current form.

This is both the first and last card in the Tarot deck. It links Wisdom to Crown in that in order to truly ascend we must be able to let go of our ego and accept the will of the cosmic consciousness without trying to force our will onto others. To just 'be'.

1 - The Magician - Keter (Crown) to Binah (Understanding)

The second card in the Tarot deck is the Magician, or Magus. This is the manifestation of the mental into physical reality, combining all four elements and all four aspects of the universe - thought (fire/wands), emotion (water/cups), action (air/swords) and finally manifestation (earth/pentacles). Everything we have or will ever achieve in the physical plane is a combination of these four elements. This is why reality is the product of the mind - as we think, we cause to become. Which is where the Hebrew name of God comes from. Your mental state - your focus - will determine your personal reality. And the collective consciousness of people around you will determine the collective reality. So in effect, the world we see around us is exactly what the collective wants it to be (as sad as that might be).

This is the card that leads away from the Crown in that to gain Understanding we must begin the journey of our physical birth, death and rebirth cycle. You cannot substitute education with experience and a deep realisation of this concept, because otherwise you may be tempted to blame others for your lot in life. Each life we choose on the path is to teach us something about ourselves - even if that lesson is to learn that there is evil in the world.

This is Adam and Eve leaving the Garden of Eden. It is the advent of physical reality in all its beauty and terror.


It is important to gain an insight into the difference between Wisdom and Understanding. Understanding is a selfish emotion - it is the desire to know and a conscious application of knowledge - whereas Wisdom is a selfless emotion - it is not a desire but an awareness and an unconscious application of knowledge. One is exoteric, one is esoteric. This is why Understanding is on the Left-hand path, the Pillar of Jachin and associated with the Luciferian - the eating of the Tree of Knowledge. Those who wish to know everything and cannot accept the Wisdom that says that they will never do so are following the will of their father, the Devil - which is the inability to attribute unknowable aspects of the universe to the collective cosmic consciousness, or God.
 
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