No Oppo Supporters Non Bulldog Footy Talk - Bulldogs only - Part 4

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maddog37

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Aug 25, 2008
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Getting on the AFL sponsored gravy train at GWS sure beats the sh*t out of working for a living.

Thats the beauty of the AFL. If you are considered a legend of the game, It matters not how publicly you fu** the dog, they will always find a way of keeping you employed.

Seems the perfect replacement for Sheedy.
 

BEaston

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Oct 9, 2013
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Very glad to see this change announced by the AFL regarding holding the ball.


For many years now, the AFL have not adjudicated the HTB the rule in accordance with the laws of the game. As per the rule, when you have prior and are tackled, you must dispose of the ball immediately. This wording is absolutely clear in the rules. Unfortunately when it comes to decision making by umpires this isn't the case in reality. Players are given an inordinate amount of time to dispose of the ball, seemingly the more well known of a player you are the more time you get. Gary Ablett's "immediate" was something like two or three full 360 spins with the ball in hand while tackled.

It was always a bug bear of mine that in the discussion around congestion and keeping the game flowing, the AFL (and media) would talk about significant rule changes that would alter the way the game is played. To me the answer (or at least part of it) was always in the rules to begin with. Pay HTB in accordance with the actual laws! I think this will help speed the game up and result in a lot less stoppages, good decision by the AFL.
 

Libbaaaa

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Very glad to see this change announced by the AFL regarding holding the ball.


For many years now, the AFL have not adjudicated the HTB the rule in accordance with the laws of the game. As per the rule, when you have prior and are tackled, you must dispose of the ball immediately. This wording is absolutely clear in the rules. Unfortunately when it comes to decision making by umpires this isn't the case in reality. Players are given an inordinate amount of time to dispose of the ball, seemingly the more well known of a player you are the more time you get. Gary Ablett's "immediate" was something like two or three full 360 spins with the ball in hand while tackled.

It was always a bug bear of mine that in the discussion around congestion and keeping the game flowing, the AFL (and media) would talk about significant rule changes that would alter the way the game is played. To me the answer (or at least part of it) was always in the rules to begin with. Pay HTB in accordance with the actual laws! I think this will help speed the game up and result in a lot less stoppages, good decision by the AFL.
Here's hoping it is consistent. For all the 360/720s we don't want it to go the other way either. Perfect example was in the Prelim when Bailey Dale got pinged for holding the ball in the 2nd quarter 0.00001 after receiving the ball.
 

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ossie_21

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Here's hoping it is consistent. For all the 360/720s we don't want it to go the other way either. Perfect example was in the Prelim when Bailey Dale got pinged for holding the ball in the 2nd quarter 0.00001 after receiving the ball.

Also needs common sense for the “making an attempt” aspect when a bloke is being pinned down by 2 other blokes and can’t move
 

dogwatch

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I reckon where a player is being tackled on the ground without the ball (having had the ball a few moments before) and the tackler tries to bring the ball back in, in order to win a HTB free it should in fact be a free against the tackler who tried to con the umpire.

Giving a free to the tackler in that situation has nothing to do with good play. It's just exploiting a poor interpretation of the rules after the ball has spilled free. It also adds to the congestion of play by stopping the ball coming out from a scrimmage.
 

doggiesin08

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Very glad to see this change announced by the AFL regarding holding the ball.


For many years now, the AFL have not adjudicated the HTB the rule in accordance with the laws of the game. As per the rule, when you have prior and are tackled, you must dispose of the ball immediately. This wording is absolutely clear in the rules. Unfortunately when it comes to decision making by umpires this isn't the case in reality. Players are given an inordinate amount of time to dispose of the ball, seemingly the more well known of a player you are the more time you get. Gary Ablett's "immediate" was something like two or three full 360 spins with the ball in hand while tackled.

It was always a bug bear of mine that in the discussion around congestion and keeping the game flowing, the AFL (and media) would talk about significant rule changes that would alter the way the game is played. To me the answer (or at least part of it) was always in the rules to begin with. Pay HTB in accordance with the actual laws! I think this will help speed the game up and result in a lot less stoppages, good decision by the AFL.
On the strict reading is a player even allowed to attempt to break the tackle? In just about every game we see Bont get momentarily tackled and his “immediate” action is to shrug or break out of it. Even if successful in doing so, by definition he has not immediately disposed of the ball.

My issue with the rule is that it is not consistently applied but l think the average strictness is ok. Sometimes they give too much time and others are too harsh.

To get rid of congestion I’d much rather the crackdown be on time wasting when giving the ball back after a free kick. Give the player some leniency if he throws the ball to the wrong opposition player in the area but give them very little time. Also clean up the nonsense when a player is standing on the mark with the ball his legs and won’t pick it up and throw it back.
 

Northernsoul74

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On the strict reading is a player even allowed to attempt to break the tackle? In just about every game we see Bont get momentarily tackled and his “immediate” action is to shrug or break out of it. Even if successful in doing so, by definition he has not immediately disposed of the ball.

My issue with the rule is that it is not consistently applied but l think the average strictness is ok. Sometimes they give too much time and others are too harsh.

To get rid of congestion I’d much rather the crackdown be on time wasting when giving the ball back after a free kick. Give the player some leniency if he throws the ball to the wrong opposition player in the area but give them very little time. Also clean up the nonsense when a player is standing on the mark with the ball his legs and won’t pick it up and throw it back.
Bont certainly got pinged for htb a lot more last year.
 

BEaston

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On the strict reading is a player even allowed to attempt to break the tackle? In just about every game we see Bont get momentarily tackled and his “immediate” action is to shrug or break out of it. Even if successful in doing so, by definition he has not immediately disposed of the ball.

My issue with the rule is that it is not consistently applied but l think the average strictness is ok. Sometimes they give too much time and others are too harsh.

To get rid of congestion I’d much rather the crackdown be on time wasting when giving the ball back after a free kick. Give the player some leniency if he throws the ball to the wrong opposition player in the area but give them very little time. Also clean up the nonsense when a player is standing on the mark with the ball his legs and won’t pick it up and throw it back.
Would depend on if they have prior or not. With this interpretation change, I daresay we will see a lot of players choosing to dispose of the ball before they even get tackled. It should actually really favour a team like ours as our midfield are elite at quick ball use in close. Some of the best hands in the game.
 

ScragCity

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On the strict reading is a player even allowed to attempt to break the tackle? In just about every game we see Bont get momentarily tackled and his “immediate” action is to shrug or break out of it. Even if successful in doing so, by definition he has not immediately disposed of the ball.

My issue with the rule is that it is not consistently applied but l think the average strictness is ok. Sometimes they give too much time and others are too harsh.

To get rid of congestion I’d much rather the crackdown be on time wasting when giving the ball back after a free kick. Give the player some leniency if he throws the ball to the wrong opposition player in the area but give them very little time. Also clean up the nonsense when a player is standing on the mark with the ball his legs and won’t pick it up and throw it back.

Yep I think we are going to see a lot of "weak" tackles now getting rewarded. We have a team that are very good at breaking tackles. Maybe the best in the league. Guys like Bont, Bailey Smith, Bailey Williams are all excellent and breaking through a weak tackle. I loved watching them shrug off lesser opponents and go on their way. Now they want to turn it into touch footy. That's a bit soft imo. Good tackle technique is no longer important, just put your hands on the bloke and if he doesn't respect your crap tackle you'll get a free. What exactly does that achieve for the game? Nothing good.
 

BEaston

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Yep I think we are going to see a lot of "weak" tackles now getting rewarded. We have a team that are very good at breaking tackles. Maybe the best in the league. Guys like Bont, Bailey Smith, Bailey Williams are all excellent and breaking through a weak tackle. I loved watching them shrug off lesser opponents and go on their way. Now they want to turn it into touch footy. That's a bit soft imo. Good tackle technique is no longer important, just put your hands on the bloke and if he doesn't respect your crap tackle you'll get a free. What exactly does that achieve for the game? Nothing good.
Putting your hands on someone doesn't constitute a tackle. You have to actually hold the player.

Good is subjective but it will reduce congestion, which quickens the game up. It will increase the importance on clean disposal which makes for a more skillful game. I think both of those things are good.

I think the main reason the AFL are doing it though, is that it will likely reduce injuries... especially concussion injuries. Softer, maybe. Good... hmm probably if you're a player.
 

weltschmerz

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Yep I think we are going to see a lot of "weak" tackles now getting rewarded. We have a team that are very good at breaking tackles. Maybe the best in the league. Guys like Bont, Bailey Smith, Bailey Williams are all excellent and breaking through a weak tackle. I loved watching them shrug off lesser opponents and go on their way. Now they want to turn it into touch footy. That's a bit soft imo. Good tackle technique is no longer important, just put your hands on the bloke and if he doesn't respect your crap tackle you'll get a free. What exactly does that achieve for the game? Nothing good.

In his handful of matches Rhylee West has caught my eye with this ability too. Very difficult man to tackle.
 

ScragCity

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BTW, it's no secret within the industry that the Scott brothers hate Bevo and they hate the way we play.
Chris Scott's ridiculously over-the-top celebration when they beat us last year was as much to do with who they beat, as it was to do with the circumstances under which they won.
 

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footscray1973

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BTW, it's no secret within the industry that the Scott brothers hate Bevo and they hate the way we play.
Chris Scott's ridiculously over-the-top celebration when they beat us last year was as much to do with who they beat, as it was to do with the circumstances under which they won.
Was very obvious on AFL 360 or whatever the show is called following our 2016 GF win. Buckley and CScott were on as guests, and Buckley was quite open and pragmatic in his admiration at what Bevo had achieved with us. Then Whateley or Robinson turned to Scott, and he basically refused to acknowledge anything of the sort, and I believe said internally at least at KP that we were not the best team in 2016 because we didn't beat Geelong! When people look back at the premiers in years to come, no one except embittered Chris Scott is going to say "ah, the Bulldogs may have been premiers in 2016 but they failed to beat Geelong in the H&A games, so there is an asterisk there". (And of course Swans supporters and old mate Plonker35 on the Saints board who will whine about umpiring ad infinitum. Sadly for them, it won't re-write any record books.)
 

Virgin Dog

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Was very obvious on AFL 360 or whatever the show is called following our 2016 GF win. Buckley and CScott were on as guests, and Buckley was quite open and pragmatic in his admiration at what Bevo had achieved with us. Then Whateley or Robinson turned to Scott, and he basically refused to acknowledge anything of the sort, and I believe said internally at least at KP that we were not the best team in 2016 because we didn't beat Geelong! When people look back at the premiers in years to come, no one except embittered Chris Scott is going to say "ah, the Bulldogs may have been premiers in 2016 but they failed to beat Geelong in the H&A games, so there is an asterisk there". (And of course Swans supporters and old mate Plonker35 on the Saints board who will whine about umpiring ad infinitum. Sadly for them, it won't re-write any record books.)
In 2015, Hawthorn lost to Essendon (15th), Port twice (9th), GWS (11th), Sydney (4th), Richmond (5th) and West Coast (2nd). Nice range of finalists and non-finalists, including losing a final against their eventual GF opponent. The WA teams were brilliant, and the Hawks weren't even top two, let alone the minor premier, yet is there anyone who really doubts that the Hawks were the best team in 2015?
 

bobs head soup

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BTW, it's no secret within the industry that the Scott brothers hate Bevo and they hate the way we play.
Chris Scott's ridiculously over-the-top celebration when they beat us last year was as much to do with who they beat, as it was to do with the circumstances under which they won.
Which makes Chris Scott's empathizing with the conditions dealt to us in 2021 all the more telling (when he said in GF week that no team should ever again have to go through what the Bulldogs were put through to get to the 2021 GF).
 

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