Oppo Camp Oliver Henry (Traded to Geelong 2022)

[TheGreatGrundy]

What did Sier do playing as a forward against Coburg?

I wasn't suggesting playing him as a forward. Pendlebury or Sidebottom could play in attack. Sier is good for one position.

 

[jackcass]

I wasn't suggesting playing him as a forward. Pendlebury or Sidebottom could play in attack. Sier is good for one position.

And therein lies the problem. You're suggesting we make other changes to accommodate him. We already have so many changes week to week that another just for the sake of it makes little sense when we need to get some stability into the team. Sier will get his chance when there's a spot available in the midfield. Might even be this week if Murphy doesn't get up.

Sier is actually ranked 7th for clearances/game (2.4) this year behind both Sidey (4.14) and Pendles (4.62) who are in our top 3 at the club, and even behind Tyler Brown (2.75). Pendles and Sidey had 14 clearances between them Saturday.

Bringing in Sier to replace Henry makes no sense given we actually want/need Henry getting these development opportunities. Hopefully when Sier does his chance he can get back to something like his 4 clearances a game or better of 2018 and 2020, and push for something north of 70% game time.

 

[ipswichpies]

Thought the same at the time.

Never mind. He has some tools and while he looks to be keeping his head up and cracking in, we ought to keep him in seniors in a development year.

I think he stays in too until he runs out of steam then give him a break but only for a week or 2 at the most, much prefer him playing most weeks unless (god forbid) injured or badly out of form. I would like to see Ginnevan given a go as well as he seems to have a few tricks, quite interesting times coming up for Collingwood fans and who would have thought at xmas.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

And therein lies the problem. You're suggesting we make other changes to accommodate him. We already have so many changes week to week that another just for the sake of it makes little sense when we need to get some stability into the team. Sier will get his chance when there's a spot available in the midfield. Might even be this week if Murphy doesn't get up.

Sier is actually ranked 7th for clearances/game (2.4) this year behind both Sidey (4.14) and Pendles (4.62) who are in our top 3 at the club, and even behind Tyler Brown (2.75). Pendles and Sidey had 14 clearances between them Saturday.

Bringing in Sier to replace Henry makes no sense given we actually want/need Henry getting these development opportunities. Hopefully when Sier does his chance he can get back to something like his 4 clearances a game or better of 2018 and 2020, and push for something north of 70% game time.

There is a spot available in the midfield, particularly against the Swans, for a big bodied inner mid who reads Grundy's taps. Seems to me a more important need than a mid sized forward with a skinny frame likely to generate only a few possessions a game at this stage of his career.

 

[jackcass]

I think he stays in too until he runs out of steam then give him a break but only for a week or 2 at the most, much prefer him playing most weeks unless (god forbid) injured or badly out of form. I would like to see Ginnevan given a go as well as he seems to have a few tricks, quite interesting times coming up for Collingwood fans and who would have thought at xmas.

I think Ginnivan needs to back up his performance Saturday a couple of times before he comes into consideration. It's not just about the scoreboard impact but his forward pressure as well. Saturday he knocked on the door. But as with all these kids I'd like to see them smashing down that door to get a senior gig rather than them getting games because there's no one else which has been the case too often this season.

 

[jackcass]

There is a spot available in the midfield, particularly against the Swans, for a big bodied inner mid who reads Grundy's taps. Seems to me a more important need than a mid sized forward with a skinny frame likely to generate only a few possessions a game at this stage of his career.

I'm 1 of Sier's biggest supporters on these boards and I want him in the team as much as anyone. But happy for him to wait for his chance rather than artificially create 1, so happy to agree to disagree.

 

[LuckyLee]

I don’t really understand why he looks petrified out there. He’s probably already a better player at VFL level than half the dudes running around for the opposition last night and he still looked scared. Macrae also was very nervous in his games too. Just haven’t really noticed it before in our young players.

McCreery and Poulter on the other hand have both come in and looked like they belonged straight away. Murphy too, under slightly different circumstances. With some players you can immediately tell that they’re going to make it at AFL level.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[gouki88]

He looks undersized and lacks a competitive edge to my eye. Don't like that someone that skinny can also look that slow and weak.

Another unfair and unbalanced assessment

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

I'm 1 of Sier's biggest supporters on these boards and I want him in the team as much as anyone. But happy for him to wait for his chance rather than artificially create 1, so happy to agree to disagree.

I don't want him to wait because his form warrants a call up and his particular skill set is in big demand in our midfield. If he is not selected soon and given regular games I do not see him staying at the club next year, and I would have him well ahead of Tyson Brown as our main inside mid in the absence of Adams.

 

[jackcass]

I don't want him to wait because his form warrants a call up and his particular skill set is in big demand in our midfield. If he is not selected soon and given regular games I do not see him staying at the club next year, and I would have him well ahead of Tyson Brown as our main inside mid in the absence of Adams.

I still question that's as clear cut as you suggest. The things he needed to work on and improve are still on display. Primarily, he remains all too often a spectator. IMHO, Coburg's periods of dominance in the 2nd and 4th quarters occurred when they were getting the clearances and all too often it was Sier's opponent getting the footy clear while Sier watched them do it. I accept that's a flaw in his game and that his inclusion will come at a cost, other posters not so much so. It seems the selectors agree.

I think Sier and T Brown bring different things to the midfield but happy to see Brown getting his opportunity in what I think is his best spot.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

18 year old undersized. Not the first to be in their first year and considered skinny.

Competitive Edge isn't a worry , we saw his attack earlier in the pre season with his marking ability. You don't take those type of marks if you are timid and lack competitive edge, hence why he has got games at senior level

I feel like you will be eating humble pie within a couple of years when he puts on a bit of size. As this kid looks the goods and has smarts from what ive seen

Im getting Jimmy Bartel vibes with his marking and versatility.

Yeah I hope so too. Also hope its ok to still have an opinion.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

Absolutely, we shouldn't even be questioning the poor kid. He looks elite to me with his skill set, just a matter of confidence and time, he is going to be very hard to stop and match up on once he gets more games

We shouldn't even be questioning the poor kid? Why not? He is now a professional athlete, he should get used to the judgement. I hope I am wrong about him, I was wrong about Josh Daicos pretty recently too. But I am still able to say on a forum what I think of his talent.

 

[OniAu]

Yeah I hope so too. Also hope its ok to still have an opinion.

Oh hundred percent. Sorry did re read my post might've seemed aggressive so do apologise!!

Probably of the group , im concerned most about Rantall. But again he wasnt played in proper position on his debut. Plus still early days.

McCreery
Poulter
McRae
Henry
Rantall
Ruscoe

in that order so far of confidence in their game being good enough for afl level.

I think we need to remember the last two draft groups have had a lot less exposure at Under 18 (2020 draft group) and VFL level ( 2019 draft group). Playing Under 18s as a top ager and dominating the comp would help you develop so much more and put your confidence through the roof.

 

[Jelly Bean]

Oh hundred percent. Sorry did re read my post might've seemed aggressive so do apologise!!

Probably of the group , im concerned most about Rantall. But again he wasnt played in proper position on his debut. Plus still early days.

McCreery
Poulter
McRae
Henry
Rantall
Ruscoe

in that order so far of confidence in their game being good enough for afl level.

I think we need to remember the last two draft groups have had a lot less exposure at Under 18 (2020 draft group) and VFL level ( 2019 draft group). Playing Under 18s as a top ager and dominating the comp would help you develop so much more and put your confidence through the roof.

Interesting. That may be the order (I have a different opinion, but that's beside the point), but I think more importantly I don't think any look to be certainties to make it (let's say 'making it' is playing 100 games). I think Macrae looks to me to be the best, followed by Poulter, but I think there is a bit of doubt on all of them.

 

[mike123]

There is a spot available in the midfield, particularly against the Swans, for a big bodied inner mid who reads Grundy's taps.

That spot goes to Crisp

 

[TradeDraft]

Interesting. That may be the order (I have a different opinion, but that's beside the point), but I think more importantly I don't think any look to be certainties to make it (let's say 'making it' is playing 100 games). I think Macrae looks to me to be the best, followed by Poulter, but I think there is a bit of doubt on all of them.

Vic Kids Missed last year because of Covid so there no Defintates yet with it being only 1st Half of there 1st or 2nd Season

 

[CasuallyDressed]

He looks a bit lost at AFL level but looks good at VFL level... probably needs to develop in the seconds.

I think he's gonna be a good player though.

 

[TradeDraft]

He looks a bit lost at AFL level but looks good at VFL level... probably needs to develop in the seconds.

I think he's gonna be a good player though.

How is going to find the Pace of AFL playing in the VFL?

 

[Jen2310]

He looks a bit lost at AFL level but looks good at VFL level... probably needs to develop in the seconds.

I think he's gonna be a good player though.

VFL will do nothing for him. The pace is different. How many goals and marks do you want him to take? lol He just needs to get used to the AFL pace, and with more games he will.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

VFL will do nothing for him. The pace is different. How many goals and marks do you want him to take? lol He just needs to get used to the AFL pace, and with more games he will.

Well, Stephenson kicked 38 goals from 26 games in his first year with us, and he wasn't good enough to stay on our list.

But seriously, I think people are rating him on performing in the VFL, because he hasn't done anything at AFL level yet. So maybe he has a year dominating VFL, that would be good for his confidence and deployment anyway. Getting destroyed by Rampe and Lloyd at the SCG this week is not a good thing for his belief.

 

[mike123]

VFL will do nothing for him. The pace is different. How many goals and marks do you want him to take? lol He just needs to get used to the AFL pace, and with more games he will.

I just want him to play a role that suits his strength. I don’t rate his type in the forward line.

 

[Jen2310]

I just want him to play a role that suits his strength. I don’t rate his type in the forward line.

He'll be fine in the forward line. Same height as Stevo, and is more of a contested mark.
Once he adjusts to the pace, he'll be okay.

 

[mike123]

He'll be fine in the forward line. Same height as Stevo, and is more of a contested mark.
Once he adjusts to the pace, he'll be okay.

Stephenson wasn’t much of an aerialist but his pace allowed him separation so he was such a threat on the lead. I haven’t seen that from Henry yet. But even then I’d say Stephenson is much better utilised on the wing.

 

[ClaytonM]

VFL will do nothing for him. The pace is different. How many goals and marks do you want him to take? lol He just needs to get used to the AFL pace, and with more games he will.

I don’t agree with the argument VFL does nothing to develop these kids. All of them would learn plenty playing in the VFL. If we were a strong team most of them would still be playing VFL now. It would not in any way be detrimental to them this early into their careers.

Would much prefer all of these kids spending most of the year in the VFL getting use to life as a professional athlete and getting use to its demands. Unfortunately we do not have that luxury now and many of them will probably get more AFL exposure than they should.

For most of them VFL is probably the right pace for their level of development at the moment. So far only McCreery and Poulter have shown signs they are ready enough to have their development fast track at the highest level. Even then I expect their loads will need to be managed and spells in the VFL required.

 

[sr36]

Oh hundred percent. Sorry did re read my post might've seemed aggressive so do apologise!!

Probably of the group , im concerned most about Rantall. But again he wasnt played in proper position on his debut. Plus still early days.

McCreery
Poulter
McRae
Henry
Rantall
Ruscoe

in that order so far of confidence in their game being good enough for afl level.

I think we need to remember the last two draft groups have had a lot less exposure at Under 18 (2020 draft group) and VFL level ( 2019 draft group). Playing Under 18s as a top ager and dominating the comp would help you develop so much more and put your confidence through the roof.

I'm no judge of the kids and haven't seen much, but it looks like a really good group. I like the chances of a fair few of them in this order:

Poulter
Henry
Ruscoe
Keane
Mcreery
Wilson
Chugg
Ginnivan

I've got no idea about Bianco, Rantall, Macrae, Kelly and Tohill.