Ongoing Test match XI speculation thread.

[99 Problems]

People are going to be seriously disappointed if they actually expect mass changes short term. We are 12 months out from an ashes with no guarantee of how much cricket we will actually play between now and then.

Without a serious drop in form or injury between now and then Warner, Marnus, Smith, Green, Paine, Hazlewood and Cummins will be in the XI for the first test. I’d add Pucovski as highly likely if he can get back in time for South Africa.

Lyon is definitely under pressure, but someone will need to finish the shield season well to come in. Pucovski could slot in at opener or 5, but there’s a batting spot available either way. Starc is almost definitely coming out. I think Neser would do well in SA, but I think with the ashes in mind Pattinson and Richardson probably come in to our rotation. One thing we learned for sure this series is you need a squad of quicks if you’re going to continually take 20 wickets against a good side, so maybe all 5 play next summer.

 

[Docker82]

Pucovski
Warner
Labuschagne
Smith
Wade
Head
Green
Henriques
Paine
Carey
Lyon
Swepson
Starc
Hazlewood
Cummins
Pattinson
Richardson
Neser

When that’s the test squad for South Africa (or at least very close) the melts on here will be delicious.

The sad thing is though, I don’t think the selectors can actually do much better with what’s available.

Outside of returning to batsman who are the wrong side of 34, I honestly don’t see much improvement to the above. Pucovski and Green are the best two young talents in the country and the selectors have already picked them.

 

[The Passenger]

One thing we learned for sure this series is you need a squad of quicks if you’re going to continually take 20 wickets against a good side, so maybe all 5 play next summer.

Gee our bowlers looked tired in this last test. If there was one criticism of the selectors - and I must say this is in hindsight because I didn't call it at the time - is we should have bought Neser in for the second or third test to get Starc geared up for one big push at the end.

Think back to the Ashes 2019 and our bowlers just looked fresh every game, and we didn't even play an all rounder till the last test.

I said somewhere else (maybe earlier this thread) that I think the selectors view the gap between Starc and Neser as to large, as opposed to 2019 were it was mostly a three way battle between Starc, Pattinson and Siddle for the last quick bowling spot (in one test two of them played), whom they seemed to consider (at that time) reasonably similar standard of player.

If Pattinson or Richardson are up and about I think we'll see a return to this policy, but even if they take longer than hoped to get their bodies right, I think Neser will perform more than adequately in a rotational set up and we need to consider this option. If Neser gets a chance, I don't see him setting the world on fire, but I've seen enough of him to know he won't let anyone down.

 

[The Passenger]

The sad thing is though, I don’t think the selectors can actually do much better with what’s available.

Outside of returning to batsman who are the wrong side of 34, I honestly don’t see much improvement to the above. Pucovski and Green are the best two young talents in the country and the selectors have already picked them.

Ultimately this - selectors can only choose from what they've got in front of them. They can't just magically pull something out of their ass. For every Labuschagne that comes in and kills it unexpectedly*, there's an absolute minimum of 20 blokes that perform as expected to their middle of the road first class performances (Shaun Marsh, Usman Khawaja, Joe Burns) or can't even reach their moderate first class performances (Aaron Finch, Alex Doolan, Cameron Bancroft).

There's a reason those sort of 50/50 selections and guys like Smith, Cummins, Hazlewood are locks every talk we walk out and we all throw our toys out of the cot when the selectors don't go our way on the 50/50's but the reality is this - the 50/50 guys that were picked won't win us matches on any sort of regular basis and they 50/50 guys who weren't picked won't win us matches on any sort of regular basis.

*And there is still every chance Labu's career with plateau and his average drops into the mid 40's, which would still be more than good enough to hold down our #3 spot.

 

[to1994]

As much as I'm critical of the state of the Shield competition, and the impact of the Big Bash, I think something stinks with the coaching setup. IMHO, it takes a fair bit of talent and commitment to score a Test century against a half-decent opposition. Over the last few years we've had Wade, Renshaw, Handscomb, Patterson, Marsh x2, Burns, Khawaja, all perform pretty well in brief patches, and then either (a) fail to fix technical issues, or (b) completely lose confidence / form.

The talent is there, but we aren't capitalizing on it.

If you are India, with a population of 1.2 billion, where everyone is cricket-mad, you can probably afford to be cavalier about discarding players that aren't-quite-up-to-it. We have 1/50th their population (and lots of other competing sports). We need to put more effort into nurturing the talent that comes through.

Labuschagne is potentially some evidence supporting your claim.

Appeared to be going nowhere in the Shield and suddenly has a ridiculously good county season under the guidance of coaches in England. It could have been a coincidence but with how few young players actually dominate our FC competion it was certainly odd.

 

[ozaddy]

Labuschagne is potentially some evidence supporting your claim.

Appeared to be going nowhere in the Shield and suddenly has a ridiculously good county season under the guidance of coaches in England. It could have been a coincidence but with how few young players actually dominate our FC competion it was certainly odd.

Let's not forget without a barrel load of luck labuschange would have been out early in nearly every innings

Sent from my Mi9 Pro 5G using Tapatalk

 

[The hands of stone]

Atleast give some hope to us supporters and lets hope its not our best team

Sent from my Mi9 Pro 5G using Tapatalk

There is always hope , currently there isn't anything that will greatly improve our batting to come in. Doesn't mean in 6 months there wont be though.

We possible need to identify batters who have the technique , game and grit for test cricket rather then getting too stuck on 'stats' in our first class games.

Runs is the obvious currency but it doesnt mean success at the higher level.

 

[LordLucifer]

Usman Khawaja to come in and bat 5 for the SA and home Ashes on the flat pitches anyone? Experienced player, cashes in on roads and also still averages 40 in Tests.

Khwaja cannot produce at Test level, looks great in all of the lower forms of the game though.

 

[LordLucifer]

Warner
Puc
Laba
Smith
Usman
Green ??
Carey ??
Pattinson ??
Cummins
Sweepson ??
Hoff ??

Or potentially another quick for Sweepson in South Africa.

 

[Port85]

The level of planning, strategy and rotation of the fast bowling squad for the 2019 Ashes was immense.

Yes, we probably finished 2-2 almost entirely to Smith with the bat, but the bowling was extremely competitive and that should be the standard with our approach to bowling in all test series.

 

[JackOutback]

I don’t think wholesale change is necessary but maybe it’s time to pick someone young that has been identified as having the potential to step up and simply getting them in early, like a Street or Phillippe. With no compelling case for senior players, it might be time to plan for the future as well as the present.

 

[LordLucifer]

We need a genuine leg-spinner in the team, I realise that Lyon has been good but more times than not, he 'contains' the batsmen, doesn't dismiss them.

Is young Green really the player the selectors were hoping for ?? Hasn't taken a wicket in his short Test tenure and looks a tad slow in the field, hope he reaches his zenith.

I have always hated Warner in the Test team and after he became Broad's bunny in England, that should have signalled his demise, it's time to wrap up this sad chapter.

1. Pucovski
2. Renshaw
3. TBA
4. Labuschagne
5. Smith
6. Green
7. Inglis
8. TBA
9. Hazlewood
10. Cummins
11. Swepson

 

[L_W_P]

Pucovski
Warner/Renshaw
Labuschagne
Green
Smith
Inglis
Lyon
Swepson
Cummins
Hazelwood
Richardson

We just dont have the depth of batsmen right now so why no go all in on the bowling? I know people take the piss out of Lyon but he has a great record so I would back him in through the Ashes.

 

[hawkman]

Is young Green really the player the selectors were hoping for ?? Hasn't taken a wicket in his short Test tenure and looks a tad slow in the field, hope he reaches his zenith.

Young player averaging 34 with the bat, i doubt they will be that disappointed

Also looks to a very good gully fielder

 

[theyellowsash]

Gee our bowlers looked tired in this last test. If there was one criticism of the selectors - and I must say this is in hindsight because I didn't call it at the time - is we should have bought Neser in for the second or third test to get Starc geared up for one big push at the end.

Think back to the Ashes 2019 and our bowlers just looked fresh every game, and we didn't even play an all rounder till the last test.

I said somewhere else (maybe earlier this thread) that I think the selectors view the gap between Starc and Neser as to large, as opposed to 2019 were it was mostly a three way battle between Starc, Pattinson and Siddle for the last quick bowling spot (in one test two of them played), whom they seemed to consider (at that time) reasonably similar standard of player.

If Pattinson or Richardson are up and about I think we'll see a return to this policy, but even if they take longer than hoped to get their bodies right, I think Neser will perform more than adequately in a rotational set up and we need to consider this option. If Neser gets a chance, I don't see him setting the world on fire, but I've seen enough of him to know he won't let anyone down.

Maybe using the all rounder to bowl would have helped keep the bowlers a bit fresher.

And both Cummins and Hazelwood were fine, they only got tired in Brisbane because they basically had to bowl for 2 out if 3 days and had to shoulder the load, because Starc couldn't be relied upon and we didn't have an all rounder to bowl some overs.

Starc wasn't tired, he's just overrated. He bowled about as good as I'd expect.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Now somebody is criticising Green in the field?

Good stuff to be found on here atm.

 

[LordLucifer]

Now somebody is criticising Green in the field?

Good stuff to be found on here atm.

It's not 'somebody', it was me.

In close in the gully he looked fine but out deep on the boundary he looked like he was struggling to pick up the flight and direction of the ball and reacted a little slower than expected. May be an issue or it could be that he doesn't normally field in the deep outfield, time will tell.

 

[LordLucifer]

Young player averaging 34 with the bat, i doubt they will be that disappointed

Also looks to a very good gully fielder

If he is to be a genuine all-rounder, he needs to start taking some wickets. It's hard to understand why he isn't though.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

It's not 'somebody', it was me.

In close in the gully he looked fine but out deep on the boundary he looked like he was struggling to pick up the flight and direction of the ball and reacted a little slower than expected. May be an issue or it could be that he doesn't normally field in the deep outfield, time will tell.

Well we all are somebody fair enough. In reality he isn’t an outfielder and it’s honestly a waste to have him fielding out there. More tactical brilliance I suppose.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Can we put together a video of a swinging ball to show to Langer a la Ramsay on Kitchen Nightmares?

Starc: Look at the swinging ball JL.
Langer: That’s amazing Mitch, pack your bags for SA.
Starc: I’ve got something to tell you JL.
Langer: Jesus. What’s Warner done now?
Starc: I didn’t swing that ball. Neser did.
Langer: Nes. I don’t know what to say.
Neser: You don’t have to stick with Starc’s buffet, JL.
Lyon: What about me?
Neser: Or Lyon’s flavourless pies.

 

[melanChronic]

If he is to be a genuine all-rounder, he needs to start taking some wickets. It's hard to understand why he isn't though.

It's very easy to understand. He's bowled 1 or 2 over spells as a glorified change of ends bowler, with the constant threat of being dragged if he goes for a boundary or doesn't immediately present a threatening delivery. Long-term issue with allrounders has been the captain has no clue how to use them effectively.

 

[corbies]

McDermott in long format averages a average 34. Also Head bowls and was described better than a part timer by Ponting

His first class bowling average is 68. It's not like it's a small sample size either, he's bowled nearly 5000 balls in first class cricket. It's not even economically he goes at 3.87 an over. His bowling isn't even worthy of being described as part time, it is just utter shit and it is bewildering that he bowls himself so often for South Australia.

 

[corbies]

Can we put together a video of a swinging ball to show to Langer a la Ramsay on Kitchen Nightmares?

Starc: Look at the swinging ball JL.
Langer: That’s amazing Mitch, pack your bags for SA.
Starc: I’ve got something to tell you JL.
Langer: Jesus. What’s Warner done now?
Starc: I didn’t swing that ball. Neser did.
Langer: Nes. I don’t know what to say.
Neser: You don’t have to stick with Starc’s buffet, JL.
Lyon: What about me?
Neser: Or Lyon’s flavourless pies.

I miss the days when Michael Neser was your sworn enemy.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Jhye is the obvious successor to Starc. Without any FC cricket in so long though, it's too soon to bring him in now. I'd probably go back to Pattinson for South Africa if he is fit and hope that Jhye is ready to go in the next year or so. Starc is just too inconsistent and has failed to get it done against quality opposition too many times now.

 

[Voice of the G]

Warner
Pucovoski
Labs
Smith
Maxwell
Green
Carey
Pattinson
Cummins
Hazlewood
Swepson

That is the side I would seriously look at but important to remember that Maxwell has only played 1 day and T20 cricket in the last 18 months and will have to make a big adjustment to his game for test cricket and I would doubt they would even select him at this stage.