AFL Other games similar to Draftstars and Moneyball

Mar 15, 2019
7
2
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Hey mate, if you're looking for other places to compete in Daily Fantasy Sports for real money, then yes there's a couple of other options for Australians.

Draftstars offer the biggest prizepools for AFL, and Moneyball have been around the longest. Both are great options. Another option is PlayON, who operate out of the UK but they are licensed in Australia and offer AFL contests. Their pools are pretty small but they run qualifiers into larger "Super" contests - last year their major one was a $100,000 prize pool which is obviously good money.

Other options are fantasy AFL betting contests at TopBetta and SportChamps. They are not traditional DFS, but more fantasy betting against other punters which can be fun also.

The last option for Australians is DraftKings. They don't yet offer AFL but there is word of it happening in future. They have enormous prize pools, regularly in excess of US$1,000,000 but you're competing against international players, and a lot of them are very good. If you're into NBA, NFL, Golf, etc, then definitely worth checking out.
 

burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
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AFL Club
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The last option for Australians is DraftKings. They don't yet offer AFL but there is word of it happening in future. They have enormous prize pools, regularly in excess of US$1,000,000 but you're competing against international players, and a lot of them are very good. If you're into NBA, NFL, Golf, etc, then definitely worth checking out.
Any idea when DK will be available in SA? Or when of our current options will offer MMA/UFC contests?
 

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Mar 15, 2019
7
2
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Its a licencing issue with SA, and I can't see that being a high priority for DK at this stage I'm afraid.

MMA is only offered at DK, which doesn't help you if you're in SA!
 

GAsnr

Club Legend
May 17, 2013
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Are these only profitable if you have big bank and can submit multiple entries? Just at first glance it seems like a lot of the comps are won by people with heaps of teams. Not many by standalone entries.
 

Gift

Club Legend
Aug 24, 2005
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Obviously more teams means its easier to win but there is risk involved in outlaying that kind of money.

If you are good at AFL Fantasy then it is possible to win one of the top prizes with only a couple entries.
 

burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
1,757
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AFL Club
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Are these only profitable if you have big bank and can submit multiple entries? Just at first glance it seems like a lot of the comps are won by people with heaps of teams. Not many by standalone entries.
Correct. They are ruining it for the casual player. You see them often with 300 entries on a day, how can anyone compete with that?! They rarely win single entry games either so isn't a case of them being too good, they just have a bankroll few can compete with

DFS won't grow here until that's sorted but it's so F'n sad seeing these DFS 'pros' entering the $2 games. Just LOL. Give off the impression you're successful/rich then enter $2 games. Not fooling anyone with that...
 

Bucking Bronco

Team Captain
May 5, 2014
329
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Correct. They are ruining it for the casual player. You see them often with 300 entries on a day, how can anyone compete with that?! They rarely win single entry games either so isn't a case of them being too good, they just have a bankroll few can compete with

DFS won't grow here until that's sorted but it's so F'n sad seeing these DFS 'pros' entering the $2 games. Just LOL. Give off the impression you're successful/rich then enter $2 games. Not fooling anyone with that...
The top guy on there has $800K of profit off the site, and the other top handful are in the hundred thousands territory too, so they do have pretty decent skill which shows up in the long run.

Totally agree about them spamming the 30 teams in the big pool entries and then you go head-to-head with them in the 1v1 vs their "best team" and you beat them 75% of the time.

It would be good if you could only enter 1 team in the pooled entries, but then I guess you would get only a couple of hundred entries and the prize pool would be minuscule, or maybe doing it that way would attract more players?

I just gave up entering teams in the pooled games unless I had a team I was really, really confident in.

It's so annoying seeing the top team which is an iteration of 29 other ones that were entered that has David Mackay or Patrick Ambrose as the one player unique to that particular team in the one game of the year where they score over 100.

It's just really hard to win.

I've given up playing it now.

I finished in the top 10 of about 8 games when I was playing during the first 8 rounds and got up to about $500 profit 2 or 3 times only to end up losing it.

I think once the year wears on there is little value in it because the edge of knowing who is in the midst of having a breakout season is already common knowledge and you can't capitalise off it.

You know, guys like Bowes etc, early on were booming and people were leaving them out, but it's kind of much more luck based now.

You get the odd positional change like Dunkley back into the mids and people miss him for the first couple of weeks of that, but largely that's the only window of opportunity you can get at this stage of the year.
 

iluvparis

Hall of Famer
Apr 1, 2005
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It makes sense though - 75% of the team each week is probably locks so if you have enough money you just spam entries varying the other 25% as much as possible to try and scoop the win.
 

burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
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The top guy on there has $800K of profit off the site, and the other top handful are in the hundred thousands territory too, so they do have pretty decent skill which shows up in the long run.
This is "winnings", not profit. They enter $4k worth of teams to win $4.1K a lot of the time then the tracking site shows winnings as 4.1k.

I finished 3rd in the GF last year, had I chosen Shuey over Redden I'd have won it. Haven't got close since that. Think my best this year is a 15th and 9th in a comp to win the ticket. I'll pack it in if I lose my money, not depositing to play against 300 entries from people. No skill in that

Still happy being up over the 3 years I've played but it's pointless now with the 'pros' scatter gunning teams at the rate they are
 

Bucking Bronco

Team Captain
May 5, 2014
329
490
AFL Club
Fremantle
This is "winnings", not profit. They enter $4k worth of teams to win $4.1K a lot of the time then the tracking site shows winnings as 4.1k.

I finished 3rd in the GF last year, had I chosen Shuey over Redden I'd have won it. Haven't got close since that. Think my best this year is a 15th and 9th in a comp to win the ticket. I'll pack it in if I lose my money, not depositing to play against 300 entries from people. No skill in that

Still happy being up over the 3 years I've played but it's pointless now with the 'pros' scatter gunning teams at the rate they are
Oh, wow, I didn't realise that.

Still, that guy with Arnold Schwarzenegger in his profile pic seems to get $1,000 payouts every second friday night, so I'd imagine he stills makes a decent amount.
 

burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
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AFL Club
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Oh, wow, I didn't realise that.

Still, that guy with Arnold Schwarzenegger in his profile pic seems to get $1,000 payouts every second friday night, so I'd imagine he stills makes a decent amount.
Yeah that's the guy who enters the $2 games too so would someone who makes as much as they make you think waste their time on $2 entries? I don't think so personally

He's won 3 or 4 main games that I've seen too so has to be an element of skill but I think if most DFS players with a modicum of knowledge could afford $5K+ on entries a weekend they'd have similar successes. I may be in the minority with that belief though
 

GAsnr

Club Legend
May 17, 2013
1,431
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Spurs, Pacers
Correct. They are ruining it for the casual player. You see them often with 300 entries on a day, how can anyone compete with that?! They rarely win single entry games either so isn't a case of them being too good, they just have a bankroll few can compete with

DFS won't grow here until that's sorted but it's so F'n sad seeing these DFS 'pros' entering the $2 games. Just LOL. Give off the impression you're successful/rich then enter $2 games. Not fooling anyone with that...
Is it just the $2 games you have issue with?
 

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burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
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I haven't verified myself but I saw on twitter the entire top 10 on Moneyball's main game last night was won by players who scatter max entries. Remind me again where the skill is or why anyone else should bother entering?
 

fredd

Team Captain
Sep 2, 2009
303
66
adelaide
AFL Club
Essendon
I don't get why people are so opposed to players who create a large number of entries. Without allowing this the prize pools would be greatly reduced. The number of unique people entering teams doesn't change your chances of winning. You could argue that these players are better at fantasy gambling than the average person, sure but that's the thing, you are gambling against people.

Draftstars and Moneyball are never going to remove this from the game. Their turnover, prizepools to advertise and profits all decrease if they were to limit people creating multiple entries.
 

iluvparis

Hall of Famer
Apr 1, 2005
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I haven't verified myself but I saw on twitter the entire top 10 on Moneyball's main game last night was won by players who scatter max entries. Remind me again where the skill is or why anyone else should bother entering?
The skill is in identifying the 75% of players that are must haves and finding enough obscure players to scoop the prize.
 

burge13

Club Legend
Jan 25, 2019
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AFL Club
Adelaide
The skill is in identifying the 75% of players that are must haves and finding enough obscure players to scoop the prize.
There's no skill whatsoever when all you are doing is scatter gunning combinations. That is all they're doing

I don't know the answer so that MB collect their rake, the games still fill and we lower max entries but it's absolutely pointless in it's current form.
 

iluvparis

Hall of Famer
Apr 1, 2005
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There's no skill whatsoever when all you are doing is scatter gunning combinations. That is all they're doing

I don't know the answer so that MB collect their rake, the games still fill and we lower max entries but it's absolutely pointless in it's current form.
If it's so easy to do why don't you implement their strategy then? Beat them at their own game?
 

fredd

Team Captain
Sep 2, 2009
303
66
adelaide
AFL Club
Essendon
There's no skill whatsoever when all you are doing is scatter gunning combinations. That is all they're doing

I don't know the answer so that MB collect their rake, the games still fill and we lower max entries but it's absolutely pointless in it's current form.
No skill whatsoever? If there are people scattering max entries of completely random, unthought out teams as you are suggesting that is an awesome result for any casual player.

Anyone entering max teams is either very skilled and profiting from an edge they have on the market or losing money and subsequently fattening the prize pool for everyone else entering teams.
 

Bucking Bronco

Team Captain
May 5, 2014
329
490
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Fremantle
The skill is in identifying the 75% of players that are must haves and finding enough obscure players to scoop the prize.
You can't afford 75% of the "must haves". In a lot of games it's closer to 25% and you just have to hope the fillers do well.

The people who routinely do well are skilled, but yeah, they have a large bankroll too.

Unless you have a large bankroll you probably aren't going to do too well, because with the pricing of players and the cap there is too much luck that comes down to how the filler players perform and when you have 4 or so of them in the one team of 9 you need to ensure they all fire on the day and the only way to give yourself a decent chance of this happening is entering many, many teams with different filler players.
 

Bucking Bronco

Team Captain
May 5, 2014
329
490
AFL Club
Fremantle
Anyone know if the top players use bots or something, and if so where would one acquaint themself with one?

I just can't believe that a human could possibly have the time to make 80 teams which contain what seems like different combinations of a pool of 20 different players every Friday night.

It takes me sometimes over an hour to make and settle on just a couple of teams.
 

FallingLiefs

Brownlow Medallist
Jan 30, 2013
14,310
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AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Anyone know if the top players use bots or something, and if so where would one acquaint themself with one?

I just can't believe that a human could possibly have the time to make 80 teams which contain what seems like different combinations of a pool of 20 different players every Friday night.

It takes me sometimes over an hour to make and settle on just a couple of teams.
Well tl;dr of this is just have to build your own.

All i know is the guys in the US before sports betting was legalised went from their props markets to this style of thing and their same computer models they previously used just combined everything because it was more sustainable than the very sharp props markets. So really the selection process was just a very complex model spitting out a number of suggested teams. Whether they then see the results from the model and then do the team in a matter of hours for their entries or the website/operator has an .xml or .txt or whatever upload system where their model just produces it in that form so they have 0 input.

Not sure how sustainable it is now over there given the market was flooded by sharks and sports betting now legalised may have taken away a stack of mug money.
 

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