Our issues

[Elite Crow]

1) Tackling: Listening to the press conference, Craig's comment
" We dont need a tackling coach"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you ****ing serious? Not only is our tackle count down but our tackles do not stop the player getting the handball away to advantage. Craig says we will work on it but with a short week, we wont achieve much. What have we been doing for the last 2 years? Our tackling has been shit for ages, who takes responsibility for its current state?

2) Lack of speed: Craig reckons its speed of ball movement that counts, but without speed you cant run down the opposition, you cant run away from them and you cant create the forward line pressure that we need. The lack of speed is a result of recruiting and keeping aged players. Carlton brought in 2 speedy players knowing we would be exposed.

3) Game plan: Has been worked out. Opposition coaches, are learning off each other.
-Our zone is broken. Mainly because we are slow and turnovers.
-Flooding defence and leaving not one forward to kick to.
-Selecting players in wrong positions, what the **** is Walker doing at wing and half back or on the bench we when we have smalls in Porps/Thompson/Douglas starting up forward. He is a Full Forward for **** sake. Kicks a goal at on 3/4 time and starts the last on the bench.
- Handballing for the sake of it

4) Selecting unfit players: Porps and Knights for example are a liability, you cant carry them. Play fit juniors instead. Jaensch has to come in.

5) Injuries: Obviously killing us.

6) Confidence is shot

 

[bobshoby]

pretty much

The tackling thing is bizarre though, even when we were at our best applying huge pressure to teams our tackles were usually average at best. Definitely an area that we could have always improved upon. You'd think he'd love that sort of thing, any player can do it, team ethos etc etc

 

[SydCrow]

1 I thought our tackling was OK today

2 It IS speed of ball movement that's the key - how many really quick players do Geelong and the Saints have? More the problem is awareness - too many players got caught. having said that it would be good to see more players taking off like Mackay does rather than looking for the switch the whole time

3 Again, the zone was OK today - Carlton had real trouble getting it out.

4 Our biggest problem was turnovers caused by poor skill under pressure and maybe over possession. When you turn it over your zone gets exposed big time.

5 goal kicking

6 confidence - see above

 

[TheLeftFist8]

So many issues but confidence is a massive one.

Apart from Danger and Mackay who else looks like taking a game on?

Brodie Martin was a breath of fresh air last year (hadn't been fully robot-ised by that stage).

I guess it's hard to take them on when you are out of position, receive a handball while flat-footed, about to be tackled, know you are a slow plodder, have poor foot skills, and no structure up forward to kick to

I'd love to now bring in a couple of natural footballers in Henderson and Jaensch and get rid of some timid plodders but i fear than they will also morph into confused, fumbling, error-ridden Crows.

Step 1: Get a structure. Rutten FB, Tippett HF, Walker FF, Davis CHB (until Bock or Sellar return).

Step 2: Get a gameplan which doesn't leave swiss holes all over the place. Make it simple.

Step 3: Get the team balance as best as we possibly can given our lack of mid depth in terms of skill and speed improvement

Step 4: Tackle like grown men. Fight like your bloody career depends on it cos by now it does.

Step 5: Encourage revolutionary tactics like kicking, even kicking more than 30m, hell why not even do it towards our goals. Step 1 will help.

Step 6: Encourage out-dated concepts like instinct

 

[KingJames23]

Things that stick out to me:

1. Gameplan - the last 4 or 5 years its worked but now, everyone has caught up and is either executing something similar or knows enough about it that they can stop it (because it hasnt bloody changed). Even blighty was calling for man on man. The definition of insanity - doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. The players cannot be enjoying playing this handball happy game plan. Walker needs to be the man up forward. Danger wants to be the clearance man. If the supporters get bored and frustrated watching this gameplan, I could imagine how the players feel about it. I hope Jaensch doesnt play until we have a new coach because Craig will turn him into a damn robot.

2. Players out of position - we dont play to our strength. Walker in the midfield and defence, Danger playing forward. Am I living in some sort of bizzaro world?

3. Turnovers - MAJOR issue and our game plan relies on everyone moving forward with the ball. Once its turned over, we are caught out and the opposition cheery pickers get the ball. Sydney ganme was also a classic example of this.

4. Underdone/injured players - their must be half a dozen or more players carrying something because we look slow, reactive and disinterested.

5. Coach - Ive been a big fan of craigy but I think the message is now becoming to boring from craigy and they seem to block their ears now. The message is not getting through. This is the same team that almost made the prelim 7 months ago, and Craigy has always said its not personnel, its structure. Well we have the structure and its not working.

6. Goalkicking - check the score today. Enough said.

 

[spexau]

Need to play simple footy for a while so the boys can get their confidence in their own ability. They are running around like headless chooks and only managed to execute the zone a few times, if that, today.

And yes, players need to play in their natural positions. Who cares how "flexible" someone is unless they can play 3 or 4 positions really well. What's the point of having Walker who is a 8/10 FF playing on the wing where he's a 3/10 midfielder? Same can be said for a number of other players who play a few roles okay but don't get put in their best role. SIGH!

 

[WhySoSerious]

Agree with all of the above, and to add to that list..... Arrogance.

This is not directed at the playing group either, this arrogance is purely directed at the coaching staff. There seems to be a problem at the club where the coaches believe that everything they say and do is scripture, and where critism towards the coaching staff is non-existent. The playing group has to take responsibility for poor execution and errors, but after weeks of consistent rubbish starting from the preseason, questions have to be asked about why it is continuing that way. For the coaches to continuily come out with comments such as "we will continue to play this way", "we dont need a tackling coach" and "players are underdone" etc to me it shows complete arrogance to admit fault with the current gameplan and coaching decisions. If players are not fit, do not play them!

It baffles me that at a club that harps on about taking on responsibilty, has its most senior blokes offloading the responsibilty onto the younger guys. If you can see problems fix them! Dont be so arrogant that you ignore the fact that the players at the moment are unable to play this type of football with the current systems and structures in place. Changes need to be made.

 

[SpiderHibs]

I thought the number of tackles we laid today was much better but it's the quality of the tackles that is concerning. No matter how we tackled Carlton, they always got a handball away without fail. There is no point in laying the tackle if the player can play on regardles.

 

[spexau]

I thought the number of tackles we laid today was much better but it's the quality of the tackles that is concerning. No matter how we tackled Carlton, they always got a handball away without fail. There is no point in laying the tackle if the player can play on regardles.

That or they'd throw it out Judd style and it will count

 

[smoovy]

We have a lot of issues. We are like a troubled Emo teen.

 

[kulak]

1)
6) Confidence is shot

I'd put that at no. 1

 

[MelbourneCrow]

Tackling for me. One Scotland goal in the 2nd qtr we nailed one bloke outside the 50.....gets the handballl to the next one.....tackle him and he gets the handball away to Scotland, who goals. No point tackling if they just cling on hopefully and nobody backs them up.

We had more scoring shots than them, but if a bloke has 7 shots at goal and kicks one, then he is no use to us.

 

[Elite Crow]

I'd put that at no. 1

The issues I listed were in no particular order, confidence only holds up for a short period of time if you have many other issues.

 

[SYDpower]

I have to ask this question as an outsider - who is the development coach down there? ie for the junior to mid players?

There was some very basic skill errors that players should not be making. Admittedly all sides make these errors, but as an outsider (& whose brother is a died in the wool crows supporter which makes our get togethers extremely entertaining, given I am a Port supporter) I cant help but notice the skill errors?

 

[Sydney Crow]

Apart from stating the obvious in that we look terribly slow (including the players we rely on to break lines) and that our delivery under pressure is terrible, I feel there is a larger issue that I imagine I will cop some flack on.

In my opinion and I expressed this at the end of last year, put simply, I think we over-achieved in 2009. Plain and simple.

No doubt our up and comers came on impressively last year but we still have some learning to do.

 

[TDRP]

It's a complicated problem that is for sure...

Let's look at the reason behind all our turnovers:

1. Lack of options for players up the ground, causing players to hesitate / uturn and kick under pressure

2. Disposal under pressure is not what it use to be.

We have made our bed with our gameplan over the preseason... and have little choice but to persist at better executing it in my opinion. Our goal kicking needs work... but I am at a loss since these same players last year were so reliable under the same directions.

Everyone needs to dig deep and back themselves to get better... With respect to changing the team... McKernan can come in and maybe Jaensch but who do they replace is the question...

Petrenko was poor today but was ok in previous weeks... but I am still not convinced... he maybe deserves a couple more weeks. Cook is only barely serviceable... he still does some good things inside... but he really doesn't inspire me with his outside game... it takes him a long time to get the ball on to his foot at times.

We are 10% off and our opposition are 10% up.

 

[cmndstab]

I'm not sure I understand everyone's obsession with a tackling coach. Should we bring in a handballing coach too? It's just as bad as our tackling, but of course you'd never get a handballing coach, because handballing is a skill that our current coaches should be teaching.

Having a designated tackling coach would be ridiculous. What we need is for our current coaches to actually get the tackling skills up and running, or to get new coaches. Tackling isn't a skill that you get an individual coach for, it's part of a large set of skills that a group of coaches should be teaching.


Similarly, calls for rugby coaches to come in and teach us how to tackle are misguided - the skills are mostly different, and the areas of similarities do not match up to our weaknesses.


I didn't detect any arrogance at all from the press conference - in fact, what concerned me the most was the complete opposite. Craig seems to recognise that we're looking terrible at the moment, but doesn't seem at all confident in listing the methods and time frames involved in fixing us up. I can only assume that this is because he legitimately has no idea how he's going to fix it up yet, or that he doesn't want to admit that we're a long period of time away from doing so.

 

[birdmanptr]

We are one burnt out team who have spent the last 6 years trying to get super fit.Which could be a factor with the injuries.

 

[WhySoSerious]

I'm not sure I understand everyone's obsession with a tackling coach. Should we bring in a handballing coach too? It's just as bad as our tackling, but of course you'd never get a handballing coach, because handballing is a skill that our current coaches should be teaching.

Having a designated tackling coach would be ridiculous. What we need is for our current coaches to actually get the tackling skills up and running, or to get new coaches. Tackling isn't a skill that you get an individual coach for, it's part of a large set of skills that a group of coaches should be teaching.


Similarly, calls for rugby coaches to come in and teach us how to tackle are misguided - the skills are mostly different, and the areas of similarities do not match up to our weaknesses.


I didn't detect any arrogance at all from the press conference - in fact, what concerned me the most was the complete opposite. Craig seems to recognise that we're looking terrible at the moment, but doesn't seem at all confident in listing the methods and time frames involved in fixing us up. I can only assume that this is because he legitimately has no idea how he's going to fix it up yet, or that he doesn't want to admit that we're a long period of time away from doing so.

Fair points and as always the 'voice of reason' so to speak around these boards which makes you the respected poster you are.

As for the tackling issue. Whilst having a designated tackling coach may sound ridiculous, at the current time our tackling is woeful. No doubt the issue is being magnified at the moment as our zone is not having its usual effect. Turnovers usually caused by our zone are now not as prominent (although there were times where Carlton struggled at points) and the responsiblity now relies more on players laying the tackle. I dont know exactly what they are doing at the club, but it appears we may be too reliant on a working zone and if thats the case the club needs to ensure that the players are prepared to lay a strong tackle if need be. Every club should be looking to improve their game (as the Crows do) and if that means working on their tackling more or finding some outside help, then so be it. At current time though it is hard to take much from it, as you say the handballing is just as bad so it is probaly part and parcel with overall poor football.

The arrogance comment is probaly more to do with our inability to make changes. Rowey and co made the point after the game about Ben Hart saying they werent going to change (or something to that effect) at the half time break. Theres always the talk on these boards about the "plan B" and debates over the Franklin/Massie fiasco (at the risk of bringing it up again ). What works on the training track doesnt always fall to place on the field, and if it doesnt the coaching staff need to take responsibilty for it. Whether it is a case of "being too arrogant" or just not knowing exactly what to do, they need to figure it out because at the moment there is clear problems that even us armchair experts can see .

 

[SCD Reborn]

If the coaches were happy with the ball movement last week - we have problems...

Workrate is an issue at the moment..
Late in the 3rd qtr, we had Carlton stuck in the back pocket, they break and end up with 3 blokes forward of the play, with no Crows player within 30m behind them chasing, that's a mindset more then anything else

I maintain our big issue (as I posted last week) is the gameplan, it is weak and too predictable, too there is no variation and our skills are 25% off the last 5 years, which is making us very easy to pick off.

The handball to kick ratio is out and the use of the wing and cut back into the middle 70-80m out from goal with this slow "risk" free footy is not working because of our skill level. There is no hard attacking running and carrying from behind. It's all slow boring footy and while that was good 2-3 years ago, it's not what we played in the last 8-10 weeks last year to make us an exciting and promising team..

Our zone has too many blokes caught in no-mans land not close enough to stop the handball or short kick and too close for a long kick. There is not enough pressure to shut down the ball carrier and all 4 teams have killed us with small 15 - 20m kicks or turning quickly and kicking a quick 50-60m kick and breaking the zone down... and to be honest it looked at times like Circle work for Carlton...

I've been a strong supporter of Neil Craig and remain so, but IMO he needs to take a good look at the the slow style we are playing and the fact that we looked far more dangerous when kicking and playing on at the start of the 4th qtr...

 

[cmndstab]

Appreciate it WSS.

I certainly would like to see the Crows place more emphasis on tackling effectively - I just think it should come from our current coaching staff, or if they are unable to do so, we should get new coaching staff. Bring in an external person to work with an individual has some merit. I loved the idea of bringing in a rugby guy to work with Dangerfield on copping less of a battering when getting tackled. However, group improvement is unlikely to come from bring in an additional tackling coach, in my opinion.

Of course, I'd be delighted to be proven wrong


The Ben Hart comment is extremely troubling to me. On one hand, I'm sure he was just spruiking the company line - "We think enough of what we are doing is working, so we're going to persist with it". The problem is, from what I've heard, he seemed altogether too pleased with it, considering we were down 10 goals to 3. Yes, we were creating opportunities and yes, we were controlling the ball for large periods of the match, but even to my untrained eye it was obvious that we simply didn't look like scoring goals. Hart told the truth - they were sticking with the plan - but he shouldn't have seemed to nonchalant about it.

Mind you, I didn't hear or see the interview so I'm only going on descriptions offered by some on here.