List Mgmt. Our Midfield

[Blue__Balls]

Don't view it as a negative and or that our development has stagnated. Over the last 5 years, clubs have averaged over 9 changes a year. WC had 9 changes this year, after winning a flag. I would be very surprised, given the composition of our list, that we have less than 6-8 changes come year's end

After 4 years of inflating the average, we should really be in a position to lower it again.

5-7 (planned) changes from the main/rookie list sounds right to me, plus any unexpected bombshells (ala Byrne) and mid-year rookies.

 

[Robbo's my hero]

Never said I was uncomfortable [emoji6] just said I wouldn’t do it. Very different

You must have new jocks. Very important in later years!

 

[Soapy V]

A couple of them haven't played a game for us yet and your delisting them in January.

Yep. Like I said earlier it will all depend on what year we have. Have another like 2018 and I expect up to 10. BUT I’m expecting a much improved season at senior and reserves level.

If that happens I expect minimal changes as our age demographic is heading in the right direction and we will have a happy club that is unified and to make major changes would be a disruption. But that’s just MO

I also expect a lot of the OOC players to be signed up prior to or during the season.

 

[thylacine60]

Agree with you Soapy, there’re will be at least 6 changes quite possibly 8 or more.
Pickett , Garnett , Le Bois gone with Cuningham, Polson and Lang under heavy scrutiny. Thomas and Simpson to retire one would think, and talls , Levi , Phillips gone if we decide to go with the Kruezer and Lobb can’t possibly carry all 4 of them.
Jones and Goddard under scrutiny at least.

bm addressing arrow as soapy now - site upgrade jumps shark day one....

 

[ParapMarkets]

Do people actually analyse our list or just guess like journos?

Also Coniglio isn't free. If he was I would be happy to grab him.

I'm not going to keep going round and round but the same comments have been made about my views on List management/changes the past 3 years and I have been right on each year. Let's just see what happens.

There’s no point us really debating this as we disagree fundamentally. I also disagree that you have been right, SOS has been trying very hard to execute a completely different strategy than you advocate.

Genuine free agents like Coniglio are no-brainers, we need to play the system to advantage if we want to succeed. Yes he is free. I don’t think we are any chance of getting him but he is a fa. SOS isn’t going to be sitting on his hands hoping all the kids come good.

 

[Soapy V]

There’s no point us really debating this as we disagree fundamentally. I also disagree that you have been right, SOS has been trying very hard to execute a completely different strategy than you advocate.

Genuine free agents like Coniglio are no-brainers, we need to play the system to advantage if we want to succeed. Yes he is free. I don’t think we are any chance of getting him but he is a fa. SOS isn’t going to be sitting on his hands hoping all the kids come good.

I know people in here don’t like it when others are right but each year I’ve said how many changes there will be and have been right. Hard to argue against

As for FAs like Coniglio being no brainers I totally disagree. Lots of factors to consider. Not that simple and he certainly isn’t free. No one is. Daisy was a FA and certainly wasn’t free. Cost us in several areas.

I also never suggested SOS won’t be doing anything. I’ve suggested 5-6 changes with a real needs focus. Important as ever in 2019 to get the right players.

Anyway that’s my opinion

 

[HARKER]

Not a Coniglio fan? Come on now...
We're stretching our midfield ability on potential and promises only.

Coniglio would make for a terrific and complementary asset to the whole.
We didn't rabidly chase Shiel for nothing and not without the understanding that our midfield group will yet take some time to gel.

I do though agree that we have to allow the parts to come together and form the bigger whole, but to ignore the midfield on the promise of what may come about would be tantamount to being negligent.

 

[Soapy V]

Not a Coniglio fan? Come on now...
We're stretching our midfield ability on potential and promises only.

Coniglio would make for a terrific and complementary asset to the whole.
We didn't rabidly chase Shiel for nothing and not without the understanding that our midfield group will yet take some time to gel.

I do though agree that we have to allow the parts to come together and form the bigger whole, but to ignore the midfield on the promise of what may come about would be tantamount to being negligent.

Potential & Promise now. Could well be different at the end of the season

I expect it will

 

[Soapy V]

Give you 3 main list and one rookie. Will add one of Daisy or Simmo to retirement (outside chance of both)

Simmo retire? Just coming into his prime

 

[Soapy V]

bm addressing arrow as soapy now - site upgrade jumps shark day one....

Ever seen Arr0w or myself in the same room at the same time?

 

[skadoosh]

Potential & Promise now. Could well be different at the end of the season

I expect it will

I know you're a glass half full man. And I have my fingers and toes crossed that all our young draftees come along and become stars. However, the chances all make it is unlikely.
We always talk big of new draftees in their 1st year eg. Dow and LOB showed lots for their age. Weitering looked amazing in his 1st year, as did Samo (we saw glimpses of future starhood). But then you see things like Weitering moved into other positions, injuries to younger players like Marchbank, Samo supposedly having 2nd year blues. Then you have Cuningham who really could've shown more, but alas injuries and missing in games. Not saying that these guys, and I'm actually talking about all of our young players drafted by SOS, won't make it. But just can't rely on promise and potential.

Is it considered being impatient to go after another star mid? Will that be for long-term benefit of our club?

 

[thylacine60]

Ever seen Arr0w or myself in the same room at the same time?

most nights

 

[Soapy V]

I know you're a glass half full man. And I have my fingers and toes crossed that all our young draftees come along and become stars. However, the chances all make it is unlikely.
We always talk big of new draftees in their 1st year eg. Dow and LOB showed lots for their age. Weitering looked amazing in his 1st year, as did Samo (we saw glimpses of future starhood). But then you see things like Weitering moved into other positions, injuries to younger players like Marchbank, Samo supposedly having 2nd year blues. Then you have Cuningham who really could've shown more, but alas injuries and missing in games. Not saying that these guys, and I'm actually talking about all of our young players drafted by SOS, won't make it. But just can't rely on promise and potential.

Is it considered being impatient to go after another star mid? Will that be for long-term benefit of our club?

I have no doubt that Cripps Kennedy SPS Dow Setterfield Walsh O’Brien Fisher Stocker will be minimum very good players.

With Cuningham Polson Lang Gibbons it’s more being hopeful

As I said it’s not about going for someone like Coniglio it’s about what it costs and what we really need. We will have a better picture at the end of the season

 

[COBALT BLUE]

I actually thought LOB had a better first year than Dow. His versatility and kicking skills are going to make him a very good long-term player. Looks equally capable on half-back or a wing, and I love his attack on the ball for an outside player. Doesn’t take a backward step.

Doesn’t get mentioned in the same light as Dow and Walsh, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up as good if not better than both.

He’s arguably already our best long kick too.

OBrein did ok in 2018...his stats were similar to Dow....he played a few very good games,and was rested after a few tired performances.With either of these two difficult to know who will take off stats wise.
OBrein certainly has a good work ethic,and is a mature young man who wants to do well and i think is sensible enough plus he is a great runner and has the gift of skills.
I think both Dow and OBrein will still be working very hard in 2019 to make a huge impact and improved depth may see both or either or for some stint in the Vfl in 2019.

 

[BlueRenaissance]

Midfield looks gravy.

More importantly, this is the year of JSoS and Cunners.

C'mon, we all know players spike their form when they are on the chopping block and out of contract. Gibbs was a bonafide master-debater at this type of thing.

Cunners to kill it.

 

[Blues90]

Who’s actually better between the 2 I don’t really care. They are very different players.

We will be debating who is the better player for years to come. Tough trying to work out who is the better player when they are both elite [emoji6]

Just saying... Dow had good contested numbers best intact by a teenager but look at lachies last 3 games he really started to get it

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

I honestly can’t see why we would chase Shiel so hard this season and offering him huge overs $ wise and than just 12 months down the track think that we no longer need someone like that. We weren’t going all out chasing Shiel just for 2019, it was a long term plan and that won’t change in 12 months because we are scared of possibly having too many good players, that would be a dream situation where we are too good and we have to lose one player because we have an A grader in Coniglio on our list.
It just seems crazy to not chase a star player because we have kids who could come good when currently only two are playing to AFL standard. The worst possible outcome of getting Coniglio is losing a player worth about $300k because that’s all we would be overpaying him.

 

[goBlue]

I honestly can’t see why we would chase Shiel so hard this season and offering him huge overs $ wise and than just 12 months down the track think that we no longer need someone like that. We weren’t going all out chasing Shiel just for 2019, it was a long term plan and that won’t change in 12 months because we are scared of possibly having too many good players, that would be a dream situation where we are too good and we have to lose one player because we have an A grader in Coniglio on our list.
It just seems crazy to not chase a star player because we have kids who could come good when currently only two are playing to AFL standard. The worst possible outcome of getting Coniglio is losing a player worth about $300k because that’s all we would be overpaying him.

We definitely will be chasing a player, not sure why people would be saying otherwise. It's just so hard to acquire an A grader like Coniglio or Kelly, look how hard we tried for Shiel and we still didn't get him.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Yeh I can’t see as getting either but I think we would be mad not to ask the question

 

[Soapy V]

We definitely will be chasing a player, not sure why people would be saying otherwise. It's just so hard to acquire an A grader like Coniglio or Kelly, look how hard we tried for Shiel and we still didn't get him.

NO ONE has ever said we won't be chasing a player or even a couple. I am only asking the value of certain players and the cost to the list/SC and our needs at years end

 

[Soapy V]

I honestly can’t see why we would chase Shiel so hard this season and offering him huge overs $ wise and than just 12 months down the track think that we no longer need someone like that. We weren’t going all out chasing Shiel just for 2019, it was a long term plan and that won’t change in 12 months because we are scared of possibly having too many good players, that would be a dream situation where we are too good and we have to lose one player because we have an A grader in Coniglio on our list.
It just seems crazy to not chase a star player because we have kids who could come good when currently only two are playing to AFL standard. The worst possible outcome of getting Coniglio is losing a player worth about $300k because that’s all we would be overpaying him.

When we chased Shiel we didn't have Walsh Stocker Setterfield. We felt we needed mature players and targeted Shiel to fill different areas. Didn't happen so we got some mids and also add mature players like Newman Bugg & Goddard after.

Our needs may well be different. A year is a long time and as I said numerous times by end of 2019 they won't be "kids". We will have a very good idea whether most of them will step up or not

 

[windows1]

I have no doubt that Cripps Kennedy SPS Dow Setterfield Walsh O’Brien Fisher Stocker will be minimum very good players.

With Cuningham Polson Lang Gibbons it’s more being hopeful

As I said it’s not about going for someone like Coniglio it’s about what it costs and what we really need. We will have a better picture at the end of the season

You have no doubts about Kennedy? I’m not potting him don’t get me wrong. But I have doubts about him being a ‘very’ good player. I have no doubt he’s at least fringe/good back up. I HOPE he is very good, but I have some ‘doubts’. Agree with the rest of your assessments although I probably need to see Stocker play a game first!

 

[Coona Blues]

You have no doubts about Kennedy? I’m not potting him don’t get me wrong. But I have doubts about him being a ‘very’ good player. I have no doubt he’s at least fringe/good back up. I HOPE he is very good, but I have some ‘doubts’. Agree with the rest of your assessments although I probably need to see Stocker play a game first!

Throw your doubts out the window
Kennedy an integral part and won't let anyone down. Too early to be definitive on Stocker but great profile, attitude, body development and skills, "bust proof" ceiling unknown.

 

[Soapy V]

You have no doubts about Kennedy? I’m not potting him don’t get me wrong. But I have doubts about him being a ‘very’ good player. I have no doubt he’s at least fringe/good back up. I HOPE he is very good, but I have some ‘doubts’. Agree with the rest of your assessments although I probably need to see Stocker play a game first!

No doubts about Kennedy at all. I've seen enough even when injured to show what he can do. Seeing him at training has me now convinced. Still young and so much upside. His combination with Cripps will be big for us

As for Stocker if SOS & Co rated him at 6 that's good enough for me. Seems to have the skills and is a pure footballer. What I like is he doesn't give up or shy away from the contest. He is training as well as anyone. More I see the more I reckon we got a steal

 

[HARKER]

No doubts about Kennedy at all. I've seen enough even when injured to show what he can do. Seeing him at training has me now convinced. Still young and so much upside. His combination with Cripps will be big for us

As for Stocker if SOS & Co rated him at 6 that's good enough for me. Seems to have the skills and is a pure footballer. What I like is he doesn't give up or shy away from the contest. He is training as well as anyone. More I see the more I reckon we got a steal

Opportunity and a good injury run (lack of injury) may well be the keys for some of our mids to establish themselves and leave others behind.

Kennedy gets the jump on others and performs to a desired standard, someone like Setterfield may find themselves serving NB duties.......and vice versa.
Lots of posturing for spots in this new make-up and as always some will shine and others may not, if for no other reason than for opportunity.