Paige's 2014 Phantom Draft

[Dogsman16]

The clubs internal position has not changed. They doubt their 1st pick will get Wright or McCartin and they doubt Durdin and Goddard will be in the elite category. The majority of their midfield group is in their early to mid 20's and they dont want to bring in project talls. Would rather get a ready made key position player that is still relatively young. John Butcher is also a possibility but they may be able to snare him with a second or third round pick.

Several of our supporters agree with a scenario such as this. I for one want our first pick traded for O'Rourke and Jacksh that way we can cover two holes in our side from the one trade. Won't be trading pick 5 for Sam Reid, think he's worth more a pick 15 - 18 at this stage.
Carlisle will be the primary focus of our 2015 trade period, really think we can pry him away from the bombers. Also supported butcher as another option that we should trade in. With the number of quality youngsters we already have on our list I would strongly consider trading our pick 26 to port for him as currently we only have two true kpf over 193cm on our list that being Jones and Redpath. Often this year and last we have had to rely on Stringer and Crameri to play 1st and 2nd tall forwards or have Campbell/Cordy as our primary target. Makes great sense that we get butcher who could do with a change of scenery.

 

[Two Planks]

Several of our supporters agree with a scenario such as this. I for one want our first pick traded for O'Rourke and Jacksh that way we can cover two holes in our side from the one trade. Won't be trading pick 5 for Sam Reid, think he's worth more a pick 15 - 18 at this stage.
Carlisle will be the primary focus of our 2015 trade period, really think we can pry him away from the bombers. Also supported butcher as another option that we should trade in. With the number of quality youngsters we already have on our list I would strongly consider trading our pick 26 to port for him as currently we only have two true kpf over 193cm on our list that being Jones and Redpath. Often this year and last we have had to rely on Stringer and Crameri to play 1st and 2nd tall forwards or have Campbell/Cordy as our primary target. Makes great sense that we get butcher who could do with a change of scenery.

Doubtful that pick 5 alone would be enough for O'Rourke and Jaksch.

However pick 5 may get you guys Reid and Butcher.

 

[Eastern Rangers]

Hmmm, all I see is 'short' and 'poor disposal'. We can't afford any more poor users of the ball in our side.

Short, skinny-fat and lacks discipline on field to anyone gifted with two eyes. Not a first round talent, irrespective of what the fanbois over at AFL.com think.

 

[blueiris]

Doubtful that pick 5 alone would be enough for O'Rourke and Jaksch.

However pick 5 may get you guys Reid and Butcher.

Sam Reid and John Butcher are not worth pick 5

 

[Zgope1]

The clubs internal position has not changed. They doubt their 1st pick will get Wright or McCartin and they doubt Durdin and Goddard will be in the elite category. The majority of their midfield group is in their early to mid 20's and they dont want to bring in project talls. Would rather get a ready made key position player that is still relatively young. John Butcher is also a possibility but they may be able to snare him with a second or third round pick.

cheers. has Ben Griffiths been mentioned?

 

[Chaisa]

Sam Reid and John Butcher are not worth pick 5

Reid isn't off-contract though, so I doubt their 2nd rounder will be enough to nab him.

 

[Goldfish]

Second version is up:

http://boundforglorynews.com/paige-cardonas-phantom-draft-2-0/

 

[bloke_]

If Hugh Goddard drops that far there's no way Freo will pass on him.

 

[List Manager]

Paige's phantom drafts are based on recent performances. Hugh didn't have the best national championships but clubs will see through that. I have him going to Carlton with their first pick if Sam Durdin is already gone.

 

[Two Planks]

cheers. has Ben Griffiths been mentioned?

I think every player in Australia that is 194 cm or taller is under consideration. Its just a matter of how far down the list they are.

 

[eth-dog]

Bloody hell, if Keitel is available I hope we'd take him...

 

[aussierulesrules]

Doubtful that pick 5 alone would be enough for O'Rourke and Jaksch.

I reckon it would be. Lets not forget that O'Rourke went at 2 in a compromised draft that also had Joe Daniher go at 10, rather than 1 or 2, (because of the F/S rule) and had the widely regarded Brodie Grundy "slide" out of the top 3 and that there is a fair chance that GWS reached for O'Rourke because they were so keen to get someone with really good skills and pace, to add to their inside brigade, hence overlooking someone like Wines for him. Then of course there is the fact that they pretty much only drafted those from Vic Metro, which may be why they picked him ahead of the generally more highly touted Toumpas (who was from SA, where GWS avoided drafting anyone from like the plague!).

Add all that to the fact that he's been injury-prone in the two seasons since and has not even come close to setting the world on fire when he has played for GWS (or apparently in the NEAFL) and you get someone who is now not likely to be worth anywhere near as much as they "paid" for him.

Jaksch is probably worth a pick closer to 20 than 10 now, given that he hasn't shown a lot either, so combined you may even get something thrown in as steak knives with them if you gave up pick 5. I reckon GWS would do pick 5 for the two of them in a heartbeat.

 

[Two Planks]

I reckon it would be. Lets not forget that O'Rourke went at 2 in a compromised draft that also had Joe Daniher go at 10, rather than 1 or 2, (because of the F/S rule) and had the widely regarded Brodie Grundy "slide" out of the top 3 and that there is a fair chance that GWS reached for O'Rourke because they were so keen to get someone with really good skills and pace, to add to their inside brigade, hence overlooking someone like Wines for him. Then of course there is the fact that they pretty much only drafted those from Vic Metro, which may be why they picked him ahead of the generally more highly touted Toumpas (who was from SA, where GWS avoided drafting anyone from like the plague!).

Add all that to the fact that he's been injury-prone in the two seasons since and has not even come close to setting the world on fire when he has played for GWS (or apparently in the NEAFL) and you get someone who is now not likely to be worth anywhere near as much as they "paid" for him.

Jaksch is probably worth a pick closer to 20 than 10 now, given that he hasn't shown a lot either, so combined you may even get something thrown in as steak knives with them if you gave up pick 5. I reckon GWS would do pick 5 for the two of them in a heartbeat.

I dont think they will do pick 5 for 2 reasons.

1. They wont want more draft picks, they will want quality 22-26 year olds.
2. There will be 10 clubs in Melbourne bidding for these 2 young players which will drive the price up.

 

[aussierulesrules]

1. They wont want more draft picks, they will want quality 22-26 year olds.

They may want that, but they've wanted the same thing during the past couple of offseasons as well and have found it very difficult to make it happen, because A: Other clubs have either been reluctant to offer up anyone of high quality off their own list and/or B: because it seems hardly anyone on other clubs lists wants to move to Western Sydney to play for GWS. So even if a club is prepared to offer up someone that GWS would genuinely like, they still have to agree to being traded to GWS and may very well not do so. So, like in these previous years, GWS may "settle" for the really high draft pick, especially since these two are hardly going to make much, if any of a dent to their regular 22.

2. There will be 10 clubs in Melbourne bidding for these 2 young players which will drive the price up.

That is a good point, but I still doubt very much that any of them will end up giving up anything individually for the two of them that will equate to being better than a top 5 pick that could get GWS someone they think is a good chance to be "elite".

They have so much talent on their list that I imagine they would much prefer one "serious gun" to two more who are at a very similar level to so many they already have on their list and I expect they would much prefer it to a couple of "fringe-types", that the other clubs may try to pony up in a trade, if GWS don't want more picks.

 

[Bailey01]

If Hugh Goddard was available at our pick I hope we would take him.
Can anyone tell me the difference between Goddard and Jake Lever? I know they are both defenders but what are their attributes and such?

 

[Skippos]

If Hugh Goddard was available at our pick I hope we would take him.
Can anyone tell me the difference between Goddard and Jake Lever? I know they are both defenders but what are their attributes and such?

As do I. And I hope he'd never stand inside the forward 50 for us either.

It's hard to explain but they're very different players. Lever is more of a natural I guess. He reads the ball to perfection and he's skilled. He does all the small things right. There's a bit of Maxwell and Fletch in the way he can zone off and neutralise other contests and a bit of Harry Taylor in his natural ability to just read and clunk the ball. Offensively he's got above average footskills for a player of his role and he's not shy to run and create. Not Cameron Giles-esque perhaps but still more than most juniors. Reads the ball well, reads the play well and involves himself in the offensive transition as another running and rebounding option. He's a nice player. Plowman's probably a good comparison in a lot of ways. Size just the knock on him, he's probably not KPD size...at least not yet.

Goddard is just athletic. He's quick, closes down well, moves well, evades well, is excellent at ground level... all of that. He mightn't have the most fantastic or natural footy brain and that's why I like him as a defender - instead of having to take the lead and create opportunity for himself he feeds off an opponent to do the thinking for him and take him to the right spots. When he's following an opponent he's not going to get outbodied very often and he's going to shut down most leads and when he has the ball he makes good decisions and is able to give a bit of run out of defence too. A more capable/little bit smaller version of Rory Thompson comes to mind but I'm not really bothered to think of a comparison so there's probably better.

Lever's probably never going to be your #1 shutdown guy. He's a better defender and more natural a player but his size limits what he can reach. Goddard's just that bit taller and with a wider frame so he could develop into your #1 defender and take the bigger blokes.

I favour Goddard because he offers a bit more flexibility and I have a little more confidence in where he'll go as a footballer if played down back but I wouldn't be against Lever purely because he's just very good and could work well in a side who already has one or two established bigger KPDs. I certainly prefer him to Marchbank.

 

[manny100]

GWS have 46 players on their list and have to reduce this to 40 in the next 2 or 3 years. If they keep players who are not getting regular games to long their trade value will plummet. At the same time GWS want as much quality on their list as possible. So I think that there is a strong possibility of GWS swapping two players previously selected with highish draft picks for a high draft pick in this coming draft. Makes senses.
If the Saints get pick 1 and GWS pick 2 and GWS are desperate for Petracca they may swap for pick 1 and throw a player(s) such as O'Rourke and ???/or draft pick. The Saints then pick up McCartin.
This is a win/win for both clubs just as the Tyson/Salem for Kelly was last year.
GWS get rid of some quantity not getting a regular game to trim their list and get the super quality they need. The Saints get their forward plus a player(s) with a couple of preseasons under the belt with good AFL skills that may turn into a couple of hundred good games..
The Demons will also be looking to deal with GWS. Maybe the Dogs as well.
GWS will also be looking to gradually alter their list age profile with top quality added to avoid to many players coming into free agency at a similar time. It sounds a bit strange but for GWS its more about what they get rather than what they give. Simply because they are blessed with an abundance - opposite for the Saints and Dees!!!!
Trade season for supporters/members of the lower clubs is sure to provide more entertainment and suspense than the playing season!!!!!

 

[aussierulesrules]

If the Saints get pick 1 and GWS pick 2 and GWS are desperate for Petracca they may swap for pick 1 and throw a player(s) such as O'Rourke and ???/or draft pick. The Saints then pick up McCartin.
This is a win/win for both clubs just as the Tyson/Salem for Kelly was last year.

I suggested an identical sort of thing on our board the other day and would be very open to it. Very unlikely that a club trades pick 1 for just another couple of picks though, even if one of them is 2 or 3. I wouldn't have any issue with it if I knew it was a good value trade, but clubs like to be able to "sell the dream" of pick 1 and all the hope that it can bring, so it would probably have to be a Cameron/Boyd/Patton on the table to entice us to part with pick 1 (if we have it). I have GWS finishing 3rd last, BTW.

As do I. And I hope he'd never stand inside the forward 50 for us either.

It's hard to explain but they're very different players. Lever is more of a natural I guess. He reads the ball to perfection and he's skilled. He does all the small things right. There's a bit of Maxwell and Fletch in the way he can zone off and neutralise other contests and a bit of Harry Taylor in his natural ability to just read and clunk the ball. Offensively he's got above average footskills for a player of his role and he's not shy to run and create. Not Cameron Giles-esque perhaps but still more than most juniors. Reads the ball well, reads the play well and involves himself in the offensive transition as another running and rebounding option. He's a nice player. Plowman's probably a good comparison in a lot of ways. Size just the knock on him, he's probably not KPD size...at least not yet.

So he's Sam Fisher Mk2?

 

[Zephiisdaman]

Would the Bulldogs really want to overlook a KP talent given they have constantly been crying out for one?

No, if Goddard is there they will take him IMO

 

[Zgope1]

No, if Goddard is there they will take him IMO

any info or just a hunch?

 

[Zephiisdaman]

any info or just a hunch?

"Strong" hunch

 

[master bate]

If you could explain how a player could play like Goldsack and Murphy that would be great!

Pick 20: GWS Giants – Ed Vickers-Willis (compensation selection)

Position: Utility
Height: 190 cm, Weight: 82 kg, DOB: 28/03/1996
Club: Sandringham Dragons
Projected draft range: 15-25
Plays Like: Tyson Goldsack/Bob Murphy

I actually think Vickers-Willis reminds me of his school mate Tom Langdon or even of young roo Jamie Macmillan. Smart, hard, does the simple things well, good size, fitness and character. Just whether he actually has midfield potential is another question and whether his kicking will make him a good kick from half back (like a Bob Murphy) or just an average kick from half back who then has to be a really good defender to be a top line player.

 

[Tank Girl]

SCPaige do you think Tim Jones, Caleb Hislop, or Josh McGuinness have much chance of being drafted? What about Logan Reynolds for next year?

 

[SCPaige]

Tank Girl I rate Josh McGuiness particularly highly. Really love how elusive he is in the back half and his ball skills coming out of defensive 50. Timmy Jones although a ball magnet, lacks a few high-end traits that probably see him more of a late to rookie option, and I think Hislop will be somewhere around the similar mark. I know last year we had a huge influx of tassie boys (Brady Gray was my personal favourite), but I just don't see much 'elite' talent coming from there this year. There may only be one or two boys taken in the National Draft this year. But I will say Jones has been super impressive with his work around the stoppages, particularly at TAC Cup level.

Regarding Tom Logan, he's a really hot prospect for next year, Tassie have a gem there in him. I hope all that helps

 

[SCPaige]

If you could explain how a player could play like Goldsack and Murphy that would be great!

Pick 20: GWS Giants – Ed Vickers-Willis (compensation selection)

Position: Utility
Height: 190 cm, Weight: 82 kg, DOB: 28/03/1996
Club: Sandringham Dragons
Projected draft range: 15-25
Plays Like: Tyson Goldsack/Bob Murphy

I actually think Vickers-Willis reminds me of his school mate Tom Langdon or even of young roo Jamie Macmillan. Smart, hard, does the simple things well, good size, fitness and character. Just whether he actually has midfield potential is another question and whether his kicking will make him a good kick from half back (like a Bob Murphy) or just an average kick from half back who then has to be a really good defender to be a top line player.

Sorry, I should've outlined this further to avoid confusion. With EVW, he has that same movement and that utility type of Bob Murphy in the way he patrols half back and gets further up the ground, but he has the marking ability, agility, tackling and athleticism of a Goldsack type.